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Posted: 8/28/2015 6:26:10 PM EDT
[#1]
3-5MOA
Much Halal. |
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Posted: 8/28/2015 6:26:26 PM EDT
[#2]
With an AK, You couldn't hit the side of a barn even if you were standing inside of it.
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Posted: 8/28/2015 6:28:50 PM EDT
[#3]
Within normal engagement distance its adaquete
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Posted: 8/28/2015 6:28:55 PM EDT
[#4]
Couldn't hit the broad side of a barn if you had the muzzle pressed against the wall.
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Posted: 8/28/2015 6:29:09 PM EDT
[#5]
Good enough to do the jobs for which it was designed... parade duty, third-world depopulation, unarmed dissident shooting, and occupying infantry conscripts' hands so they can't break as much stuff.
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Posted: 8/28/2015 6:29:54 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
With an AK, You couldn't hit the side of a barn even if you were standing inside of it. with the door closed |
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Posted: 8/28/2015 6:31:36 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
with the door closed Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
With an AK, You couldn't hit the side of a barn even if you were standing inside of it. with the door closed The guy holding the ak would be too distracted by the goats in the barn. 
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Posted: 8/28/2015 6:32:18 PM EDT
[#8]
It'll probably blow up in your hands first.
Russian=crap. |
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Posted: 8/28/2015 6:32:19 PM EDT
[#9]
They really are pretty much junk.
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Posted: 8/28/2015 6:32:31 PM EDT
[#10]
Even at 6 MOA, that's a hit on a man-sized torso at 200+ yards.
They are not and were never really intended to be precision instruments. I'd be curious to know how your friend defines "good accuracy overall". |
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Posted: 8/28/2015 6:33:50 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Within normal engagement distance its adaquete WW2 distances? Korea? Vietnam? Iraq? Afghanistan? |
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Posted: 8/28/2015 6:33:55 PM EDT
[#12]
Same accuracy as an off the rack AR really. They're pretty good for what they are.
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Posted: 8/28/2015 6:35:11 PM EDT
[#13]
in Soviet Russia, AK47 shoots you.
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Posted: 8/28/2015 6:35:12 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Even at 6 MOA, that's a hit on a man-sized torso at 200+ yards. They are not and were never really intended to be precision instruments. I'd be curious to know how your friend defines "good accuracy overall". I guess he hasn't defined it properly, but for me and another friend, we defined accuracy as hitting a torso sized target at 300yds. Both of us felt quite confident with our ARs we could do it without much of a thought, both of us also own AKs and do not feel confident that we would be able to do it should the need arise without multiple follow up shots. |
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Posted: 8/28/2015 6:37:14 PM EDT
[#15]
Gotta be worst than a Dragunov right? A guy in our club had one and was barely able to break clays at 50yds. I dont wanna imagine an AK.
and yes the guy could shoot. |
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Posted: 8/28/2015 6:38:26 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
WW2 distances? Korea? Vietnam? Iraq? Afghanistan? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Within normal engagement distance its adaquete WW2 distances? Korea? Vietnam? Iraq? Afghanistan? Average rifle engagement distances during those various conflicts probably aren't nearly as disparate as a lot folks think. |
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Posted: 8/28/2015 6:39:35 PM EDT
[#17]
Depends on which make, and what ammo you're using.
Eastern European and Russian stamped guns, about 4 MOA average. Billet receiver with East German or Finnish Defense Forces ammo, 2 MOA or less. This isn't based on what I read on the internet, but years of shooting them dating back to 1990's. Valmet Rk62 and SAKO Rk 92 or 95 are extremely accurate guns, but are not really AK's when you look at how they're made. |
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Posted: 8/28/2015 6:40:04 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Same accuracy as an off the rack AR really. They're pretty good for what they are. No. AKs I've shot off the bench were pie-dish accurate at 100 yards. A bit worse than my old Mini-14 trunk gun. My off the shelf ARs shoot business-card sized groups of ten. |
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Posted: 8/28/2015 6:42:19 PM EDT
[#19]
Honestly, with those pitiful sights, the intrinsic accuracy of the AK doesn't matter a whole lot.
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Posted: 8/28/2015 6:42:39 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Depends on which make, and what ammo you're using. Eastern European and Russian stamped guns, about 4 MOA average. Billet receiver with East German or Finnish Defense Forces ammo, 2 MOA or less. Valmet Rk62 and SAKO Rk 92 or 95 are extremely accurate guns, but are not really AK's when you look at how they're made. This.... |
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Posted: 8/28/2015 6:42:46 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Depends on which make, and what ammo you're using. Eastern European and Russian stamped guns, about 4 MOA average. Billet receiver with East German or Finnish Defense Forces ammo, 2 MOA or less. This isn't based on what I read on the internet, but years of shooting them dating back to 1990's. Valmet Rk62 and SAKO Rk 92 or 95 are extremely accurate guns, but are not really AK's when you look at how they're made. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Depends on which make, and what ammo you're using. Eastern European and Russian stamped guns, about 4 MOA average. Billet receiver with East German or Finnish Defense Forces ammo, 2 MOA or less. This isn't based on what I read on the internet, but years of shooting them dating back to 1990's. Valmet Rk62 and SAKO Rk 92 or 95 are extremely accurate guns, but are not really AK's when you look at how they're made. Those are different beasts than the typical AK pattern. I'm specifically talking about AK47s and AK47M styles. Quoted:
Quoted:
Same accuracy as an off the rack AR really. They're pretty good for what they are. No. AKs I've shot off the bench were pie-dish accurate at 100 yards. A bit worse than my old Mini-14 trunk gun. My off the shelf ARs shoot business-card sized groups of ten. So far I have yet to shoot an AR that groups worse than 2" from a benchrest with any kind of ammo |
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Posted: 8/28/2015 6:43:25 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
in Soviet Russia, AK47 shoots you. What about Romania? |
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Posted: 8/28/2015 6:44:15 PM EDT
[#23]
It should be good for minute of trashcan accuracy.
