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Posted: 7/25/2013 1:16:16 PM EDT
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2377841/Hackers-hijack-software-CAR-remotely-control-steering-brakes-horn-using-laptop.html
Hackers hijack software in a CAR and remotely control the steering, brakes and horn using a laptop
 Forget hacking accounts, computers or mobile devices - security engineers from Indiana have managed to hack the software inside the Toyota Prius and Ford Escape. Using a laptop wirelessly connected to the car's electronics, Charlie Miller and Chris Valasek were able to remotely control the brakes, the accelerate, change the speedometer, switch the headlights on and off, tighten the seatbelts and even blast the horn. The project was funded by a grant from the U.S Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency to highlight the security risks affecting modern-day cars. Yeah, let's hook up every goddam thing to the Internet.  |
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Posted: 7/25/2013 1:19:10 PM EDT
[#1]
like i needed another reason to not buy a prius
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Posted: 7/25/2013 1:20:35 PM EDT
[#2]
First post hit it out of the park.
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Posted: 7/25/2013 1:22:19 PM EDT
[#3]
Hybrids...
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Posted: 7/25/2013 1:22:33 PM EDT
[#4]
I suspect this is doable with just about any vehicle that has parallel parking assist.
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Posted: 7/25/2013 1:26:08 PM EDT
[#5]
Michael Hastings died in an out-of-control single car accident.
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Posted: 7/25/2013 1:26:14 PM EDT
[#6]
I wont drive anything that doesn't have a mechanical connection between me and the tires.
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Posted: 7/25/2013 1:27:19 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I suspect this is doable with just about any vehicle that has parallel parking assist. I'm not sure exactly what the exploit even was. The article talks about some cars offering wireless, but doesn't say that's what this car has. It also talks about bluetooth exploits, which wouldn't be internet related. There's also the possibility that they hijacked the wifi signal that the car uses for internal communication between various sensors. There was a proof of concept hack around that last year, I believe. |
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Posted: 7/25/2013 1:27:53 PM EDT
[#8]
They found a new way to kill the next Breitbart. Did anyone think of John Noveske after reading that? If they can do it to a Prius, I guarantee any Chevy or Ford is already susceptible.
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Posted: 7/25/2013 1:29:28 PM EDT
[#9]
I'll take "fuck that shit" for 1000, Alex.
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Posted: 7/25/2013 1:31:39 PM EDT
[#10]
This is why I choose to own older pickup trucks. Yeah... that's the ticket...
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Posted: 7/25/2013 1:32:07 PM EDT
[#11]
Anything written onto a microchip, can be re-written by anyone with enough smarts. And it isn't THAT hard. In other words, if a human can make it, a human can break it.
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Posted: 7/25/2013 1:33:42 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
They found a new way to kill the next Breitbart. Did anyone think of John Noveske after reading that? If they can do it to a Prius, I guarantee any Chevy or Ford is already susceptible. What about GM's? Big GM's. You know, limousine size GM's... |
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Posted: 7/25/2013 1:34:13 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I wont drive anything that doesn't have a mechanical connection between me and the tires. I hope you take real good care of your older cars. There really aren't any of those left. All modern cars have a black box for recording data. At least we are told that's what they are used for. With all the lies and cover ups, who can trust anyone anymore. |
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Posted: 7/25/2013 1:34:42 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
This is why I choose to own older pickup trucks. Yeah... that's the ticket... my '66 mustang aint got no computer parts! too bad i sold it because my ride now has to have child seats 
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Posted: 7/25/2013 1:36:06 PM EDT
[#15]
This isn't unique to hybrids.
Most modern cars can be remotely compromised. |
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Posted: 7/25/2013 1:36:12 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
What about GM's? Big GM's. You know, limousine size GM's... Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
They found a new way to kill the next Breitbart. Did anyone think of John Noveske after reading that? If they can do it to a Prius, I guarantee any Chevy or Ford is already susceptible. What about GM's? Big GM's. You know, limousine size GM's... What if a "terrorist" (think CIA) could control a Presidential limousine that has a Republican President in it. You are onto something here. |
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Posted: 7/25/2013 1:37:00 PM EDT
[#17]
Well this thread went to crazy town pretty quick. Must have been the secret microchip instructions in OP.
