Here's the deal. My boy is 13 and on total brain drain. He is ofically "Smarter" than dad and we cramp his "Style".

I knew that it was comming and can accept it. Hell, I remember when I was that age.

The big problem is with him following instructions. He can't remember to take out trash or clean his room. He can't even remember to close a door behind him. Seriously. Three times today. Tell him to go close it and he walks by it and does not stop.

He is not trying to get my goat or push my buttons. some of you know him, he is a good kid. I worry thet he won't live to see 18. No, I am not going to whack him, I worry about him walking out in front of a truck, or getting lost walking home from school. You can see the school door from my front door, but I still worry.
Added info, he is one of the ADHD kids, no medication. I know some don't buy into the ADHD program, but I for one believe.

Anyone who has advice or suggestions, please help. We are at our wits end... fullclip

When ever I didnt follow instructions my parents beat me.  Worked

Sell him to the gypsies.

My oldest is 15 now, same situation.
As he gets older, he gets better. We thought the ADHD thing too, but the more time goes by and the more I remember how we were at that age, it seems more normal.

Raised 2 teenage stepsons. They are now grown and very successful in their respective fields.

But that stretch between 13 and 19 was a bitch.

I feel deeply for you [b]fullclip[/b]. Your patience' are in for a serious workout.

At age 13, my father was 6'5" 250.  All he had to do was look at me and I did what he said...I got cocky one time and started to talk shit to him and my Mother....lets just say my father dropped the HAMMER!

He never had a problem w/ me again..It sounds F-ed up, but boy did it work!

Spectre, we have been to a lot of specialist on the ADHD thing, tried all the drugs. They tended to work, but the side effects were terrible. We dedided to go with the diet and tlc route.

He is similar to me at that age, but the days where he get worse, fatigue makes him go wild with energy, are hard to bear... fullclip

I was a youth pastor for over 5 years, & this is still one of my favorite jokes.

Bible scholars have figured out that Isaac was somewhere between the age of 11 or 12 years old when Abraham took him up to the mountain to be a sacrifice. They  figured out if he had waited until he was 13 that it wouldn't have been much of a sacrifice.[rofl2]

Seriously though, the teenage years are the most rebellious years of a persons life. It's not to late to tell him you will kill him, & make another one just like him.[:D]

Yep. Same here. I became a better person because of it[^]

Did you guys say something? I wasn't paying attention. [:D]

Seriously this is a stage. I'm not saying let it go, just deal with it. Don't let "little" stupid shit turn into big shit.

Keep on him and ride his ass secure in the knowledge that you drive him fucking nuts too.

I guess I missed something here, could you explain again?

As for the beatings, some of the guys have joked about it, but aside from some spankings at a younger age, I have found some other methods that work better.

He is a very smart boy, there is no puzzle or game that he cannot defeat, if it holds his interest. And as for his school work, the only bad grades he gets, b is a bad one for him, it is because of failure to turn in work on time. The work itself is near perfect.

I guess the key is "If it holds his interest". If not, it is passed by. Thanks... fullclip

Mine is just turning 13 and I know exactly what you are talking about!  One thing I have learned, is that this begins the time where you realize that this fatherhood business starts taking much more time and effort.  I really have to spend more time being an influence, hopefully positive, to try to stay ahead of his active mind.  If I don't do things to keep it occupied, he'll find something.  That is just too scary to contemplate.

speaking from a 16 year olds perspective, I would say, when I was littler, I know my dad spanked me (this was when I was really young though).

He only had to spank me once for him to put me in my place. Now, I thank him for it because I'm not the spoiled littrle brat most other people my age are.

Just put some Playboy Magazine cut-outs (Or print out the BOTD thread) on the back of all the doors.  He'll close em, I guaruntee it.




Patriot - Can't wait til I have chitlinz.

Its tough to loose control. You are in the same position as most parents. good plan not to wack him. he's his own person going thru his own growth. remain friendly so you can repeat things he may absorb.

Put him to work!  Send him to a friends farm for the summer or something like.  Some good hard physical labor does wonders to give kids some disipline.  It is like beating their butts everyday!

Great idea, I have the farm, I was raised on one myself. only problem is he would have to be supervised by my mother everyday. I couldn't allow that.