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Posted: 8/28/2015 6:45:26 PM EDT
[#24]
In my experience, AKs are *way* more accurate than a Mini-14 or Mini-30.
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Posted: 8/28/2015 6:45:53 PM EDT
[#25]
With a WASR and tula ammo I get 8 MOA at 100yds. I'd love to try some different ammo in it but beer money comes first.
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Posted: 8/28/2015 6:46:31 PM EDT
[#26]
There are a lot of dead soldiers, Marines, and sailors who would probably disagree with the know it all's who think it couldn't hit the broad side of a barn.
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Posted: 8/28/2015 6:51:07 PM EDT
[#27]
Good enough for the Red Army.
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Posted: 8/28/2015 6:51:44 PM EDT
[#28]
from my experience with my 6 ars and 2 aks i get about .5 moa-2 moa with my ars and 3-5 moa with my aks. if your friend is after accuracy tell him to build an ar. you can buy a larue or rainier barrel and you will have a sub moa gun. it has never been cheaper to build an ar.
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Posted: 8/28/2015 6:51:47 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Same accuracy as an off the rack AR really. They're pretty good for what they are. I can ring 6" steel at 200 yards with every shot from my basic BCM midlength using surplus ammo. Not so much with any of my AKs. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile |
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Posted: 8/28/2015 6:53:46 PM EDT
[#30]
I'd take a full auto AK. Semi, meh.
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Posted: 8/28/2015 6:55:49 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Same accuracy as an off the rack AR really. They're pretty good for what they are. That's been my experience, at least with iron sights. Then again I was never as "sight sensitive" as some here seem to be. In fact I was really surprised at how accurate my AK-74 (older OH Ord. build) is....And I have old eyes. 
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Posted: 8/28/2015 6:56:33 PM EDT
[#32]
I think it was Fortier who was embedded with some Army or Marine unit in Iraq. He wrote an article for one of those periodicals like Book of the AK.
While embedded with this unit, they were able to recover some of hadji's AK ammo. They did a cross section of the bullet. Its steel or tungsten penetrator was off center. So I would imagine the bullet once it was spun up, during its flight wobbled a lot. Imagine a clothes washer with a load out if balance or if your car tire were to throw off one of its wheel weights. |
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Posted: 8/28/2015 6:58:39 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
WW2 distances? Korea? Vietnam? Iraq? Afghanistan? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Within normal engagement distance its adaquete WW2 distances? Korea? Vietnam? Iraq? Afghanistan? More likely encounter riot control or looters out to 50yd |
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Posted: 8/28/2015 6:59:19 PM EDT
[#34]
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Posted: 8/28/2015 6:59:34 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
That's been my experience, at least with iron sights. Then again I was never as "sight sensitive" as some here seem to be. In fact I was really surprised at how accurate my AK-74 (older OH Ord. build) is....And I have old eyes. http://oi50.tinypic.com/34j9c9w.jpg http://oi46.tinypic.com/2zs31bd.jpg Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Same accuracy as an off the rack AR really. They're pretty good for what they are. That's been my experience, at least with iron sights. Then again I was never as "sight sensitive" as some here seem to be. In fact I was really surprised at how accurate my AK-74 (older OH Ord. build) is....And I have old eyes. http://oi50.tinypic.com/34j9c9w.jpg http://oi46.tinypic.com/2zs31bd.jpg For the most part I was talking about AK47s and Aks using 7.62x39 not 5.45x39, the 5.45 guns seem to do much better overall than those chambered in 7.62x39. |
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Posted: 8/28/2015 6:59:58 PM EDT
[#36]
My Krebs -74 was a pleasure to shoot and actually shot pretty well... for an AK. 2" groups at 100.
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Posted: 8/28/2015 7:00:55 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I think it was Fortier who was embedded with some Army or Marine unit in Iraq. He wrote an article for one of those periodicals like Book of the AK. While embedded with this unit, they were able to recover some of hadji's AK ammo. They did a cross section of the bullet. Its steel or tungsten penetrator was off center. So I would imagine the bullet once it was spun up, during its flight wobbled a lot. Imagine a clothes washer with a load out if balance or if your car tire were to throw off one of its wheel weights. Home made, not factory produced |
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Posted: 8/28/2015 7:01:12 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I think it was Fortier who was embedded with some Army or Marine unit in Iraq. He wrote an article for one of those periodicals like Book of the AK. While embedded with this unit, they were able to recover some of hadji's AK ammo. They did a cross section of the bullet. Its steel or tungsten penetrator was off center. So I would imagine the bullet once it was spun up, during its flight wobbled a lot. Imagine a clothes washer with a load out if balance or if your car tire were to throw off one of its wheel weights. You can see that in one of Larry Vickers recent AK-74 vids. 
