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Posted: 3/21/2006 5:31:25 PM EDT
I was on CP's website and they had post ban mag bodies for sale. They said "can not be shipped to California" but nothing about any other state. Anybody know if the bodies without the spring, follower, and floorplate is legal to ship/possess to NY?
Link Posted: 3/21/2006 6:56:26 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/21/2006 6:58:33 PM EDT by ThatFalGuy2]
As far as I know, it is not illegal for "them" to ship, but it sure is for us to possess, the way it was explained to me anyway is that it's like having an AR and the "other" parts from an automatic, look around there are pre-bans out there, you can even check with Valkyrie0002, he has some VERY nice ones for sale still I believe, done in permaslik. Sean.
Link Posted: 3/22/2006 3:59:23 PM EDT

Originally Posted By ThatFalGuy2:
As far as I know, it is not illegal for "them" to ship, but it sure is for us to possess, the way it was explained to me anyway is that it's like having an AR and the "other" parts from an automatic, look around there are pre-bans out there, you can even check with Valkyrie0002, he has some VERY nice ones for sale still I believe, done in permaslik. Sean.



From what I gathered in the NY assault weapons ban case law it is NOT illegal to possess components of a high cap magazine. Of course this would have to be argued in court and IMO I probably wouldnt take the chance unless they were undated post ban mag bodies.

Heres the law:
23. "Large capacity ammunition feeding device" means a magazine, belt,
drum, feed strip, or similar device, manufactured after September
thirteenth, nineteen hundred ninety-four, that has a capacity of, or
that can be readily restored or converted to accept, more than ten
rounds of ammunition; provided, however, that such term does not include
an attached tubular device designed to accept, and capable of operating
only with, .22 caliber rimfire ammunition.
Link Posted: 3/22/2006 4:06:23 PM EDT

Originally Posted By jaymeister99:

23. "Large capacity ammunition feeding device" means a magazine, belt,
drum, feed strip, or similar device, manufactured after September
thirteenth, nineteen hundred ninety-four, that has a capacity of, or
that can be readily restored or converted to accept, more than ten
rounds of ammunition; provided, however, that such term does not include
an attached tubular device designed to accept, and capable of operating
only with, .22 caliber rimfire ammunition.





Here's what I don't get about this law.

You can stuff more than 10 rounds of 9mm into some .40 magazines and they'll work. Does mere posession of the .40 magazine constitute having a magazine capable of accepting more than ten rounds of ammunition? I think it could be argued that all .40 magazines could be illegal then! These laws suck ass!
Link Posted: 3/22/2006 4:29:24 PM EDT

Originally Posted By maddog_enigma:

Originally Posted By jaymeister99:

23. "Large capacity ammunition feeding device" means a magazine, belt,
drum, feed strip, or similar device, manufactured after September
thirteenth, nineteen hundred ninety-four, that has a capacity of, or
that can be readily restored or converted to accept, more than ten
rounds of ammunition; provided, however, that such term does not include
an attached tubular device designed to accept, and capable of operating
only with, .22 caliber rimfire ammunition.





Here's what I don't get about this law.

You can stuff more than 10 rounds of 9mm into some .40 magazines and they'll work. Does mere posession of the .40 magazine constitute having a magazine capable of accepting more than ten rounds of ammunition? I think it could be argued that all .40 magazines could be illegal then! These laws suck ass!



If you read the statues of that law and take it literally yes, but since we live in a country with a common law system the reality in every case is probably no. But give it a few yers and see what happens when Spitzer is governor. You can kiss those mags goodbye if he has a say in it.
Link Posted: 3/22/2006 4:36:09 PM EDT
Link Posted: 3/22/2006 4:40:13 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Raptor22:
Yes, they can ship them to you but they can be only used as replacement mag bodies and you have to keep the old ones (preferably with the floor tabs broken off so the they cannot be used again).



Do you have any link to anything about this, case law?
Link Posted: 3/22/2006 5:29:58 PM EDT

Originally Posted By jaymeister99:

Heres the law:
23. "Large capacity ammunition feeding device" means a magazine, belt,
drum, feed strip, or similar device, manufactured after September
thirteenth, nineteen hundred ninety-four, that has a capacity of, or
that can be readily restored or converted to accept, more than ten
rounds of ammunition; provided, however, that such term does not include
an attached tubular device designed to accept, and capable of operating
only with, .22 caliber rimfire ammunition.



