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Posted: 6/16/2003 7:18:58 AM EDT
Just wondering if the Mak-90 is specifically listed as banned in NJ

I think it is, for some reason...

Also, on the general AWB (national), it says Bushmaster (and Armalite) AR-15 rifles are banned. Fine, they make XM15-E2S, a virtual clone... but the ban also says that 'or similar/clones'. what gives? How is my (and everyone elses Post ban AR15 legal? (Nationally, not just NJ)

Just curious. did they change something internal/cosmetic? It's still a remake/clone, but no one cares? =)
Link Posted: 6/16/2003 10:45:16 AM EDT
Nationally, there are no banned-by-name firearms; they are banned-by-feature. They can't have any more than 2 of a pile of criteria.

NJ and a couple other states specifically ban things *by name*...if it says Colt on it, it's banned. If it says AR15 on it, it's banned.

Bushmasters are NOT banned by name, specifically, so they're still legal to sell in NJ as I recall. And since a Bushmaster is NOT a Colt, it's not "similar to", as a Colt HBar Match Sporter would be similar to a Colt Sporter II...as far as I know. I could be completly wrong I'm sure someone else will explain it better later.

I believe MAK-90's are specifically banned by name, again.

However...the SAR1/SAR2/SAR3 rifles aren't banned in NJ. Weird, eh? 30 round mags are, but you can block them off to 15 rounds and be ok.
Link Posted: 6/16/2003 10:50:29 AM EDT
Oh okay, so it's a super technicality that a Bushmaster 20'' HBAR is not a clone or 'techincally similiar' to a Colt HBar Match Sporter. Cute.

Okay, I am familiar with the feature deal (actually looking for a flash suppressor for my 10/22 since it is in a stock with no pistol grip... might as well have the max of 2). =)

Okay, I will ask him for pics and lettering/writing on it before I pay for anything/'import'

Any more input?
Link Posted: 6/16/2003 11:40:19 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Phoenix_III:
Just wondering if the Mak-90 is specifically listed as banned in NJ

I think it is, for some reason...



www.njguns.com/define.htm

Unless the list has recently changedm the MAK-90 ain't on the list. Just to be safe, if you hit the NJSP web site, they have a page on firearms issues, and I think they have a phone/email contact list. Ring them up and find out for sure.


Also, on the general AWB (national), it says Bushmaster (and Armalite) AR-15 rifles are banned. Fine, they make XM15-E2S, a virtual clone... but the ban also says that 'or similar/clones'. what gives? How is my (and everyone elses Post ban AR15 legal? (Nationally, not just NJ)

Just curious. did they change something internal/cosmetic? It's still a remake/clone, but no one cares? =)



Wrong. The Bushmaster AR-15 and Armalite AR-15 are NOT banned by name. The Armalite AR-180 type and the Bushmaster Assault Rifle (MUCH different animal than the AR-15) are done by name.

The only specific AR-15 listed is the Colt AR-15 and CAR-15 series. The NJ high and mighty ruled that firearms such as the bushmaster XM-15 and the Armalite AR-15 are NOT considered substantially identical to the Colt AR-15. The difference being I believe they consider the Colt AR-15 and CAR-15 being named as preban config rifles, and thus postban config rifles aren't considered substantially identical.
Link Posted: 6/16/2003 11:44:00 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/16/2003 12:08:53 PM EDT by Phoenix_III]
Very good to hear (Bushmaster assault vs post bans today)... was just curious... still watching

www.awbansunset.com very closely...
=D


checked list again, posted here (NJguns)



(1) The following firearms:

Algimec AGM1 type
Any shotgun with a revolving cylinder such as the "Street Sweeper" or "Striker 12"
Armalite AR-180 type
Australian Automatic Arms SAR
Avtomat Kalashnikov type semi-automatic firearms
Beretta AR-70 and BM59 semi-automatic firearms
Bushmaster Assault Rifle
Calico M-900 Assault carbine and M-900
CETME G3
Chartered Industries of Singapore SR-88 type
Colt AR-15 and CAR-15 series
Daewoo K-1, K-2, Max 1 and Max 2, AR 100 types
Demro TAC-1 carbine type
Encom MP-9 and MP-45 carbine types
FAMAS MAS223 types
FN-FAL, FN-LAR, or FN-FNC type semi-automatic firearms
Franchi SPAS 12 and LAW 12 shotguns
G3SA type
Galil type Heckler and Koch HK91, HK93, HK94, MP5, PSG-1
Intratec TEC 9 and 22 semi-automatic firearms
M1 carbine type
M14S type
MAC 10, MAC 11, MAC 11-9mm carbine type firearms
PJK M-68 carbine type
Plainfield Machine Company Carbine
Ruger K-Mini-14/5F and Mini-14/5RF
SIG AMT, SIG 550SP, SIG 551SP, SIG PE-57 types
SKS with detachable magazine type
Spectre Auto carbine type
Springfield Armory BM59 and SAR-48 type
Sterling MK-6, MK-7 and SAR types
Steyr A.U.G. semi-automatic firearms
USAS 12 semi-automatic type shotgun
Uzi type semi-automatic firearms
Valmet M62, M71S, M76, or M78 type semi-automatic firearms
Weaver Arm Nighthawk.

