matt and i have been dying to get back to a gym, but with the future looking the way it does, we're not sure that going to one is going to be all that feasible.

so i saw a commercial for the new Bowflex Ultimate today and we got to discussing a home gym.  we've decided that a home gym system is probably preferable to the alternative (especially considering that, if we close on this house, the closest gym is 30+ minutes on the conservative side) and my schedule isn't exactly conducive to the hours of most of the gyms around here.  add that to the cost of gas and travel time.....

so, we're looking for something that equates as much as possible to a gym experience, at least in the exercises available.

what systems do you guys have experience with and what did you like/dislike about it(them)?

neither one of us are looking for body building competition results so top-of-the-line isn't necesary, but we want to stay with something that's well-know, good quality, and good service/warranty.

thanks, jenn.

 I tried a Bowflex before, but I didn't like it too much.  That's just me.  The movement was very fluid, and the resistance was the same in very point of the repetitions.  The Bowflex IS a good machine, but being a person so accustomed to free weights, I wasn't used to the feeling of the movements.  You should try it for yourself.
 I also tried the total gym before.  Like the Bowflex, it was smooth, but executing the movements were a bit strange.  I noticed that this machine puts a lot of stress on your tendons.  It's pretty clever that they make a machine that uses body weight, but because of that, small increments in resistance is not possible.
 I prefer free weights.  Although it can be dangerous without a spotter, you can do A LOT more types of exercises with free weights.  It's also much cheaper.

Strength is good, endurance is better. Start running and doing isometrics. Muscle endurance is gained through high reps at moderate weights. You don't need an expensive toy to get the job done.

Amen Newbie. Don't get suckered. What you can't do with free-weights, you don't need.

i certainly hope you don't make your living advising people.  you do a damn poor job of listening to them.  answers like yours just irk me.  you're so interested in flaunting your "knowledge" that you don't even pay attention to the question.

next time why don't you try actually answering my question.

fyi, i am not interested in free weights.  first, we don't have the space.  second, we won't be working out together all of the time and hence won't have spotters.  third, i'm not sure i'd save any money by going that direction, considering i'd still have to start from scratch and purchase every thing.  that ain't exactly cheap, ya know.

i don't plan on being suckered.  i plan on making an educated decision, no thanks to you.

ARLady,

How much space do you have?  You might want to start out with a inexpensive chin-up bar and a good bodyweight program for a couple of months until you can really decide what your ultimate fitness goals will be.  Once you know exactly what you want to achieve you can shop for the gear that will best fit your goals.

The bodyweight military style PT workouts can get you into very good shape with very little equipment needed.  The various exercises can hit all your muscle groups and is a good primer before hitting some heavy iron. Not to mention you can usually do your workouts anywhere and you can start now.

My wife and I cycle bodyweight PT for a couple of months out of the year to give our joints and muscles a good rest from the weights.  It's definitely great for building muscle endurance.

Regards,

Chris

Hope I dont anger you ;) , but i second the free weight suggestion.  I had a crappy bench but recently got a new one.  It's a chi-mart special but it was only $99 and it is olympic size w/ a seperate weight crutch for bench press that extends so you can do squats.  I also picked up a 300 pound olympic barbell set at sportmart for $110.  Pick up 2 or 3 sets of dumbbells (or one of those multi weight dumbbell sets) and you are all set for much less than a good home gym.  Here's what I have in mine:

Bench : $99
300 lb Weight set : $110
Solid Dumbells (20 lb - 40lb) : $30/pair average.  You probably don't need the whole range.  You can get a 60 pound dumbbell set that uses plates at chi-mart for $20.

That would give you everything you need for less than $250.

I do my workouts while everyone sleeps and have no spotter.  Sure, you may not be maxing out your bench but you can still do a LOT of stuff.  And with the free weights, when you get tired of doing a particular exercise, you can mix it up.  

HTH
-Nuke

oooooooo..ARLady....your mean![;)]   [url]powerblock.com[/url][bounce][url][email protected][/url]...your call sweetness/my weakness,......Please dont[argue] yell at me![bounce]

"I've found there are two types of salesmen. The one's who sell you what you want, and the one's who sell you what you need."

Ok. I've worked with several of the multi-system machines, and assisted a good friend in researching them. Honestly, I would say if you are going that route, go with the Bowflex. Very flexible with regards to the number of available exercises. Out of all the machines, I felt it had the best consistency with regards to resistance. Quality....hrm....I would say 4 out of 5. My friend ended up buying one, and is very happy with it, but within the first three months he broke one of the 10lb power rods. He had the new one in about a week, no charge, so the service I would say is very good. I would warn you though....it looks much smaller on TV. I'd guesstimate the unit height at around 6'5" to 6'6". yes, it does fold up, but it's still a big machine.