This, I, as in just myself, believe would be the cincher, would a body not be readily restorable?

The way that I look at it, mind you, not the way that I agree with, is that there is 4 parts to any given magazine, you have yer, follower, spring, floor plate, body.....

Follower...has no bearing on cap.
Spring... has no direct bearing on cap.
Floor plate...has no bearing on cap.
Body...unless modified, has every bearing on cap.

The law states "that can readily be restored", to me, that is the mag body, do I agree with it? In absolutely no f'ing way possible do I. Would you get prosecuted? Most likely not unless you did something stupid, I don't believe that you would. Would anyone ever find out? Almost certainly not, ever heard of it happening to anyone else, at least anyone not acting like an ass?

I have quite a few friends and aquaintances that are LEO, family that is LEO, I have been pulled over with my firearms and mags in vehicle, not once by any have I ever been asked how old the rifle with the collapsing stock is, never had anyone try to collapse that pinned stock, nor anyone ask how old or manufacture for my high caps were.

I think it unlikely that it ever really would be an issue, BUT, for that prosecuter or LEO that has a hard-on for you, it is only fuel. I think that the potential is there, that is enough for me to not buy new manufacture. If it costs $4 (for shits and giggles) more per mag and you buy 10 of them, $40 bucks is not alot to be sure that you aren't on the other end of that hard on, hell, even 100 mags or bodies, $400 is not alot, think about the what if, and do you know what it would cost just to have your lawyer show up in something like this, never mind the cost of the whole proceedings?

Be prepared for the worst, hope for the best.....Sean.

This is only my way of looking at items like this, there are quite a few dealers that will send you the whole mag, metal still hot and paint or other finish still dripping off, as far as I know, it is not thier responsibility to govern you, it's your own.....
Link Posted: 3/22/2006 9:01:37 PM EDT
Link Posted: 3/23/2006 2:52:56 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/23/2006 2:55:21 AM EDT by ThatFalGuy2]
I stand corrected!

Just out of curiousity and to maybe sound dumb here, but would you be better set to have the "demilled" mag bodies with you to show destruction or that they are unusable? Is this a stupid question? I mean, epsecially if the "new" bodies are dated? Sort of this is my new one, here is the one it replaced? Sean.

ETA....I wonder if anyone has ever tried this with the lower, useless pre-ban replaced with new lower, wait, there is something about that, nevermind.....
Link Posted: 3/23/2006 1:21:57 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Raptor22:

Originally Posted By jaymeister99:

Originally Posted By Raptor22:
Yes, they can ship them to you but they can be only used as replacement mag bodies and you have to keep the old ones (preferably with the floor tabs broken off so the they cannot be used again).



Do you have any link to anything about this, case law?



I asked a New York State Police investigator about this. Also this was SOP under the now sunsetted Federal AWB. You were allowed to replace mag bodies but the old ones had to be rendered unusable and retained as proof.



SOP???
Link Posted: 3/23/2006 1:34:26 PM EDT

Originally Posted By ThatFalGuy2:

Originally Posted By jaymeister99:

Heres the law:
23. "Large capacity ammunition feeding device" means a magazine, belt,
drum, feed strip, or similar device, manufactured after September
thirteenth, nineteen hundred ninety-four, that has a capacity of, or
that can be readily restored or converted to accept, more than ten
rounds of ammunition; provided, however, that such term does not include
an attached tubular device designed to accept, and capable of operating
only with, .22 caliber rimfire ammunition.



This, I, as in just myself, believe would be the cincher, would a body not be readily restorable?

The way that I look at it, mind you, not the way that I agree with, is that there is 4 parts to any given magazine, you have yer, follower, spring, floor plate, body.....

Follower...has no bearing on cap.
Spring... has no direct bearing on cap.
Floor plate...has no bearing on cap.
Body...unless modified, has every bearing on cap.

