I've had a guy apply for a job with my company that's in the National Guard.

I understand the 2 weeks a year thing - they take off two weeks (hopefully with sufficient notice of the dates) and can keep their job.  What about the weekend thing?  When does that start?  Will I lose that person Friday morning, or do they start the Guard service Friday night and are back to work on Monday morning?

Thanks

You, by law, have to work around his schedule.  You will know in advance when he needs weekends off.  Yes it is very common the have Friday drill, he is then required to be at work Monday morning.  Hire him!

What time on Friday?  I can't have a crew out of town 6 hours away and have someone expect to not work on Friday morning.

Yes he'll have a 2 week summer camp and on weekend a month.  Very rarely do Fridays become requirement unless it's a range qualification weekend or so.  You should feel good to have a quality individual to work for you and serve your state at the same time.

Depends.  Could be 0600, could be 1800, could be never.  Not everyone does Friday drills.

I do Friday drills all the time, extremely common with units that do shit at drill.

 Fuck Fridays that's why I love being in a Maint. Co.    That's some sho nuff troof though................

Some months they might have a MUTA 6, 7 or 8. It all depends on what the tasking for that month is. That means that he could be gone on Friday or even Thursday.
Your typical MUTA 4 drill weekend is 0700 Saturday til about 1700 hrs Sunday. Then the EM has 8 hrs before s/he has to report back to their civilian employer for their next shift.

Ask for his/her annual training schedule. That may change over the course of the year, but it'll give you an idea of when they'll be needed for their Guard job

I'm quickly learning that one weekend a month and two weeks a year does not actually mean one weekend a month and two weeks a year.

A drill weekend at my unit is 0700-1500 Saturday and Sunday the third weekend of each month. The twelve days of ADT are scheduled by the individual to work alongside the active duty at the same unit, usually scheduled 45 days in advance and sometime between May and August typically.

tax,

We appreciate YOUR service to the country.  It's tough to be a small business owner w/ troops in the Guard & the Reserves.

Ask him for a copy of his unit's scheduled drill memo & the phone number/email of his Platoon Sergeant.  That will lay out the scheduled drills for the year as are currently scheduled.  They can change.  Some drills are MUTA 4 (Saturday/Sunday); others are MUTA 5 or 6 - Friday evening or all day Friday.  He should be back to work with you Monday morning in most cases.

As it's the Guard, he'll also be on call for any state emergencies declared by your Governor, and he sometimes may be required to attend additional training funded by the Army - anything from a 2 day school at state headquarters to a MOS qualification school that lasts several months.  And of course, there's always Afghanistan.

These folks will be able to help you out w/ any questions you may have:

http://www.esgr.org/site/

Of course, knowing all this, you can't discriminate against hiring him on the basis of his duties, or you'll run afoul of:

http://www.osc.gov/userra.htm

Best thing to do is ring the ESGR folks.  Again, thanks for YOUR service to our country.

Gig 'em,

backbencher
(National Guard member back from Iraq last November, employed by a small business)

Well, there went that guy's potential job.

Nice post backbencher.

2 weeks a summer can mean 14 days split up in 3-4 day segments anytime during the year.

Why do you say that?

I'm looking to fill a position in a two man crew, not one position with forty guys in a shop that can cover for someone if they are out a day for Guard duty.  I've never hired active military / Guard before, so I need to understand what I'm in for if the guy meets the job requirements.  

My concern is knowing far enough in advance when the guy will be gone that I can plan the schedule accordingly.  I can't have someone tell me on Wednesday that they can't work Friday, or will be leaving in a couple of days for their 2 week commitment.

My experience in the NG was that we rarely reported for drill on a Friday. If we did, it was in the early evening. One weekend a month, and two weeks in the summer? On paper, yes. In reality? There's a pretty good chance of being called up for something.





 

Depends on the unit.

When I was in some drills where 0700 saturday till 1700 sunday.

Some where 1700 friday till 1700 sunday.

Some where 0700 thursday till 1700 sunday.

AT was never 2 weeks, mostly 3, but sometimes 4 - 6 weeks if we were on a train up for deployment.

Then there are company and battalion meetings on weeknights during the month.

I was an Officer in a combat arms unit (FA), attached to a light infantry brigade.

Never had that done that way in the Army Guard. I know when we were attached to the Air Guard guys they were able to do that. There were Air Guard guys who knocked out their entire annual obligation in one straight month. That would have been ideal.

The Soldier should know at least a month or so in advance when he will need to be somewhere. The obvious exception to this is natural disasters.

 

They will have their yearly schedule for the coming fiscal year, though it is sometimes subject to change, and should have no trouble giving you a copy.   If they won't that's a warning sign.   Once in a while things can come up - natural disasters, school slots, whatever, that is not planned for, but that should be minimal and still give at least a couple days notice (I have only once in my career been able to give less than 2 weeks notice for Reserve stuff).  Changed drill dates are normally at least 60 days out.  Bad news is, Annual Training for some units is up to a month now - though sometimes, as noted, it's still only 12 days or so, and often even broken up.  

