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Posted: 5/21/2003 8:48:44 PM EDT
[#1]
The Wrangler is fairly well rated BUT it is the best at doing what it does, offroading. If you put a couple grand into a wrangler it can do some amazing stuff offroad.
I wouldnt let some shit bag car salesmen scare you away from such a fine rig. |
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Posted: 5/21/2003 9:16:33 PM EDT
[#2]
Just a guess, but considering what Wranglers are often used for (heavy Offroading) I'm not suprised that they might burn some trannys out. The gears on them things gotta go through some work.
I'm looking at Wranglers myself, I'm dying to get one. |
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Posted: 5/21/2003 9:48:21 PM EDT
[#3]
I have an '88 Jeep Cherokee. It has the EXCELLENT 4.0L I-6 engine and a crappy (some say the worst) Peugeot 5-speed transmission. It also has 290k miles and NO engine or transmission problems.
They only put crappy Peugeot transmissions in some jeeps back in the late 80s. Most modern Jeeps use excellent Japanese (Toyota) transmissions. When it comes to Jeeps (Wrangler or Cherokee), hardcore rockcrawlers tend to keep the 4.0L engine and the stock transmissions. What they upgrade is the Dana 35 rear end. Sometimes, they upgrade the Dana 30 front end, but since it is full floating it can handle bigger tires than the rear Dana 35 (often, they keep the Dana 30 front but upgrade the axles/U-joints in it). If you want to go offroading, I suggest you look for a Jeep with a rear Dana 44. If you stay with tires under 30x9.5R15 in size, don't run lockers, and don't go rockcrawling, the stock Dana 35 is OK. If you want to know about Jeeps, talk to people who use them off road. Look at what they replace and what they tend to leave stock. As far as salesmen, I haven't meet many who really understood the capabilities of various vehicles, beyond whatever it takes to make sales to soccer moms. |
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Posted: 5/21/2003 9:57:20 PM EDT
[#4]
I have to add: if you want a Wrangler with serious off-road capability, get a TJ Wrangler, the one with the round head lights. It is the most off-road capable Jeep in decades, at the very least. The Rubicon version of the TJ is the most capable TJ version, and it is one of the most capable Jeeps ever (in large part because it comes stock with lockers front and rear). But the Rubicon is expensive, and you can modify a standard TJ to outperform a Rubicon if you know what you are doing.
You also want to know where else to look. I don't know much about the offroading in your area, but here in the SouthWest, on our tight, rocky mining trails, the capable vehicles tend to be the smaller ones. Jeep CJs, Wranglers, Cherokees, short wheelbase Toyota Landcruisers, and short bed Toyota pick ups with solid front axles (and sometimes bobbed tails). Basically, small vehicles with solid front axles and little rear overhang. |
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Posted: 5/21/2003 10:15:47 PM EDT
[#5]
Jeep Quality = Oxymoron
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Posted: 5/21/2003 10:24:35 PM EDT
[#6]
They aren't a Land Cruiser, but hell, who is?
I'm on my second Jeep, a 1997 with an (gasp!) auto tranny. I'm 43 & I **REFUSE** to shift gears in rush hour anymore. The quality on my '97 is heads above the one I bought new in 1984. |
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Posted: 5/21/2003 10:26:34 PM EDT
[#7]
Mom is finally retiring the old 90 Wrangler for a 2001 Blazer in a few days. I had it after I got my license and drove it till i got my z-71 in september. She has had it since 93. Lotsa good times in that thing[:D]. But its getting kinda old and I wish i had more time to work on it, ya know do some mods to it like maybe air lockers and a winch and a suspension lift and 35s, but its kinda impratical for me. I would love to find a 95 wrangler to fool around with, but doubts are out on that one.
In short, I loved my Jeep, it took me wherever I wanted to go with many great stories along the way. |
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Posted: 5/21/2003 11:02:04 PM EDT
[#8]
I have grown up with Jeeps.
