The M249 SAW, POS or just needs better parts?

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[ARCHIVED THREAD] - The M249 SAW, POS or just needs better parts?

Posted: 5/14/2003 4:50:16 PM EDT

I carried a SAW for 2 years. My experience is:

1 Heavy
2 Carring your own extra barrell and amo sucked
3 Bipod was weak and would often break
4 If you oiled the bolt carrier then it would smoke and irritate your eyes when fired
5 If you oiled to lightly it would jam
6 The 30 round GI mag option made it more of a single shot

Now I actually loved the weapon. Didn't have to many malfunctions and such. How ever many give it a really poor performance rateing. Also I know an armorer that says all his problems come from 249s that are worn out. On CNN I never saw a SAW that was not jaming.
So is the SAW a POS and time for an upgraded model or is it time to replace it with some thing new? I think that the shrike would be an interesting replacement system. What type of weapon would you sugest?

Posted: 5/14/2003 5:10:47 PM EDT

[#1]

SAWs. Kick. Ass.

Posted: 5/14/2003 6:06:16 PM EDT

[#2]

CIS Ultimax 100
From Singapore, takes only M16-type magazines. Is developed with 100-round drums.
http://world.guns.ru/machine/mg20-e.htm

HK21E
If 7.62 isnt your fancy then theres the HK23 in 5.56

Or the good ole' reliable RPK74, All the reliablility of an AK47 (Pour dirt in and it will shoot- also operates under water without problems), in a reinforced light-machinegun design. Use with 100round drums for best results.
(Note: I understand that using a Russian-designed weapon is precived as very anti-american, but M249 comes from belgium. Cold war is over).

Of all, I would prefer the HK23E most.

Posted: 5/14/2003 6:20:46 PM EDT

[#3]

in my experience the SAW earned its bad reputation from training exercises. it is HORRIBLE with blanks. and trying to run blanks from an M16 magazine and you might as well run around with a stick yelling "BANG BANG BANG"

now a clean SAW, liberally oiled with live ammo and you got yourself a party!!!

Posted: 5/14/2003 6:22:22 PM EDT

[#4]

The SAW I carried was born 3 years after me, and I am 23. I have no clue how a new SAW would perform, but the SAW's in my unit were about as reliable as Tim Couch.

Posted: 5/14/2003 6:27:05 PM EDT

[#5]

I also carried the SAW in the Army

I know what you mean about the oil, it is a PITA!
I Also agree that is a little heavy for just 5.56.
I never had any jams, but then again, I never used it in harsh conditions also.

Posted: 5/14/2003 10:51:02 PM EDT

[#6]

I did see a SAW jam during live coverage in Iraq... had to wonder about that.

Posted: 5/15/2003 12:22:18 AM EDT

[#7]

Quoted:
SAWs. Kick. Ass.

View Quote

Exactly, quit bitching Saw is tough.

Posted: 5/15/2003 12:36:08 AM EDT

[#8]

got to use one repeatedly in the Marine Arty, enjoyed it. Never broke anything, regular maintenance seemed enough, and the 30rd mag was always referred to as an 'emergency' option, so never was concerned with its performance.

That said, improvements / upgrades are always welcome.

Posted: 5/15/2003 12:54:14 AM EDT

[#9]

I think the SAW was a good weapon overall. I was in weapons squad so usually we had m60's or on vehicles had the .50 or MK19. But when I did use the SAW I thought it was pretty good, but think they should have stuck to 7.62.

Posted: 5/15/2003 10:11:26 AM EDT

[#10]

IMI Negev. Its the IDFs "debugged" M249.

Lighter, runs without being liberally oiled. Lower reciever and bolt redesigned so that the magazine feeds from straight below so its now reliable with M16 mags-enough so that when doing CQB they often choose to switch to a magazine. Esp when using the short barrel.

[url]http://www.isayeret.com/weapons/lmg/negev/variants.htm[/url]

Posted: 5/15/2003 11:51:15 AM EDT

[#11]

Quoted:
......but the SAW's in my unit were about as reliable as [b]Tim Couch[/b].

View Quote

Ouch!!! Thems is fightin' werds from wher I'm standing (which is the home of the University of Kentucky)

On topic....I've never shot a SAW, but haven't noticed the SAWs really jamming at the Knob Creek though, for whatever that's worth, which isn't much.

Posted: 5/15/2003 2:25:27 PM EDT

[#12]

Quoted:
IMI Negev. Its the IDFs "debugged" M249.

Lighter, runs without being liberally oiled. Lower reciever and bolt redesigned so that the magazine feeds from straight below so its now reliable with M16 mags-enough so that when doing CQB they often choose to switch to a magazine. Esp when using the short barrel.

[url]http://www.isayeret.com/weapons/lmg/negev/variants.htm[/url]

View Quote

Thats a cool weapon.

Posted: 5/15/2003 2:46:11 PM EDT

[#13]

SAWs dont jam at knob creek because they are low milage collector guns. most of the SAWs in service are worn out and ready for the band saw.

Posted: 5/15/2003 2:55:03 PM EDT

[#14]

Adopt the Negev design, call it M249A1.

Supposedly they are close enough to each other, if the barrels will interchange, we wouldn't need much else, since belts and mags are the same.

Tukka might know more about how close a Minimi and a Negev are to each other.

Posted: 5/15/2003 5:39:46 PM EDT

[#15]

If you guys think the M249 is heavy try carrying the M240 MAG for awhile and you'll think the SAW is made of feathers.

The mag issue with the SAW is due to cyclic rate. It simply cannnot feed the weapon fast enough especially on the high cyclic rate.

And virtually any complaint about the M249 is true of any other support weapon.

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - The M249 SAW, POS or just needs better parts?

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