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Posted: 2/1/2006 7:21:09 AM EDT
The paper says only 14% of the 147,000 registered voters turned out for this election. Not good for the pro-gun scene.
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 10:15:36 AM EDT
What else do you expect when no one will volunteer and help out? We'll reap what we've sown. Herring is as anti as they come. Maybe if this keeps up though, once we look like NY or California, maybe then some of the lazy assed gun owners will get off their asses and actually do something besides talk BS.

Mike
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 11:05:56 AM EDT
Yeah. Less than 6% of registered voters in district 33 voted for Staton. Don't say it's because Loudon is turning liberal. If as much as a measly 9% voted for Staton, we'd have another staunch defender of our rights in the Senate.
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 12:04:09 PM EDT
What...... I voted for PVC!h=85%

...once we look like NY or California, maybe then some of the lazy assed gun owners will get off their asses and actually do something besides talk BS.



More likely... 'look more like Maryland.'
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 12:44:14 PM EDT

Originally Posted By 3DVR_M4:
What...... I voted for PVC! h=85%

...once we look like NY or California, maybe then some of the lazy assed gun owners will get off their asses and actually do something besides talk BS.


More likely... 'look more like Maryland.' hr


I don't think anyone's principaled stand against Kilgore who openly attacked PVC and ran away from all the core issues is equivalent to standing by and doing nothing as a good - solid candidate falls to a measley 8.4% turnout for Herring. Don't blame HardRock's PVC vote for your new Senator Herring. The only valid excuse for not helping when HardRock asked is that it was so...incredibly winable. A measly 9% would have you saying Senator Staton instead.
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 12:55:49 PM EDT

Originally Posted By dutch_1:
...equivalent



Equivalent?

I never said they were.

Momentum however, in politics, is a bitch, and principles are like opinions which are like…
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 1:22:29 PM EDT
From the wires:

"Democrat Mark R. Herring, a lawyer and former Loudoun County supervisor, was elected to the state Senate yesterday after a campaign that spoke to the frustration of many residents over unchecked growth and traffic.

Herring, 44, defeated Supervisor Mick Staton Jr. (R-Sugarland Run) with 62 percent of the vote to his opponent's 38 percent, according to unofficial results from the 33rd Senate District, which encompasses most Loudoun precincts and a sliver of western Fairfax."

We should all be ashamed. But most especially - those who live in Fairfax and in Loudon and DID NOT BOTHER TO VOTE

Link Posted: 2/1/2006 1:37:04 PM EDT
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 1:50:50 PM EDT

Originally Posted By CBR900:
From the wires:

"Democrat Mark R. Herring, a lawyer and former Loudoun County supervisor, was elected to the state Senate yesterday after a campaign that spoke to the frustration of many residents over unchecked growth and traffic.

Herring, 44, defeated Supervisor Mick Staton Jr. (R-Sugarland Run) with 62 percent of the vote to his opponent's 38 percent, according to unofficial results from the 33rd Senate District, which encompasses most Loudoun precincts and a sliver of western Fairfax."

We should all be ashamed. But most especially - those who live in Fairfax and in Loudon and DID NOT BOTHER TO VOTE




Pointing fingers at ar15.com member's for not volunteering at the polling place does no good. The real reason we lost him is a 14% voter turnout. No amount of volunteering would have made up for that
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 4:53:23 PM EDT
Actually it was 5.2 voters for Staton. The other 8.4 were Herrings. There was very little time to get things organized but some tried. Otheres did not try. HardRock & Bubbles weren't the only ones calling out for help. VCDL called out for volunteers, VGOC called out for volunteers, GOA called out for volunteers, Ken Cuccinelli called out for volunteers. All Staton needed was to get 9% of the registered voters to vote. Some people tried to help. Others did not try.
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 5:14:27 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Hard Rock:
What else do you expect when no one will volunteer and help out? We'll reap what we've sown. Herring is as anti as they come. Maybe if this keeps up though, once we look like NY or California, maybe then some of the lazy assed gun owners will get off their asses and actually do something besides talk BS.

Mike



Wow....that was a little "in your face". Just out of curiousity, how does more volunteers translate into more voters? I would seriously consider volunteering if I understood the correlation. I think for these types of elections, the politicians have done a very poor job demonstrating how the positions they hold relate to the lives of the 20 and 30 somethings that make up such a large portion of this district. I can tell you from the Republican special election between Minchew and Staton, my wife and I were probably the youngest people in that administration building by probably 20 years.
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 5:43:10 PM EDT
Don't live in the district but liberal media played Stanton as pro-development and Herring as anti-growth. Also looked like Herring rasied a lot more money compared to Stanton.

The growth issue is probably the key factor - people move to outer burbs and then get sick of lack of roads. Kaine also portrayed himself as anti-growth. Funny thing thing is that is now the Dems in Fairfax are pushing for high densisty development.

