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Posted: 12/6/2005 6:35:00 AM EDT
If I follow all the lawful proceedures, is it possible to own a SBR in Massachusetts? I Looked through the NRA and GOAL.org pages with no definative answer.

TIA
Link Posted: 12/6/2005 11:30:23 AM EDT
Yes SBRs are legal in MA, assuming you can get your CLEO signoff.
Link Posted: 12/6/2005 1:26:54 PM EDT
Thanks for the info. Although my bank account is going to get lighter now...
Link Posted: 12/7/2005 5:40:30 PM EDT
Anybody have any input on going the Corp. route in MA for SBR's? Curious about cost and how difficult it is to start a corp. in MA.
Link Posted: 12/7/2005 7:45:34 PM EDT
I was going to go the Corporate route, but my CLEO signed the form 1

I believe a corporation is about $500 to start and $500 a year after with some additional fee

I wrote to the atf to see if you could have a corporation in one state but the SBR in another, I have not heard back
Link Posted: 12/8/2005 9:43:25 AM EDT
If you don't mind me asking, what town do you live in?
Link Posted: 12/11/2005 2:52:32 PM EDT
Why do we need a CLEO signature for the SBR?
Link Posted: 12/11/2005 3:40:23 PM EDT
Form 1 from the ATF, which is required to get approval for SBRs on a Federal level, has a requirement for approval from the CLEO.
Link Posted: 12/13/2005 12:57:32 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/13/2005 1:00:12 PM EDT by 95thFoot]

Originally Posted By Emoto:
Why do we need a CLEO signature for the SBR?



Not for the rifle itself, but for the license to own/buy one. (hi-cap A or B license)

ETA: also, if this mean "short-barreled rifle", same still applies, but now CLEO must sign off on so-called "Green Card" for class III items in MA. He can attach various conditions, such as burglar alarms, etc. No sound suppressors allowed in MA, though.
Link Posted: 12/13/2005 1:13:30 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/13/2005 1:15:06 PM EDT by supermoto88]

Originally Posted By 95thFoot:

Originally Posted By Emoto:
Why do we need a CLEO signature for the SBR?



Not for the rifle itself, but for the license to own/buy one. (hi-cap A or B license)

ETA: also, if this mean "short-barreled rifle", same still applies, but now CLEO must sign off on so-called "Green Card" for class III items in MA. He can attach various conditions, such as burglar alarms, etc. No sound suppressors allowed in MA, though.




Actually it is for the rifle itself, The form has the serial # on it and the approval is only good for that rifle.
The CLEO has to sign, unless you go the corporation route. The signature is for the ATF to show them that your CLEO has knowledge that you should be allowed to own a SBR

Now non of this means anthing unless you have your LTC A/B, FID

You do not need a green card for SBR, the only NFA items that requires them is a machine guns

and correct... no supressors
Link Posted: 12/16/2005 9:36:37 AM EDT

Originally Posted By supermoto88:

Originally Posted By 95thFoot:

Originally Posted By Emoto:
Why do we need a CLEO signature for the SBR?



Not for the rifle itself, but for the license to own/buy one. (hi-cap A or B license)

ETA: also, if this mean "short-barreled rifle", same still applies, but now CLEO must sign off on so-called "Green Card" for class III items in MA. He can attach various conditions, such as burglar alarms, etc. No sound suppressors allowed in MA, though.




Actually it is for the rifle itself, The form has the serial # on it and the approval is only good for that rifle.
The CLEO has to sign, unless you go the corporation route. The signature is for the ATF to show them that your CLEO has knowledge that you should be allowed to own a SBR

Now non of this means anthing unless you have your LTC A/B, FID

You do not need a green card for SBR, the only NFA items that requires them is a machine guns

and correct... no supressors



Sorry, I am still confused about this. I live in MA and have a Class A LTC (ALP). If this SBR is not full auto, why do I need CLEO for anything?
Link Posted: 12/16/2005 9:48:45 AM EDT
SBR are still classified as NFA (national firearms Act, machine guns SBR SBS, supressors etc) items and require federal approval. The federal approval form Form I requires CLEO signature

Some state prohibit all NFA items, Mass only prohibits supressors
Link Posted: 12/16/2005 3:52:31 PM EDT

