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Posted: 2/2/2006 2:57:01 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/22/2006 2:19:38 AM EDT by MrsGungho]
Update
Passed and to be signed by Daniels next Tuesday. Only one piece of the law gives pause, that being a copy of every 4473 will be passed onto the Indiana State Police within one month of being filled out. Legislators that are for this bill say they will work next session to get that piece removed.

HB 1176


This letter was passed to me from a friend. Let's do our homework folks and get some calls made for thanks in the House and to get it passed in the Senate.


I just got off the phone talking with Rep. Troy Woodruff. HB 1176 is now out of the House and headed for the Senate.

This is a spectacular bill. Unless I'm mistaken no other state has a lifetime carry permit. It's my estimation that Troy has blazed a trail in the Nation by getting such a bill this far.

It not only provides for a lifetime permit but it will allow for on line renewal application and it will also end the process of Indiana gun dealers having to go through the state police on background checks for gun transfer and instead allow them to go directly to the Feds NICS. For gun dealers this means no more long delays on the phone or endless busy signals.

Troy told me he has Governor Daniels as well as the Indiana State Police on board with this. What we must do now is reguardless of where you live for each and everyone of you to call Senator's Johnny Nugent, John Waterman and Mike Delph and your own state Senator's office and ask them to help this bill get through the senate. 1-800-382-9467 When the operator asks if this is a comment about a bill tell them no you just need to talk to their assistant. Then leave you message with that office. These three are very good legislators for gun owners.

This will be a big plus for Gov. Daniels as well as Rep. Troy Woodruff and Senator Johnny Nugent in earning them recognition from gun owners and gun dealers across the state. If this succeeds and your calls will see that it will, this should get national attention.

Troy has asked me to get Joel Partridge from the NRA to contact the Governor's office to show their support. I'm in the process of doing that. I'm also going to ask Larry Pratt, President of Gun Owners of America call the Governors office and show their support too.

This is a major accomplishment and a prime example of what happens when citizens work with their elected to make things happen. This started with you guys in the 2nd Amendment Patriots and our very good friends Sen. Nugent and Rep. Woodruff. Troy even told me he got 65 votes for the Vermont style carry. That's 65 out of 100 House members. That's a statement.

Please be sure to thank them both. NOW GET ON THE PHONES

I must clarify. I was incorrect when I said that Rep. Woodruff got 65 votes for the Vermont style. I should have said that he believed he could have gotten that many votes if he tried, but he didn't want to make them nervous on this bill.


Link Posted: 2/2/2006 4:30:26 AM EDT
Thanks for the update! What are the downsides to this bill?
Link Posted: 2/2/2006 4:32:26 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/2/2006 4:32:43 AM EDT by buckfever34]
Looks like a good thing.

Link Posted: 2/3/2006 5:42:10 AM EDT
whats the difference in an "unlimited" licence and a "qualified" licence?
Link Posted: 2/3/2006 5:52:42 AM EDT

Originally Posted By RoseMech:
whats the difference in an "unlimited" licence and a "qualified" licence?



My guess is that "Unlimited" is AKA "personal protection", while "Qualified" is AKA "target & hunting". With the latter, you can only carry the gun at a range or in the field, and it must be unloaded and secured while traveling to/from.

Link Posted: 2/3/2006 6:14:14 AM EDT
This reminds me, I have to renew my permit in a few months.
Wish this was already law.
Link Posted: 2/4/2006 5:23:11 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Shadowsabre:
This reminds me, I have to renew my permit in a few months.
Wish this was already law.



Same here.

When I renew mine, I have to drive like a maniac to the Sheriff's Department. I get off work at 3:30, and the person who does handgun permits leaves at 4:00.

Thanks for the heads-up, MrsG.
Link Posted: 2/4/2006 2:49:25 PM EDT
HB 1176 needs a hearing in the senate. Indiana
Met with a few folks today. As I thought some of us have differences of opinion in some areas. We all showed up and there where many who could not for many different reasons. I have been somewhat discouraged in some ways as I have heard very apathetic responces and the excuse:
Thanks, but I get all of the info I need from NRA and ISRPA.

