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I wouldn't be a FM, there is a huge thread in the archives shortly after my join date which i explain why, TBS was active in that one....I'll try to get you a link later...

eta: http://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.html?b=1&f=135&t=716166&page=1

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that I based my decision on actual masonic teachings, and not on conspiracy theories found on the net.

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Me either, and not due to a weakness of faith.

I have family and friends in the Masons, and wanted to join. After much research, I realized that as a Christian, I could not do so in good conscience.

The basic teaching of the lodge is that there is only one true religion, Freemasonry, and one true god, whom they call GAOTU ( Grand Architect of the Universe ).
completely incorrect

They teach that all other religions are merely reflections of the one true religion, Freemasonry. This is why new applicants to the lodge must profess belief in A god. ( any one will do ). completely incorrect. yes belief in YOUR god is required for admission

This is because they teach that Jesus, Allah, Buddha, Krishna, etc are just prophets/great men who represented the one true god, GAOTU.  
GAOTU is simply a generic reference to deity. Not all masons are christian.

Any man who worships Jesus, Allah, Buddha, Krishna, etc is really worshiping GAOTU without realizing it. see above. the ignorance here is astouding.

This is why the lodge teaches that all men, including Christians, are in spiritual darkness until they join the masons.
not entirely correct. we teach men to open their minds and hearts and learn. Spiratual growth AND scientific growth being essential to a mans education

The candidate for the Entered Apprentice degree is told that he will brought out of darkness ( ignorance ) and into the light.
yep.... un-edutacted to educated. It is every man's duty to pass knowledge to others... mason or not.

After masonic instruction, the mason will now realize that his religion was false, and that he was really worshiping GAOTU all along.
completely wrong. Your religion is yours.

Freemasonry also teaches the concept of the universal fatherhood of God, and brotherhood of man, making all men right with God whether they believe in Jesus Christ or not. patially true. We teach that you should be right with YOUR religion and adhere to it's tenents. Mandating a jew worship as a christian would be ofensive. just as a muslim lodge forcing a crhistian to worship as a muslim. It's about respect. Something many christians have a hard time understanding these days.

This is one of the reasons you won't find many masons who believe in the inerrancy of the Bible.
i know more christians that think that than masons.

None of this is biblical in any way. There is also a whole works oriented system, i.e. earning your way to the masonic heaven by following rituals/observances etc.
lunacy,  there is no masonic heaven. Salvation can only be granted through following YOUR religion.... not masonry

You will commonly hear masons state the Freemasonry in not a religion, and that religion isn't even allowed to be discussed in the lodge.
correct

What they mean is that OTHER religions are not to be discussed. ( Christianity, Islam etc )  This is hardly surprising.
already explained above

What religion wants people discussing/worshiping another religion in their own temple/church?
certainly not the christians! The southern baptists here were protesting in a LDS temple on an open house here

There are many Christians who are in the lodge. You have to wonder if they paid any attention to the teaching, oaths, and rituals they went through to join.
if they didn't they aren't masons. Our Chaplin is a baptist minister

Most did not, and think of the lodge as just a social club; a place to make business contacts and hang out.
you really have no clue here. if that were they case they were not admitted to the lodge

Here's a test.  Ask a mason if he would rather quit the lodge, or his church. The answer will be telling.
i have left 1 lodge, i have left many churches. How many churches have you left?

ETA - When first researching Freemasonry, I only consulted masonic resources. I read masonic literature/teachings, and brought up any questions I had directly to men who are not only active masons, but officers of the lodge.
BS....  this list is almost verbaitem off the ephesians website. the same crap that is posted over and over agian and FULL of mistakes.

I only add this to show that I based my decision on actual masonic teachings, and not on conspiracy theories found on the net.
i want documents or texts you have researched. Alex jones book and youtube isn't a source.

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I have friends that are Freemasons and good Christians. I cannot be a Freemason as it is forbidden by my church (or any Orthodox Catholic Christian Church) but that doesn't mean Freemasons are bad people or satanists.

Heck at least one of my relatives was a Freemason and a Methodist-Episcopal minister; of course he was also a Confederate chaplain for John T Morgan's Cavalry. As long as your church doesn't have a problem with it (and my understanding is you should be active in your church when you apply) there shouldn't be any heartache on your part in joining.

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Me either, and not due to a weakness of faith.

I have family and friends in the Masons, and wanted to join. After much research, I realized that as a Christian, I could not do so in good conscience.

The basic teaching of the lodge is that there is only one true religion, Freemasonry, and one true god, whom they call GAOTU ( Grand Architect of the Universe ). No... Masonry does not profess to be a religion, certainly does not claim to be the only one religion.

They teach that all other religions are merely reflections of the one true religion, Freemasonry. This is why new applicants to the lodge must profess belief in A god. ( any one will do ). We do?  Guess I missed that lecture when joining.  Again, Freemasonry is not a religion.

