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Posted: 4/23/2002 10:39:48 AM EDT
[#1]
Israel must be shaking in its boots.
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Posted: 4/23/2002 10:54:41 AM EDT
[#2]
Quoted: Israel must be shaking in its boots. Yup, that's alot of camels..... |
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Posted: 4/23/2002 10:59:22 AM EDT
[#3]
My dad was working for Northrop in Taif (Saudi Arabia) in the late 70's teaching them about the fighter jets we sell them etc...he asked them what would happen if Israel attacked them at night (Their pilots were afraid to fly at night--was the rumor my dad told me then) and they said "we pay America to fly for us" prolly a joke, but kinda makes you wonder, huh.
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Posted: 4/23/2002 11:02:48 AM EDT
[#4]
[image]http://www.atlapedia.com/online/map_images/political/Saudi_etc_pol.jpg[/image]
Surrounded by a sea of enemies 360 degrees! |
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Posted: 4/23/2002 11:06:48 AM EDT
[#5]
Quoted: My dad was working for Northrop in Taif (Saudi Arabia) in the late 70's teaching them about the fighter jets we sell them etc...he asked them what would happen if Israel attacked them at night (Their pilots were afraid to fly at night--was the rumor my dad told me then) and they said "we pay America to fly for us" prolly a joke, but kinda makes you wonder, huh. A joke? I think it's a little too true to be a joke. US troops in Saudi Arabia are the American Foreign Legion, protecting the Saudis for the sake of their oilfields. They have the infidels they hate standing guard over them. |
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Posted: 4/23/2002 11:07:30 AM EDT
[#6]
Huh, Yeah like Israel is going to attack them. Hahaah. If Israel puts troops on the west side of Israel then that gives them the basis for a pincer attack to the north if the Syrians and Lebanese attack from there, and also allows them to stop a Jordanian Attack from the East.
[img]http://www.lib.utexas.edu/maps/middle_east_and_asia/middleeast_ref01.jpg[/img] |
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Posted: 4/23/2002 11:16:21 AM EDT
[#7]
Benj..that is why Arafat want the Golan as part of his "peace plane"
To hold it and allow Syrian/Russian tanks access to Israel's heartland... |
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Posted: 4/23/2002 11:18:13 AM EDT
[#8]
I dunno, this might be a simplistic solution, but if the U.S. annexed Saudia Arabia and Israel annexed Jordan, Syria, and Lebanon, I think we'd be in a position to realize true peace in the Middle East. [:D]
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Posted: 4/23/2002 11:18:18 AM EDT
[#9]
Benj..that is why Arafat want the Golan as part of his "peace plane" To hold it and allow Syrian/Russian tanks access to Israel's heartland That is %110 correct. The Golan Heights are the most Strategic Spot in all of Israel. Arty and rockets can command the Area for Miles around plus you have the highground. Best Fighting Ground in Israel. Ben |
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Posted: 4/23/2002 11:27:05 AM EDT
[#10]
Does Anyone know if the US has forces in Cyprus, not dealing with anything just Looking and wondering??
Ben Edited TO Add: Cyprus British Forces on Cyprus Under the provisions of the Treaty of Establishment, Britain retained perpetual sovereignty over two areas on the southern coast of Cyprus, totaling 256 square kilometers. A further fifteen reserved areas, including water sources and off-base radar sites, remained under British jurisdiction. Since 1960 the British Army and Royal Air Force (RAF) have garrisoned up to 10,000 troops in the Sovereign Base Areas at Akrotiri and Dhekelia. Formerly, two squadrons of bombers and their fighter escorts were based on Cyprus, but since the late 1970s the RAF has no longer stationed combat aircraft on the island That is a 1991 Document. |
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Posted: 4/23/2002 11:27:30 AM EDT
[#11]
Any Arab sources claiming that Israelis are massing on their borders? That would lend a lot of credibility to this story.
If both sides are saying similar things, then it's probably true. As it stands, this could be little other than a rumour, as far as we can tell. |
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Posted: 4/23/2002 11:35:06 AM EDT
[#12]
If this is the true, then let get it over with. |
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Posted: 4/23/2002 11:36:01 AM EDT
[#13]
I wonder how the Saudi's would fare against the IDF forces....