There is not much he likes more than a trip to the farm, the work is paid off by the four-wheeler and guns.. fullclip

I feel your pain, brother.  I just finished making my 14 year-old do the ear-dance from his bedroom to the kitchen to clean up the mess he left behind after making his lunch for school tomorrow.  It is almost as if at age 12, God cuts the power to half of his brain cells.  My 11 year-old is already starting to show signs of it.

All I can say is hang in there.  I know that I was a [b]complete[/b] idiot from ages 13-19, and I think that I turned out alright.  Well, I didn't wind up in jail, anyway.

Adolescents not only go through changes in the body..but their brain also changes, new neural pathways are grown, and their frontal brain lobes (where reasoning takes place) also begin to grow. Because their frontal lobes are growing, most of their reasoning process takes place in hippocamus part of the brain.

So..you can expect to see a lot of strange behavior between ages 13-15 including mood swings and short term memory problems.

You can also expect to see a lot of experimentation in terms of identity, lots of different hair and clothing styles and music.

Between 15-17 you can expect a lot of rebelliousness as they seek to assert their own independence. At this stage, you can also expect to feel the most stress in your marriage, brought on by your teenager.

What is that saying that goes something like...

"Your punishment will be bearing children that act the same as you."

That would probably help along with an after school something or other that will interest him and be good for him...when he turns 14 he can be an Explorer...

I think it made me a little to good so I am making up for it now though.

it's part of growing up, really it's no big deal.  I'm 22 so I can still remember my days, and my younger brother is 13.  Most kids grow out of it.

Take him shark fishing... Ask "Hey wanna go 'Chum?'"... JUST KIDDING!!!!

Oh my friend's kid is 14 and he fucking knows it all. Wonder boy. We are losers and dont know shit. Too bad he is scared of authority.

I didn't end up in jail, but I took a couple rides in cruisers...

That being said, I think ADHD exists in some people bordering autism, but not in 99% of the people diagnosed these days... It's definately a scapegoat

My younger brother supposedly has ADHD, but he can sit and play a videogame for hours... On the other hand, a person I knew a (long) while ago had (has?) ADHD and couldn't sit still. Even if something had his full blown attention, it wasn't going to last more than about 10 minutes... Always annoyed the crap out of me cause he would change games every 2-10 minutes...

My suggestion would be to find something he is interested in and "help" him explore it without interfering. This is the time in his life when he will choose what he wants to do...

And I totally agree with TJ about punishments AND rewards. My father used to beat me for anything I did wrong, and ignore me the rest of the time. When I was somewhere around 13 he moved out and changed, a LOT (there is no way to convey how much he really changed). He had numerous talks with me pertaining to "there is no right and wrong, rather there are actions and consequences."

I have a lot more to say, but it's late and I dont know your son. I feel your frustration, but ultimately you are the one to decide your course of action...

Jonathan

Find something he really likes, buy it for him and use it to reward and reinforce good behavior and keep him from it to provide consequences....a new Honda xr 200 for him and a XR 400 for you?

Behavior modification via Points System(this worked at the group home I worked at for adolecent sex offenders and high risk youth)

make a punch list that is a living document  that has a place for check marks at each task for each day of the week.....(homework complete, take out trash, close door, mow lawn, make bed, ect...)....assighn a point value for each task. When he fails to complete a task, put in a check.  Begin on monday end on sunday.  Begin w/ 100 points and subtract at the end of the week.  between 90 and 100 at the end of the week  gives him Between A to B prvilages, behavior between 80 and 90 will give him B to C privies, and so on.

Behavior on week one dictates the privilages of the following week(delayed gratification/and punitive measures)  After a few weeks on the system, he will begin to manipulate it. He will know he can not take out the trash 2 times and not make his bed once and still get full privilages(this suck but deal with it, he IS learning to monitor his on behaivior and manipulate his environment,,,,,this is good)  I worked with kids that would do perfect all week, just so they could call me a stupid mother fucker on the last day as I left my shift, knowing full well that they would only loose 10 pionts for Verbal Aggression and still maintain thier full privilages..... It didnt bother me a bit...any problem child that can maintain control and plan that kind of shit was well on their way to being a functional member of society.