I've known four people so far who have developed home gyms out of freeweight systems. The most expensive one to date was still about 400 less than the Bowflex Ultimate, which is $2000. This goes to the above quote, regarding want and need.

No machine you could get will truly replicate the workout you would get with freeweights. The biggest benefit of free weights is that you have a constant resistance through the entire range of motion...machines do not have truly consistent resistance, especially in the lower phase of a rep, where that resistance is most important. THAT is why people will recommend free weights....not for 'bodybuilding', but because they will provide a better and higher quality workout. I've been on the Body For Life program for 6 weeks now, and about 80-90% of my exercises are with dumbbells.

A set of dumbbell weights with stand holders, two grips, and the bolting mechanisms to hold the weights on the grips would cost usually around 350 (builds from 10-80lb dumbbells). That setup alone would be about the same size but half as tall as the Bowflex, and would allow you to work every muscle group except quads and calves. Add 200 for a rack and bar, and you can do many more exercises, and quads. If you have a decent mat, you would have no need for a spotter.



I would say this then. If you have any fitness stores which sell equipment, such as a Fitness 2000...go in and talk to the reps there, just to get an idea of things. Let then know exactly what you want, and have them run through the comparison with a machine. If you decide to go the machine route, while it is expensive I would definitely recommend the Bowflex.

okay, for all you free weight junkies.  [;)]

what kind of leg exercises can one do with free weights?  i know of squats and cleans but little else.  not that there isn't a way, but i'm not too sure i wanna be strapping weights to my ankles for leg extensions and what not. [:D]

no, i'm not mean.  i just don't mind being verbal about nincompoops who wanna flaunt their "superior knowledge" at the expense of getting me answers.

Personally, my bag has always been free-weights of some sort.  Don't get me wrong, I'm not exactly Arnold.  I'm 185 lbs. of bones and belly, but I do have a lot of experience over the years.  I have never used the bowflex, but I have used the Total Gym and I wasn't a fan of it.  Just not enough incremental stages of weight and you don't get anywhere near the same resistance that you do with free weights.  As far as building your legs is concerned, I have had the best results from simply jogging.  Not only will you firm up your legs and rear, but you will also build your cardiovascular strength and your immune system (both of which are more important than anything).  It is also a very peaceful thing to do with someone.  I go jogging all the time with my girlfriend and we love it.  Just something to consider.  Good Luck with your choice.

P.s. One serious suggestion:  Stay away from any supplements that contain caffeine or similar product(usually used for fat loss).  What these items do is boost your heart rate which causes your metabolism to rise.  THIS IS BAD BAD BAD.  Many people have lost their lives (i.e. FLOJO).  Please be safe.  Once again, good luck.

ARLady, when cmoth was refering to "newbie", I believe he meant the previous poster, who as you can see goes by the handle of ar15_newbie.  I'm no expert, but I believe the advice that cmoth gave was sound, given your goal to get into shape, but not looking for "body building competition results".  Seems to be like there was a misunderstanding here and perhaps an apology is in order...

Rocko

ARlady,

The following freeweight exercises can be done for legs.

squats - Use narrow, medium, wide stances to hit different areas.
barbell hack squats
front squats
sissy squats - Good in place of leg extensions.
leg extentions
lounges barbell or dumbbell
stiff legged dealifts barbell and dumbbell
leg curls
boot strappers
calf raises
seated calf raises
etc., etc
If you do a internet search I'm sure you'll find many more.

There's a lot of other exercises you can do but you only need to do a few basic ones.  Sqauts, stiff legged deadlifts and calf raises should cover just about everything in a leg workout.  If you need more variety add mix and match some of the others I mentioned.

If you get a bench like the one I have you can get the leg curl/extension attachment so you don't need to strap weights to your feet.  The leg attachments can also be setup so you can use you bench as an incline ab bench.  Just make sure to stick with benches constructed with 2" steel tubing or better.  The smaller ones break and bend too easily.  

[img]http://www.parabody.com/prodimages/hp_multibench.jpg[/img]

As someone else mentioned you will spend a whole lot less on free weight equipment than on Bowflex and other type of machines and also get superior workouts and results.

Again, I don't know how much space you have but I know you will spend less.

Here's how my home gym looks like.  My old house only had half the workout space as current one pictured and I had no problems getting a gym quality workout.

[img]http://a8.cpimg.com/image/CA/59/11002058-b372-02000180-.jpg[/img]

Hope this helps.