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Posted: 4/23/2002 11:45:22 AM EDT
[#14]
[b]
Quoted: I wonder how the Saudi's would fare against the IDF forces.... There will be no match. IDF forces will win hand down. Israel forces fight for survival of a country, and Saudi forces? Don't think so. And we are not even discussing that IDF are seasoned vets yet. My 2 cents. |
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Posted: 4/23/2002 11:53:07 AM EDT
[#15]
boy, there must be a lot of camel s*** stacking up!! i know lots who would be happy to fly 10,000 miles to smoke a camel. you know, i almost (but not quite) feel sorry for those stupid aarraabb bastards. mcole
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Posted: 4/23/2002 11:53:14 AM EDT
[#16]
I'm pretty sure the Saudi's would get their asses kicked, especially if the US stood by and let it happen. One has to wonder, however, if the US would supply the Saudi's with intelligence to insure the oil supply?
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Posted: 4/23/2002 11:53:46 AM EDT
[#17]
There may be something to this story...this is why:
Over the past few weeks, the US has been pulling out of Saudi Arabia... Qatar is one place we have been establishing a base at to replace the base in Saudi...General Franks will operate out of that base "against Iraq." (Fox News 4/22/02) Anyway, The Saudis have ticked the US off because they took 5.6 billion dollars of equipment (radar and air defense) and put it out in the desert to scorch in the sun. Saudis seem to feel they can protect themselves now... Personally, I believe there is a plan on behalf of several arab nations to attack Israel...at the same time the US receives it's next big "terrorist attack" They are going to hit Israel from all three sides. It's possible that Israel knows this and may attempt some pre-emptive strikes - the US is problably going along with it and Israel could be taking advantage of the fact that the US is getting booted from Suadi Arabia. that's my two cents. Franklin [url=http://www.survivalforum.com]SurvivalForum[/url] |
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Posted: 4/23/2002 11:55:23 AM EDT
[#18]
Quoted: Benj..that is why Arafat want the Golan as part of his "peace plane" To hold it and allow Syrian/Russian tanks access to Israel's heartland... Definately a simple "divide and conquer" type plan. Looks like if someting breaks out, we're going to have WWIII, eh? |
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Posted: 4/23/2002 12:07:58 PM EDT
[#19]
We might get to find out if Israeli spies have "borrowed" a few tips from Uncle Sam on how to deceive/disable/destroy the AWACS planes we sold to Saudi Arabia.
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Posted: 4/23/2002 12:22:03 PM EDT
[#20]
Crap one thing I do realize is that Saudi Arabia is just the Kind of Nation to Make a Troop MOvement just to get a wright up in a newspaper. They know full well that Israel isn't going to attack them.
There is probably just a few ways that a War can Start. And there is Only two nations that can Start an All out war with Israel Lebanon and Syria. If Iraq attacks Israel their Ass if Grass "JUST SOONER RATHER THEN LATER" (To use George Senior's Immortal Words). The only way they can Attack is in Unison, But the Saudi's aren't known for Blitzkreig and the Narrowiest Point is the 100 Mile dash through Jordan. Not Likely. They would have to cross a Mountain range or the Dead sea. Nah, Saudi is sitting this Dance out. Whether they like it or not. Eqypt Is the Question Mark? The problem is there are people who will go to other nations to fight, but there are not enough of those to make an Appreciable differance in any Nations OOB. Unless they moved in mass from Multiple countries, not likely. In the End Syria and Lebanon are just gonna have to Grow big enough balls to try and pull it off, even though they can't. And on the other hand they have the pressure that their isn't going to be a better time for them to pull it off save now. With every month that the US is operating inside their countries and killing their fighters they are going to fall apart from the AMERICAN DEVIL "DOGS".hahah They have to do something, but they are fucking TOAST either way... The only way to do it is with a Nuke, and well that is their only chance. But the US is still Operating.. Their fucked. And the US is the one doin the Driven. Ben |
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Posted: 4/23/2002 12:33:00 PM EDT
[#21]
Egypt Can't attack Israel because if they did the would meet the US's Carrier groups in the Red Sea and Have US Marines Landing west of Alexandria and East of Port Said Taking the Suez Canal cutting off Egyptian forces in the Sinai Penin. The rest getting Butchered by the Israelies.