The law states "that can readily be restored", to me, that is the mag body, do I agree with it? In absolutely no f'ing way possible do I. Would you get prosecuted? Most likely not unless you did something stupid, I don't believe that you would. Would anyone ever find out? Almost certainly not, ever heard of it happening to anyone else, at least anyone not acting like an ass?

I have quite a few friends and aquaintances that are LEO, family that is LEO, I have been pulled over with my firearms and mags in vehicle, not once by any have I ever been asked how old the rifle with the collapsing stock is, never had anyone try to collapse that pinned stock, nor anyone ask how old or manufacture for my high caps were.

I think it unlikely that it ever really would be an issue, BUT, for that prosecuter or LEO that has a hard-on for you, it is only fuel. I think that the potential is there, that is enough for me to not buy new manufacture. If it costs $4 (for shits and giggles) more per mag and you buy 10 of them, $40 bucks is not alot to be sure that you aren't on the other end of that hard on, hell, even 100 mags or bodies, $400 is not alot, think about the what if, and do you know what it would cost just to have your lawyer show up in something like this, never mind the cost of the whole proceedings?

Be prepared for the worst, hope for the best.....Sean.

This is only my way of looking at items like this, there are quite a few dealers that will send you the whole mag, metal still hot and paint or other finish still dripping off, as far as I know, it is not thier responsibility to govern you, it's your own.....



Yes I doubt it would be an issue, and no I dont think a mag body constitutes a "magazine" under the law. But someday, somebody somewhere will get stopped and arrested over it. It will go to court, and then it will probably get dismissed. And that person will have pissed off $50,000 or better over it in legal fees. All for a $10 mag body.

If it doesnt have a date stamp, I'll consider buying to replace a few of the mag bodies I have with busted feed lips. If theres a date, hell no, not taking the chance, even if it is apparently legal.

Link Posted: 3/23/2006 1:35:32 PM EDT
Anybody know if the new CP mags are date stamped?
Link Posted: 3/23/2006 2:30:57 PM EDT
Link Posted: 3/23/2006 3:19:31 PM EDT
When you can still buy NIW or excellent condition preban mags for $15 it hardly pays to buy mag bodies.
Link Posted: 3/23/2006 3:23:39 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Raptor22:
SOP = Standard Operating Procedure.



That sounds ludicrous, but since when are gun laws not?

I can have a pre-94 magazine, with all new parts except for the mag body.

I can then get a mag body, but need to already have a mag to get it.

I can then take this brand new mag body and put all of my new parts into it so I have a 100% new mag, as long as I keep my old mag body.

WTF!




Link Posted: 3/23/2006 3:28:47 PM EDT

Originally Posted By rkbar15:
When you can still buy NIW or excellent condition preban mags for $15 it hardly pays to buy mag bodies.



What? Mag bodies are 9-10 each, throw in a new magazine kit from CP which runs 3 for 9.95 for a CS spring, floorplate, and MP follower. Thats 12-13 a mag, and NIW prebans dont come with a MP follower for $15, so make the total at least $17 with those.
Link Posted: 3/23/2006 3:32:44 PM EDT
The ATF allowed the repair of a preban mag including the mag body but you couldn't end up with more usable mags then you originally started with. That was the reason for crushing and retaining the old mag body.

This has never been officially approved in NY by any agency that has the authority to do so.
Link Posted: 3/23/2006 3:36:04 PM EDT

Originally Posted By jaymeister99:

Originally Posted By rkbar15:
When you can still buy NIW or excellent condition preban mags for $15 it hardly pays to buy mag bodies.



What? Mag bodies are 9-10 each, throw in a new magazine kit from CP which runs 3 for 9.95 for a CS spring, floorplate, and MP follower. Thats 12-13 a mag, and NIW prebans dont come with a MP follower for $15, so make the total at least $17 with those.



You're forgetting that to repair a preban mag you have to factor in the original cost of the mag that you are repairing.
Link Posted: 3/23/2006 3:57:49 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/23/2006 3:59:26 PM EDT by jaymeister99]
No Im not forgetting, I already have loads of beat up preban mags to replace, that is why I want new bodies. No point in spending $17 on a NIW mag.
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