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Posted: 2/16/2006 10:59:55 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/22/2006 6:44:38 PM EDT by Archangel6]
If I had a 10.5 or 11.5 upper and had say a TAC16 suppressor permanently attached to it would it be considered legal?

RD
Link Posted: 2/16/2006 4:04:58 PM EDT
You need to be over 30 inches with the stock collapsed or you will need to register it as a pistol.
Link Posted: 2/16/2006 9:25:31 PM EDT

Originally Posted By ARDOC:
You need to be over 30 inches with the stock collapsed or you will need to register it as a pistol.



Now that I think about it the TAC16 totally comes apart doesn't it....
Link Posted: 2/22/2006 6:44:24 PM EDT
Ok, see the portion circled this is what I am talking about, it does not remove from the can hence it is 1 piece making the can what 7.25 OAL?



IF I were to blind pin, and weld the can to the end of my 10.5, 11.5 or 14.5" barrel would it be legal? Theoretically total bbl length would be over 16" in either config listed above
Link Posted: 2/23/2006 1:28:21 PM EDT
Hmmmmm.... I've been thinking about the same thing! It seems like it should work to me. I feel another project coming on!
Link Posted: 2/23/2006 7:14:44 PM EDT
I don't see why it wouldn't be legal. I have a 14.5" barrel with a pinned welded flash hider that is legal. The supressor is basically acting as a very long muzzle device that when welded becomes part of a barrel. You would in essence be constructing a 16" integrally supressed barrel. IMO

Link Posted: 2/24/2006 3:53:24 PM EDT
Yes it is OK.
Link Posted: 2/24/2006 5:48:17 PM EDT

Originally Posted By RodMI:
Yes it is OK.



I like the way that you think!
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 5:25:12 AM EDT
AK fans have been doing this for quit some time to the AMD 65. The requirements are in how you Permanently attach it that is where you will get 10 years in the pen. I’m going to do this very same thing to my folding AK after my Form1 is approved.
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 5:44:47 AM EDT

Originally Posted By RodMI:The requirements are in how you Permanently attach it that is where you will get 10 years in the pen.


Silver solder & Blind pinning?
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 8:12:20 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/25/2006 8:23:50 AM EDT by triage1998]
I hate to hijack this thread.




You need to be over 30 inches with the stock collapsed or you will need to register it as a pistol.



How long does it take to process a handgun in Michigan? The reason I ask is we have a discussion going on over at the team forum about a slight problem I have with a buyer from Michigan on GUNBROKER.

I sold a milled underfolder Ak-47 to some guy in Michigan. The AK is 26" folded. So it is considered a handgun. Do the police hold the firearm( I din't know this before selling)? What is the process to registering a handgun in MI?

Read the thread and you will see that this problem now crops up.


www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=1&f=75&t=440574
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 8:41:05 AM EDT
The buyer gets a permit to purchase from they're local police dept, takes it to the FFL that you are shipping it too, they handle the transfer there..the new owner takes it back to their local PD and they do a "Safety" inspection on it.

The buyers FFL should be able to answer their questions..

RD
Link Posted: 2/25/2006 3:26:01 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/25/2006 4:00:18 PM EDT by RodMI]
The problem with registering a Folding AK is no one knows how to enter it in the computer! A normal green card is good for only 7 days then it expires.


P.S. how do you post photos? I have a photo of a AK green card I would like to post.

i40.photobucket.com/albums/e204/rk40risk/8324GreenCard2.jpg
Link Posted: 2/26/2006 5:10:17 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/26/2006 5:10:54 PM EDT by yagermeister]
triage1998
Here in Mi a rifle has to be at least 26" with the stock folded.Underfolders are usually under 26 without a longer muzzle break.Any rifle between 26 and 30 inchs with a folding/collapsable stock has to be registered like a pistol.If he took it in with out a longer brake they may be holding it .Otherwise they dont hold the gun your in and out ...but they try to make it as big as a hassle as they can ...so it could take time.
Link Posted: 2/27/2006 8:21:41 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/27/2006 8:22:24 AM EDT by metroplex]

Originally Posted By triage1998:
I hate to hijack this thread.




You need to be over 30 inches with the stock collapsed or you will need to register it as a pistol.



How long does it take to process a handgun in Michigan? The reason I ask is we have a discussion going on over at the team forum about a slight problem I have with a buyer from Michigan on GUNBROKER.

