How can I price out this shop/apartment plan? ETA: Critique my layout UPDATED LAYOUT

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[ARCHIVED THREAD] - How can I price out this shop/apartment plan? ETA: Critique my layout UPDATED LAYOUT

Posted: 9/21/2011 6:10:01 PM EDT

Might have to right click -> view picture to get the full resolution.

Basically, I'm an impatient bastard and can't wait a week for my Pop to look at this plan and get a rough estimate. I know material costs can change a LOT depending on where you live, so I'm not asking anyone to quote it, but maybe show me some resources that help me do it myself.

So what's the best way to estimate materials? There will be very little labor costs, only for pouring the slab and maybe putting up the metal. Dad is retired but has built 5 houses and ran an HVAC/plumbing company.

We plan on stick construction with 9' ceilings. Wood trusses. Possibly 2x6" on the external walls. Stained concrete floor and nothing fancy inside, just sheetrock and basic trim. Metal siding and roof. Only 2 full size windows and 1 half (1 not shown). 8'x10' garage doors with electric openers.

UPDATE:

Here are the changes I made. We're liking it a lot better. Thanks for the ideas guys.

OLD REVISION

Posted: 9/21/2011 6:18:01 PM EDT

[#1]

Bump, go ahead and critique the layout I've got too. I'm always open to other ideas, and we could be living here for up to 7 years.

Posted: 9/21/2011 6:20:26 PM EDT

[#2]

With labor assume 60 bucks a square foot plus. You providing labor and buying material at GC prices, I could build it under 30k.

Posted: 9/21/2011 6:23:57 PM EDT

[#3]

Put a window in the bedroom.
You need an egress in case of emergencies, and some natural light also.

Posted: 9/21/2011 6:27:01 PM EDT

[#4]

Quoted:
Put a window in the bedroom.
You need an egress in case of emergencies, and some natural light also.

Yep, there will be one there between the bed and door. I just didn't update this drawing.

Also, I just noticed the half window in the bathroom above the toilet didn't show up on this cross-section.

Posted: 9/21/2011 6:28:10 PM EDT

[#5]

Quoted:
With labor assume 60 bucks a square foot plus. You providing labor and buying material at GC prices, I could build it under 30k.

Yeah, Dad was thinking about 25k, but needed to really look at it to get a better estimate.

Also have to consider septic and water, phone, cable, and electric lines depending on the land we buy.

Posted: 9/21/2011 6:33:43 PM EDT

[#6]

One thing I noticed, you have the bathroom plumbing along an exterior wall. How cold does it get there? Also think about how much room you will have in the wall for plumbing AND insulation.

Posted: 9/21/2011 6:34:45 PM EDT

[#7]

If you're just laying around watching TV in the living room area, you have to walk all the way across the house to take a leak.

Can you squeeze a half-bath in there? I've always been a strong proponent in having a backup toilet.

Posted: 9/21/2011 6:37:19 PM EDT

[#8]

Quoted:

If you're just laying around watching TV in the living room area, you have to walk all the way across the house to take a leak.

Can you squeeze a half-bath in there? I've always been a strong proponent in having a backup toilet.

Was going to mention something related to this.

Think about having guests, to use the restroom they will have to walk through the bedroom.

Posted: 9/21/2011 6:37:33 PM EDT

[#9]

Quoted:

If you're just laying around watching TV in the living room area, you have to walk all the way across the house to take a leak.

Can you squeeze a half-bath in there? I've always been a strong proponent in having a backup toilet.

Or consider reversing the positioning of the bath/bedroom?

Posted: 9/21/2011 6:38:19 PM EDT

[#10]

Quoted:

If you're just laying around watching TV in the living room area, you have to walk all the way across the house to take a leak.

Can you squeeze a half-bath in there? I've always been a strong proponent in having a backup toilet.

Dude, it's like 30 feet away from the couch

Wouldn't be worth paying for additional walls, plumbing, and toilet fixture.

Our plan is to live in this cheaply for 5-7 years while we save up to build our dream house.

Posted: 9/21/2011 6:38:24 PM EDT

[#11]

Concrete floors will get mighty cold in the winter.