My personal (admittedly biased) experience has been that someone who is a good employee isn't going to let his reserve service interfere with his job any more than he can help it, and often the unit will work with him if they can.  OTOH, shitbirds, the kind who will abuse their reserve status, you don't want as an employee anyway and they should give you plenty of non-military reasons to not hire/fire them.

I guess that it depends on what State you are in.  Here in Alaska the Guard has done all kinds of strange things for Drills and AT.  Since people are more active and some jobs are more summer time, some Units tended to schedule no drills during July and Aug.  To make up for the 'lost' days they did more MUTA 5's during the winter.  For a long time the annual traing was during the winter as alot of the 'local' people were out of work.
I know that it can get tough to schedule around drill dates for a employee but in the long run you will be better off.  As has already been stated those in the Guard tend to have a better state of mind, know how to work with little supervision, for the most part are drug free and in good health.  A 'Training Schedule' is published at the begining of the year (oct) and handed to everyone.  The troops are also told to ensure that their employers know well in advance what the drill dates are, so you should know well in advance when your 'Guard Member' will be not at work.

I pulled the pin from the Air Guard with 24 years 7 months 4 days..



I had my years schedule I think by Sept/Oct of the previous year if I recall right. Mainly my drill (UTA) weekends were 0700 Sat-1500 Sunday. During the last few years we wouldn't have a UTA in July. That one would be a combined into a 2 seperate UTA's in one month. Also as stated our Annul Field training (AFT) 15 days a year may or may not be all in a row. AFT alot of time was broken up in to pieces here and there to combine with our UTA weekend/s.



So you does this look on a calender..



Lets go to this Aug, lets say this is when the big "War" is. 6Aug-10Aug would be 5 AFT days. 11Aug-12Aug would be UTA days. 13Aug-17Aug would be 5 more days of AFT followed up by 18Aug-19Aug as a UTA weekend.



With this being said, for me at least, the military was darned good about working around my civilian work schedule..

We hired a guy that was reliable as all hell but had to do some reserve stuff. One of his supers had a fit when they found out. The other super said "I have his schedule for the next 6 months. The guy you want to keep? I don't know if he'll show up tomorrow or not."

If you can make it work and he's qualified for the position, it probably won't be one of your worst decisions.

He will have his annual schedule at the start of the fiscal year, however it may change slightly throughout the year. You/he should no no later than 3 weeks out when his drill will be for a given month. Three weeks should be plenty of time to plan around. Look at it this way, he's serving his country on those weekends maintaining equipment and training for his military specialty, he's not getting a three day weekend to screw off. Find out his job and rank, chances are he's a hardworker and a good guy. If he's an NCO (E-5/SGT or above) then he's show that he can follow and lead and has a strong performance history that led his leadership to promoted him. His MOS may bring experience and a skillset to the table you have not yet considered, either.

When I was in, we got our schedule for the year in October, and drill dates rarely changed. Exceptions would be extra training,split training(make up "drills" to replace time lost at actual duty time for things like sickness or family issues) or volunteer emergency duty-I almost got sent from IA to help out in NC for hurricane relief one year. We had 3-4 times a year where were on duty Friday as well. These were noted in the schrdules we received in October.

Lol, many manager's will avoid hiring NG folks like the plague. It's wrong and it's illegal, but in at least some companies the unwritten rule is don't hire current .mil folks cause you will lose your employee fairly regularly, have to keep his job open for him, and make scheduling concessions, all by law if your hire them. Many places take the easy way out, claim the guy "isnt qualified" and move down the list. It's supremely fucked up, but with many blue color jobs it happens.

weekend = friday,saturday & sunday

2 weeks = 18-20 days

Yep, I've had a few interviewers that had a hard on for me because of my degree and skillset and loved my prior service active duty experience. Then when they found out I was in the NG their attitude changed and they wanted to wrap up the interview. This is why I'll probably stay in service with the state or fed .gov, at least they respect NG/AR service obligations, where as civ employers see you as a crutch.

I'm in the Army Reserves and I believe I can answer your question. All units I've seen give out a yearly schedule that you can give to your employer so you know the dates ahead of schedule, however they can be changed. You will usually know the 2 weeks, 6 months prior to having to go for the 2 weeks. Also Fridays are really rare and maybe twice a year. That's usually reserved for FTX(Field training exercise) or BRM (Basic Rifle Marksmanship.)

According to a friend of mine that was in the guard, the real deal is on e weekend a month and three years in Iraq.

This is true with my last manager. Although he was a worthless, kiss-ass yes-man he decided he wouldn't hire anyone in the NG after having to give me the weekend a month off. One time he called me and told me that he wasn't going to be able to give me the time off I needed for Drill. I simply told him that the issue was between him and the state and to leave me out of it, or put it on paper for me.
He also wouldn't hire retired police LEOs because the departments around there wouldn't hire him.

He should be able to provide you a drill and annual training (2 weeks) schedule for at least the entire Fiscal Year (Oct-Sept). These dates are determined well ahead of time.