I have spoken to NRA-ILA grass roots co-ordinator about the fact that there are bills in the IN legislature above and beyond hb 1028. She did not have an answer except that the NRA lobbiest in Indiana may not have comminicated beyond the tunnel focus of Castle Doctrine legislation they braught a copy of from FL. Does not seem to matter to the NRA that we in Indiana may have a lifetime liscense in the works. I am speaking of HB 1176.
I made a search on line for isrpa and found something in Italy so I added Indiana to the search and still no direct links to the organization or anything to do with legislative updates.
Copied from email:Met with a few folks today. As I thought some of us have differences of opinion in some areas. We all showed up and there where many who could not for many different reasons. I have been somewhat discouraged in some ways as I have heard very apathetic responces and the excuse:
Thanks, but I get all of the info I need from NRA and ISRPA.

I have spoken to NRA-ILA grass roots co-ordinator about the fact that there are bills in the IN legislature above and beyond hb 1028. She did not have an answer except that the NRA lobbiest in Indiana may not have comminicated beyond the tunnel focus of Castle Doctrine legislation they braught a copy of from FL. Does not seem to matter to the NRA that we in Indiana may have a lifetime liscense in the works. I am speaking of HB 1176.
I made a search on line for isrpa and found something in Italy so I added Indiana to the search and still no direct links to the organization or anything to do with legislative updates.
Copied from email:
[Quote:]
I just had a phone conversation with Rep. Woodruff and Sen. Nugent about HB 1176. It has not been scheduled for a hearing on the senate side yet.

Sen. Nugent tells me that the Chairman, Sen. Long, is troubled with the "lifetime" language. He seems to be concerned what would happen if someone has a lifetime permit and does something to have it revoked, how would it be done. Well, it would be the same procedure if someone just received their four year permit and a week later does something wrong. There's no difference.

I've told you before that I'm not too fond of Sen. Long when it comes to standing strong for gun owners. What you all must do and I sincerely hope you will and that is call Sen. Long's office Monday and politely request that he give HB 1176 a hearing. Again the number is 1-800-382-9467, ask the operator to put you into his office. I don't care what state you live in just call him. This bill needs to get a hearing in the senate in the next few days.

Long has given HB 1028 a hearing which is unbelievable. That's Rep. Koch's bill that would allow a citizen to use deadly force like Florida's Castle Doctrine law. Yet Sen. Long has a problem with honest law abiding citizens having a lifetime carry permit to exercise their Constitutional right.

Rep. Woodruff told that me tonight that he has a few more moves if the senate doesn't co-operate, but it would be a whole lot better if they would.

If this becomes law it would be the first in the nation. Every legislator whose name is associated with this will benefit from it. You would think that would occur to Sen. Long.

There are about 130 recipients on this e-mail list. I hope that everyone one of them and their spouse and their friends will call Sen. Long's office, too. Especially everyone in the Ft. Wayne, IN area needs to make the call.

HB 1028, Rep, Koch's bill, I'm told, was a (NRA Bill). HB 1176 is an American citizen gun owner bill. IT'S YOUR BILL. HOW BAD DO YOU WANT IT? Do you want the hassle every 4 years from local law enforcement agencies who try to make it a hardship for you to even apply for a permit? Maybe they don't want you to own a gun. Maybe they don't like the medication you have prescribed. Maybe it's just the way you look that doesn't appeal to them. There's countless reasons why they might imagine that you ought not be allowed to exercise your right to keep and bear arms. But a lifetime permit would put a lot of this aggravation behind you.

CALL MONDAY, CALL EARLY!

