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Posted: 10/25/2013 1:43:13 AM EDT
[#1]
Tell me about it.
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Posted: 10/25/2013 1:52:43 AM EDT
[#2]
Oh well. I enjoy being retired. For "middle class" people you pretty much have to be debt free before retiring to make it work. Taking on a new 30 year mortgage when you're 45 years old is not the way to go about it. 
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Posted: 10/25/2013 1:59:19 AM EDT
[#3]
Sounds about right. I will die at my business.
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Posted: 10/25/2013 2:02:59 AM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Oh well. I enjoy being retired. For "middle class" people you pretty much have to be debt free before retiring to make it work. Taking on a new 30 year mortgage when you're 45 years old is not the way to go about it. Unless your mortgage is @ 4% and your investments are returning 15%. 
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Posted: 10/25/2013 2:04:57 AM EDT
[#5]
You see it in threads here.
People paying $200+ a month for the latest smart phone and data plan, high cable / internet monthly bills, $50k pickups parked in the driveway, etc... People live for the here and now.
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Posted: 10/25/2013 2:09:19 AM EDT
[#6]
From the article:
Further, 40 percent say a large unexpected healthcare expense represents their biggest retirement fear, while and 37 percent list the loss or reduction of Social Security as fear No. 1.
This is proceeding as planned (government dependence) As for the stock market, only 24 percent of the middle class view stocks as a good investment for retirement. Meanwhile, 45 percent say "the stock market doesn't benefit people like me."
A majority (52 percent) say they shun stocks because "I am afraid to lose my nest egg in the ups and downs of the market." This despite the market's historical average return of around 10-11%... 
vs the expected -30% return for social security for Gen X'ers. |
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Posted: 10/25/2013 2:14:16 AM EDT
[#7]
Got a better link than Newsmax?
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Posted: 10/25/2013 2:17:50 AM EDT
[#8]
There are a lot of factors. People tend to put off getting married, starting families and buying homes until they are sometimes (much) older than in the past. Which in many cases leads them to carrying debt later in life than in the past. Then there's divorce which resets the clock to zero for quite a few people. 
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Posted: 10/25/2013 2:38:36 AM EDT
[#9]
9 more years to go. Debt Free.
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Posted: 10/25/2013 2:56:25 AM EDT
[#10]
I will never retire.
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Posted: 10/25/2013 3:03:07 AM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You see it in threads here. People paying $200+ a month for the latest smart phone and data plan, high cable / internet monthly bills, $50k pickups parked in the driveway, etc... People live for the here and now. Very true. I read an article once that said the primary reason most middle class Americans struggle with retirement savings is parked in their driveway. |
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Posted: 10/25/2013 3:03:34 AM EDT
[#12]
I figure in 10 years there will be means testing for retirement.[SSI] If you did save and invest, your SSI payments will be cut once your income exceeds X amount. You'll have to draw down your retirement funds to some point before you will receive full payout.
The medical health insurance costs WILL force many who thought they had enough to retire to continue to work or at least work part time. The amount of people I know who are retiring soon while still owing a considerable amount on their house mortgage staggers me. |
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Posted: 10/25/2013 3:21:05 AM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I figure in 10 years there will be means testing for retirement.[SSI] If you did save and invest, your SSI payments will be cut once your income exceeds X amount. You'll have to draw down your retirement funds to some point before you will receive full payout. The medical health insurance costs WILL force many who thought they had enough to retire to continue to work or at least work part time. The amount of people I know who are retiring soon while still owing a considerable amount on their house mortgage staggers me. Which will make the SS system even more redistributive than it already is. I've worked hard all my life, saved and invested a little and will receive a little inheritance. Those who live their lives responsibly, by working and saving, will be punished for their responsibility if/when means testing is employed. |
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Posted: 10/25/2013 3:23:05 AM EDT
[#14]
When you look at what inflation can do to savings it's no wonder.
Your million dollar nest egg becomes worth 10% of what it was and you're screwed. You bust your ass to provide for retirement and STILL wind up in the FSA just to stay alive. I ain't goin' nowhere. |
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Posted: 10/25/2013 3:23:14 AM EDT
[#15]
The true middle class has been shrinking while the number of people who are being falsely told that they are middle class has been increasing.