+1
Barring a complete turd on his way towards a negative chapter/ discharge, even a mediocre soldier is typically a better worker than the average civilan. The .mil is good at beating some work ethic into you.

Yep. I did a stint in the guard after active duty. I had no idea it would take up so much of my time.

this man isn't lying. the Guard plays such an active role in theatre operations, it isn't funny. This ain't your daddies National Guard. Some of the "weekend warriors" i know have 2 combat tours.
imagine 100 percent of the responsibilites of an Active Duty component, 1/4 of the budget and training..rough picture at what your looking at.
that being said, HE should be able to provide a Training schedual and or a letter to his employeer from his Commander, just so you, HR, and Him are all on the same page.

it may be difficult to work around some times, but the employers who understand what we do, are a god send and your Service member is proud to say they work for you.

Its a rare Guardsman who's been in the whole post- 9/11 period who DOESN'T have at least 2 years of mobilized time.

Lets see....my unit, post 9/11...

six months guarding airports while they stood up TSA

Personnel at nuke plants almost continuously from 2002-2008

Air Guard base security 2003-2004

Southwest Border missions 2006-2007

NYC Bridges and Tunnels activations several times

Guys backfilled other units of the BDE who went to Iraq in 2005 or so

Afghanistan 2008-2009

and now they are in Kuwait for a year after training most of 2011 for a  mobilization that was changed from A-stan to Kuwait at the last minute

On top of that we were dealing with the typical every-few-years reorg in the middle of all that and about half the unit going to an MOS reclass school for an MOS that most ultimately were never awarded because the BN/ BDE didn't want guys with that MOS  stolen away as backfill for other deploying units

With all due respect, (and this is coming from someone who has an immediate family member in the guard), that is not 100% true.

The stories I heard about individuals who are in the guard, and their true motivation for being in it (ie, college bennies and a paycheck) and can't wait to get out... make me wonder what has become of our armed forces.

My view.

It is cyclical.

With the impending drawdowns, you'll be seeing many of those types getting out , either on their own accord or shown the door for failure to maintain to standard

The unit I am referring to hasn't deployed in over 8 years.  Many of them expect never to deploy by the end if their contract.

Just my experience.  YMMV

What kind of unit are they?

Ask him for his unit's training schedule. He should have it for the remanider of the year (end of September). By the end of October he should provide you with the new training schedule for next year.

Members of the National Guard are authorized 48 periods per fiscal year (October to September). These periods are called MUTAs, Multiple Unit Training Assembly. There no more than 2 periods or MUTAs per day. One period or MUTA is equivelant to 1 day of Active duty pay. The training schedule will look like this or simuliar:
   
DATE_______________________ MUTA_________________________TRAINING________________________LOCATION
1-3 June 2012 ...................................5........................................................ SQD  LFX ..............................................FT Riley, KS
18-20 July 2012 ............................... 6......................................................... PLT LFX .............................................. FT Campbell, KY

This means, during a MUTA 5, he has to report to his armory Friday evening at approximately 1830. The remainder of Friday evening is period 1. Saturday & Sunday are the remaining 4 periods. The location is where the unit will travel to from the armory, not where he has to report to. During a MUTA 6 he would have to be at the armory at 0630, basically, during a MUTA 6 or greater, you lose him all day Friday. On the rare occassion, there may be a MUTA 8 which means he is gone Thursday and Friday.

Annual training is not included in the MUTA count. When a Guardsman goes on Annual Training they are on Active Duty for Training (ADT) orders. It is one day for one day. Most AT's are 2 weeks (15 Days), Saturday to Saturday. The exception would be for a train-up prior to mobilization/deployment or an OCONUS Annual Training, Combined Manuever Training Center, Hoehenfells, Germany for example.

If for whatever reason you absolutely cannot let him go for Annual Training, he has the option of Year Round Training (YRT), but instead of loosing him for 2 weeks, you will loose him for 3 weeks. The  reason for this is because the unit is accomodating the individual soldier and he is performing is AT requirment at the Armory during the normal duty week. Hopefully doing something meaningful but more than likely being an office bitch or armory buetification.

Hope this helps.

I know a guy in the Air Guard who, IIRC, deployed at least 3 times to Iraq.  I think he's out of the guard now, but it seemed he was always gone then.



 

We mostly start drills saturday morning. Periodically we will do a 4 day (thurs-sun) drill and then skip the next month.



Ask him. His drilling may be very minimal.



I happen to drill A LOT, but I also use my own vacation time to do so, and I am not typical. The higher you get up the food chain the more time you put in.


 

Ill IM you.

Here's a good link for a quick news blip on hiring people from the national guard...

Hmmmmm.. Fly in a helicopter, maybe get a few pounds of C-4 as a parting gift....  I could accept that.  

ETA:  This is probably dumb, but the employer isn't expected to pay for the time the employee takes off for his 2 week training, right?

ETA #2:  He listed his MOS as 92Y.  What does this mean to me?

God forbid a company compensate someone for service to the country.

We have several local employers who not only pay for the two week drill, they actually maintain salary level during deployments.