Just my .02



It will be tough at first...but he will soon get the picture. Especially after he does good one week and the two of you go dirt bike riding or skiing or fishing on a saturday...this also gives you a chance to spend time with him in a fun atmosphere and he will see you as an authority figure and role model as well as a great dad.

or, standby and do nothing, and your kid will turn into a dopesomkeing street urchin that is too cool for school

-HS


edited to add:   The Point System worked with kids that had ADD and ADHD(so said the Witch Dr.) that were not on meds because thier parents didnt believe in meds. The IQ's in question were various: it doesnt matter...eventually the retards figured it out(eating booger in public... -5 points)

get his teachers involved as well, if he spends 5th period algebra stareing out of a window, you need to know(-3 points)

He's entered the evil twin phase !!


And that ADAH crap.....  Total Bullshit.

Thanks, I'm 40 and no kids.

GOOD LUCK.


Oh, maybe he discovered the joys of mary jane.

I'm 46 and got my first child when she was 8, she's now 15. (She's my stepdaughter, I met my wife 8 years ago)
But I also got a psycho-exhusband, attorney's and pack of corrupt judges.

At 15, my daughter too "knows it all" and is "too cool".
When I speak to her I can see that her BRAIN IS NOT WORKING.
She's on "Brainstem Behavior"......seriously! NO higher function most of the time.

When she actually does "think", you can see her jumpstart her brain. It's a physical change!!!

I'm getting a vasectomy for my Birthday!
I'm not going thru this $hit again!

I never had, or wanted, offspring.

I got this one as part of "a package deal".

SEX is the act, children are/is the punishment for your stupidity.

NO....I don't enjoy the child.

On her 18th birthday......the world WILL change.

TJ and HS, you have given me a great deal of things to try, thanks. If they don't work can I send the kid to you? Just kidding, couldn't make it without him.

I didn't think one kid would be this much work. Kind of thought just feed and water them and it would be OK. little did I know....

TJ, the thoughts on the ADHD angle seem to run with what I have learned. I have read everything I could find for the last 7yrs, and about the only things I know for sure are:
The schools use it as an excuse for poor performance in both teachers and students. Look at the "drug lines" for the noon feeding of ADHD drugs. Sickening.
Every child reacts differently, as no two kids are the same with the problem.
Many parents want to use ADHD as an excuse for not wanting wo work with dicipline for thier kids.

With my kid and the games, if I leave it to him he will try the easy ones and quit if they get too hard, but if I stand ofer his shoulder and keep him calm, he can defeat any you give him. The frustration level builds, and you can see it happen. This kid gets to feeling overwhelmed with any task, and has to have a calming influence with him or he just gives up and wanders off.

Thanks for the help and the chanch to vent. Have to cut this short of I will be late to work. Keep the tips comming... fullclip

I have a friend who was on meds as a child for severe ADD.  At the age of 20 or 21 he was placed on meds for it again.  I believe that he's off of them now.

We worked for the same employer for a short amount of time and I have to say he was one of the best workers I ever had around.  However, you had to give him only two things to do with instructions to immediately find you when he was done.  Or give him a notepad with what you wanted done by the end of the day.  Usually he finished up everything within a couple of hours and was extremely nice to all of the customers.

Outside of work I found it was easier to keep him focused by fun things we had in common.  I trained him for a very short time in martial arts and he would remain very focused on that and even called to thank me one time after he had an altercation.  Vid games were another fave pasttime.  Trying to teach him how to cook was a disaster.  Hopefully his wife will do most of the cooking in the house.  

Hang in there dads.
My 16 yr old genius is not as bad as I was.

My lil guy just turned 19 mos last week, (36" tall and 30 lbs)   so I have the grace period before the teens hit.   May I offer a suggestion?   Dr.  James Dobson has a book out called "Bringing Up Boys" .  I have read the book and even sat through the video series for it.   I highly recommend it to any parents with boys.   Dobson also has written a book for boys to read about what is going on with them and what they can expect.   Have not read that book yet, but it comes strongly recommended.   "Bringing Up Boys" really opened my eyes and Dobson even encourages taking your boys hunting/shooting...how many authors will do that in today's media?    

Cosmos

I don't know the details of you relationship with your step-daughter but having had 7 years to guide and maybe even mold her one has to wonder why she acts the way you say she does.