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Posted: 10/25/2013 3:23:25 AM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Which will make the SS system even more redistributive than it already is. I've worked hard all my life, saved and invested a little and will receive a little inheritance. Those who live their lives responsibly, by working and saving, will be punished for their responsibility if/when means testing is employed. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I figure in 10 years there will be means testing for retirement.[SSI] If you did save and invest, your SSI payments will be cut once your income exceeds X amount. You'll have to draw down your retirement funds to some point before you will receive full payout. The medical health insurance costs WILL force many who thought they had enough to retire to continue to work or at least work part time. The amount of people I know who are retiring soon while still owing a considerable amount on their house mortgage staggers me. Which will make the SS system even more redistributive than it already is. I've worked hard all my life, saved and invested a little and will receive a little inheritance. Those who live their lives responsibly, by working and saving, will be punished for their responsibility if/when means testing is employed. seized and redistributed to make things more 'fair' |
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Posted: 10/25/2013 3:26:26 AM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Which will make the SS system even more redistributive than it already is. I've worked hard all my life, saved and invested a little and will receive a little inheritance. Those who live their lives responsibly, by working and saving, will be punished for their responsibility if/when means testing is employed. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I figure in 10 years there will be means testing for retirement.[SSI] If you did save and invest, your SSI payments will be cut once your income exceeds X amount. You'll have to draw down your retirement funds to some point before you will receive full payout. The medical health insurance costs WILL force many who thought they had enough to retire to continue to work or at least work part time. The amount of people I know who are retiring soon while still owing a considerable amount on their house mortgage staggers me. Which will make the SS system even more redistributive than it already is. I've worked hard all my life, saved and invested a little and will receive a little inheritance. Those who live their lives responsibly, by working and saving, will be punished for their responsibility if/when means testing is employed. SCOTUS ruling on Flemming vs Nestor (1960), no contractual right to Social Security exists. |
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Posted: 10/25/2013 3:27:50 AM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
And I give it a 50% chance that people who lived within their means and saved for retirement will get their 401ks, IRAs seized and redistributed to make things more 'fair' Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I figure in 10 years there will be means testing for retirement.[SSI] If you did save and invest, your SSI payments will be cut once your income exceeds X amount. You'll have to draw down your retirement funds to some point before you will receive full payout. The medical health insurance costs WILL force many who thought they had enough to retire to continue to work or at least work part time. The amount of people I know who are retiring soon while still owing a considerable amount on their house mortgage staggers me. Which will make the SS system even more redistributive than it already is. I've worked hard all my life, saved and invested a little and will receive a little inheritance. Those who live their lives responsibly, by working and saving, will be punished for their responsibility if/when means testing is employed. I think seizing of retirement assets by the government isn't to far off either. All that filthy lucre just sitting there out of reach of government control is akin to a jug of water to a man dying of thirst. [But it will be for our "own good" when they do it.  ]
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Posted: 10/25/2013 3:50:08 AM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You see it in threads here. People paying $200+ a month for the latest smart phone and data plan, high cable / internet monthly bills, $50k pickups parked in the driveway, etc... People live for the here and now. exactly....the same people who save shit yet expect to drive his & her luxury cars.....live in the big home high on the hill.....spend $30k on home theaters....vacation in exotic locations...fly first class instead of coach....on & on..... |
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Posted: 10/25/2013 4:04:56 AM EDT
[#20]
... heck with that!
Retiring into one of these - Hitting most every National Park in the USA for a couple weeks, each. Planning on dragging a small SUV and motorcycle with. Roughly 3 to 4 year plan, visiting each state in the union and dedicating one summer to Alaska via Canada  |
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Posted: 10/25/2013 4:16:20 AM EDT
[#21]
I won't retire.
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Posted: 10/25/2013 4:18:02 AM EDT
[#22]
<-------- 8 weeks from retiring. We'll, if I choose to. I will probably work for another 6 months.
Divorce is the biggest reason most of my coworkers cannot retire "on time". The second reason is STUPIDLY borrowing against their 401k or other retirement savings to pay for an indulgent life style.