My parents had the old Jeep Wagoneers. We went through 3 of them, a 75, 77, and 82. They were all good rigs, and got us where we wanted to go during the winters in Eastern Washington. I put a lift and 33" tires on the old 77 Wagoneer and it is great for the mountains. My daily driver is a 91 Cherokee that I picked up for $2,000. It has 218,000 miles on it and still runs great. Sunroof works, AC blows cold, the only thing not working is the cruise control. My 4.5" lift just showed up today and I will be spending my weekend putting it on. My dad has a 98 Wrangler TJ which I got for him back in 1998. It has been a great Jeep, 67,000 miles on it and no problems at all. The good thing about the Jeep Wranglers is their simplicity. You can do a lot with them and mod the hell out of them for very little. I will always own a Jeep vehicle, the mountains are only 10 minutes away and we use them a lot for recreation, especially in the winter. |
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Posted: 5/22/2003 5:33:40 AM EDT
[#9]
i am about ready to pick up a 99 cherokee sport, got lift and tires in mind, as wellas lockers and some 410's, slip yoke eliminator, and a new shaft are also in the works for it
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Posted: 5/22/2003 6:06:35 AM EDT
[#10]
I drive a 94 Wrangler with a 4.0 and auto tranny daily and I love it. I bouhgt it in '97 with 11k miles on it. It now has 105k and I just put a new engine in it. I didn't have any engine trouble until the PCV system clogged up and blew all the oil out through the air cleaner. I thought about selling it but I went ahead and dropped $3700 for a new motor but it's like a new vehicle now for a lot less money.
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Posted: 5/22/2003 6:18:56 AM EDT
[#11]
Quoted: Jeep Quality = Oxymoron My thoughts exactly. My company has worked on many projects for DaimlerChrysler over the last 16 years. In fact, out VP was the lead engineer for Jeep on the original CJ (Wrangler) back in the day. I do NOT drive a DaimlerChrysler vehicle, and probably never will, with the possible exception of the Rubicon. |
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Posted: 5/22/2003 6:33:12 AM EDT
[#12]
The I6 Jeep engine is the most durable gasoline engine on the market today, IMHO.
My 2000 Jeep TJ has about 30k miles on it and I haven't had a single problem with it, (not that you'd expet to at 30k, but if you listen to some people, like the salesman you know.....) and I'm not just driving it to church on Sundays. 4" lift, 33" BFGs, locker in the front....on the stock axles - I'll upgrade when and if I break 'em. It's a Jeep, not a car. If you keep that in mind, you'll be very happy. |
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Posted: 5/22/2003 7:08:04 AM EDT
[#13]
I have a 2 week old 2003 Wrangler. This has to be one of the best built vehicles I have ever owned. I am EXTREMELY pleased with mine so far. I already have a 2 inch lift on it and new tires are going on tomorrow.
Very close friend of mine who I have known most of my life is a manager at the DC parts distribution center in Orlando. They cover the southeast US and south/central America. He said they ship out fewer parts for new Jeeps than almost any other vehicle in the Chrysler line. I am thoroughly sold on Jeep. My Wranlger is a tight built vehicle, and very well designed. |
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Posted: 5/22/2003 7:18:54 AM EDT
[#14]
What kind of lift did you get Hawkeye?
Did you install it yourself? |
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Posted: 5/22/2003 7:43:56 AM EDT
[#15]
Wranglers (Danglers) are widely regarded as crap in stock form in the offroad community unmodified. You can make them very good but it'd be cheaper to buy a used hummer.
If you HAVE to have a heep, get a TJ with the round headlights. They are very capable out of the box. Older heeps like the cj-7 and -5 have more personality and are generally built better than the danglers, but if you can't swing a Land Cruiser (best choice) then get the newer TJ. |
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Posted: 5/22/2003 7:56:42 AM EDT
[#16]
Quoted: What kind of lift did you get Hawkeye? Did you install it yourself? For now, I just went with Daystar 1.75 coil spacers. Put it in myself. I MIGHT add a 1 inch body lift with 1 inch motor mounts, if I get to froggy and impatient [;)]. I am going to start saving so that when my 31 BFG MT's wear out, I can upgrade to a full 3.5 susp system and 33's. That will put me right where I want to be. I must say, working on the Jeep's susp is a DREAM compared to working on some of my older trucks. |
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Posted: 5/22/2003 7:59:11 AM EDT
[#17]
Quoted: Wranglers (Danglers) are widely regarded as crap in stock form in the offroad community unmodified. You can make them very good but it'd be cheaper to buy a used hummer. Your joking right? If you HAVE to have a heep, get a TJ with the round headlights. They are very capable out of the box. I thought in your previous statement you said they were crap? Older heeps like the cj-7 and -5 have more personality and are generally built better than the danglers, but if you can't swing a Land Cruiser (best choice) then get the newer TJ. Since you seem to indicate that the TJ isnt built very well, what year is yours? |
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Posted: 5/22/2003 7:12:18 PM EDT
[#18]
We (son and I) have had four Jeeps. Three of them were CJ-7s and one is a Wrangler. I guess you'd say I have a little bit of experience with them.