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Posted: 7/25/2013 1:37:58 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
This isn't unique to hybrids. Most modern cars can be remotely compromised. The devil in this is in the details. I'm going out on a limb and guessing they didn't just walk up to a car in the parking lot and start playing GTA4. |
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Posted: 7/25/2013 1:38:23 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
They found a new way to kill the next Breitbart. Did anyone think of John Noveske after reading that? If they can do it to a Prius, I guarantee any Chevy or Ford is already susceptible. Noveske was driving an '84 Land Rover. Michael Hastings, on the other hand, was driving a 2013 Mercedes when he died in his single vehicle car crash, where he zoomed through red lights apparently out of control. http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2013/07/08/three-weeks-later-details-about-reporter-michael-hastings-death-in-fiery-car-crash-remain-a-mystery/ |
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Posted: 7/25/2013 1:40:38 PM EDT
[#20]
Anyone owning a Prius deserves to have a hacker drive it for them.
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Posted: 7/25/2013 1:41:25 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I hope you take real good care of your older cars. There really aren't any of those left. All modern cars have a black box for recording data. At least we are told that's what they are used for. With all the lies and cover ups, who can trust anyone anymore. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I wont drive anything that doesn't have a mechanical connection between me and the tires. I hope you take real good care of your older cars. There really aren't any of those left. All modern cars have a black box for recording data. At least we are told that's what they are used for. With all the lies and cover ups, who can trust anyone anymore. Don't worry I have a good supply of late 90's Crown Vics and Town Cars with room for more. 
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Posted: 7/25/2013 1:42:46 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The devil in this is in the details. I'm going out on a limb and guessing they didn't just walk up to a car in the parking lot and start playing GTA4. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
This isn't unique to hybrids. Most modern cars can be remotely compromised. The devil in this is in the details. I'm going out on a limb and guessing they didn't just walk up to a car in the parking lot and start playing GTA4. Re-reading it, the parallel parking feature is somewhat unique in having braking, acceleration and steering controlled by wire (either directly or in parallel with a mechanical system) I have been looking at Fords, but the Ecoboost debacle has cooled my interest somewhat. I have heard of several complaints about the sync system, which apparently was the point of entry for the hacks. Any wireless capability in the car (Sync, Bluetooth connections, WiFi or even OnStar I suppose) could be exploited to one degree or another. Some just to listen or disable the car, others to actively control it. Ford & Toyota should offer delete options on wireless capability. Bet there would be more than a few takers... |
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Posted: 7/25/2013 1:43:08 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The devil in this is in the details. I'm going out on a limb and guessing they didn't just walk up to a car in the parking lot and start playing GTA4. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: This isn't unique to hybrids. Most modern cars can be remotely compromised. The devil in this is in the details. I'm going out on a limb and guessing they didn't just walk up to a car in the parking lot and start playing GTA4. Most of these exploits are extremely complicated, or have unrealistic prerequisites. |
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Posted: 7/25/2013 1:43:10 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
This isn't unique to hybrids. Most modern cars can be remotely compromised. Between remotely delivered malicious code, ad supply chain issues, the future could be scary. |
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Posted: 7/25/2013 1:43:48 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Between remotely delivered malicious code, ad supply chain issues, the future could be scary. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: This isn't unique to hybrids. Most modern cars can be remotely compromised. Between remotely delivered malicious code, ad supply chain issues, the future could be scary. Indeed. I'll keep my 88 Ford. |
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Posted: 7/25/2013 1:44:21 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I wont drive anything that doesn't have a mechanical connection between me and the tires. They disabled power steering, they weren't able to actually steer the car. Steer by wire is still not implemented on any production car (yet). |
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Posted: 7/25/2013 1:44:53 PM EDT
[#27]
I think in this case, they were directly plugged into the car, but there was a NOVA ScienceNow episode ("Can science stop crime?" or something like that) where the called the car's onstar phone and flashed the lights, unlocked it so someone could get in, started the engine, and he drove away. Then they put him on a track and locked up his brakes.