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Posted: 8/28/2015 7:01:43 PM EDT
[#39]
its a bullet hose. how accurate does it need to be?
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Posted: 8/28/2015 7:01:50 PM EDT
[#40]
Will it make one jagged hole at 100 yards like everyone with an AR says theirs does? No. But, it will hit a man size target at distance just fine.
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Posted: 8/28/2015 7:03:43 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I guess he hasn't defined it properly, but for me and another friend, we defined accuracy as hitting a torso sized target at 300yds. Both of us felt quite confident with our ARs we could do it without much of a thought, both of us also own AKs and do not feel confident that we would be able to do it should the need arise without multiple follow up shots. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Even at 6 MOA, that's a hit on a man-sized torso at 200+ yards. They are not and were never really intended to be precision instruments. I'd be curious to know how your friend defines "good accuracy overall". I guess he hasn't defined it properly, but for me and another friend, we defined accuracy as hitting a torso sized target at 300yds. Both of us felt quite confident with our ARs we could do it without much of a thought, both of us also own AKs and do not feel confident that we would be able to do it should the need arise without multiple follow up shots. You know what to do. Gather your friends and get to a 300 yard range. Walk your talk, buddy! ETA - no personal experience with the AK-74, but I'm under the impression that the -74 is more accurate than the -47. |
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Posted: 8/28/2015 7:04:09 PM EDT
[#42]
I was able to do this at around 80 yards. I was using an adjustable peep sight in the stock location.
ETA: Group probably started to open up when it started to heat up, this was a 20 round rapid fire group, more or less. I think I was using Silver Bear soft points, too. |
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Posted: 8/28/2015 7:06:44 PM EDT
[#43]
Quoted:
Very serious. You're posting in the wrong place. Try the AK forum. |
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Posted: 8/28/2015 7:11:50 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
For the most part I was talking about AK47s and Aks using 7.62x39 not 5.45x39, the 5.45 guns seem to do much better overall than those chambered in 7.62x39. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Same accuracy as an off the rack AR really. They're pretty good for what they are. That's been my experience, at least with iron sights. Then again I was never as "sight sensitive" as some here seem to be. In fact I was really surprised at how accurate my AK-74 (older OH Ord. build) is....And I have old eyes. http://oi50.tinypic.com/34j9c9w.jpg http://oi46.tinypic.com/2zs31bd.jpg For the most part I was talking about AK47s and Aks using 7.62x39 not 5.45x39, the 5.45 guns seem to do much better overall than those chambered in 7.62x39. Build quality is everything. In my experience AKs are sort of like optics, you get what you pay for. My milled SA-M7 Arsenal in 7.62 X 39 is just as accurate as the '74. 
I have a WASR 10/63 under-folder that is of the 3 MOA variety. Fun as all get out though, that's why I still have it.
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Posted: 8/28/2015 7:12:06 PM EDT
[#45]
1. Depends on the AK. They aren't all the same, anymore than AR platform rifles are.
2. Most commercial AK ammo isn't the best stuff in the world. 3. AK sights suck ass compared to the AR. |
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Posted: 8/28/2015 7:12:15 PM EDT
[#46]
i can't comment on the difference in mechanical accuracy between the AR and AK--i just don't have the numbers. but i will tell you the following with absolutely no hesitation:
take your friend out to the country with an AR and an AK. don't mess with KD or groups--just pick out targets (stumps, cans, bright-colored rocks) at random, and have him try to hit them with the AK. then hand him an AR with irons, and you will watch his hit rate improve dramatically. |
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Posted: 8/28/2015 7:13:05 PM EDT
[#47]
If you can see him well enough to know you need to shoot him, you can hit him every time with an AK. I believe that expecting 5" @ 100m mechanical accuracy with assorted ammuniton is fair.
74s are a bit better, accuracy wise. Many eastern optics for the 74 and 100 series guns recommend a 400m zero. Personally, I have seen 2 to 5" with 7.62 and 1.5 to 4" with 5.45. |
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Posted: 8/28/2015 7:13:11 PM EDT
[#48]
Most AK's are 2-3 MOA guns with good quality ammo and a good shooter.
Some are 1-2 MOA with handloads and a excellent trigger puller. |
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Posted: 8/28/2015 7:14:17 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Valmet Rk62 and SAKO Rk 92 or 95 are extremely accurate guns, but are not really AK's when you look at how they're made. Just how accurate? I had someone tell me he did 1 MOA with his issued Rk (think it was a 95). I find that hard to believe for 7.62x39. |
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Posted: 8/28/2015 7:15:11 PM EDT
[#50]
Garbage gun is garbage.
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