Obviously, we like 'em, and consider ourselves to be [i]Jeepers[/i], but... IMHO, Jeepers are like Harley owners. We're loyal to our rides, no matter how much they nickle & dime us - and I hate to admit it, but they do - if you really use them. Ours are daily drivers, and make the occasional trip out onto the beach for surf fishing. Other than that, no rough usage. I'm a GM man for every other vehicle, and can honestly say that our Jeeps have required more work than all other vehicles I've ever owned (I'm over 40) combined. We still love 'em though. [:)] |
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Posted: 5/22/2003 7:47:52 PM EDT
[#19]
Quoted: Wranglers (Danglers) are widely regarded as crap in stock form in the offroad community unmodified. You can make them very good but it'd be cheaper to buy a used hummer. After +/- $250 for a RE spacer lift and +/- $100 for the front swaybar quick disconnects, you'll have this. [img]http://images.cardomain.com/member_img_a/353000-353999/353202_8_full.jpg[/img] Articulation enough to have the tire touching the underside of the fender. From the other side. [img]http://images.cardomain.com/member_img_a/353000-353999/353202_2_full.jpg[/img] In the time I've had mine the only things to go wrong were a turn signal buring out, and a wiring connector behind the gauge cluster came loose and caused the gauges to stop working. Otherwise trouble free. Jeep, don't leave home without one. [;)] |
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Posted: 5/22/2003 7:49:35 PM EDT
[#20]
I have a '91 YJ, and I've owned both an '81 and an '83 CJ5. One thing that I've noticed about the YJs is how much better thought out the design of the soft top is, over the CJ series; mine has so far put up with quite a few HEAVY downpours, and hasn't yet leaked a drop. My CJs leaked like the top was made of chicken wire. I also lifted it about 3 inches, using lift shackles, and add-a-leafs. Doing it this way, I've lost some articulation, but since I don't really need a whole lot of suspension travel for the type of off-roading I do, it suits me fine. Mine has a (yecch!) 4-cylinder engine, but does ok, running 31x10.5 tires; I don't spend a whole lot of time in the hammer lane, but that's ok.
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Posted: 5/22/2003 7:51:54 PM EDT
[#21]
I've got a 2000 Wrangler TJ, 6 cylinder, auto.
I've got a 4" suspension lift and 33" tires. I still need to get lockers front and rear, lower gears and a winch. But, even without the "still need to buy" things, I have had a blast with it in the mountains here in CO. It is a hell of a fun vehicle to own. |
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Posted: 5/22/2003 8:01:57 PM EDT
[#22]
Quoted: For now, I just went with Daystar 1.75 coil spacers. Put it in myself. I MIGHT add a 1 inch body lift with 1 inch motor mounts, if I get to froggy and impatient [;)] Here's a pic of mine with a coil spacer lift and 1" body lift on 31's. [img]http://images.cardomain.com/member_img_a/353000-353999/353202_17_full.jpg[/img] I did the raised motor mounts as well. Now I need to get a high clearance transfer case skid to take advantage of the extra room. |
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Posted: 5/23/2003 2:58:41 PM EDT
[#23]
Quoted: Wranglers (Danglers) are widely regarded as crap in stock form in the offroad community unmodified. You can make them very good but it'd be cheaper to buy a used hummer. If you HAVE to have a heep, get a TJ with the round headlights. They are very capable out of the box. Older heeps like the cj-7 and -5 have more personality and are generally built better than the danglers, but if you can't swing a Land Cruiser (best choice) then get the newer TJ. Who in the "offroad community" rides around in stock vehicles? With that in mind, you have to realize that Jeeps are very easy and relatively inexpensive to modify heavily. That's why they're so popular, and that's also why you rarely see Hummers and Rovers/Cruisers out on the trails. I've never actually seen, in person, a Cruiser or Hummer that's as capable as my Jeep, which only has about $3k of mods. Not because they aren't (or can't be made) capable, but because it's cost prohibitive to do so. |