Jim and Margie
2nd Amendment Patriots
STAY UNITED
[/Quote:]
As many folks who can please let them know you want the bill to be acted on and not die quietly in a comittee.
txgho1911
Link Posted: 2/6/2006 2:56:00 AM EDT
txgho thanks for posting the update.
We need to get calls made this morning to get a hearing set for this bill guys.
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 4:55:29 AM EDT
bump for update
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 5:06:24 AM EDT
When will the Lifetime Permit take effect? At signing or at a later date?
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 5:08:52 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Dog1:
When will the Lifetime Permit take effect? At signing or at a later date?



July 1, 2006
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 6:17:05 AM EDT
Blast. I was hoping it'd be ready in May when I come to live in IN. I guess I'll wait until July to get my CCW permit.
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 7:20:58 AM EDT
Does this take the local departments out of the application loop?

As I read it, it may or may not, depending on money to fund it.
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 8:46:56 AM EDT

Originally Posted By MrsGungho:
Update
Passed and to be signed by Daniels next Tuesday. Only one piece of the law gives pause, that being a copy of every 4473 will be passed onto the Indiana State Police within one month of being filled out. Legislators that are for this bill say they will work next session to get that piece removed.



If they can get that part removed that would seal the deal on one of the most meaningful pieces of gun related legislation to hit the ground in recent years. It follows the Governors preference for licenses in general to be valid for longer periods so I would fully expect him to support it.
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 8:47:16 AM EDT

Originally Posted By MrsGungho:

Originally Posted By Dog1:
When will the Lifetime Permit take effect? At signing or at a later date?



July 1, 2006



Mine expires in late June this year, I wonder how that will play out?

I wonder how much this will cost? Great piece of news.
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 10:08:59 AM EDT
Our permits expire in Oct., so the timing may just right.

I am also curious as to the cost....whatever it will be well worth it. I missed out on the Lifetime Hunting.

But I am all over this one!
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 10:23:43 AM EDT
Cost as per the bill's wording-

Permits a person to apply for and receive a lifetime handgun license. Requires a person applying for a lifetime handgun license to pay a fee of: (1) $125 for a lifetime unlimited license if the person does not currently possess a valid handgun license; (2) $100 for a lifetime unlimited license if the person currently possesses a valid handgun license;
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 11:19:33 AM EDT
I'm up in August so this may work out great
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 11:34:04 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/14/2006 11:59:56 AM EDT by MrsGungho]

Originally Posted By Dog1:
Does this take the local departments out of the application loop?

As I read it, it may or may not, depending on money to fund it.



The local police will still have a hand in the application process.
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 12:13:04 PM EDT
Mine expires July 12. I wonder if that will leave me enough time to apply. I usually renew a couple of months early, but may have to hold out longer.
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 12:33:03 PM EDT
I am good till June 07'. But this is great news.
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 1:32:56 PM EDT

Originally Posted By M4Madness:
Mine expires July 12. I wonder if that will leave me enough time to apply. I usually renew a couple of months early, but may have to hold out longer.



If you apply for renewal prior to your permit expiring, and you retain a copy of said application along with your old permit, you can still carry even if the permit expires before your new one arrives.

Link Posted: 3/14/2006 1:44:51 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/14/2006 1:45:20 PM EDT by M4Madness]

Originally Posted By Shooter521:

Originally Posted By M4Madness:
Mine expires July 12. I wonder if that will leave me enough time to apply. I usually renew a couple of months early, but may have to hold out longer.



If you apply for renewal prior to your permit expiring, and you retain a copy of said application along with your old permit, you can still carry even if the permit expires before your new one arrives.




Yeah, I've always heard that, but figured I'd renew early just to avoid any hassles.

I'm hoping to get the lifetime permit deal this time, as I'd hate to pay $25 to renew then have to turn right around and send another $100. It'll save me the $25 if I can renew between July 1 and July 12.
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 2:43:21 PM EDT

Originally Posted By MrsGungho:

Only one piece of the law gives pause, that being a copy of every 4473 will be passed onto the Indiana State Police within one month of being filled out.

