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Posted: 5/19/2008 12:53:08 AM EDT
[#1]
I believe they are called an eagle mount. We also used to have what was called a scorpion mount for putting up a SAW next to the primary weapon.If I were you, I'd be thinking beyond simply being a "Mk 19 gunner". You will be a gunner, period. Learn ALL of your weapons systems in and out, and make sure your driver knows how to do your job as well. Train the guy who is probably going to replace you, if he doesn't have rocks for brains. Mk 19 use is going to be dictated by your area ROE. You could find yourself in an area where the Mk 19 is going to have little daily practical use.
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Posted: 5/19/2008 1:24:25 AM EDT
[#2]
3ID wrote an AAR about the initial invasion and peace keeping tour they did. One of the things that they pointed out was the shortcomings of some of the gun mounts MP's were suing on their HMMV's. MK19's were prone to stoppages, and had minimum engagement range issues M249's had issues with the power of the rounds They suggested that both be mounted, M249 for close work, MK19 for the heavier work. www.globalsecurity.org/military/library/report/2003/3id-aar-jul03.pdf Page 241, in the PDF page system. Page 251 if going by the document page numbers. |
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Posted: 5/19/2008 3:13:51 AM EDT
[#3]
Oh yeah, i definitely feel you on being a gunner. I actually am an instructor for belt-fed weapons for my company, I just chose the MK19 because it takes probably the most experience/responsibility to operate. I'll look into those mounts though, thanks. |
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Posted: 5/19/2008 3:17:20 AM EDT
[#4]
thanks very much, i'm going to forward that to my CoC and bribe the maintenance guys to weld me up some mounts when i get overseas. |
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Posted: 5/19/2008 7:09:59 AM EDT
[#5]
I Can almost garrentee you, you will not be a m19 gunner.
With small exception in certain parts of asscrackistan, you will be manning a m2/240/249. The ONLY time we ever took out m19's out was when we had 6 gun trucks to escort some big ball congressman from kuwait to BIAP. And even he was in some uparmored RV. They told us we could not take the 19's beacuse of collateral damager and no real application short of destroing everything in its path, which is a rarity in iraq. We had m2's with a side pintle mount with a 240, m16 with 203 up there. That was just the front turrent and small side turrets. Not this camo netting and 10 foot tall plexiglass bullshit they are running with now. I dont even know how the gunners can effectivly engage with all this bullshit now. If you can, take a 240 over a m2. Much more controlable, agile, and effective for killing cars and people. I will take 480 rds of 308 over 100 of .50 anyday. I would also recomend geting a noxex suit or gloves and mask at the very least. Flash burns are a real mother fucker. |
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Posted: 5/19/2008 7:11:56 AM EDT
[#6]
If you can, bring a shit load of female pintle mounts and the male ones for them. Also bring a welder with you so you dont have to beg and borrow. Anything else you can scrounge up in country or butcher other vehicles for. |
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Posted: 5/19/2008 8:48:02 AM EDT
[#7]
Yeah MK-19 were a no-go for us in Baghdad. Mounting two weapons in the turret is going to be a real bitch. "Pope glass" and grenade covers will impede your ability to un-ass your turret in a hurry as it is without have two belt-feds in your way. We did bolt a few extra pintles to the turret armor for M249s but it was a real hassle.
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Posted: 5/19/2008 8:56:38 AM EDT
[#8]
Here's an early pic from our deployment. 249 mounted on the turret armor.
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Posted: 5/20/2008 10:40:46 AM EDT
[#9]
I see your girly guntruck, and raise you a manly one
 I was in the turret for most of that 1300 mile trip. Oh yeah, and the cover on that HMMVV was plastic. No Armor 2005-2006. Gota love fucked up army logistics |
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Posted: 5/20/2008 10:03:03 PM EDT
[#10]
2004 we were riding 10 deep in the back of a 5 ton..... 
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Posted: 5/21/2008 5:10:18 AM EDT
[#11]
but you atleast had steel plates on the side for armor.
Ask me how I know. My guys built half the 5 ton gun trucks in 03-04. |
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Posted: 5/21/2008 7:38:14 AM EDT
[#12]
We didnt have a single peice of armor on any of our trucks. My unit was there APR03 to JUL04. My company had two gun trucks. The rest were equipment carriers or troop transports. Our BN CMDR got in trouble because we were average more convoys than some of the combat arms units... |
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Posted: 5/21/2008 12:31:48 PM EDT
[#13]
we're definitely bringing a MK-19 w/ us because we're rolling out in platoon groups and our CO already informed us on his thoughts as far as ROE. I know how much damage it does, thats why since i'm semi-responsible and a good shot w/ one i'm gonna be on it.
