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Posted: 9/5/2002 12:41:06 PM EDT
[#1]
It appears to be an M4 variant with a 10.5 or 11 inch barrel. It has a RAS by Knights' for handguards and an AIMPOINT scope.
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Posted: 9/5/2002 1:10:55 PM EDT
[#2]
It's definitely Delta. A Secret Service guy would be wearing a tie and have on sun glasses, not to mentioned starched, white boxer shorts.
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Posted: 9/5/2002 1:21:01 PM EDT
[#3]
Notice even in a very dangerous situation, the operator has his "Finger off of the Trigger".
He must have took an NRA Firearms safety class eh...... I believe that is an M4 variant with a 10.5 inch barrell. Most likely Delta, Dont think the haircut and facial hair falls into military regs. Besides to really confirm we would need to see his Oakly sunglasses! |
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Posted: 9/5/2002 2:07:09 PM EDT
[#4]
Marvl is right on, if it was a secret service (SS) guy, he wouldn't have a weapon, he'd just be ready to bite an ear off . . . then scribble some racial slurs on a nearby wall . . .
[devil] |
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Posted: 9/5/2002 2:11:49 PM EDT
[#5]
There are better pics under the "Uppers, barrels, etc." section..
Not Delta.. SEALs. |
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Posted: 9/5/2002 2:14:34 PM EDT
[#6]
M4?
Look at the butt stock, or lack there of. |
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Posted: 9/5/2002 2:15:56 PM EDT
[#7]
What do they mean "running for cover"?
That guy is scanning for targets! |
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Posted: 9/5/2002 2:20:01 PM EDT
[#8]
Not an M4, cause the whole point of an M4 is the 14.5 inch barrel with the grenade launcher cut-out.
Looks likely to be a Colt M733 Commando with KAC RAS and a Red Dot. |
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Posted: 9/5/2002 2:37:01 PM EDT
[#9]
I'm thinking some kinda of HK thinga ma giggy.
Take the photo and enhance it. There is no butt stock/buffer tube. After I enhanced it it looks like a pistol cal, short, maybe 10 or 20 round magazine. Retractable butt stock. Deffinately not a M-16 based weapon. |
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Posted: 9/5/2002 2:41:07 PM EDT
[#10]
hopefully it is NOT a 5.56 with that short of a barrel. unless you use rounds optimizedfor short barrels, the round will not fragment, pissing away all of the usefullness of the round.
just ask a delta somali vet. |
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Posted: 9/5/2002 2:49:13 PM EDT
[#11]
Comment on the operator, not the weapon: I'd guess Delta as well, not SEALs. After just finishing "Inside Delta Force" this is exactly the kind of job Delta has been tasked to do in the past and they know exactly how to do it. In all the written-by-a-former-SEAL books I've read, I dont remember too many stories of diplomatic protection or bodyguarding by the SEALs. I could also be completely wrong... My (somewhat "informed") armchair opinion.
--ZERO |
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Posted: 9/5/2002 3:04:09 PM EDT
[#12]
Those are M4A1 lowers with 10.5" flattop uppers, cut carry handle for rear sight, Aimpoint dot sight, "Enhanced cheek weld" stock (collapsed), and KAC RIS...
And I should qualify and say that like Mr. Zero, I'm just offering an armchair opinion and not trying to sound like a know-it-all.. :) |
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Posted: 9/5/2002 3:05:32 PM EDT
[#13]
Quoted: I'm thinking some kinda of HK thinga ma giggy. Take the photo and enhance it. There is no butt stock/buffer tube. After I enhanced it it looks like a pistol cal, short, maybe 10 or 20 round magazine. Retractable butt stock. Deffinately not a M-16 based weapon. [left][img]http://us.news2.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/ap/20020905/capt.1031253312.topix_afghanistan_karzai_knd106.jpg[/img][/left] [right][img]http://us.news2.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/ap/20020905/capt.1031243332.topix_afghanistan_karzai_assasination_attempt_knd104.jpg[/img][/right] Sorry but that is no HK there. Its the same guy from a better angle. For one thing that is clearly a AR front sight and front gas block-why would a HK anything have a AR type gas block? Why would a pistol cal anything have a gas block? And it is blurry but it does look like a 30rnd AR mag sticking out of it too. |
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Posted: 9/5/2002 3:10:14 PM EDT
[#14]
Quoted: hopefully it is NOT a 5.56 with that short of a barrel. unless you use rounds optimizedfor short barrels, the round will not fragment, pissing away all of the usefullness of the round. just ask a delta somali vet. Apparently those reports were not entirely accurate... [url]http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=12&t=139293[/url] |
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Posted: 9/5/2002 3:11:16 PM EDT
[#15]
Hey there's a prisoner. Thought he got shot dead.
