Range Mishap - AR15.COM

Posted: 7/20/2002 3:54:17 PM EDT

Pulled up at the range today and a highpower shooter showed me the remnants of a casing. Turns out a young shooter was shooting a .308 (as I recall) from the sitting position. He dropped a round on the concrete and it detonated. The bullet barely moved, but he caught about a dozen small pieces of brass in his lower leg. That's the second incident I'm aware of. I can still see the scars from the first.

I was a little surprized the priemr would detonate from a drop of about 18 inches, but I guess anything is possible. Everyone was grateful it was his leg and not an eye.

Eddie

Posted: 7/20/2002 3:55:37 PM EDT

[#1]

Geez. What kinda ammo was it?

Posted: 7/20/2002 4:02:35 PM EDT

[#2]

a high primer in factory or reloads can do this easily

Posted: 7/20/2002 4:03:54 PM EDT

[#3]

Also shows that people who refuse to wear protective eyewear are taking silly risks.

Posted: 7/20/2002 4:05:59 PM EDT

[#4]

Sounds like a freak accident to me. I've dropped rounds several times and never even dreamed of it going off. Maybe a primer hitting a sharp surface dead on would do it. Guess it just wasn't his lucky day.

Posted: 7/20/2002 4:16:18 PM EDT

[#5]

I didn't take notice of the headstamp, but it was surplus ammo. Had the three spot crimp mark on the primer that I've seen on some imported 5.56 ammo. The primer appeared to be seated flush. The round that fragged my leg was also factory.

Eddie

Posted: 7/20/2002 4:48:10 PM EDT

[#6]

It had to be a high primer (ie not fully seated) and it had to hit perfectly square with the concrete. I have drop rounds of ammo on concrete and never had this happen. Not saying it can't but it must be extremely rare!. Also keep in mind that since there was no barrel for the case to push against is the reason the bullet didn't move much. When a cartriudge is fired the case expands against the barrel throat which in turn causes all the gases to propel the bullet forward. Since the case had nothing to expand against it was a relatively safe detonation...if there is such a thing.

Sgtar15

Posted: 7/20/2002 11:24:15 PM EDT

[#7]

It had to be a high primer

View Quote

Primer wasn't high. As I mentioned it was crimped in place. Two incidents, that I'm aware of, in over 30 years. That's pretty rare.

Eddie

Posted: 7/20/2002 11:29:02 PM EDT

[#8]

A friend of mine that works in a gunshop had this happen with a .380. He dropped a round onto concrete, and the casing exploded, leaving the bullet about where it fell. His leg was full of brass shrapnel.

Posted: 7/21/2002 12:21:43 AM EDT

[#9]

Interesting.

So if the brass isn't fully supported, it gives.

I would've thought the bullet might dislodge, but without much force.

Good to know.

Posted: 7/21/2002 12:29:28 AM EDT

[#10]

Is there any specific reason why this only seems to happen with .308's and not .223's or 7.62x39?

Posted: 7/21/2002 12:37:36 AM EDT

[#11]

Is there any specific reason why this only seems to happen with .308's and not .223's or 7.62x39?

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I don't think caliber has anything to do with it. IMO primer brand and cartridge weight would be the two biggest factors. The round that fragged my leg was .45ACP.

Eddie

Posted: 7/21/2002 12:47:12 AM EDT

[#12]

In all my years of shooting I had never seen this - until last year. Within a two day period, two guys on my swat team were loading mags and dropped speer lawman 9mm on some gravel. Same result, the casing exploded sending brass flying. The first time it happend, one guy got hit in the family jewels by the brass. He thought its was the bullet and it scared the shit out of him. Lucky both incidents only led to very minor wounds.

Posted: 7/21/2002 12:49:18 AM EDT

[#13]

Most of the outdoor ranges that I go to are topped with asphalt. It's a very uneven surface. If the primer happens to land on a protruding pebble, BAM!

Posted: 7/21/2002 3:37:34 AM EDT

[#14]

I don't think it's "luck" that these were minor wounds, I think the brass fragments just don't have a lot of power to 'em and any resulting wound is gonna be pretty minor. 'Cept if you were VERY unlucky and got nailed in the eye because you were bent over or something but now we're talkin' real long odds.

The reason the bullets aren't going anywhere is that there's no "gas seal" behind 'em. Normally, a handgun powder charge would be set to burn across 4" - 6" or more of barrel travel, while the .308 needs 18+. Without that, 90% or more of the powder's energy is being completely unused, leaving 10% at worst to power the light brass frags.

Upshot: this isn't anything to fear losing life or limb over. It's more of a "bandaid and owwie" threat :). Mind you, I'm sure picking brass frags out of your hide HURTS, I don't intend to minimize that but y'all experienced the WORST that could happen, versus "luck".

Posted: 7/21/2002 3:59:44 AM EDT

[#15]

The eye protection thing is sort of like insurence. Sure glasses are a nuisence to wear, sort of like paying for insurence, but when you need them, they can really save you.

I have heard of Federal primers being "touchy" but have no personal experience with them. Something about the metal part is thin and soft thus transfering a "ding" very well.

Posted: 7/21/2002 4:15:13 AM EDT

[#16]

Once, when clearing the chamber of the household riot Mossberg the ejected shell (S&B buckshot) landed on a hard surface & set off the primer. Just the primer, not the gunpowder. Scared the %*(*%^%$ out of me. When examined most of the primer was still in place (anvil, etc) just the external metal was gone.

Posted: 7/21/2002 4:38:11 AM EDT

[#17]

Maybe the reason .308 does it, and .223 and 7.62x39 do not is because of mass, .308 would have more energy on impact but (I believe) all three cartridges use primers with similar shock tolerances.

Kharn

Posted: 7/21/2002 6:48:10 AM EDT

[#18]

There have also been reports of loose rimfire ammo thrown in a pocket with a battery detonating.

Posted: 7/21/2002 1:16:43 PM EDT

[#19]

I had an emergency room doctor dig .22LR brass out of my hand years ago when a co-worker smashed one with a hammer to prove that the bullet would not fly off. He proved his point, the bullet was still lying there smashed under the hammer. Tell that to my profusely bleeding hand though.

Posted: 7/21/2002 9:02:21 PM EDT

[#20]

LS1Eddie,
What range was this at?

Posted: 7/21/2002 9:08:28 PM EDT

[#21]

Shit happens.

Posted: 7/21/2002 9:13:33 PM EDT

[#22]

This is scary. I'll be careful handling ammos from now on.

Posted: 7/21/2002 9:43:26 PM EDT

[#23]

Quoted:
I had an emergency room doctor dig .22LR brass out of my hand years ago when a co-worker smashed one with a hammer to prove that the bullet would not fly off.

View Quote

Ah, there's a smart one!

Posted: 7/21/2002 10:21:37 PM EDT

[#24]

Quoted:
I had an emergency room doctor dig .22LR brass out of my hand years ago when a co-worker smashed one with a hammer to prove that the bullet would not fly off. He proved his point, the bullet was still lying there smashed under the hammer. Tell that to my profusely bleeding hand though.

View Quote

WHAT THE HELL WERE YOU THINKING SON? Suffering from 'thinkus interruptus?'

actually um, err,....hmm me and an "EX" friend are guilty of a similar thing. No one got hurt but yeah, we were dumb.

We took empty 22 shells, no powder or bullet, just primer in the shell and we stuck it (open side down) into a copper tube where just the rim stuck out. We then heated the rim with an oxy-acetylene torch and "POP" those suckers flew far.

talk about your "Thinkus Interruptus"

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