If Syria Attacks en Masse, they are going to Have Nato Rolling up their ass from Turkey. No matter how you look at it The Arab states are frickin Toast. This War is over before it ever begins. They can only use nukes and they can only use them on Israel. That is their only option and that is why saddamm wants one or two or three. That is why Saddamm is going down. hahah. These Nations run their mouths , now they are going to have to put up or shut up. Because the US is climbing through every orifice they have. EDITED TO ADD: Of course Politic will stall the US and keep that decisive victory from Taking place. It always does. |
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Posted: 4/23/2002 1:15:22 PM EDT
[#22]
Well Saudi already HAS ballistic missle capability.....
[url]http://www.fas.org/irp/threat/missile/saudi.htm[/url] Of course they [b]promised[/b] to not put chemical or nuclear weapons on them..... RIGHT |
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Posted: 4/23/2002 1:24:31 PM EDT
[#23]
Hmmm, Well, What do they want. If they Launch those missiles with Nukes, then can sure kill Israel and fast, but they are going to loose the Thrown of Saudi. And America will be gettings its oil for Free for the next 100 years. Plus, If Saudi did take out Israel then the game is over and America no longer has to play a game of Diplomacy, I can't recall any of our enemies in the last 50 years who didn't want us to use diplomacy at some point. It kinda gives our enemies a rest.
If they don't Launch those Missiles with Nukes then they can kill a few people , right about the time Israel takes them out. |
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Posted: 4/23/2002 1:30:35 PM EDT
[#24]
Quoted: They know full well that Israel isn't going to attack them. Ben Of course Israel 'DID' attack first in the 1967 war. They lied and claimed Egypt attacked first knowing the US media and government would believe their lie. |
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Posted: 4/23/2002 1:35:40 PM EDT
[#25]
That may be true, but this is a different Ball Game of sorts. THE ISRAELIES COULD JUSTIFY ATTACKING SAUDI MISSILE SILOS. AND THEY WOULD GET AWAY WITH IT, but it doesn't change the Strategic Lay of the Land Any and The Israelies would be one step ahead. THe Saudis would be pissed but their ain't a damn thing they could do about it because they are still going to have to run that 100 miles to Israel. If any other nation makes that an excuse to attack then the Scenario still holds and the same Strategy still applies.
EDITED TO ADD: Israel isn't going to attack first because as it stands right now, they have the LEAD in the WAR, and those in power are in favor of the Israels right to protect itself. They have the Strategic advantage and the Diplomatic Advantage and the Advantage in their War Machine. They can handle the Terrorist actions in their country without complaint. And until someone gets a thorn in their side and tries to go toe to toe with Israel the Situation will stay as it is now. But whoever attacks Israel first is going to have Unleashed the Rath of God because then Israel won't have to utter any Excuses or spin. All they will have to do is Kill their enemy. Ben |
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Posted: 4/23/2002 1:44:24 PM EDT
[#26]
I'm just tired of the whole fucking part of the world.....
Yeah, Yeah I know Garandman, don't get all religious on me about it being the holy land....if it weren't for the oil we'd have nuked the whole place in 1990 or 91.....or hell in 77 during the Tehran deal.... Drill in Alaska, Drill off the east and west coast like they do in the gulf....or spend the research money we need to spend on fuel cells to get this shit over with... |
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Posted: 4/23/2002 2:03:57 PM EDT
[#27]
Coz you are so right! This is clearly a case where the needs of the country outweigh the BS argument of the tree huggers.