Posted: 9/21/2011 6:39:26 PM EDT

[#12]

why such an enormous garage?

Posted: 9/21/2011 6:39:43 PM EDT

[#13]

Quoted:
One thing I noticed, you have the bathroom plumbing along an exterior wall. How cold does it get there? Also think about how much room you will have in the wall for plumbing AND insulation.

Good call. It get's pretty damn cold here. Usually approaches 0°F fairly often in the worst part of winter. I might have to do something about that. Of course, if we go with 2x6" exterior walls and cellulose insulation, we might be fine.

Posted: 9/21/2011 6:40:07 PM EDT

[#14]

Quoted:
why such an enormous garage?

Because it will be my shop when we eventually build our real house.

Posted: 9/21/2011 6:41:08 PM EDT

[#15]

Quoted:
Concrete floors will get mighty cold in the winter.

Not as bad as you might think. I've lived in places with it before and it's not too bad. Wife already plans to have lots of rugs.

Posted: 9/21/2011 6:42:15 PM EDT

[#16]

Quoted:

Quoted:

If you're just laying around watching TV in the living room area, you have to walk all the way across the house to take a leak.

Can you squeeze a half-bath in there? I've always been a strong proponent in having a backup toilet.

Or consider reversing the positioning of the bath/bedroom?

You might be onto something there. I could put the bathroom where the closet is and move the closet over into that corner. Would also help with preventing the pipes from freezing.

Posted: 9/21/2011 6:44:24 PM EDT

[#17]

The window in the "TV Area" needs to be on the same wall as the wood stove. You'll want the TV to go on the long side wall, not the short one... less walking traffic to interrupt the game.

If the wood stove is your only heat source, I'd strongly suggest a secondary in the bedroom.

Put a window next to the washer/dryer, and another window (or two, or three) above the bed headboard.

I'd want a real door dividing the bedroom and kitchen. Looks like you've just got an opening.

If it were me, I'd rotate the bed to rest on the north wall, make the wall that divides off the closet extend the full length of the room, put a door in the middle of that dividing wall, and put the desk on one side of the door. You get way more closet space and way less hidden hallway space. The dresser can go in the closet or be eliminated entirely in favor of more efficient custom closet furnishings.

Or alternatively, rotate the bed to rest on the north wall, extend the closet wall and add a door, and put the desk on the south wall of the bedroom.

This is obviously a bachelore pad, so consider using a stacked washer/dryer unit and putting more cabinetry in the found space. I think the setup you have now with the cabinet and ironing board won't leave much walk space.

Because of the narrow layout of the bathroom, I'd consider a transom window over the tub/shower.. it would add light and airiness to the space.

In the kitchen - put your faucet and dishwasher in the island.

Posted: 9/21/2011 6:44:33 PM EDT

[#18]

It looks good. What program did you use for layout?

Posted: 9/21/2011 6:51:39 PM EDT

[#19]

I'd have an entrance to the bath from the shop, or a separate bath the you can still use it as a guest room/mother in law suite.

Posted: 9/21/2011 6:51:54 PM EDT

[#20]

Quoted:

Quoted:
why such an enormous garage?

Because it will be my shop when we eventually build our real house.

Man after my own heart and he has an understanding wife

Posted: 9/21/2011 6:54:26 PM EDT

[#21]

Consider putting the Washer & Dryer in the garage area if it will not get sub-zero out there. Gives a little more interior space and doesn't keep the noise in the small living area.

ETA: You are planning on insulating the wall between the garage and the living area, right? As well as the garage walls.

Posted: 9/21/2011 6:54:57 PM EDT

[#22]

Quoted:
It looks good. What program did you use for layout?

Solidworks. I love Solidworks, but it's a pain in the ass to use for architecture.

Posted: 9/21/2011 6:55:46 PM EDT

[#23]

There are a bunch of good ideas in this thread. Thank you. Plan on seeing Rev 2.0 tomorrow night.

Posted: 9/21/2011 6:58:16 PM EDT

[#24]

Need to rearrange the closet and bathroom a bit.