Pan left <<<<---- [img]http://www.foxnews.com/images/65066/7_22_090502_karzai_bodyguards.jpg[/img] |
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Posted: 9/5/2002 3:13:41 PM EDT
[#16]
ArmdLbrl
Go to the photo in the story and pull it into your computer, enlarge and brighten. You'll see what I'm talking about. If I could post a pic I would. |
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Posted: 9/5/2002 3:14:38 PM EDT
[#17]
Quoted: Quoted: I'm thinking some kinda of HK thinga ma giggy. Take the photo and enhance it. There is no butt stock/buffer tube. After I enhanced it it looks like a pistol cal, short, maybe 10 or 20 round magazine. Retractable butt stock. Deffinately not a M-16 based weapon. [url]http://us.news2.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/ap/20020905/capt.1031253312.topix_afghanistan_karzai_knd106.jpg[/url] Sorry but that is no HK there. Its the same guy from a better angle. For one thing that is clearly a AR front sight and front gas block-why would a HK anything have a AR type gas block? Why would a pistol cal anything have a gas block? And it is blurry but it does look like a 30rnd AR mag sticking out of it too. Got anymore pics???? |
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Posted: 9/5/2002 3:16:15 PM EDT
[#18]
Quoted: Notice even in a very dangerous situation, the operator has his "Finger off of the Trigger". He must have took an NRA Firearms safety class eh...... I believe that is an M4 variant with a 10.5 inch barrell. Most likely Delta, Dont think the haircut and facial hair falls into military regs. Besides to really confirm we would need to see his Oakly sunglasses! Looks like this guy has Oakley's! [img]http://www.foxnews.com/images/65066/7_21_090502_karzai3.jpg[/img] |
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Posted: 9/5/2002 3:16:40 PM EDT
[#19]
Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: I'm thinking some kinda of HK thinga ma giggy. Take the photo and enhance it. There is no butt stock/buffer tube. After I enhanced it it looks like a pistol cal, short, maybe 10 or 20 round magazine. Retractable butt stock. Deffinately not a M-16 based weapon. [url]http://us.news2.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/ap/20020905/capt.1031253312.topix_afghanistan_karzai_knd106.jpg[/url] Sorry but that is no HK there. Its the same guy from a better angle. For one thing that is clearly a AR front sight and front gas block-why would a HK anything have a AR type gas block? Why would a pistol cal anything have a gas block? And it is blurry but it does look like a 30rnd AR mag sticking out of it too. Got anymore pics???? [url]http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=12&t=139293[/url] |
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Posted: 9/5/2002 3:20:04 PM EDT
[#20]
Who would have thought this would be the scene for an assassination attempt?
[img]http://us.news2.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/ap/20020905/capt.1031253312.topix_afghanistan_karzai_knd106.jpg[/img] The serenity of a sunflower blowing gently in the wind, when all of a sudden the crackle of small arms fire rings out! Do I get the job at the LA TIMES or what? |
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Posted: 9/5/2002 3:20:56 PM EDT
[#21]
Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: I'm thinking some kinda of HK thinga ma giggy. Take the photo and enhance it. There is no butt stock/buffer tube. After I enhanced it it looks like a pistol cal, short, maybe 10 or 20 round magazine. Retractable butt stock. Deffinately not a M-16 based weapon. [url]http://us.news2.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/ap/20020905/capt.1031253312.topix_afghanistan_karzai_knd106.jpg[/url] Sorry but that is no HK there. Its the same guy from a better angle. For one thing that is clearly a AR front sight and front gas block-why would a HK anything have a AR type gas block? Why would a pistol cal anything have a gas block? And it is blurry but it does look like a 30rnd AR mag sticking out of it too. Got anymore pics???? [url]http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=12&t=139293[/url] Thanks Armd! |
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Posted: 9/5/2002 3:26:28 PM EDT
[#22]
The weapon features an upper built for Crane NSW by a vendor. The upper has its own NSN number.
The receiver is M4 spec, with M4 feed ramps and a flat top, but it is not a Colt. The barrel is from Diemaco (Canadian) and is hammer forged, chrome-lined and reportedly 10 inches. The rear back up iron sight is a standard detachable carrying handle, cut and nicely finished by the vendor. The rail system is a RIS from KAC without the rail covers and the Aimpoint mount is a KAC straight mount. The stock is the SOCOM M4 stock. JAW |
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Posted: 9/5/2002 3:31:16 PM EDT
[#23]
What do you think this MG is?
It looks like a 1919 but of course it ain't. Probably a 7.62x51 something. Would an M2 be too big for a copter? [img]http://us.news2.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/ap/20020905/capt.1031253062.attacks_military_xms104.jpg[/img] |
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Posted: 9/5/2002 3:32:17 PM EDT
[#24]
does anyone know why both my Adobe PhotoDelux and my MGI PhotoSuit BOTH refuse to open the copies of the pictures I downloaded from Yahoo's news photo wire? I downloaded them to try and edit them to see the rifles better but neither editor will open them now. They are supposed to be just normal JPEG format pics. Do the wire services use somekind of encryption or something?