We Have oil here. Lets frickin use it! |
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Posted: 4/23/2002 2:05:26 PM EDT
[#28]
Quoted: THE ISRAELIES COULD JUSTIFY ATTACKING SAUDI MISSILE SILOS. AND THEY WOULD GET AWAY WITH IT....... Ben The Israelis will provide their own justification and the American media and the government will look any other way. Ben, 'THANKS' to you and the divdoc for adding maps. I keep coming back to this topic just to check my memory on geography. |
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Posted: 4/23/2002 2:10:19 PM EDT
[#29]
The Israelis will provide their own justification and the American media and the government will look any other way They might and it ain't fair in the normal since of things, but alls fair in love... Ben, 'THANKS' to you and the divdoc for adding maps. I keep coming back to this topic just to check my memory on geography I just wish we had some Java applettes that we could draw on the maps while they are displayed. That would be a cool thing to add to AR15.com.. A WARROOM/CIC. To keep track of the goings on. Ben |
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Posted: 4/23/2002 2:24:24 PM EDT
[#30]
Quoted: I'm just tired of the whole fucking part of the world..... Me too. I think we need to spread some Democracy on there asses. |
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Posted: 4/23/2002 2:43:05 PM EDT
[#31]
Quoted: I just wish we had some Java applettes that we could draw on the maps while they are displayed. That would be a cool thing to add to AR15.com.. A WARROOM/CIC. To keep track of the goings on. Ben I just don't know about the HUN with an active Java applette in his hands !! |
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Posted: 4/23/2002 2:45:14 PM EDT
[#32]
[soapbox]
Saudi's couldn't fight their way out of a wet paper bag if you ask me, especially if the US pulls completely out. [soapbox] |
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Posted: 4/23/2002 2:45:34 PM EDT
[#33]
hahahaha.
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Posted: 4/23/2002 2:59:08 PM EDT
[#34]
Good discussion, gents. Let me take a step further: First of all, if you are a moderate Arab country, such as Egypt, Jordan, Syria, etc..., who is happened to share border with Israel, would you want to be a guinea pig to fight Israel, and you know the consequences that your country will be wiped out first and it will take 20 to 30 yrs to rebuild? I wouldn't, and I doubt it if leaders of these countries would. Iraq, an extremist country and strong militarily, has a buffer zone (Syria, Jordan, and Saudi), so naturally Iraq tends to talk a lot when dealing with Israel. If Iraq is shared border with Israel, I think things would be different. I think peace in Mid. East is just an euphoria. The way these guys are going at each other for so long now that Peace will never happened. People say that when you are in the middle of a conflict, you are usually not seeing clearly. And this is a perfect example. We discuss these things so we can learn from it and for the heck of it. But there will be no peace in Middle East in our lifetime. Again my 2 cents. |
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Posted: 4/23/2002 3:20:43 PM EDT
[#35]
Quoted: Iraq, an extremist country and strong militarily,......... mojo, just a small pick as I know this was not the prime topic within your post. Today Iraq is relatively weak militarily with an Army perhaps 40% the size of their pre Gulf War army. On the other side of the coin the United States now uses about 7 times the so called "smart weapons" used during the Gulf War. |
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Posted: 4/23/2002 3:32:16 PM EDT
[#36]
Quoted: Quoted: Iraq, an extremist country and strong militarily,......... mojo, just a small pick as I know this was not the prime topic within your post. Today Iraq is relatively weak militarily with an Army perhaps 40% the size of their pre Gulf War army. On the other side of the coin the United States now uses about 7 times the so called "smart weapons" used during the Gulf War. Actually, Mojo is right, the Iraqi military machine has been hard at work in the last 10 and have built to a scale rivaling 92. I've seen reports on CNN and online basically saying it is one of the most powerful outside of US backed regimes. By most accounts, Iraq is ready and willing to go for round two, supposedly this time they won't spread their forces and will encourage fighting in their cities in order to rally other Muslim terrorist nations against us. The report I read (can't find it right now) said that their plan involves attacks here to sway public opinion as well. The point is that their military is still very strong. We're not comparing them to us, we're comparing them to that region. |
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Posted: 4/23/2002 3:41:05 PM EDT
[#37]
Quoted: Actually, Mojo is right..... Okay (Relative to something Iraq is strong.) |
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Posted: 4/23/2002 3:59:16 PM EDT
[#38]
I think it's important to state that the main reason Iraq was whupped so soundly the first time, is not due to a lack of equipment or sophistication. It was due to horrible, horrible strategy and tactics. They dug in their tanks for Christ's sake.