I sold a milled underfolder Ak-47 to some guy in Michigan. The AK is 26" folded. So it is considered a handgun. Do the police hold the firearm( I din't know this before selling)? What is the process to registering a handgun in MI?

Read the thread and you will see that this problem now crops up.


www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=1&f=75&t=440574



I had to do that for my FN Herstal PS90. It's 26.23" OAL. I had the vendor ship it to my FFL dealer. I obtained a purchase permit PRIOR to visiting the FFL. I took the rifle (unloaded) to the Police station with the completed permit. They process it for registration/inspection into the computer. Afterwards I get a green card that identifies my PS90 as a pistol and as being registered. Neither the PS90 nor the 5.7x28 caliber was in the system. They had to manually input it.
Link Posted: 2/28/2006 1:14:31 PM EDT
Since a p90 dosent have a folding or collapsable stock it should not have to go on a green card....
Link Posted: 2/28/2006 1:25:45 PM EDT

Originally Posted By yagermeister:
Since a p90 dosent have a folding or collapsable stock it should not have to go on a green card....



According to MSP it does. My FFL dealer also told me to bring a purchase permit ahead of time, and he's a straight shooter. Its OAL is 26.23" or so, so that makes it a Michigan pistol / Federal rifle.
Link Posted: 3/2/2006 3:31:38 AM EDT

Originally Posted By metroplex:

Originally Posted By yagermeister:
Since a p90 dosent have a folding or collapsable stock it should not have to go on a green card....



According to MSP it does. My FFL dealer also told me to bring a purchase permit ahead of time, and he's a straight shooter. Its OAL is 26.23" or so, so that makes it a Michigan pistol / Federal rifle.



You got a green card on that thing? Can you CCW it, legally?
Link Posted: 3/2/2006 10:15:22 AM EDT
Looking at Rocketman223's post, it makes sense that its becomes a 16" integrally supressed barrel. Therefore the question becomes, can a person make such a rifle or do you have to be a licensed Class 3 (or 2 whatever it is) manufacturer to make such an animal?
Link Posted: 3/5/2006 3:37:13 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/6/2006 11:23:57 AM EDT by coltsonly]
I have gone through this process already and have a friend that lives in another county going through it now and you wouldnt believe the answers he is getting from local, state and county officals. First in regards to the law it states in MI for a rifle to be considered legal it must have a barrell length of at least 16"s and a overall length of at least 30"s. If the rifle is less the 30"s but more then 26"s in overall length it must be presented for a safety inspection and registered on a green card. The part of the law that says between 26 and 30 mentions with the stock collapsed or folded but I was told by Oakland county they take it to mean removed also. I have a wh 27a1 thompsom with the receiver milled for a 21/28 removable stock and the barrell cut down to a oal of 16"s with a permanently attached compensator (welded/pinned) and with the stock removed the gun measures 29 5/8" so on a green card it went. I found this info out after the fact but being I have a cpl I was able to take it in for an inspection with no problems. If I did not have a cpl technicaly I should have filed for a green card (purchase permit) first then upon getting the card take the gun in for inspection and go from there. If the rifle is less then 26 or the barrell less then 16 its a sbr and illeagle in MI.
My friend knowing what I went through purchased a folding stock for his mini 14 called the locals, state and county authorites and was told everything from the law dropped with the awb to dont bother bringing it in because your ok and in regards to a supressor or muzzel brake as long as you need a tool to remove it your ok. He actually had to take my copy of the firearm laws of MI to convince them. So I would advise read and know the law before you make changes and dont take someones word for it that your ok get it in black and white.
When I was registering it I brought up the fact that if they listed it as a pistol on the card conciveably I could slide the stock off put in a 50 round drum sling it over my shoulder put on a long coat and go up to 7/11 for some milk. They saw things my way and put rifle on the card so that part may be flexable in regards to how they classify the weapon. Hope the info helps.
In regards to permenantly attaching the comp or surpressor if it is used to make the barrell a legal 16's it must be permenantly attached/welded. If its not and you can remove it technically you are in posession of short barrell and if a receiver is in the house you can be charged with mfg. a sbr gun and thats a no no in MI. If your barrell is of legal length 16"s or more and you are putting on something you can do whatever you want.
coltsonly
Link Posted: 3/19/2006 3:29:56 PM EDT

Originally Posted By RodMI:
The problem with registering a Folding AK is no one knows how to enter it in the computer! A normal green card is good for only 7 days then it expires.

MI Permit to Purchase "green cards" are good for 10 days, not seven.
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