This is because they teach that Jesus, Allah, Buddha, Krishna, etc are just prophets/great men who represented the one true god, GAOTU.  Funny thing, I don't remember ever discussing Buddha or Krishna or Mohhamad in Lodge.  Don't remember talking about Jesus a whole lot, but seeing as my Lodge was comprised of Christian and Jewish members, he did come up in conversations.

Any man who worships Jesus, Allah, Buddha, Krishna, etc is really worshiping GAOTU without realizing it. Nobody worships the GAOTU as you claim.  GAOTU is used as substitute for using the term God.  Kind of like when someone says a prayer and uses Lord or Heavenly Father.  To me it means God, to a Muslim it would mean Allah.  Get the point, we're not worshipping a new God, we are using a neutral term that allows us all to route our prayer to the God we believe in.

This is why the lodge teaches that all men, including Christians, are in spiritual darkness until they join the masons. Not in spiritual darkness that I recall, but capable of improving their character through spiritual reflection, brotherhood.

The candidate for the Entered Apprentice degree is told that he will brought out of darkness ( ignorance ) and into the light. Kind of like saying if you go to the gym and work out you will be stronger than if you sit on the couch all day. Masonry is about improving oneself.

After masonic instruction, the mason will now realize that his religion was false, and that he was really worshiping GAOTU all along. What unmitigated bullcrap. I am a Mason and raise the BS flag, are you a Mason? I speak from experience, you speak from?

Freemasonry also teaches the concept of the universal fatherhood of God, and brotherhood of man, making all men right with God whether they believe in Jesus Christ or not. Again, no it does not.  It teaches that their is an inner good and an inner evil in man and that through spiritual reflection you can effect the balance and lead a better life. I don't recall salvation being raised as a benefit of the Lodge.  Only Jesus can save a soul.  Masonry has nothing to do with salvation, at least not as the vehicle.  That is Jesus and Jesus alone.

This is one of the reasons you won't find many masons who believe in the inerrancy of the Bible. Broad brush strokes huh?

None of this is biblical in any way. There is also a whole works oriented system, i.e. earning your way to the masonic heaven by following rituals/observances etc. Nope, Heaven was never promised to me.  By believing in God, by living a good life in accordance with His desires, by accepting Jesus as my savior I go to Heaven.  Masonry is simply another vehicle to do that, but without accepting Jesus as your savior first and foremost you're going nowhere in my opinion.

You will commonly hear masons state the Freemasonry in not a religion, and that religion isn't even allowed to be discussed in the lodge. Wow, one of the first sensible things you've said yet in this whole convoluted diatribe.

What they mean is that OTHER religions are not to be discussed. ( Christianity, Islam etc )  This is hardly surprising. Wrong, we don't discuss religion at all... we mainly talk about works done in the community, oddly enough... many through our parishes.  We work with scouting, little league, college fraternities, church groups, synagogues, civic groups, retirement homes, etc.

What religion wants people discussing/worshiping another religion in their own temple/church? We're not a religion, drop your false premise.

There are many Christians who are in the lodge. You have to wonder if they paid any attention to the teaching, oaths, and rituals they went through to join. Yes, yes we did

Most did not, and think of the lodge as just a social club; a place to make business contacts and hang out. By and large it is indeed. You missed the civic involvement part.

Here's a test.  Ask a mason if he would rather quit the lodge, or his church. The answer will be telling. I'd rather quit the Lodge. Truth be told I have not gone in years.  Not because of the bullshit falsehoods you have represented here, but because of internal politics that were very un-Masonic, and I don't suffer duplicity well. Still, I'll defend the organization from ignorance when confronted by it.

ETA - When first researching Freemasonry, I only consulted masonic resources. I read masonic literature/teachings, and brought up any questions I had directly to men who are not only active masons, but officers of the lodge.
          I only add this to show that I based my decision on actual masonic teachings, and not on conspiracy theories found on the net.

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By quit the lodge, I meant to come out from under Freemasonry. I'm assuming you meant that you changed lodges, not renounced Freemasonry. As far as your changing churches frequently, I hope you will find one that is doctrinally sound, with regular expository preaching, and good Christian fellowship.

Yes, there is a works based salvation system. You have never read or been instructed that by studying the craft, and doing good works, that you can gain entry to the "Grand Lodge on high" or the "Celestial Lodge Above" where GAOTU resides?  ( This flies in the face of the biblical doctrine of election. No matter how 'good' we are in life, none of us are remotely worthy of God's good grace. ) this is simply wrong. doing good works in the here and now helps mankind. Following your faith gets you into heaven. THERE IS NO MASONIC VERSION OF HEAVEN. masonry is not nor does it espouse to be a religion.  What part od GAOTU is a gneric term to reference diety can you not understand?

Yes, many people do join thinking they can make business/social contacts, or think it is no different than the Moose or Elk club. Obviously you have never been in a lodge that held one day membership drives. You show up a non-mason in the morning, leave that evening a third degree mason. Lunch included. Ask around if you don't believe me. i specifically ask that of new candidates. That is a specific reason for not allowing them into the fraternity. No our lodges do NOT allow one day classes ans we require a 30 day investigation committee on all new members.i don't think you will find many masons that agree with the one day class garbage.