I'm in an Engineer company, so we'll have more vehicles than weapons to mount on em, even with 2-240s, 2-.50s, 2-spare 249s, and 1- MK19 per platoon. Being Engineers also helps w/ the field modifications because we have welders on hand. thanks for the input everyone, oh and for the record, in '04-'05 we had dumptrucks w/ sandbags and 4x4 wooden posts for armor, along w/ anything we could cut off shot up Iraqi army APCs. |
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Posted: 5/21/2008 5:02:51 PM EDT
[#14]
looks like im gonna have to print out more condolence payment forms
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Posted: 5/21/2008 10:25:29 PM EDT
[#15]
In addition to whatever weapons you bring, your unit will be falling in on whatever weapons the unit you are RIPing with is leaving behind. I assume that your company leadership has been in contact with that unit; hopefully they'll forward to your company a list of what equipment they have on hand. In spite of the above, I am still amazed at the number of convoys I've seen with no guns on top, or only M4s, because the unit says they don't have any belt feds available to them. |
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Posted: 5/22/2008 3:38:05 AM EDT
[#16]
thats what we're getting in the RIP, we're only bringing M4s and M9s for every troop. I dont understand how units can go out w/ no weapons mounted. I know back in the day we were one of the softest targets in our area because everything else was Strykers up in Mosul. We RARELY got fucked with because we looked mean as shit cuz every swingin dick had his weapon outboard and his head on a swivel. The convoys w/ no one stickin their heads out of the armor were the ones that got nailed. |
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Posted: 5/22/2008 4:03:19 AM EDT
[#17]
let me just say from experiance, the mk19 is FUCKING USELESS unless your in the coutryside. once you get into any even mildly built up areas, all you have is a pintle mounted war crimes tribunal initiator.hinking.gif
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Posted: 5/22/2008 8:07:26 PM EDT
[#18]
If you don't mind me asking then, what weapons are you training with during your mob at Bragg, Riley or whereever you are training at? We had to ship all of our weapons to Bragg to train with, and then they got shipped here, where they sit in a connex unless needed.
I've only seen that around Kabul, the theory being that your ROE make you so limited that having someone in the hatch only makes them an IED target that can't fire back. I won't comment publicly on that mindset.... |
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Posted: 5/22/2008 9:02:00 PM EDT
[#19]
Bad leadership ignorant about the ROE. |
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Posted: 5/23/2008 3:17:47 PM EDT
[#20]
yeah, but that one time you can use it, it's beautiful baby, beautiful. |
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Posted: 5/23/2008 3:19:22 PM EDT
[#21]
we're natty guard, I believe we're drawing heavy weps at the mob site for training, then we get our real ones when we hit the ground. Everything but personal weps, M4, M9 and M249 will be waiting for us. |
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Posted: 5/23/2008 3:29:40 PM EDT
[#22]
Most of the gun trucks now have the OGPK turret which cannot mount a seondary m249 like the factory M1114 turret can. The OGPK turret is not the turret with the added "pope glass" but the turret that has the built in bullet proof glass panels. It is a little taller than the factory turret and won't work with a secondary pintle. It does have a built in rack where you can stow your SAW as a back up, the gunner can stand up and engage from the shoulder.
The new turret is powered and has good all around visibilty, it allows the gunner to look at things with out exposing his head to an IED blast. |
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Posted: 5/23/2008 3:31:41 PM EDT
[#23]
I don't think I've seen a vehicle with an empty turret outside the wire. If the OP's unit will be operating outside the wire they will draw crew served weapons somewhere. |
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Posted: 5/23/2008 6:44:35 PM EDT
[#24]
The mirrors are nice also. Just don't forget to charge the battery...the hand wheels suck. |
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Posted: 5/23/2008 9:22:16 PM EDT
[#25]
We are NG as well and still brought everything. Oh well, different mob plan, I guess. |
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Posted: 5/24/2008 1:37:26 PM EDT
[#26]
we took our m19 too, they collected dust. Trust me you wont use them |
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Posted: 5/25/2008 10:22:47 AM EDT
[#27]
we thought that last deployment until we got into a 6 hr long firefight. Mainly i figure i'll be using the 249 in the secondary mount more though. |
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Posted: 5/25/2008 10:55:56 AM EDT
[#28]
If you're going to an urban area, I would just sport a 240. MK-19 are nice but I wouldn't roll with one everyday.
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Posted: 5/25/2008 11:29:51 AM EDT
[#29]
we're going to have more pintle mounts than weapons, so we're going to mount every belt-fed we can get our hands on. |
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Posted: 5/25/2008 1:22:47 PM EDT
[#30]
Rock on bro. Have fun!
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Posted: 5/26/2008 5:54:44 AM EDT
[#31]
Damn more mounts than weapons huh? we have more weapons than mounts, we have to borrow mounts from other platoons when we roll out, which is a rareity now, we do mostly dismount patrols in baghdad now, my area is crazy IED alley.
