User Panel
User Panel
User Panel
|
Posted: 8/11/2002 7:22:53 AM EDT
[#1]
Well you adjusted the trigger to a POSSIBLY unsafe pull weight... so that COULD qualify for a ND +1. BUT, you were following safety practices by keeping the gun downrange -1 so I guess you get credit for that. Let's see... the tally is 0, so I would just call it a scary discharge.
[:D] BTW... did you ever get your SAR1? |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/11/2002 7:30:59 AM EDT
[#2]
I would consider it negligent in that
1, you did not intend for it to happen, 2, you set your trigger weight to an unsafe pull weight. Kudo's for observing safety rules, and keeping the weapon downrange. You really should consider re adjusting the trigger. It seems to me that just placing your finger on it would cause a discharge. It would then be difficult, if not impossible to get a proper firing position, finger possitioned properly, breathing set, prior to firing. In my opinion, there is no such thing as an "Accidental" discharge. Of course it was unintentional, but the why is the question. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/11/2002 7:32:56 AM EDT
[#3]
Can I get a hell yes?
[img]http://groups.msn.com/_Secure/0LAAAAKMNRRKaIGHwKRv1vC8rAuSVqrnJsQNf5dc55mVM7ZmnJl2k1o4yvBZapffv0Pr6NbTyNKw/IM000413.JPG[/img] Love them both but the SAR 2 is the cats ass with the RSA trigger. I have that trigger set at maybe two pounds. Very nice setup for less than $400. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/11/2002 7:43:22 AM EDT
[#4]
Quoted: I would consider it negligent in that 1, you did not intend for it to happen, 2, you set your trigger weight to an unsafe pull weight. Kudo's for observing safety rules, and keeping the weapon downrange. You really should consider re adjusting the trigger. It seems to me that just placing your finger on it would cause a discharge. It would then be difficult, if not impossible to get a proper firing position, finger possitioned properly, breathing set, prior to firing. In my opinion, there is no such thing as an "Accidental" discharge. Of course it was unintentional, but the why is the question. I downed 37 of 40 targets so the trigger weight is not an issue as far as position. I like a light trigger, that's my preference, I don't expect you to agree with that nor did I ask you to. I have used this rifle for 3 years and this is the first issue I have had with it. The trigger was adjusted to this weight out of the box. Safety and gun handling are my priorities when shooting. The question would be what type of discharge. I was of the mindset that there were only NDs but if no one is hurt and no property damaged then the UD would seem to apply. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/11/2002 8:01:19 AM EDT
[#5]
Regardless of how it happens, if it wasn't suppose to happen, it's UNINTENTIONAL. (or, "OH, SHIT!") [;D]
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/11/2002 8:20:28 AM EDT
[#6]
Quoted: Regardless of how it happens, if it wasn't suppose to happen, it's UNINTENTIONAL. (or, "OH, SHIT!") [;D] Agreed. But would you say there are two types of "I didn't want that to happen" discharges? No property or personal damage but the firearms discharges = UD? Property or personal damage = ND? |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/11/2002 8:27:13 AM EDT
[#7]
I like a light trigger, that's my preference, I don't expect you to agree with that nor did I ask you to. I have used this rifle for 3 years and this is the first issue I have had with it. in that case, you may want to check the sear engagement points to see if they're worn. as they wear, your pull may have lightened, unperceptably, over time. I don't think you have to wound someone or damage something to consider it a ND, but if it helps you sleep better.. Call it what you will. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/11/2002 8:34:46 AM EDT
[#8]
If I was RO'ing it would be an AD.
I really don't care how long you have been exposed to firearms or how careful you are, if you are a shooter you WILL have an AD sometime during your life. Either your weapon will malfunction, or you will screw up, but believe me when I say it will happen. The solution to this problem is to remember those basic firearm safety rules, and follow them. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/11/2002 8:44:10 AM EDT
[#9]
Quoted: I like a light trigger, that's my preference, I don't expect you to agree with that nor did I ask you to. I have used this rifle for 3 years and this is the first issue I have had with it. in that case, you may want to check the sear engagement points to see if they're worn. as they wear, your pull may have lightened, unperceptably, over time. I don't think you have to wound someone or damage something to consider it a ND, but if it helps you sleep better.. Call it what you will. I was of the mindset that there were no accidental discharges just negligent. I really couldn't call the one last week an ND and wondered what others thought on the topic. Trigger weight isn't an issue if you keep your finger off the trigger or out of the trigger guard. Which I didn't but I did ensure the rifle was pointed in a safe direction. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/11/2002 9:23:37 AM EDT
[#10]
Here's my 2¢:
If you "brushed the trigger" it was a negligent discharge - you caused it and didn't intend it. The round discharged because you were negligent about trigger control. Where it happened and the fact that no damage occurred is immaterial. If the weapon discharged because of a mechanical failure, that's an [i]accidental[/i] discharge. Because you were on a range with the weapon pointed in a safe direction and no damage was done it would not be [i]negligent[/i]. I had a negligent discharge from a mechanical failure because mine was in my home and I broke several rules of safety before the mechanical failure became the last link in the chain. See the difference? |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/11/2002 9:45:20 AM EDT
[#11]
Quoted: Here's my 2¢: If you "brushed the trigger" it was a negligent discharge - you caused it and didn't intend it. The round discharged because you were negligent about trigger control. Where it happened and the fact that no damage occurred is immaterial. If the weapon discharged because of a mechanical failure, that's an [i]accidental[/i] discharge. Because you were on a range with the weapon pointed in a safe direction and no damage was done it would not be [i]negligent[/i]. I had a negligent discharge from a mechanical failure because mine was in my home and I broke several rules of safety before the mechanical failure became the last link in the chain. See the difference? Yeah, I see the difference and would agree that my lack of trigger discipline caused the discharge. My thoughts were since nothing bad resulted how could I view it as an ND. With trigger control in mind It is an ND. Guess I am slipping.[:\] |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/11/2002 10:28:08 AM EDT
[#12]
Did you ever stop to think that a trigger that is adjusted down into the onces can cause a fatal error?