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Posted: 5/23/2003 5:19:23 PM EDT
[#24]
Five0, I'm lookin for a Wrangler as well- preferably a YJ. I've done some research and talked to a few owners and nobody seems to have any serious complaints. I've never heard of anybody having tranny problems: maybe the guys you've talked to have been the unlucky few to get the runts of the pack- then again, maybe I haven't talked to enough people. So I guess the verdict is still out....... |
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Posted: 5/23/2003 5:24:30 PM EDT
[#25]
Quoted: Quoted: What kind of lift did you get Hawkeye? Did you install it yourself? For now, I just went with Daystar 1.75 coil spacers. Put it in myself. I MIGHT add a 1 inch body lift with 1 inch motor mounts, if I get to froggy and impatient [;)]. I am going to start saving so that when my 31 BFG MT's wear out, I can upgrade to a full 3.5 susp system and 33's. That will put me right where I want to be. I must say, working on the Jeep's susp is a DREAM compared to working on some of my older trucks. Sounds like it's gonna be niiiiiccceee. Post a pic if you get the chance, Hawkeye. I love lookin at Jeeps. |
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Posted: 5/23/2003 5:31:55 PM EDT
[#26]
While we're on the Jeep subject here, could any of you tell me what "lockers" and the "Dana 44" is? I'm a newbie with the Jeep lingo. Thanks alot |
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Posted: 5/23/2003 5:52:14 PM EDT
[#27]
A locker is a device that is put in the differential. It locks both tires on that axle together so that they receive equal amounts of torque. If one tire is in the air, and one on the ground, you will still keep moving via the one on the ground. There are numerous different kinds of lockers. Some are automatic, some are electrically activated, others are air activated. Lockers are similar in concept to a limited slip differential. An open diff, means that all the power going to that axle with take the path of least resistance, via the tire with the least amount of traction. Example: if you have one rear tire in sand, and the opposite rear tire on pavement, you would probably sit still, because the tire in the sand would have less resistance than the one on the pavement and would get all the power. A limited slip sends power to both tires, regardless of traction. It attempts to keep one tire from turning faster than the other. It can be overcome though with the right circumstances. A locker, takes that a step further. An automatic locker can be over come, but not nearly as easily as a LS unit. An Air locker like an ARB, fully locks the axle when activated. There is no slip at all. Both tires receive equal power all the time and one cant turn faster than the other. Thats a quick simple version.
A Dana 44 is a type of axle. Most Jeeps have a Dana 35 rear, and a Dana 30 front. A Dana 44 is a heavier duty axle. The larger the number, the stronger the axle. It will have a larger ring and pinion and have more splines on the axle shaft, thus increasing its strength. That means it can take larger tires, more weight, and withstand more power applied to it. Hope that isnt too confusing, there really is more to it than that, but its a long conversation to get into. I got my new tires on today. Will try to get some new pics up when I can. I really like the way its turning out so far. |
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Posted: 5/23/2003 5:58:22 PM EDT
[#28]
I had a 1994 wrangler and burned out the trany, and clutch. But this was after some serious beatings on the tank trails of Ft Bragg. I drove it hard for 5 years, that, and a water pump went on me are the only problems I every had. The water pump I did myself. Thats not too bad. I've considered selling my truck and getting a 2003. Once you have one, theyre hard to get rid of. And if you do get rid of it, youll think about getting another every time you see somebody else in one. Just reading this thread is giving me the Jeep jones again.