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Posted: 5/26/2008 7:11:41 AM EDT
[#32]
We're going to have mounts on our 916s, mounts on humvees, and a mount on an RG.
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Posted: 5/31/2008 3:07:04 PM EDT
[#33]
if anyone is familiar with The Rusty Nail at FOB Speicher back in 06 I was there downloading all the uparmer and steel plates those guys used to armor convoy vehicles.
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Posted: 6/1/2008 6:08:37 AM EDT
[#34]
If they gave me a MK19 and a SAW, I'd lock the MK19 in the trunk and mount the SAW as the primary, and use my M4 for over head.
Welcome to 2008. I hope you like going out and NOT getting shot at. |
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Posted: 6/1/2008 6:15:48 AM EDT
[#35]
That'll be tough... but i guess i could get used to it
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Posted: 6/1/2008 6:31:33 AM EDT
[#36]
are you reffering to the turrets like mine? (see avatar) You can, indeed, put the secondary mount on that turret. Some of our trucks had it done. |
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Posted: 6/1/2008 8:13:48 AM EDT
[#37]
I was there 06 -07 when we upgraded the turret. Our old turrets were factory set up to accomodate the secondary pintle. I guess the new ones could be modded, but it seems a lot less practical. Are you guys really seeing less action? 06-07 was hot for action almost every night, and the south went crazy when the surge started. |
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Posted: 6/1/2008 10:04:38 AM EDT
[#38]
southwest Baghdad was a mess when the surge hit.
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Posted: 6/1/2008 1:08:27 PM EDT
[#39]
Vicinity of Kalsu and Scania was pretty crazy, I would agree. |
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Posted: 6/1/2008 3:06:22 PM EDT
[#40]
man scania was a little hot when i was leaving. One day no one showed up to the haji mart and we got mortared that day. They kicked a bunch of those assholes off the shops.
We were pulling out and i was test firing my m16 at the test lane and right as I shot a ied went off on our lead guntruck, We werent even a 1/4 past the checkpoint. |
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Posted: 6/1/2008 3:25:13 PM EDT
[#41]
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Posted: 6/1/2008 5:29:08 PM EDT
[#42]
We roll out with them every day, in HMMWV's and ASV's.
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Posted: 6/1/2008 7:25:42 PM EDT
[#43]
During the surge time frame people were getting killed in and around Scania on a very regular basis. The area between Scania and Kalsu was crazy. |
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Posted: 6/2/2008 6:27:29 AM EDT
[#44]
Yeah the months before we left, efps and attacks were geting more regular in the south. We lost a few trucks and a few guys from our security BN in the south. EFP vs 1114 is a bad sight. Luckily i was never hit in my short time there. |
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Posted: 6/2/2008 11:21:08 AM EDT
[#45]
21 convoys, 20,000+ miles, from scania to biap (round trip) 18 times, from biap to balad (round trip) 6 to 8 times (lost count), from biap to taqaddum (round trip) 3 times, biap to ramadi (round trip) 1 time from balad to spiecher to marez and back once. thats 36 trips by scania/kalsu/muhmadiyah area, 12 to 16 trips through northern baghdad/taji/balad area, eight trips into anbar, and the total for my squad is: one IED two shoot outs, niether of which could have been longer than 30 seconds one escalation of force one medevac (see escaltion of force  )one "probable" enemy KIA zero casualties seriously, we had guys from the 05-06 deployment talkin about how it was gonna be like, tellin all thier stories "when I wuz in eye-rack!" and then when we get here they are totally like "wtf?"... |
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Posted: 6/2/2008 12:12:48 PM EDT
[#46]
wow... well, having been there once when it was... entertaining, I'll be more than happy to spend a uneventful year in the desert. |
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Posted: 6/2/2008 4:03:07 PM EDT
[#47]
North East Baghdad on Sadr City border has been pretty crazy, we live out of an old cigarette factory and we get hit all the time that comment about not getting shot at in 2008 is trash, ive been in tons of fire fights past few months.
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Posted: 6/2/2008 7:03:06 PM EDT
[#48]
lemme guess, your in the 2/30? Regardless of your unit, from your tone it sounds like you would like to trade AO's. I sincerely wish I could accomodate you. |
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Posted: 6/3/2008 4:58:40 AM EDT
[#49]
It's calmed down now but running around Sadr city we used to come back from sweeps and missions black on small arms. There are fewer and fewer hotspots. The rest of my company is on Falcon and that A/O is pretty calm mostly cache work.
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Posted: 6/3/2008 7:09:15 AM EDT
[#50]
Yea I am in 2/30, Alpha company to be exact and people who arent here always say they want to be here, and when the shit hits the fan they always are the first to leave. not trying to be a dick or anything just saying what i see. what unit are you in bro? just curious
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