If you ever drop that weapon with a round in the chamber it can go off if it hits on the butt hard enough. I know ,you're never going to drop the rifle right? I'm sure that's what everyone that ever dropped a weapon said. And yes it is a ND because you took the trigger down to an unsafe pull. Think about this scenario, You have a discharge with this gun and someone is shot (other then yourself),the prosecutors office now has your gun and they do a test and find the extremely light trigger pull,what do you think they would do with you? And last,the gun was in your care and it discharged,it is your gun and you are responsible for what happens while it is in your control,PERIOD. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/11/2002 11:35:04 AM EDT
[#13]
Quoted: Did you ever stop to think that a trigger that is adjusted down into the onces can cause a fatal error? Possibly. I am of the mindset that the operator would be more of the cause though. Never letting the muzzle cover anything you are not willing to destroy.[:)] If you ever drop that weapon with a round in the chamber it can go off if it hits on the butt hard enough. Never dropped a weapon yet and it is strictly a target rifle used in specific activities. This isn't a squirrel rifle. It's a single shot target rifle loaded just before each shot. I know ,you're never going to drop the rifle right? I'm sure that's what everyone that ever dropped a weapon said. And yes it is a ND because you took the trigger down to an unsafe pull. We can "what if" till the end times. What if I have a seizure with a 5lb trigger? Proper gun handling can save a lot of butts. If I do ever drop my rifle I'll let you know. I would also say that even with a 2lb trigger the rifle most likely would have discharged. You sound as though you haven't done much competitive shooting. Please correct me if this is wrong. Benchrest shooters typically use 2 oz triggers and I've yet to hear of anyone shot at a BR event. Think about this scenario, You have a discharge with this gun and someone is shot (other then yourself),the prosecutors office now has your gun and they do a test and find the extremely light trigger pull,what do you think they would do with you? And last,the gun was in your care and it discharged,it is your gun and you are responsible for what happens while it is in your control,PERIOD. Again we can "what if" forever. [:)]I don't live my life with the question of what is the liability of each action I take. That would be letting the lawyers and liberals win. Ain't living like that dude, you want to, great. I hope it suits you. I readily admit a rifle discharged while in my care when I didn't want it to. I am not ducking the issue, I fully accept responsibility and admitted it was an ND but it was an ND that probably would have happened with a heavier trigger weight. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/11/2002 11:59:15 AM EDT
[#14]
I was always taught that there was no such thing as an accidental discharge. Firearms sometimes discharge because of a malfunction but I would classify that as a unintential discharge and not negligent if no injury/death resulted. A slam-fire or broken sear would be a good example.
If you modify a firearm by altering the fire control mechanism to an unsafe condition that in it self would be negligent. I'm not sure if this was the case or not. The fact that you used the only reliable "safety between your ears" avoided a potential injury or death. So I believe your discharge was negligent but your safe gun handling avoided the consequences. Thanks for bringing this up for discussion. |
|
|
Win a FREE Membership!
Sign up for the ARFCOM weekly newsletter and be entered to win a free ARFCOM membership. One new winner* is announced every week!
You will receive an email every Friday morning featuring the latest chatter from the hottest topics, breaking news surrounding legislation, as well as exclusive deals only available to ARFCOM email subscribers.
AR15.COM is the world's largest firearm community and is a gathering place for firearm enthusiasts of all types.
From hunters and military members, to competition shooters and general firearm enthusiasts, we welcome anyone who values and respects the way of the firearm.
Subscribe to our monthly Newsletter to receive firearm news, product discounts from your favorite Industry Partners, and more.
Copyright © 1996-2024 AR15.COM LLC. All Rights Reserved.
Any use of this content without express written consent is prohibited.
AR15.Com reserves the right to overwrite or replace any affiliate, commercial, or monetizable links, posted by users, with our own.