Before I built a squat rack, I used dumbbells to work-out quads and calves.  To do squats, you simply hold a dumbbell in each hand while squatting.  If you can't hold the weight for long enough to finish your set, you can use lifting straps as a cheat.  Some people find it easier doing this way, because it's easier to balance since your center of gravity is lower.  If you get stuck at the bottom, you can drop the weights a few inches to the floor.  For calves, you can stand on a block of wood, lift one foot (to increase the resistance, if needed), hold onto something to steady yourself with one hand, and hold a dumbbell in the other.  The added advantage of doing these two exercises is that your grip strength will improve.z

[rolleyes]

i appreciate your desire to keep things civil and friendly in your forum, but i don't need parenting.  i haven't broken any of the rules, i haven't made any personal attacks, i haven't started any pissing wars.  [red]IF[/red] i do that, i fully expect someone to come down on me.  but until then....




of course there's an apology in order.  he can apologize for his "i know better than you" attitude.  [;D]  [:D]

i know he wasn't referring to me with the "newbie" comment.  i think it's fairly obvious that i'm not a newbie.  [:D]  and i don't doubt the soundness of his advice.  except that i didn't ask for it.  and i didn't ask to be told what i should be doing instead.

maybe i just don't want to use the damn free weights.  maybe i've already decided those aren't what i want (or need for the smartass).

let me show you how it could have been said:

"ARlady,
can't answer your specific question, but let me add this: strength training is good, but don't forget the importance of running and isometric exercises.  IMO they are more important.

also, consider free weights instead of a machine for these reasons....blah, blah, blah"

it's not his opinion or i would have reamed the others who suggested free weights.

Well, maybe its me, but I just don't see the "smartass" in his reply.   In your reply to him, you said:



How is he not paying attention to the question?  You asked for opinions on the bowflex and any alternatives.  He gave you his opinion on the bowflex, and gave you an alternative.  Seems to me this is exactly what you asked, no?  

You then said:



Well, if you were going to be this defensive about it, perhaps you ought to have qualified your original question with the fact that you aren't interested in free weights.  I reread your original post, and no where was this mentioned.   You likely won't need a spotter if you are only lifting moderate weights (as he suggested).

I don't mean to psychoanalyze, but it seems that, being a woman, on a predominately male site in even probably a more predominately male forum, you came here expecting an "I know better than you" (when we ask a question like this here, aren't we hoping that someone who [i]does[/i] know better than us answer, anyways?) attitude, as you put it, and waaay overreacted to the first statement that even ever so slightly suggested that. Seems like you already had it set in your mind exactly what you wanted and didn't want, and when he failed to read your mind (because you certainly didn't include it in your first post) and suggested exactly what you [i]didn't[/i] want, you felt insulted somehow blew up.

My advice, lighten up and don't be so defensive... I still don't see any sort of bad attitude on his part - just concise, and probably good, advice.  

Rocko

Hmm...leg exercises...you could do "good mornings", lunges, and calf raises.  They're all fun to do.

Another thing...

It wasn't me who started this argument, was it?[:\]

Here's my question... what is your goal?  Increased strength?  Endurance?  Lower body fat?  If you are looking for either of the latter two then a home gym may not be the way to go.  

The other thing to consider is how are you at self-motivation?  Do you get distracted easily at home?

I've had a treadmill at home and rarely used it... but I have no problem working out at the gym 3-5 days a week.  I found that everytime I would say I was going to set aside time to work out I would find myself working on the barn or in the garden or hauling hay instead.  

There's no sense in learning at the $600 cost I did (cheap compared to a $2,000 "system") if you have any doubt about your committment to using it regularly at home.

Personally, for the money I would have to spend to get the quality and quantity of workout that I get at my gym, it's worth the commute and membership fees.  I schedule that time into my day and consider it the same as a doctor's appointment... don't miss it or you'll pay in the long run.  [:D]  

Miss_Magnum raises some very good points. To add on a little, your overall goal should be a big factor as should your comfort with the system you choose. If you are not comfortable with free weights, that is obviously not the answer for you, as you are far more likely to find excuses not to use them.

If you already have your mind made up on a "machine" (weight stack, or bowflex) then I recommend taking a trip to a local sporting goods store, or better still would be a fitness eqt. store. There you can try out various types of machines and decide which ones you like. If you fall in love, buy one. If you don't then move on.

If I recall correctly Bowflex offers a trial period during which the machine can be returned.

One of the best points made by M_M is that for some, a gym membership is the best way to go. I realize that it is inconvenient given the distance from your home, but sometimes the fact that your good money is going to that membership serves to motivate you to go when at home you can always "do it later". Another benefit is that at most gyms you have a wealth of knowledge at your disposal. The majority now offer personal training form credentialed professionals who should tailor a workout program to your goals, likes, dislikes, any previous or incurred injuries, and a variety of other factors. They should also take the time to educate you as to why you are performing the exercises that you are (what is this doing specifically) and other such things, in essence working themselves out of a job within a month or two. It is their job to maintian your motivation, and enthusiasm for your workouts, thus increasing the chances of your ultimate success. I could go on and on, and will if you would like, but I have blown hard long enough for now.

If you can provide a little more information, I can try to help more.