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Posted: 10/25/2013 4:22:39 AM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Divorce is the biggest reason most of my coworkers cannot retire "on time". The second reason is STUPIDLY borrowing against their 401k or other retirement savings to pay for an indulgent life style. This. Not getting married and not having kids was one of the best things I did for my retirement planning. Not borrowing against my pension, 457 Plan, annuity, and IRA was the second best. As I was nearing retirement age my Lt., who was divorced, said he would kill me if I got married in my remaining years with the department. |
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Posted: 10/25/2013 4:23:27 AM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
And I give it a 50% chance that people who lived within their means and saved for retirement will get their 401ks, IRAs seized and redistributed to make things more 'fair' Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I figure in 10 years there will be means testing for retirement.[SSI] If you did save and invest, your SSI payments will be cut once your income exceeds X amount. You'll have to draw down your retirement funds to some point before you will receive full payout. The medical health insurance costs WILL force many who thought they had enough to retire to continue to work or at least work part time. The amount of people I know who are retiring soon while still owing a considerable amount on their house mortgage staggers me. Which will make the SS system even more redistributive than it already is. I've worked hard all my life, saved and invested a little and will receive a little inheritance. Those who live their lives responsibly, by working and saving, will be punished for their responsibility if/when means testing is employed. What's your problem? If I want to buy a new car every two year and take lavish first class flights to weeklong stays at the Wynn in Las Vegas and you pinch pennies, ride your vehicles out for 10 years and take more frugal trips to the local state park and stay the motel 8.....I think it's only fair that I get half, maybe a bit more, of your money when we're about to retire.
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Posted: 10/25/2013 4:23:59 AM EDT
[#25]
I'm 45 now. I honestly don't think I will be able to retire.
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Posted: 10/25/2013 4:25:14 AM EDT
[#26]
I don't believe I will retire. Cost of living in 40 years will easily be twice what it is today. You need to retire with a cool million at a minimum to live comfortably in your remaining years assuming you don't outlive the money.
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Posted: 10/25/2013 4:31:24 AM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You see it in threads here. People paying $200+ a month for the latest smart phone and data plan, high cable / internet monthly bills, $50k pickups parked in the driveway, etc... People live for the here and now. As opposed to suffering when you're young and can enjoy life to the fullest so that you can have a tiny bit of extra comfort when you're old enough that you won't appreciate it? |
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Posted: 10/25/2013 4:32:56 AM EDT
[#28]
MAYBE some of us don't WANT to retire
I plan on working til I'm a drooling vegatable
The THOUGHT of sitting around with nothing to do is the FURTHEREST thing I want . |
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Posted: 10/25/2013 4:46:46 AM EDT
[#29]
I'll never be able to retire. Part of that is decisions I have made in my life, the other parts is the Fed will make sure in 40 years that it is too expensive to live.
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Posted: 10/25/2013 4:52:18 AM EDT
[#30]
I will do consulting. I won't retire.
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Posted: 10/25/2013 4:59:37 AM EDT
[#31]
I retired.
Now I'm back in school learning some cool things (gonne-smith'n). 
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Posted: 10/25/2013 5:00:14 AM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
From the article: This despite the market's historical average return of around 10-11%...
Quote HistoryQuoted:
From the article: As for the stock market, only 24 percent of the middle class view stocks as a good investment for retirement. Meanwhile, 45 percent say "the stock market doesn't benefit people like me."
A majority (52 percent) say they shun stocks because "I am afraid to lose my nest egg in the ups and downs of the market." This despite the market's historical average return of around 10-11%...
This is a big problem with the public's perception of the stock market, and is probably just as bad as social security failing or unexpected healthcare costs. Anyone who's over 30 has seen 2 major stock market crashes (and recoveries) in their adult lifetimes, and people have a short term memory when it comes to stocks. The average person doesn't understand what a stock is, why stocks have value, why prices fluctuate, or what the long term returns are. All they see are ticker symbols that are up one day, and down the next, and they see it as a "risky" investment. If you expect to retire at 65, you need to be investing in a diverse stock portfolio, through a tax advantaged account, as early as possible. If you wait until you're 40 to start your retirement saving, you'll never get there. You need to get started while you're under 25, and you need to save as much as possible early on in your career. It's really that simple, but most people are too short-sighted to even consider retirement savings until they're 35+. |
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Posted: 10/25/2013 5:01:37 AM EDT
[#33]
I'm one of those, but it is because retirement doesn't interest me. I chosemy new industry in part because I can work on it till I die.
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Posted: 10/25/2013 5:04:13 AM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I don't believe I will retire. Cost of living in 40 years will easily be twice what it is today. You need to retire with a cool million at a minimum to live comfortably in your remaining years assuming you don't outlive the money. Oh, and that "cool million" is probably not enough to retire today, let alone 30 years from now.