Originally Posted By supermoto88:
SBR are still classified as NFA (national firearms Act, machine guns SBR SBS, supressors etc) items and require federal approval. The federal approval form Form I requires CLEO signature

Some state prohibit all NFA items, Mass only prohibits supressors



I am pretty sure MA prohibits: AOW, SBS, and Suppresors.
Link Posted: 12/17/2005 6:38:06 AM EDT
I haven't been able to find any laws that prohibit SBS AOW as long as the AOW looks like a firearms
Link Posted: 12/19/2005 8:03:42 AM EDT

Originally Posted By supermoto88:
I haven't been able to find any laws that prohibit SBS AOW as long as the AOW looks like a firearms


www.titleii.com/BardwellOLD/nfa_faq.txt

MA- Yes- Short Barrel Rifle, Machine Guns, large bore destructive device
No-sound suppressor (silencer),short shotgun,any other weapon,explosive, incendiary or poison gas destructive device
Link Posted: 12/19/2005 12:24:26 PM EDT
Good to know

Thanks
Link Posted: 12/20/2005 1:19:09 PM EDT
Ah, so it was the barrel length that did it. Thanks!
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 5:20:13 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/23/2005 6:00:02 AM EDT by CFFUTS23]
Ah...a lot of info above is wrong.

Short Barrel Rifles (SBRs), Any Other Weapon (AOWs) and Short Barrel Shotguns (SBS) are all legal in MA. Suppressors are not and I have no idea about explosives and incendiary devices.

A 'Green Card' is only necessary for a machine gun, nothing else. In fact, you could theoretcially just have a green card and own a machine gun but not have an FID or class A or B permit.

Similarily, you can own a SBR with only a class B license. For example, if you have a Ruger 10/22 and wanted to cut the barrel down to 10', it is legal in MA assuming you have class B or better (to own the rifle) and you get your CLEO to sign off on your Federal paperwork.

If you are requesting legal help over the web, understand that you will get a lot of poor, incorrect information. The idiots in the MA legislature have no idea and don't take the time to understand what an SBS, SBR or an AOW is or they probably would have banned it by now.

Also, keep in mind that States laws and Federal laws don't always make sense. You don't need a 'Green Card' for class 3 material, but rather only for Machine Guns, which happen to be a type of class 3 items. Then you have to jump through your CLEOs rules and assuming you get through all three hoops you get a new toy.

Finally, if you are serious about getting into class 3 weapons, then go talk to a dealer (I recommend these two - Waltham: Law Enforcement Equipment or Norton: We Are Guns) and ask them what you need to buy the AOW, SBR or Machine Gun you want. They dealers know the laws (they want the sale) and then you schedule a meeting with your CLEO to let them know you are interested in a purchase and that the dealer has walked you through the State laws. Then you ask if the CLEO will confirm with his signature that it is legal to own the type of weapon in question in his jurisdiction and wait to see if the CLEO has any particular rules (must have a safe, alarm, etc.) but don't bring this part up - let the CLEO tell you. Then schedule a follow-up with your paperwork and proof of complicance with the chief's regulations.

When I first got into class 3 toys, I spoke with Richard at We Are Guns about buying a Mossberg AOW - got my facts straight and setup a meeting with my CLEO. After my meeting with my CLEO and learning that he would sign b/c I'm a responsible person, I came back with the proper paperwork for an SBR, an AOW and a Green Card application. He signed all three, but I later had to get my C&R license from the Feds to complete the Green Card application. My MA state examiner rejected my Green Card application since my examiner didn't consider me a valid "collector" because I didn't have a Federal C&R license. A C&R is very easy to get - you send in the Fed paperwork and it comes back with 20 lbs of books in about 2 months. Once I gave the examiner my C&R license number, I was sent my Green Card. By the way, my Green Card says "For All Lawful Purposes", but that is another story.

Yes, my CLEO was good to work with, but if you believe everything you read on the web you wouldn't think you had a chance in hell of getting any - much less three signatures on class 3 toys in MA. I've since moved to NH, but the moral of the story is talk to people who have completed the transaction - not the people who are "pretty sure MA prohibits"

Good luck and spread the word so more people buy class 3 toys before the legislature bans them!
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