While I understand your disagreeing with me, I don't appreciate you implying that I am lying about my sources.  I'm not familiar with the ephesians website you referenced, so I don't know what is posted there. As I stated before, I have family and friends in the masons, and access to their books. Mackey, Wilmshurst, Pike, Ward, Evans, Newton, among others. if you have actually read those books  then you obviously missed something, i am still of the impression you have not and are simply spouting the normal garbage. I seriously doubt most people would care enough to read them. They are VERY dry reads and unless your interested in joining io doubt you have read them based on your above posts.

I don't expect to change your mind. We'll just have to agree to disagree.
agreed. and i have no issue with answering questions or debating facts. I will not stand by and allow untruths and rumors that have long since been disproved to be spread.

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Several of my friends are Masons including a few that attend my church. For the most part I believe that the larger portion of Masonic membership simply partake as a social function and have very little use/understanding for the spiritual aspects.
That being said, I have some serious qualms with the spiritual understanding of salvation that are made quite clear in the teachings of Masonry.

Bottom line for me is this: If you are a follower of Jesus Christ and you believe His claim to be God in the Flesh sent to redeem fallen men…why would you need further enlightenment then Gods word the Bible?
What can the teachings of Masonry accomplish that the Bible cannot?
The Bible is clear that the Church is where Christians should gather to worship and serve God and serve others. Christianity and Secret societies simply don’t add up.

Masonry boils down to a man made method of attaining enlightenment/relationship with God based on our own merits. It welcomes every man-made religion because it says the same thing as every man-made religion…you can save yourself if you just try hard enough.
this is absolutely un true.

So yes, you will find plenty of good people there and perhaps even plenty of good people who attend Christian Churches…but you won’t find Jesus Christ there. He just simply wont play well with "other ways to God" when He makes statements like this….”Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.” John 14:6

Of course for COC sake I will add that this is my opinion of what the Bible teaches....but would be happy to explain why.

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Sounds like another divide and conquer question. Just like this thread:
Catholics, Protestants, Jehovah's Witnesses and LDS, what do you think about each other?

participate with caution
Don

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I wish I could say that I was misinformed ....but if what you say is true then your Lodge differs from the vast majority and Im not sure they understand the fundamental tenets of Masonic teachings.
Yes, they might go along with the Holy Bible being "your path"...but they will not tell you it is the "only path."
Jesus might be Your way...but not the only way.

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I didn't ask whether you approved of the one day class or not. You stated that people don't join haphazardly, and I was merely illustrating that they do. Quite frequently. The one day classes are fairly common as many lodges are running low on members.

As to your second point, you should read posts more carefully before you respond to them. Especially if you are going to call someones integrity into question. I have already stated that the reason I began studying up on Freemasonry was that I wanted to join, as I have family and friends who are masons.

I don't frequent anti-masonic websites, or obsess over this subject as you apparently do. I did my homework, and made a decision not to join. After that I didn't give the masons much thought. However, if someones asks whether or not they should join, I'll give my opinion. I still have family and friends in the masons. We get along fine. I don't badmouth the masons around them, and they don't badmouth Christianity.  Live and let live.

Best of luck.

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Good thread, I don't know what to think about the Masonry, From Christians I have heard they are bad. But have never heard exactly why.
I wont ever bash a Mason, My daughter stayed at Scottish Rite hospital when she was young, that was a great place.

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Thats what is kind of confusing, I will go out on a limb and say the Masons I have known  would profess to be Christains but are not active in a Church.
I would imagine some Masons are very active in the Church.

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You're correct, I’m not a Mason but I do know that the core of Masonry doesn’t accept the claims of Jesus Christ as the only way to God the Father.
My statement wasn’t that I claim to know one lodge from another....but if someone attends a lodge that recognizes Jesus Christ as who he claims to be….well that would be a rare find.

This is my point: for the Christian there is no need for any further spiritual enlightenment then what is found in Gods word....Especially when it conflicts with Gods word.
The Christian who believes that Jesus is The Truth (singular) needs to be cautious when fraternizing with groups who at their core teach that Jesus is a truth (plural)  Is it wrong to be friends with them? Of course not! But we shouldn’t lay aside Christ for Companions.
If you’re a Mason and can freely discus your Faith in Christ and his claims at the Lodge that’s one thing…but if you’re asked to set aside your faith in Jesus and His message that’s something else entirely

That is the question to Christians, if you have a relationship with Jesus Christ and believe His word to be true…why is there a need for membership in a group that claims to offer additional enlightenment?

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Fair enough...I'm sure you're more then capable of conducting your own further research into the Masons should you be so inclined.

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Can you pray in Jesus name?  

Is there only one faith one Lord one BAPTISM?   or is there another baptism outside of the NT?

 

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epic sidestep....so let's say 'if' baptisms occured in a lodge, these hypothetical baptisms not only have ABSOLUTELY no religious meaning/symbolism, but also are not in conflict with biblical teachings on one Lord one Faith one Baptism?
 

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let me know your thoughts...

http://emfj.org/dbr.htm