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Posted: 10/25/2013 5:05:02 AM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
When you look at what inflation can do to savings it's no wonder. Your million dollar nest egg becomes worth 10% of what it was and you're screwed. You bust your ass to provide for retirement and STILL wind up in the FSA just to stay alive. I ain't goin' nowhere. This is very true. The current state of the economy and the Fed's QE Infinity is going to kill people's retirement savings. Those who work hard, play by the rules, and live right are going to screwed. |
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Posted: 10/25/2013 5:07:13 AM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You see it in threads here. People paying $200+ a month for the latest smart phone and data plan, high cable / internet monthly bills, $50k pickups parked in the driveway, etc... People live for the here and now. Left out vacations, and 5k sqft houses. |
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Posted: 10/25/2013 5:08:38 AM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I retired.
Now I'm back in school learning some cool things (gonne-smith'n). Me too. Just finished school this week. (not gun smithing) 
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Posted: 10/25/2013 5:11:22 AM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This. Not getting married and not having kids was one of the best things I did for my retirement planning. Not borrowing against my pension, 457 Plan, annuity, and IRA was the second best. As I was nearing retirement age my Lt., who was divorced, said he would kill me if I got married in my remaining years with the department. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Divorce is the biggest reason most of my coworkers cannot retire "on time". The second reason is STUPIDLY borrowing against their 401k or other retirement savings to pay for an indulgent life style. This. Not getting married and not having kids was one of the best things I did for my retirement planning. Not borrowing against my pension, 457 Plan, annuity, and IRA was the second best. As I was nearing retirement age my Lt., who was divorced, said he would kill me if I got married in my remaining years with the department. Yep. Mid-life nasty divorce + alimony and/or child support and massive legal fees...pretty much ends the dream of easy retirement at 65. Ask me how I know. |
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Posted: 10/25/2013 5:15:54 AM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted: ... heck with that! Retiring into one of these - Hitting most every National Park in the USA for a couple weeks, each. Planning on dragging a small SUV and motorcycle with. Roughly 3 to 4 year plan, visiting each state in the union and dedicating one summer to Alaska via Canada http://www.rvt.com/photos2/2620/5282620/main.jpg Just stay out of the passing lane.
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Posted: 10/25/2013 5:16:12 AM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Unless your mortgage is @ 4% and your investments are returning 15%. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Oh well. I enjoy being retired. For "middle class" people you pretty much have to be debt free before retiring to make it work. Taking on a new 30 year mortgage when you're 45 years old is not the way to go about it. Unless your mortgage is @ 4% and your investments are returning 15%. I am going to be honest, I am really happy you are not my investment adviser. |
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Posted: 10/25/2013 5:22:53 AM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
This. Not getting married and not having kids was one of the best things I did for my retirement planning. Not borrowing against my pension, 457 Plan, annuity, and IRA was the second best. As I was nearing retirement age my Lt., who was divorced, said he would kill me if I got married in my remaining years with the department. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Divorce is the biggest reason most of my coworkers cannot retire "on time". The second reason is STUPIDLY borrowing against their 401k or other retirement savings to pay for an indulgent life style. This. Not getting married and not having kids was one of the best things I did for my retirement planning. Not borrowing against my pension, 457 Plan, annuity, and IRA was the second best. As I was nearing retirement age my Lt., who was divorced, said he would kill me if I got married in my remaining years with the department. If the key to success is NOT getting married and NOT having kids, things are pretty jacked up all around. What's the point? Just work long enough to save up money to not work again? What a life... |
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Posted: 10/25/2013 5:25:02 AM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Just stay out of the passing lane. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: ... heck with that! Retiring into one of these - Hitting most every National Park in the USA for a couple weeks, each. Planning on dragging a small SUV and motorcycle with. Roughly 3 to 4 year plan, visiting each state in the union and dedicating one summer to Alaska via Canada http://www.rvt.com/photos2/2620/5282620/main.jpg Just stay out of the passing lane. ... I'll have "all the time in the world" Truthfully, the whole idea is to mosey from place to place leisurely. It's the dichotomy to the profession/career rat-race |
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Posted: 10/25/2013 5:25:27 AM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If the key to success is NOT getting married and NOT having kids, things are pretty jacked up all around. What's the point? Just work long enough to save up money to not work again? What a life... Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Divorce is the biggest reason most of my coworkers cannot retire "on time". The second reason is STUPIDLY borrowing against their 401k or other retirement savings to pay for an indulgent life style. This. Not getting married and not having kids was one of the best things I did for my retirement planning. Not borrowing against my pension, 457 Plan, annuity, and IRA was the second best. As I was nearing retirement age my Lt., who was divorced, said he would kill me if I got married in my remaining years with the department. If the key to success is NOT getting married and NOT having kids, things are pretty jacked up all around. What's the point? Just work long enough to save up money to not work again? What a life... Not everyone finds having kids enjoyable. Marriage is not necessary to be with someone you love. |
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Posted: 10/25/2013 5:34:51 AM EDT
[#44]
And here I am planning early retirement at 35.