Posted: 9/21/2011 7:01:50 PM EDT

[#25]

Quoted:
Need to rearrange the closet and bathroom a bit.

Yep, I'm going to put the bathroom where the closet/desk is and put the closet in the northwest corner. I'm also going to use stackable washer and dryer and keep that east wall where they are currently at open in case we ever need to add on a small bedroom for any accident baby we might have.

Posted: 9/21/2011 7:08:06 PM EDT

[#26]

Try to arrange the kitchen/laundry/bath areas so that the plumbing is clustered. You'll pay more if it's all spread out. Someone else said it- interior walls are warmer.

Posted: 9/21/2011 7:08:28 PM EDT

[#27]

Quoted:

Might have to right click -> view picture to get the full resolution.

Basically, I'm an impatient bastard and can't wait a week for my Pop to look at this plan and get a rough estimate. I know material costs can change a LOT depending on where you live, so I'm not asking anyone to quote it, but maybe show me some resources that help me do it myself.

So what's the best way to estimate materials? There will be very little labor costs, only for pouring the slab and maybe putting up the metal. Dad is retired but has built 5 houses and ran an HVAC/plumbing company.

We plan on stick construction with 9' ceilings. Wood trusses. Possibly 2x6" on the external walls. Stained concrete floor and nothing fancy inside, just sheetrock and basic trim. Metal siding and roof. Only 2 full size windows and 1 half (1 not shown). 8'x10' garage doors with electric openers.

http://i293.photobucket.com/albums/mm64/shtblocker/ShopLayout.jpg

Put the sink on the island. A sink should either be against an exterior wall with a window above it, or be on an island facing away from the kitchen into the other portion of the room. I also agree with other comments that the apartment portion needs more windows. One over the bed... one window in the bathroom, though higher up for privacy.

I'd also place about two wide windows on the left wall of the apartment in the living room... and I'd have two windows in the wall on the bottom... or just one large window.

Posted: 9/21/2011 7:12:04 PM EDT

[#28]

I agree put the bathroom and the kitchen back to back, less pipes to run, and safer as far as freezing pipes goes. Make the bathroom a walk through to the bedroom. Put the bedroom in the top corner that way if some one is up late watching tv the don't disturb the people sleeping. You may also want to put the piping in at least for what every you are planning to heat your shop with. IMO I would in floor heat the whole thing, with separate heating controls, if that is not in the budget, make sure you put in the piping at least for a furnace or wood stove what ever you plan to do for the future. Also another cheap thing is to wire in the surround sound before the sheet rock goes up, whether you use it or not, its fairly cheap to do, and save you time and cosmetics in the future. Concrete floors are cold this is why I suggest the in floor heat not to mention it being very efficient. Not sure where you are planning on putting the hot water heater, furnace and so on, if in the garage you can put them on the wall next to the kitchen and where your bath should be to save piping.

Posted: 9/21/2011 7:35:53 PM EDT

[#29]

Quoted:

Try to arrange the kitchen/laundry/bath areas so that the plumbing is clustered. You'll pay more if it's all spread out. Someone else said it- interior walls are warmer.

This and I would also put a shop sink in the garage.

Posted: 9/22/2011 3:59:00 AM EDT

[#30]

Quoted:

Quoted:

If you're just laying around watching TV in the living room area, you have to walk all the way across the house to take a leak.

Can you squeeze a half-bath in there? I've always been a strong proponent in having a backup toilet.

Was going to mention something related to this.

Think about having guests, to use the restroom they will have to walk through the bedroom.

This is the first thing I noticed.

Posted: 9/22/2011 4:13:10 AM EDT

[#31]

One thing I would add would be some sky lights. Free lighting during the day.

Also look into tankless water heaters. That way your saving money on electicity by not having to keep 80 gallons of water hot all the time. Plus a shower in the bathroom.

Also consider a porch or deck if that is your or your wifes thing.

Good luck, I wish I could do something like that myself.