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Posted: 9/5/2002 3:32:25 PM EDT
[#25]
So there you have it boy's and girl's.
Damn.. I love this place! [:D] |
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Posted: 9/5/2002 3:32:43 PM EDT
[#26]
[img]http://i.cnn.net/cnn/2002/images/09/05/top.sf.soldier.karzai.ap.jpg[/img]
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Posted: 9/5/2002 3:34:24 PM EDT
[#27]
Quoted: does anyone know why both my Adobe PhotoDelux and my MGI PhotoSuit BOTH refuse to open the copies of the pictures I downloaded from Yahoo's news photo wire? I downloaded them to try and edit them to see the rifles better but neither editor will open them now. They are supposed to be just normal JPEG format pics. Do the wire services use somekind of encryption or something? My guess. They might have extra characters after the .jpg suffix. Just remove them and it should open. Take a look at the whole filename in explorer. Or just add .jpg to the suffix. It works. |
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Posted: 9/5/2002 3:35:39 PM EDT
[#28]
Quoted: The weapon features an upper built for Crane NSW by a vendor. The upper has its own NSN number. The receiver is M4 spec, with M4 feed ramps and a flat top, but it is not a Colt. The barrel is from Diemaco (Canadian) and is hammer forged, chrome-lined and reportedly 10 inches. The rear back up iron sight is a standard detachable carrying handle, cut and nicely finished by the vendor. The rail system is a RIS from KAC without the rail covers and the Aimpoint mount is a KAC straight mount. The stock is the SOCOM M4 stock. JAW Again, look at the pic in the article and in seadwellers 1st post. There is no rear stock...or even short buffer tube. Edited to add Somebody that can post a pic email me your address and I'll send you what I'm looking at. |
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Posted: 9/5/2002 3:36:44 PM EDT
[#29]
When called upon to fight, the HH-60H stands ready. The HH-60H armament consists of 2 M-60D/M-240 machine guns or two GAU-17A miniguns. It is capable of carrying M60 or M240 machine guns and 4 Hellfire missiles. With its weapon system growth package, it can pack a GCAL-50 machine gun, 2.75" rockets, Stinger, Maverick or Hellfire missiles.
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Posted: 9/5/2002 3:37:54 PM EDT
[#30]
Armd-
This is the filename of the helo as I see it in explorer: capt.1031253062.attacks_military_xms104 Guess you do have to add the .jpg suffix. |
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Posted: 9/5/2002 3:40:26 PM EDT
[#31]
[img]http://us.news2.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/ap/20020905/capt.1031243332.topix_afghanistan_karzai_assasination_attempt_knd104.jpg[/img]
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Posted: 9/5/2002 3:41:17 PM EDT
[#32]
Quoted: What do you think this MG is? It looks like a 1919 but of course it ain't. Probably a 7.62x51 something. Would an M2 be too big for a copter? [url]http://us.news2.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/ap/20020905/capt.1031253062.attacks_military_xms104.jpg[/url] No that is a .50 cal. XM218 is the model number IIRC. I don't know why the different number, it certainly appears from the outside to be nothing more than a new production copy of the flexable aircraft mount version of the M2 Browning used on Army and Navy aircraft and the turrets of PT boats in World War II. |
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Posted: 9/5/2002 3:41:33 PM EDT
[#33]
Quoted: What do you think this MG is? It looks like a 1919 but of course it ain't. Probably a 7.62x51 something. Would an M2 be too big for a copter? [url]http://us.news2.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/ap/20020905/capt.1031253062.attacks_military_xms104.jpg[/url] The 'Pave Hawk' can be fitted with two .50's, one in each door. [50] |
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Posted: 9/5/2002 3:42:46 PM EDT
[#34]
Quoted: Quoted: What do you think this MG is? It looks like a 1919 but of course it ain't. Probably a 7.62x51 something. Would an M2 be too big for a copter? [url]http://us.news2.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/ap/20020905/capt.1031253062.attacks_military_xms104.jpg[/url] No that is a .50 cal. XM218 is the model number IIRC. I don't know why the different number, it certainly appears from the outside to be nothing more than a new production copy of the flexable aircraft mount version of the M2 Browning used on Army and Navy aircraft and the turrets of PT boats in World War II. Did you figure out the 128bit encoded capt. pics? |
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Posted: 9/5/2002 3:43:49 PM EDT
[#35]
Quoted: Quoted: What do you think this MG is? It looks like a 1919 but of course it ain't. Probably a 7.62x51 something. Would an M2 be too big for a copter? [url]http://us.news2.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/ap/20020905/capt.1031253062.attacks_military_xms104.jpg[/url] The 'Pave Hawk' can be fitted with two .50's, one in each door. [50] Cool, but what about a door mounted 20mm? In a helo. |
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Posted: 9/5/2002 3:44:21 PM EDT
[#36]
Quoted: The weapon features an upper built for Crane NSW by a vendor. The upper has its own NSN number. The receiver is M4 spec, with M4 feed ramps and a flat top, but it is not a Colt. The barrel is from Diemaco (Canadian) and is hammer forged, chrome-lined and reportedly 10 inches. The rear back up iron sight is a standard detachable carrying handle, cut and nicely finished by the vendor. The rail system is a RIS from KAC without the rail covers and the Aimpoint mount is a KAC straight mount. The stock is the SOCOM M4 stock. JAW Well, what are they feeding it? Most 5.56 loads are not supposed to be very effective fired from such short barrels. Or are they just using M193 and just not caring about how it works past 50m? |
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Posted: 9/5/2002 4:12:21 PM EDT
[#37]
Oh shit do I feel stupid.