Parenting is not all that challenging if you follow a simple rule: Your children are your priority. You take on the responsibility of raising a child in that manner when you concieve a child, allow that child to be born (depending on your religious beliefs) or enter into a marriage with a child in the picture.

Maybe she picks up on your feelings toward her and responds in a normal fashion.

I'm not going to tell you how to raise you step-kid because some people don't have what it takes to be parents. But, judging from your demeanor, it's likely that on her 18th birthday her world will change...for the better.

I think that ADHD is a cop out dx by both parents and Dr's.They love to jump the gun and rx them ritalin or whatever the new drug of choice is to "prevent" destructive behaviour.

In this day and age of two working households really hurts that family and kids especially.Kids, even teenagers need constant partenting and positive influence.You can't just expect a kid to succeed without that.

Often, parents just buy the kids whatever they want out of guilt for not being there;Nintendo, Mtn. Dew, Doritos and Hostess cakes.

I have four kids ages 10,8,7,6, so I can speak from experience.We took in the oldest(got him at age three) as our own after his parents were shipped off to pokeyland. Now, this kid was MESSED up. When we got him he was covered in body lice, scabies, and a mullet that would put to shame Joe Dirts.

The kid has given me some serious trouble;spitting in a teachers cup, and a couple classroom disruptions.But, I starightened him out and put him back in line, for now..

I KNOW he's gonna be a handful when he hits the teenage years, but I hope to continue steering in the right path.

My nine yr old is pretty good.Never a problem with him.I got him into business this year.I lent him a couple hundred dollars to start his own business.He started selling those trading cards kids are all into nowadays.I built him two display cases and rented him one of my tables at a flea market I sell at and he's now hustling.He's up to two tables and four display cases now.Does his own buying,inventory and accounting; with my supervision of course.

It's kinda sad when the kid is making more than I in a single sunday...lol

Anyways, get the boy involved in some enterprise or something.Keep his wheels turning.

Congratulations, your boy does NOT have ADHD or ADD. A real ADD kid can't watch TV for ten minutes quietly much less do a puzzle.

I remember when we used to call ADD and ADHD "being a boy".

I think a good thing to remember about 13 year old boys is "Testosterone good".  Testosterone is the best drug ever, and we make it ourselves. It also leaves us with about as much mental ability and focus as a chimp with a fish hook in its eye that has been soaked in acetone and set afire.

Want to see your kid get better focus? Try cutting out TV and computer games for a week. Also try a whole food solution with a diet heavy on cereal grains and fish. There are many ways to deal with a teen PITA that don't involve violence or drugs.

Thomas Jefferson said it best, above:

"Rewards for good behavior and consequences for bad behavior are paramount."

[One of these days I gotta figure out how you guys do that neat quote doohickey thing]

Anyway, I've got an 8 year old son and a 13 year old daughter.  The daughter is really getting a good "mouth" on her.

The son is still in the "good kid" age range.  We went shooting at Swan Creek yesterday and he shot his AR-15 for the first time (both Swan Creek and Guntersville Dam have been closed since Xmas).  I don't look forward to the rebellous years, but I know I'll get through it.

You just gotta remember that no matter what they do, they will always come back to you for something.  And when they do, you got them!!!

Good luck,

Merlin

http://www.homestarrunner.com/tgs3.html    turn the sound up... this will teach ya

Some more great tips here today. One thing I see is the opinion on the ADHD angle. Some believe, some don't.

The fact that my kid is going thru the same things I did is one thing I want to avoid. Some of the feeelings of insecurity, being overwhelmed, and loss of control led to abusiveness in family and teachers I will not stand for in association with my child. Don't misunderstand, a spanking is not the same as a beating or some of the other punishments pissed off adults on a power trip can dream up.

Cosmos, thanks for the book tip, will look into it.

Ed, The girls are there too. They never made them look like that when I was young!![:)]

Soylent_Green...Tactical Jew..While I agree the ADHD is overblown, I still believe there is something to it. We left the drugs and went to a diet and more hands-on parenting when he was in the first grade.

Tumor, I just can't think of anything to say about your thoughts.[:(]

Thanks guys... fullclip

That spanking crap is way out of line for a young man his age!   Sure at that age what we do or want him to do just doesn't interest him(so he just blows it off and tries to endure(same as you or me at a piano recital).