Posted: 9/22/2011 8:05:20 PM EDT

[#32]

Bump for update

Posted: 9/22/2011 8:08:14 PM EDT

[#33]

tag for review

Posted: 9/22/2011 8:11:53 PM EDT

[#34]

What program are you using to draw this? I have been using google sketchup to draw plans but my computer does not like it sometimes. This is the thread that got me interested in building a house.

Posted: 9/22/2011 8:24:38 PM EDT

[#35]

Quoted:
What program are you using to draw this? I have been using google sketchup to draw plans but my computer does not like it sometimes. This is the thread that got me interested in building a house.

I'm using Solidworks 2011. It sucks for architecture, but it's all I have and I know it like the back of my hand.

Posted: 9/22/2011 8:39:37 PM EDT

[#36]

Thanks for the info. I might give that a shot. BTW that will make one hell of a man cave if you build the house on the same lot

Posted: 9/22/2011 9:57:19 PM EDT

[#37]

Change the location of the sink and stove in the kitchen area . Food flow is generally, fridge to sink to stove to table. Or move the fridge so it's closer to the shop so you take less steps to get a beer.

TS

Posted: 9/23/2011 6:56:52 AM EDT

[#38]

Quoted:
Change the location of the sink and stove in the kitchen area . Food flow is generally, fridge to sink to stove to table. Or move the fridge so it's closer to the shop so you take less steps to get a beer.

TS

It's funny, because I didn't even realize it until I got home and laid out the plans on my kitchen countertop. But the kitchen layout in this plan is exactly identical to our current kitchen layout. I got a kick out of that. It works pretty well for us, but I could move the fridge over on the eastern wall next to the sink and add more counter space where the fridge currently is. That would give us the food flow you're talking about.

Posted: 9/23/2011 7:24:37 AM EDT

[#39]

I might suggest with the relocated bathroom, have you thought about adding a utility sink along the shared wall in the garage next to the W/D?

Makes a lot easier to clean up after working without making a mess of the house on the way through if you're greasy, etc.

Posted: 9/23/2011 7:33:17 AM EDT

[#40]

Assuming the structure is single sloped with purlins(or wood deck), I can roof it for around $14-16k. Double lock standing seam with 25 year weathertightness and color warranty.

Posted: 9/23/2011 7:37:36 AM EDT

[#41]

As others have said walking thru the bedroom to get to the bathroom is a no go. Beyond inconvient.

As a one guy crash pad this had potential. For a husband and wife no way. Think about it for a minute. Two thirds of the space is your shop. Nothing for her. There is no where near enough storage or closet space for two people. 700 sq ft for five to seven years? You think you're putting off kids that long? Have you really sat down and hashed this out with your wife?

Posted: 9/23/2011 7:38:25 AM EDT

[#42]

Quoted:
I might suggest with the relocated bathroom, have you thought about adding a utility sink along the shared wall in the garage next to the W/D?

Makes a lot easier to clean up after working without making a mess of the house on the way through if you're greasy, etc.

Good catch. There will be a big utility sink next to the washer and dryer. I just forgot to add it last night.

Posted: 9/23/2011 7:40:40 AM EDT

[#43]

Quoted:
As others have said walking thru the bedroom to get to the bathroom is a no go. Beyond inconvient.

As a one guy crash pad this had potential. For a husband and wife no way. Think about it for a minute. Two thirds of the space is your shop. Nothing for her. There is no where near enough storage or closet space for two people. 700 sq ft for five to seven years? You think you're putting off kids that long? Have you really sat down and hashed this out with your wife?

Yep, she's on board with it. I've been kicking myself in the ass for 4 years now because I wish I would have done this instead of buying a house. We've been talking about doing this for a few years too. We're both good with it.

Her favorite "home" was her 450 sq ft apartment. We're also ok with walking through the bedroom to use the bathroom.

Posted: 9/23/2011 7:42:20 AM EDT

[#44]

Also, the wall where the desk is on the updated layout will be framed for a door. That way if we ever need to add a bedroom, we can just knock some sheet rock out and frame up a bedroom in the shop area. That will give us an extra room for any mistake kid we have.

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - How can I price out this shop/apartment plan? ETA: Critique my layout UPDATED LAYOUT

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