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Posted: 7/25/2013 1:46:34 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You'd have guessed right. Most of these exploits are extremely complicated, or have unrealistic prerequisites. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
This isn't unique to hybrids. Most modern cars can be remotely compromised. The devil in this is in the details. I'm going out on a limb and guessing they didn't just walk up to a car in the parking lot and start playing GTA4. Most of these exploits are extremely complicated, or have unrealistic prerequisites. As an exercise in theory it makes sense. Having white hats publish the faults in the system is worth the money if the manufacturers start thinking security. |
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Posted: 7/25/2013 1:47:21 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted: They disabled power steering, they weren't able to actually steer the car. Steer by wire is still not implemented on any production car (yet). Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I wont drive anything that doesn't have a mechanical connection between me and the tires. They disabled power steering, they weren't able to actually steer the car. Steer by wire is still not implemented on any production car (yet). |
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Posted: 7/25/2013 1:48:29 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted: As an exercise in theory it makes sense. Having white hats publish the faults in the system is worth the money if the manufacturers start thinking security. I mean, we are in the year 2013, and technology exploits have been around for 50 years. For smart animals, we as a species can be pretty fucking stubborn. |
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Posted: 7/25/2013 1:48:46 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
They disabled power steering, they weren't able to actually steer the car. Steer by wire is still not implemented on any production car (yet). Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I wont drive anything that doesn't have a mechanical connection between me and the tires. They disabled power steering, they weren't able to actually steer the car. Steer by wire is still not implemented on any production car (yet). There's obviously some electronic to mechanical linkage in the cars with parking assist. |
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Posted: 7/25/2013 1:49:42 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
They disabled power steering, they weren't able to actually steer the car. Steer by wire is still not implemented on any production car (yet). Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I wont drive anything that doesn't have a mechanical connection between me and the tires. They disabled power steering, they weren't able to actually steer the car. Steer by wire is still not implemented on any production car (yet). http://www.wired.com/autopia/2013/05/al_drivebywire/ |
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Posted: 7/25/2013 1:49:52 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: In other words, if a human can make it, a human can break it. Truer words were never spoken . |
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Posted: 7/25/2013 1:50:45 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: I wont drive anything that doesn't have a mechanical connection between me and the tires. They disabled power steering, they weren't able to actually steer the car. Steer by wire is still not implemented on any production car (yet). And? There are no production cars that are steer by wire (yet). All production cars still have a physical connection from the steering wheel to the tires. |
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Posted: 7/25/2013 1:51:15 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This isn't unique to hybrids. Most modern cars can be remotely compromised. . . . this is On-Star , can I help you ? |
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Posted: 7/25/2013 1:51:17 PM EDT
[#36]
I remember in the Michael Hastings thread where it was posted that Alex Jones talked about this. Half the thread laughed their asses off and said it's impossible tinfoil hat nuttery. Then berated the people who talked about it.
Line for extra large servings of crow is ---------> |
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Posted: 7/25/2013 1:51:50 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted: like i needed another reason to not buy a prius Course, they wouldn't use a Volt for this. People, if you want to be SAFE, you MUST buy a VOLT! It's the only option! |
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Posted: 7/25/2013 1:52:32 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I remember in the Michael Hastings thread where it was posted that Alex Jones talked about this. Half the thread laughed their asses off and said it's impossible tinfoil hat nuttery. Then berated the people who talked about it. Line for extra large servings of crow is ---------> It's still tinfoil hat nuttery. |
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Posted: 7/25/2013 1:53:16 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Michael Hastings, on the other hand, was driving a 2013 Mercedes when he died in his single vehicle car crash, where he zoomed through red lights apparently out of control. http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2013/07/08/three-weeks-later-details-about-reporter-michael-hastings-death-in-fiery-car-crash-remain-a-mystery/ Quote HistoryQuoted:
Michael Hastings, on the other hand, was driving a 2013 Mercedes when he died in his single vehicle car crash, where he zoomed through red lights apparently out of control. http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2013/07/08/three-weeks-later-details-about-reporter-michael-hastings-death-in-fiery-car-crash-remain-a-mystery/ 2013 Mercedes-Benz C-Class C250 features Standard Features Anti-Theft & Locks. Selective Locking/Unlocking Via Remote Vehicle Theft Tracking Notification Included With mbrace In-Vehicle Technology Vehicle Anti-Theft Via Alarm and Engine Immobilizer Locking Fuel Filler Radio Anti-Theft Child Safety Door Locks Located on Rear Doors Power Door Locks Operated Via Key, Remote and SmartKe With Automatic Locking Valet Lockout Power Trunk Lock/Unlock Via Multi-Function Remote and Interior Switch Braking & Traction. Pre-Charging Brake Optimization System Vehicle Stability Control System 4-Wheel Anti-Lock Brakes Front Power 295-mm Ventilated Disc and Rear Power 300-mm Ventilated Disc Brakes Brake Assistance Traction Control Controlled by Engine Management Hill Start Control Electrical. Audio and Navigation Pre-Wiring Delayed Power Retention 74 Cold Cranking Amp Battery Front Cigarette Lighter With Ashtray 2 Front Power Outlets Engines & Emissions. Roadside Assistance Warranty for Unlimited Months, Unlimited Miles, Turbocharged 1.8-Liter, I4, 16-Valve, 4, DOHC, DI Engine; Front/Longitudinal Mounted With Horsepower Of 201@5500, Torque Of 229@2000, Alloy Block and Alloy Cylinder Head intercooled turbo ULEV II Emissions Entertainment, Communication & Navigation. . Vehicle Location System Included With mbrace In-Vehicle Technology Diversity Radio Antenna HD AM/FM Radio With 8 Speakers Total; CD Player; MP3 Player Mercedes-Benz mbrace: Safety & Security, Navigation, Destination Planning & Convenience Services Via Vehicle, Online & Compatible Smartphones. More Info: www.MBUSA.com/mbrace AM/FM Radio Seek, Scan, COMAND and 8 Speakers Total; CD Player; MP3 Player Auxiliary Audio Input Jack In-Glass Radio Antenna Wireless Communication Access For Bluetooth Enabled Devices with Bluetooth Streaming Audio Exterior Lighting. Daytime Running Lights Automatic High/Low Beam Control Twin Projector Beam Halogen Headlights Automatic Headlights With Automatic On/Off and Time Delay Rear Foglights Perimeter Lighting Activated Via Remote Exterior, Design, Paint & Finish. Sport Side Skirts Sport Front Air Dam Sport Rear Air Dam Front and Rear Body Color Bumpers Chrome Grille, Chrome Body Side Moldings, Cladding, Body Color Exterior Door Handles, Chrome Exhaust Pipe and Chrome Side Windows Heating, Ventilation & Air Conditioning. Rear HVAC Ducts Separate Driver/Front Passenger Climate Controls Automatic Climate Control Interior Air Filter Instrumentation. Tachometer Digital Clock Trip Computer With Trip Odometer Exterior Temperature Gauge Automatic/Delayed Locking and Automatic Headlights Tire Pressure Monitor Compass Steering Wheel Mounted Controls For Audio Cruise Control Service Interval Indicator For Brake Wear and Oil Level Interior Lighting. Illuminated Entry Doors Front and Rear Reading Lights Trunk/Interior Load Area Light Interior, Design, Decor & Floor Covering. Alloy Trim Located On Center Floor Console, Doors and Instrument Panel Leather Steering Wheel Carpet Located in Passenger Cabin and Cargo Area/Trunk Rear Carpeted Floor Mats Front Carpeted Floor Mats Remote Controls & Remote Releases. Remote Fuel Door Release Panic Alarm Multi-Function Remote Operates Anti-Theft, Door Lock/Unlock, Panic Alarm, Perimeter Lighting, Power Windows, Sunroof and Trunk Keyless Entry Operated Via Key Fob Universal Garage Door Opener Remote Trunk/Decklid Release Located Inside Vehicle and On Multi-Function Remote Safety. Rear 3-Point Center Seatbelt Emergency Fuel Shut-Off Device Automatic Locking Retractors Trunk Anti-Trap Device Front and Rear Pretensioners First Aid Kit Front and Rear Side Head Curtain Airbags Passenger Airbag Side Guard Door Beams Front Seatbelt Height Adjusters Driver Airbag Rear Center 3-Point Seatbelts Front Active Head Restraints Seat Mounted Front Side Airbags Driver Knee Airbag Passenger Airbag Cutoff Sensor Seats. Theater Style Rear Seating Front Dual Reclining Sport Bucket Seats With Adjustable Seat Height and Adjustable Headrests Rear Bench Seat With Adjustable Headrests and Fold-Down Center Armrest Seat Type=bench Front Passenger Power Seat Adjusts 8 Ways Total Front Dual Reclining Bucket Seats Driver Side Adjusts 8 Ways Total, Adjustable Seat Height, Passenger Side Adjusts 8 Ways Total, Adjustable Seat Height, Adjustable Headrests and Fold-Down Center Armrest Front Dual Manual Lumbar Support Driver Power Seat Adjusts 8 Ways Total Leatherette Seats Steering. Power Rack and Pinion Variable Assisted Steering Telescopic Steering Column Tilt Steering Column Storage. Front Covered Lower Console Storage Located On Floor Temperature Controlled Storage Cools Glovebox Cargo Area Tiedowns Lockable Illuminated Glovebox Rear Armrest Storage Front and Rear Cupholders Front and Rear Door Mounted Storage Seatback Storage Pockets Sunroof/Moonroof & Removable/Convertible Top. Front Power Glass Tilt and Slide Sunroof Suspension. Independent Multi-Link Rear Suspension With Coil Springs, Shock Absorbers and Sport Ride Type Independent Multi-Link Rear Suspension With Coil Springs and Shock Absorbers and sport Ride Type Front Stabilizer Bar Towing/Trailering & Payload. 