All you can do is impress upon him that he is part of a loving(never failing)family and we work together for the good and well being of the family.


Find something that interests him(really gets his attention)  with us it was Little League,baseball ,football!

Then try to work that into the equation with school,homework(and I don't mean school work).

Just give him Love and lots of it(and time as well).

He will grow out of these awkward years,just don't let them scar you or him!  When he gets about twenty-five or so he will think you have been taking night college courses!

   Bob  [:D]

Going through something similiar, at the moment. Here is what I've done so far, and it's working. When my son went to his mother's place for Easter weekend, I yanked his TV, Telephone, even the cable connected to the cable jack, and all games attached to the TV. I also brought out his sleeping bag and set it in the middle of the floor. When he got back, I had mentioned to him about the clear instructions I gave him before he left (his room was a mess). I made him clean what parts needed cleaned in his room, and told him he had to sleep in the living room using his sleeping bag for a week, if continued to live like a pig in his room then he will be sleeping in the back patio. I also mentioned that if he misses another homework assignment it's automatic sleep in the back patio time no questions asked. Did I forget to mention the door will be locked while he's back there. After sleeping three days on the floor, he's was whining. I didn't give in. His first week back in his room was lastweek. He went to his mom's place just last weekend, should of seen how nice he left his room. He still doesn't have his TV, or phone back. To tell you the truth, seems like he don't miss it. I've seen his homework completion increase 100%. This kid thought he could ace the test but not turn hardly any homework in. WRONG! His homework is 40% of his grade. The thing that REALLY did it was his mother came in from out of town and sat with him in class the WHOLE day. Talk about embarrassing! He's in eighth grade LOL. Just an idea. [):)]

 In a way I am participating in raising two different generations of kids.
I had mine young, and made all the usual young parent mistakes, but tried for consistency and muddled through it. He’s now 33 and a pretty decent, hard working person raising his own family. He’s doing great, is a terrific person (not just my opinion, told to me by others once they realized the connection.) and I am very proud of him.
I’m now helping “Lady Rain” raise her three ‘teens. (14, 16 and 17 years old.)
 The two oldest are girls. (Whoa, a lot of difference here. The ladies may not like this next statement, but the logic path doesn’t always coincide with real life.)
I’ve been doing this job for a bit over (3) years. Saying that there was a lot of anger etc. when I showed up isn’t the half of it. The girls are now doing fine, they are happy that an adult male is there, and will frequently turn to me to discuss things even though I am the “tough one’, and don’t get wrapped around the emotional axle.
The oldest recently told me that I am one of the few adults that she respects because “You always tell me the truth, and don’t sugarcoats things, even when we discuss my screw-ups. And I trust you because I can count on you to help me even when things are my fault.”  
I kind of enjoy the interaction, and really like the fact that they will discuss anything with me. (Though I now know much more about female plumbing than I ever cared to know.)  Lady Rain was a bit taken back at first, because they sometimes skip past her, but she now realizes that there are mom questions and that there are (pseudo) dad questions.
I never thought that I would have the father-daughter relationship and find, even with the "snot/witch" angle that I like it.
Don't misunderstand me, they are still'teens and we have multiple conflicts & tantrums, but all-in all it is manageable, and in a perverse way, "fun". They do challenge you.
The boy is going to take a bit more time. To those that don’t believe the ADD or ADHD issue, yes it’s overdone, but at times it is a lifesaver. Both sides of his family have depression in their history, and he is the one from this generation tagged with issues.
It’s a long slow process with numerous setbacks if you do it right. Both the psychiatrist and we are believers in minimal chemical use and while we are getting somewhere it is a sometimes-painful road.

The big thing that I see between “my” kids is that my first boy understood the ratio of work to rewards, and understood the concept of consequences.
My younger kids do not. They are very bright, but in my mind blind to reality. We have a ton of kids underfoot all the time, and I can report that their friends are likewise obtuse.
This generation of kids operates under different rules than before. I hate to say it, but we had better learn to deal with it because it appears to be widespread.
I suspect that many will adjust their thinking once life b*tch slaps them around a bit, some will never get it.