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Posted: 5/23/2003 6:02:25 PM EDT
[#29]
[url]http://www.offroaders.com/album/clearfield/clear-06012k1/[/url]
Check out the pics in here.....there is a Tracker in there kicking some ass.... |
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Posted: 5/23/2003 6:20:56 PM EDT
[#30]
94 Jeep wrangler w/4.0, 5spd, 3.55 rear axle here. So far I have busted;
1 rear axle. 1 ring and pinion set including yoke. 2 transfer case tailpiece castings. 1 transfer case 2-4 wheel drive shift fork. umm... maybe a few other things too. But in all fairness I have to admit it was all my fault. I used to get my kicks drag racing 5.0 mustangs and rolling 31-10.50s from a standing start is murder on a drive train. However, the jeep corp service is incompetent. The front axle vacuum disconnect is a driveline part and no amount of arguing could convince the asswipes is wasn't a stuck 4wd indicator switch that went bad. Oh well, I fixed it myself and will never buy another hitler-daimler-chrysler-jeep again all because such incredibly poor service departments. BTW, Jeep is not affiliated with the better business bureau. They have their own customr bitch department. Of course all they do is rubber stamp what the moronic dealers give them. Screw Herr Daimler just for his service dept. |
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Posted: 5/23/2003 6:41:08 PM EDT
[#31]
I've owned a 1993 YJ Wrangler, 1985 CJ, and now have a 1998 TJ Wrangler. The 93 was problem free, the 85 was problem free, and the 98 is another story. So far, 2 front pinion seals over 2 years, one rear main seal, one radiator, and one right rear axle seal. In all fairness, I did tow around a couple boats that were at the max capacity rating. Gas mileage is around 13 miles to the gallon.I still love my little beotch though. Never left me stranded.
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Posted: 5/23/2003 6:41:42 PM EDT
[#32]
I've owned three jeeps. All were AMC and prior. Needless to say they all sucked as far as relaibility went. They had tons of personality. Similar to harleys or jaguars. Would I buy another? MAybe a TJ if I neede a short WB, but not likely. I'd proabbly build a late 70s TLC or even an early '90s D-90. In summary, you can get a lot more vehicle for less money. You just got to learn to cut through the crap. ZT
2001 Trooper w/ARB bull bar, Warn m8000, OME springs, Rancho RS9000s, 33" ATs, TOR sliders, CALMINI sways, 4.30 axles (stock), modified D-60 rear axle (stock), soon to be locked front, tied w/ Toy in relaibility honors! |
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Posted: 5/23/2003 6:56:21 PM EDT
[#33]
1985 CJ7
1991 Commanche (I4) 1994 Cherokee (I4) 1997 Cherokee (I6) 1999 Wrangler (I6) 2001 Wranger (I6) No major problems with any of them. Sometimes I wonder what the heck you guys with all the problems are doing wrong...or what the hell am I doing RIGHT? That's 6 Jeeps since 1985 and the biggest problem I've had with any of them was a waterpump in the '94 Cherokee. Currently we are looking at a new Rubicon...I will ALWAYS own a Jeep. |
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Posted: 5/25/2003 2:41:10 PM EDT
[#34]
DAMN! Thanks guys! A lot here to digest. I am certainly in the market!
Thanks much! I wanted to ask about reasonable pricing but I got a bit tied up. |
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Posted: 5/25/2003 2:57:42 PM EDT
[#35]
'preciate the info, Hawkeye |
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Posted: 5/25/2003 3:02:01 PM EDT
[#36]
I have a 94 CJ.
I found it was best for getting me LAID. Chicks really check out a guy in a Jeep. |
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Posted: 5/26/2003 9:05:29 AM EDT
[#37]
Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: What kind of lift did you get Hawkeye? Did you install it yourself? For now, I just went with Daystar 1.75 coil spacers. Put it in myself. I MIGHT add a 1 inch body lift with 1 inch motor mounts, if I get to froggy and impatient [;)]. I am going to start saving so that when my 31 BFG MT's wear out, I can upgrade to a full 3.5 susp system and 33's. That will put me right where I want to be. I must say, working on the Jeep's susp is a DREAM compared to working on some of my older trucks. Sounds like it's gonna be niiiiiccceee. Post a pic if you get the chance, Hawkeye. I love lookin at Jeeps. Here are a couple that I took with my new Digi cam that my wife got me for my Birthday yesterday. These are just out in the backyard, nothing special. Went for a ride at the beach for a while this morning and played around a little. I was thoroughly amazed. I LOVE this Jeep. Forgot to take the freakin camera with me or I would have had some nice pics. [img]http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid63/p946e072b65f3f949e1e0568edcc550bc/fc128891.jpg[/img] [img]http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid63/p622abe4b3e0b79e77599a33169fafacb/fc128893.jpg[/img] |
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