Though they don't have the equipment they once did, they certainly will make better use of it. Saddam has had a decade to adapt his armed forces to fighting the USA. |
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Posted: 4/23/2002 4:01:41 PM EDT
[#39]
Quoted: Quoted: They know full well that Israel isn't going to attack them. Ben Of course Israel 'DID' attack first in the 1967 war. They lied and claimed Egypt attacked first knowing the US media and government would believe their lie. Actually, Jordan, Syria, and Egypt ALL had divisions marshalled a short distance from Israel's borders - a clearly belligerent act - and Israel (rightly) understood that they had to take the initiative. If the Arab nations hadn't had their troops poised to strike, Israel never would have attacked. It also explains why Israel took the Sinai, Golan, and the West Bank - she needed buffer zones so that in the next war she wasn't fighting Arab armies on her own territory. |
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Posted: 4/23/2002 4:07:57 PM EDT
[#40]
Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: They know full well that Israel isn't going to attack them. Ben Of course Israel 'DID' attack first in the 1967 war. They lied and claimed Egypt attacked first knowing the US media and government would believe their lie. Actually, Jordan, Syria, and Egypt ALL had divisions marshalled a short distance from Israel's borders - a clearly belligerent act - and Israel (rightly) understood that they had to take the initiative. If the Arab nations hadn't had their troops poised to strike, Israel never would have attacked. Israel lied when announcing Egypt had attacked. |
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Posted: 4/23/2002 4:12:17 PM EDT
[#41]
Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: They know full well that Israel isn't going to attack them. Ben Of course Israel 'DID' attack first in the 1967 war. They lied and claimed Egypt attacked first knowing the US media and government would believe their lie. Actually, Jordan, Syria, and Egypt ALL had divisions marshalled a short distance from Israel's borders - a clearly belligerent act - and Israel (rightly) understood that they had to take the initiative. If the Arab nations hadn't had their troops poised to strike, Israel never would have attacked. Israel lied when announcing Egypt had attacked. Prove to me and the rest on this board that Isreal lied about this. Were you there? Provide links that back up your point. |
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Posted: 4/23/2002 4:41:14 PM EDT
[#42]
Quoted: Israel lied when announcing Egypt had attacked. I never said that Israel [B]didn't[/B] attack first - just that Israel's attack was made against the armies of 3 Arab nations that were marshalled along her borders, preparing to attack. I hope you aren't suggesting that a nation should wait until invading armies are on her territory before attacking them. |
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Posted: 4/23/2002 4:43:50 PM EDT
[#43]
First of all, if you are a moderate Arab country, such as Egypt, Jordan, Syria, etc... Since when has Syria been a "moderate" Arab state? Syria is Iraq with a better PR department. [;)] |
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Posted: 4/23/2002 4:59:06 PM EDT
[#44]
[b]
Quoted: Quoted: Iraq, an extremist country and strong militarily,......... mojo, just a small pick as I know this was not the prime topic within your post. Today Iraq is relatively weak militarily with an Army perhaps 40% the size of their pre Gulf War army. No problem, bro. As Minman72 said, I refer to guys in Mid. East. Iraq's military is nothing comparing to US. What makes Iraq dangerous: 1. Their nuclear capability is unknown. 2. Their extremist-mindset: they don't like to compromise with anyone, unless they have no choice. Because of these 2 factors, Iraq is the first to get the ax if war in the Mid. East involving US. I definitely don't like Iran and Saudi Arabia. These two are quiet but deadly. Iran can be an extremist country overnight. Notice that Iran has been quiet for a long time, I think she has been training her armed forces, preparing, and helping anyone againsting US and Israel. Saudi? I think Saudi is a fricking rich double agent. Saudi has been helping terrorists [b]behind the scene[/b], see 09/11 terrorists (most were Saudi origin). Again my 2 cents analysis. |
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Posted: 4/23/2002 6:09:18 PM EDT
[#45]
[b]
Quoted: First of all, if you are a moderate Arab country, such as Egypt, Jordan, Syria, etc... Since when has Syria been a "moderate" Arab state? Syria is Iraq with a better PR department. [;)] Well maybe, but at least US has a relationship (in a political standpoint)with Syria than Iraq. |
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Posted: 4/23/2002 8:13:17 PM EDT
[#46]
I think the sun has cooked all their heads.
good fences make good neighbors. We've got our own problems here in the states. We don't need to be referee for a street fight. Hell I'm not Henry Kissinger so I'll shut my pie hole. |
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Posted: 4/23/2002 11:25:45 PM EDT
[#47]
Actually, there is another reason for the Saudi's to put troops on their NW border.
To keep the Palestinians out. The PLO was already kicked out of Jordan hard about 15 years ago IIRC. Perhaps Saudi Arabia, being the split personality country it is, is just trying to avoid having the PLO enter Saudi Arabia and destabilize the country. Or they are just being cautious. |
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