Link Posted: 6/16/2003 11:47:31 AM EDT
the

Avtomat Kalashnikov type semi-automatic firearms
interests me though... Aren't SAR-1 (and 3) and any real AK type rifle (not an RPK receiver, or AKM(odern)) illegal in NJ then? =
or is it again that with a certain number of US or non-origin parts, they are not considered avtomat Kalashnikov rifles anymore?
Link Posted: 6/16/2003 11:59:58 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Evil_Ed:
Nationally, there are no banned-by-name firearms;



You are mistaken.


TITLE 18 > PART I > CHAPTER 44
Sec. 921. - Definitions


(a)
(30)

The term ''semiautomatic assault weapon'' means -

(A)

any of the firearms, or copies or duplicates of the firearms in any caliber, known as -

(i)

Norinco, Mitchell, and Poly Technologies Avtomat Kalashnikovs (all models);

(ii)

Action Arms Israeli Military Industries UZI and Galil;

(iii)

Beretta Ar70 (SC-70);

(iv)

Colt AR-15;

(v)

Fabrique National FN/FAL, FN/LAR, and FNC;

(vi)

SWD M-10, M-11, M-11/9, and M-12;

(vii)

Steyr AUG;

(viii)

INTRATEC TEC-9, TEC-DC9 and TEC-22; and

(ix)

revolving cylinder shotguns, such as (or similar to) the Street Sweeper and Striker 12;

Link Posted: 6/16/2003 12:06:29 PM EDT
yowza...

I know how the AR-15, err, my Bushmaster XM15-E2S passes, but what about AK-47s (true, like a SAR-1)??

I can see how an AK74 and AK(M) can pass... but it is all models/varients... unless again the AK is okay because it may only have 2 features, that is, the pistol grip and magazine...

that would make sense..
Link Posted: 6/16/2003 1:55:40 PM EDT
*SIGH*

The never ending saga of NJ gun laws...

Evil_Ed, I mean no disrespect at all towards you. Just need to make sure things are straightened out.


Originally Posted By Evil_Ed:
if it says Colt on it, it's banned.



That is incorrect. I've owned two Colt Match Target rifles. They are for sale in most gun stores in the state.


If it says AR15 on it, it's banned.


This IS correct.


I believe MAK-90's are specifically banned by name, again.


As pointed out above, this is incorrect. MAK 90s are around. SARs are more popular, though.
Link Posted: 6/17/2003 11:37:13 AM EDT
I wonder how the law would be interpreted in the case of a factory (WW II issue) M3 Carbine? These where the M1 Carbine variation with the I/R sniper scope on them. IIRC, they where marked "M3" as opposed to M1.

No, I do not have one, I just want to stir the pot a bit.
It strikes me as funny that the Norinco M14/S is on the banned list but the Springfield M1A is not...and if you where to send a Norinco to Smith Specialities, it'd come back marked M21 or something like that and then be perfectly legal (in a post ban configuration of course)

God, I hate this place.

ka
Link Posted: 6/17/2003 7:49:37 PM EDT
true COlt Hbar and match target is legal
best thing to do is call the NJSP and get the firearms division
there are a few revisions the guy told me but I forgot what they were
i only remember the 2 colts
Link Posted: 6/19/2003 3:21:50 PM EDT
The Mak 90 is legal. Due to a criminal court case in Monmouth county. The Judge in the case ruled the MAK90 was not an assault weapon. This was about 1997. I bought one from Sarco's in 1998. I sold it when I purchased a bulgarian. OK gun. Not accurate.
You guys/Gals on this sight living in NAZI JERZI should purchase Evan Nappens orange book on NJ gun laws.
Link Posted: 6/22/2003 1:03:30 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Jetlag:

You are mistaken.

TITLE 18 > PART I > CHAPTER 44
Sec. 921. - Definitions




Federal law specifically states the mentioned firearms? I never read it fully (I always get to a specific part, get disgusted, and walk away from it)...I stand corrected if those previously quoted names are in the federal AWB list.
Link Posted: 6/22/2003 1:07:47 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/22/2003 1:09:00 PM EDT by Evil_Ed]

Originally Posted By FMJunkie:
*SIGH*

The never ending saga of NJ gun laws...

Evil_Ed, I mean no disrespect at all towards you. Just need to make sure things are straightened out.



Fair enough If I'm wrong, I fully expect to be corrected



That is incorrect. I've owned two Colt Match Target rifles. They are for sale in most gun stores in the state.



Ahh...so they just banned 2 letters and 2 numbers stamped into a piece of alumnium. Ok I thought they banned 4 more letters as well. In a certain order, of course. (Wonder if Colt would ever make a run of Clot RA-51's...)



This IS correct.



Knew I was right about *something*


As pointed out above, this is incorrect. MAK 90s are around. SARs are more popular, though.


I never pretended to be a lawyer

Well, that makes things easier for me..So I can legally traipse around NJ with my SAR-2, provided I block the mags. Could be worse, I guess...most of the cops I talk to in NJ think the ban is probably the dumbest thing they've ever heard of, but *shrug* not much they can do about it, and most don't care either way.

Thanks for the corrections!

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