Just got a pic redone that shows it's some kind of pad on the stock with a strap that made it look like, to me any who, that there was no butt stock. Sheesh what do I need glasses? Oh, I already have some I just can't find them cause I can't find my glasses.[:I] |
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Posted: 9/5/2002 4:20:13 PM EDT
[#38]
Quoted: Oh shit do I feel stupid. Just got a pic redone that shows it's some kind of pad on the stock with a strap that made it look like, to me any who, that there was no butt stock. Sheesh what do I need glasses? Oh, I already have some I just can't find them cause I can't find my glasses.[:I] Ahh like a cheek rest? Or perhaps a spare mag holder? That explanes why the stock looked a little odd. I thought it might of been something like the MagPull telestock. |
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Posted: 9/5/2002 4:34:17 PM EDT
[#39]
Those guys are CIA SPEC OPS..
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Posted: 9/5/2002 4:36:37 PM EDT
[#40]
[img]http://us.news2.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/ap/20020905/capt.1031253312.topix_afghanistan_karzai_knd106.jpg[/img]
Definitely an M-16 family member! Eric The(Happy)Hun[>]:)] |
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Posted: 9/5/2002 4:41:14 PM EDT
[#41]
Quoted: Those guys are CIA SPEC OPS.. Possible, but not probable. It was publicly announced that US Special Forces would take over bodyguard duites for Karzai some months ago after the first attempt on his life. Everyone has assumed that ment Delta, though naturally the Army has never confirmed that they specificaly were getting the job. |
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Posted: 9/5/2002 4:41:23 PM EDT
[#42]
There are also reports of Americans from private security forces working over there as well, though I doubt they would be guarding Karzai. Undoubtably US GI there...
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Posted: 9/5/2002 4:50:11 PM EDT
[#43]
I think the big thirty round magazine thingy is a giveaway.
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Posted: 9/5/2002 4:58:47 PM EDT
[#44]
Quoted: I think the big thirty round magazine thingy is a giveaway. Well in all fairness, in the first pic posted, the fence was blocking the view of the mag. |
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Posted: 9/5/2002 5:02:59 PM EDT
[#45]
[b]Sea Dweller Wrote:
Quoted: Notice even in a very dangerous situation, the operator has his "Finger off of the Trigger". He must have took an NRA Firearms safety class eh...... I believe that is an M4 variant with a 10.5 inch barrell. Most likely Delta, Dont think the haircut and facial hair falls into military regs. Besides to really confirm we would need to see his Oakly sunglasses! -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Looks like this guy has Oakley's![/b] Oh that is funny you caught it. You must have seen black hawk down too! |
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Posted: 9/5/2002 5:17:18 PM EDT
[#46]
Counter Terrorism Ops don't have to stick to ball ammo. You'd be better off with a softpoint round comming out of the short barrel.
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Posted: 9/5/2002 5:17:32 PM EDT
[#47]
CIA SPEC OPS are considered US special forces.
I say this as CIA operators like those vests.. |
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Posted: 9/5/2002 5:21:13 PM EDT
[#48]
I could be wrong but the shirtless guy looks like he has a Beretta, not a Sig. I could be wrong though.
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Posted: 9/5/2002 5:27:19 PM EDT
[#49]
I like the handle he is holding with the left hand.
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Posted: 9/5/2002 5:29:32 PM EDT
[#50]
Quoted: What do you think this MG is? It looks like a 1919 but of course it ain't. Probably a 7.62x51 something. Would an M2 be too big for a copter? [url]http://us.news2.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/ap/20020905/capt.1031253062.attacks_military_xms104.jpg[/url] its an M2, definetly not too big for choppers. Trust me... |
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