HB 1176



So, What can/can't the ISP do with the 4473s, and how long can they keep them? Anyone know?
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 3:15:23 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Riotgun:

Originally Posted By MrsGungho:

Only one piece of the law gives pause, that being a copy of every 4473 will be passed onto the Indiana State Police within one month of being filled out.

HB 1176



So, What can/can't the ISP do with the 4473s, and how long can they keep them? Anyone know?



I am posting the last letter I received on this issue below.


In reference to the issue of copies of the 4473's being sent to the state police after this bill becomes law let me explain a few things.

As I said we hope to get this resolved at the Governor's signing of the bill. Though we now live in a Nation where everything is documented, drivers licenses, social security numbers, tax returns, car registrations, house titles, credit cards, bank accounts, telephones, computer passwords and e-mails, surveillance cameras in stores, in the parking lots, on the streets, RFID's in many of the items you buy at your local Wal-Mart and Target stores, and the list goes on and on. It seems like everyone wants a record of something.

I don't like any of this documentation. I'd prefer we buy a gun, any gun, with the same ease as we'd buy a screwdriver. Most of these kinds of regulations make no sense. In this case, for example, when the state police get those 4473's there is nothing to prove that the original buyer will have that gun two weeks later or even two days later.

Having the state police out of the background checks is an improvement. No more delays on the phone or having a buyer leave and come back once the dealer gets through. Having the lifetime permit will eliminate the ordeal of having a permit expire and then getting delayed in the renewal process or getting delayed in the renewal process and then having the permit expire.

Trying to keep up with all those forms coming into them will likely be more than they'd be able to handle. As it is now if they choose to have a copy of a 4473 they contact a dealer and request it. Now they'll be getting them automatically. I hope they drown in them and they just might.

We do want to make sure that the Governor's office will ensure that they destroy those records in a timely fashion.

I just want to remind everyone again that taking a major step like getting a lifetime permit is a grueling endeavor, but it is a step towards getting to the point that Indiana citizens can once again carry their firearms where they want, when they want and without any "permit". Though this measure is not perfect we will eventually get it exactly the way we want it. You can take that to the bank! Maybe we'll have even more on board with us in the next session and new ideas are welcomed.

Jim and Margie
2nd Amendment Patriots
STAY UNITED
www.2ndamendmentpatriots.org



Check out the website he has listed at the bottom, there is updates on the page with some questions answered there. Any other questions, I have been told to e-mail from that site and ask. They have been very accommodating about answering questions up to now.
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 3:18:35 PM EDT
Thanks MrsG!
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 5:11:00 PM EDT
One step at a time. Great news. Tagged for more updates.
Link Posted: 3/18/2006 5:44:38 AM EDT
Just found out this morning that Daniels will also be signing HB1028 at the same time he is signing our lifetime license to carry.
This is the No Duty to Retreat law. It will also go into effect on July 1,2006.
Link Posted: 3/18/2006 12:28:44 PM EDT
Another great thing to p... off that Indystar moron...
Link Posted: 3/21/2006 4:34:48 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/21/2006 5:08:06 AM EDT by hoosierdaddy]
I just confirmed with Gov. Daniel's office that he will be signing both HB1028 and HB 1176 at 3:00 this afternoon.
Link Posted: 3/22/2006 2:17:47 AM EDT
It is confirmed. Gov. Daniels did sign both bills today.
Here is part of the e-mail I received from a friend.


I was able to be present for the signing of these 2 bills today. I must say I was impressed by what the Governor said. In a nut shell, he sounded very much like he is of a like mind as us on "the gun issue".

It was VERY nice to have Larry Pratt, of the Gun Owners of America fly in for the ceremony & to have dinner w/ several of us afterwards!
He is a very nice, down to earth fellow and meeting him only increased my respect for him and the organization!



They both go into effect on July 1 this year. Great job guys.
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