4453-Lb Gross Vehicle Weight Rating 1135-Lb Payload Package Transmission. Adaptive Automatic Transmission 7-Speed Electronically Controlled Manually Interactive Automatic Transmission With Overdrive and Tow/Haul/Snow ModeTouchShift Manually Interactive Automatic Transmission Wheels & Tires. Front P225/45HR17 BSW All-Season and Rear P245/40HR17 BSW All-Season Tires Alloy Wheels Front 17-in. X 7.5-in. and Rear 17-in. X 8.5-in. Compact Spare Tire Interior Spare Tire Mounted Under Cargo Floor Inflatable Spare Tire Kit Windows, Mirrors & Wipers. Front Dual Sunvisors Dual Body Color Folding Power Adjustable Heated Signaling Exterior Rearview Mirrors With Driver Side Electrochromic Rain Sensing Intermittent Windshield Wipers Power Window Lockout/Override Manual Sunshade Located on Sunroof/Moonroof Dual Body Color Folding Power Adjustable Heated Signaling Exterior Rearview Mirrors With Driver Side Electrochromic and Passenger Automatic Tilt-Down Heated Windshield Glass Rain Sensing Variable Intermittent Windshield Wipers Front Vanity Mirror Tinted Glass Front Illuminated Vanity Mirrors Rear Window Defroster Front and Rear Power Windows With One-Touch Up and One-Touch Down Heated Washer System Electrochromic Interior Rearview Mirror Is such a thing even possible? |
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Posted: 7/25/2013 1:53:20 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted: . . . this is On-Star , can I help you ? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: This isn't unique to hybrids. Most modern cars can be remotely compromised. . . . this is On-Star , can I help you ? I'm actually familiar with the security systems at On-Star as well, and I'm not impressed. Two steps away from a kid with Cheetos stained fingers shutting down every GM in the country is pretty scary. |
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Posted: 7/25/2013 1:54:46 PM EDT
[#41]
So they have physical access to the OBDII or other bus in the vehicle and people are surprised they can make the computer do wonky stuff?
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Posted: 7/25/2013 1:55:00 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted: And? There are no production cars that are steer by wire (yet). All production cars still have a physical connection from the steering wheel to the tires. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: I wont drive anything that doesn't have a mechanical connection between me and the tires. They disabled power steering, they weren't able to actually steer the car. Steer by wire is still not implemented on any production car (yet). And? There are no production cars that are steer by wire (yet). All production cars still have a physical connection from the steering wheel to the tires. And the cars that auto-park ....what controls the steering ? If youre buzzin along the highway and the computer gets a signal to steer left . . . . . . |
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Posted: 7/25/2013 1:57:01 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
They found a new way to kill the next Breitbart. Did anyone think of John Noveske after reading that? If they can do it to a Prius, I guarantee any Chevy or Ford is already susceptible. Yeah there have been a few suspicious single vehicle auto accidents that this could apply to, but Noveske was driving an 80's vintage vehicle IIRC. I have one word to contemplate in addition to the obvious implications for automobiles. Airbus. |
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Posted: 7/25/2013 1:58:08 PM EDT
[#44]
so the question is can this be done to things like airplanes also?
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Posted: 7/25/2013 1:59:25 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted: so the question is can this be done to things like airplanes also? |
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Posted: 7/25/2013 2:00:14 PM EDT
[#46]
Skynet will be a constantly changing group of teenagers and college losers and they will rule the world.
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Posted: 7/25/2013 2:06:17 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It's actually MUCH harder to do this to an airplane because there is a physical air-gap between the systems that control it and the other systems on the plane. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
so the question is can this be done to things like airplanes also? I wouldn't be quite so sure about that. |
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Posted: 7/25/2013 2:08:22 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I think in this case, they were directly plugged into the car, but there was a NOVA ScienceNow episode ("Can science stop crime?" or something like that) where the called the car's onstar phone and flashed the lights, unlocked it so someone could get in, started the engine, and he drove away. Then they put him on a track and locked up his brakes. I re-read the art. it was wireless. |
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Posted: 7/25/2013 2:17:51 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I wouldn't be quite so sure about that. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: so the question is can this be done to things like airplanes also? I wouldn't be quite so sure about that. |
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Posted: 7/25/2013 2:20:28 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It's actually MUCH harder to do this to an airplane because there is a physical air-gap between the systems that control it and the other systems on the plane. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
so the question is can this be done to things like airplanes also? However, I would say that navigational systems are potentially vulnerable. Eta: depends on the aircraft and specific element targeted. |
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