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Posted: 10/25/2013 5:42:15 AM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
And here I am planning early retirement at 35. Shit, you make me feel old considering I retired last year at 39. 
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Posted: 10/25/2013 5:43:37 AM EDT
[#46]
There is a staggering number of people in their 40s and 50 that have essentially nothing saved. They spend everything.
There are many people here that post that they are sneaking money to buy guns.... money that they can barely afford week-to-week. They comment that their wife says they have bills to pay and they don't need another gun. How much money do you think they are putting away? If people think they will work well into normal retirement age - what are they going to do when there are no jobs for another 6 million old folks? Our commercial market economy continues to become more and more efficient and evolve to more specialized skills. The specialized skill jobs will be held by much younger people. And a huge number of current jobs will be gone, wiped out by gains in efficiencies, self-help, tech and web-based economies. Don't plan on seeking employment at age 65. You will be surrounded by millions competing for the same job for the same reason. Such jobs will pay squat. |
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Posted: 10/25/2013 5:52:25 AM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Oh well. I enjoy being retired. For "middle class" people you pretty much have to be debt free before retiring to make it work. Taking on a new 30 year mortgage when you're 45 years old is not the way to go about it. There is little difference between renting and buying at that age. The wifey and I have a 2400' 4 bdrm place in a prosperous surb in North Dallas. House payment is $1400/month. A two bedroom apartment in the same area is 1200+. We are able to deduct the interest and taxes making it cost about the same as the apartment. We have a 3.5% mortgage. Unlike in an apartment, we have a private back yard, room for my guns, space to entertain the kids, etc. The condo would require us to do away with family gatherings, etc. We have saved a bit. But I am nearly 10 years away from the full retirement age. Our fear is that the government will look at our assets (created from post tax dollars) and decide that we either give them some of our money or they will not pay us back the money that was forcefully taken under penalty of law. I will always be busy unless my health deteriorates. My wife has serious health issues and won't be able to delay retirement until 66. But you are right. Unless you retire with considerable cash reserves and/or liquidable assets, you will find it hard to stop working just to pay health insurance. |
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Posted: 10/25/2013 5:54:07 AM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
There is a staggering number of people in their 40s and 50 that have essentially nothing saved. They spend everything. There are many people here that post that they are sneaking money to buy guns.... money that they can barely afford week-to-week. They comment that their wife says they have bills to pay and they don't need another gun. How much money do you think they are putting away? If people think they will work well into normal retirement age - what are they going to do when there are no jobs for another 6 million old folks? Our commercial market economy continues to become more and more efficient and evolve to more specialized skills. The specialized skill jobs will be held by much younger people. And a huge number of current jobs will be gone, wiped out by gains in efficiencies, self-help, tech and web-based economies. Don't plan on seeking employment at age 65. You will be surrounded by millions competing for the same job for the same reason. Such jobs will pay squat. And the low pay, low skill, part time jobs that some older folks take to supplement their retirement savings are and will be taken by the newly amnestied. Especially if they are exempt from Obamacare's employer mandate. Retirees are gonna get pinched all the way around. i have zero illusions that I will ever be able to retire. Nor will I enjoy the quality of life that my parents enjoy in their later life (retirement savings and pensions). |
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Posted: 10/25/2013 5:59:20 AM EDT
[#49]
Well, pensions are a thing of the past except for .gov employees, and very few have the means to save for 30+ years of not working. People will work until they can't work anymore and then go on the government teat. It will be worse for the blue collar types and they will physically be unable to do their jobs much sooner.
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Posted: 10/25/2013 6:01:16 AM EDT
[#50]
Divorce and a layoff pretty well took care of my plans. On top of which I think I would be bored retired. Almost all of the fun stuff people talk about in retirement; travel, open a business, etc,. requires money, time and effort. I may as well keep working.
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