Gunowners can make a difference an election but not enough to make a difference in every election. That District had Senator Waddell (sic?) a Dem before Mims got into office and he voted pretty good on guns in general.
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 6:31:06 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/1/2006 6:33:16 PM EDT by CBR900]
Fiend has a point; my message above was only 1/2 complete; to those who turned out to vote, and especially to those whowent above and beyond, THANK YOU!

Please know that you did your best, we appreciate your efforts, and though we lost this battle, free democracy won & the war to preserve our rights goes on. CBR
Link Posted: 2/2/2006 3:52:18 AM EDT

Originally Posted By kcobean:
Just out of curiousity, how does more volunteers translate into more voters? I would seriously consider volunteering if I understood the correlation.



More volunteers = higher voter turnout at the polls through phone calls, lit drops, stuffing envelopes, etc.

I made hundreds of phone calls to Republican (and a few Democrat, b/c they vote for RINO's in GOP primaries) for Staton prior to both the primary & special election. Many of the people I reached DID NOT KNOW even last weekend that there was a special election being held this past Tuesday.

Was growth an issue in this election? Yup. Can Herring do anything about it as a freshman Senator? Nope. Of course, he wasn't going to tell the voters that...
Link Posted: 2/2/2006 5:05:56 AM EDT
Here is my problem with gun owners, and it's not just here on AR15.com but in general. Most of the gun owners here and on other boards talk big talk about how they are going to resist if .gov tries to take their guns. If these same gun owners can't even do something so simple as work for a campaign and help at the polls, then they sure as hell aren't going to lift a finger to defend their rights if the fight gets violent. In other words, they are full of hot air.

There are five, yes, FIVE people that stepped forward in the November election and only a couple that stepped forward this time. This is out of over 70 AR15.com members that are local to the area.

For those who stepped forward, they are the ones I know I can count on if the SHTF, for the others, I just can't count them as reliable.

I'm sorry if my posts offend some but all of you know that I'm right. The anti's have got gun owners pegged and I'm tired of carrying the burden alone. The VCDL PAC sent out an email on my behalf regarding the election with my phone number begging for help. Wanna know how many people stood up and answered that call?

NOT ONE.

All I have to say is that you all who bitch and whine about our rights and will most likely really complain and freak out once Herring gets his steam up, don't say a damned word to me about it. We should have had this election in the bag but due to the pathetic apathy of the gun owning community, we now have a man in the state Senate who proclaimed that he wanted concealed carry repealed completely. Now we have another person to fight against in Richmond.

For Bubbles, LRT, Hank Readen, Dutch... I thank you for all you did. You stepped forward for all gun owners in the state. We tried and failed but I cannot say enough that you all are true warriors and friends willing to do what is right. I hold you in the highest regard and I have the deepest respect for you.

Something to think about... How many people are in the US? Now, out of that number, how many are over the age of 18 and able to vote? With that number in mind, how many gun owners are in the US? Look the numbers up. You'll find that gun owners are the largest voting block by far. Why then are we floundering so badly?

At this point in time, I'm tired. I no longer have the desire to keep fighting... especially when most others can't be bothered with helping out. I hope that some here wake up before it's too late but I won't hold my breath. Maybe one of you will step forward and fill the spot I'm leaving. Maybe not... we'll see. I'll help on occasion if the cause is great enough to catch my interest but I'm no longer going to fight every battle. After I snapped at my 7 month old daughter for being noisy (playing) a few weeks ago, I decided that this would be the last time I'd do this. I was wrong for snapping at her and if I have to fight alone, I'm not going to do it at the cost of my family.

To say that I'm disappointed in gun owners in Va is quite an understatement. I get asked by many to help fix their guns which for the most part, I do for free. I've given my heart and soul for gun rights here... but no more. If you haven't helped with the politics, don't ask me to fix your guns. I'm not going to do it.

Mike
Link Posted: 2/2/2006 5:08:59 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/2/2006 5:10:51 AM EDT by chapperjoe]
this was not an election I could have voted in right? I heard nothing about this at all.....

That turnout number is pathetic, but volunteers don't tend to increase turnout, they tend to sway the undecideds.

I'd love to see turnout figures based on age, occupation, religion, race, etc.....


ETA:


Something to think about... How many people are in the US? Now, out of that number, how many are over the age of 18 and able to vote? With that number in mind, how many gun owners are in the US? Look the numbers up. You'll find that gun owners are the largest voting block by far. Why then are we floundering so badly?



numbers indicate 45-65% of american households have guns in them. lets say thats 100,000,000 gun owners over the age of 18. there are 4,000,000 NRA members. go figure.
Link Posted: 2/2/2006 5:55:03 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Hard Rock:
Here is my problem with gun owners, and it's not just here on AR15.com but in general. Most of the gun owners here and on other boards talk big talk about how they are going to resist if .gov tries to take their guns. ...



.gov is not going to need to take my guns. I'll need to sell them all to pay my property taxes which have almost doubled in the past 5 years.

Gov. Tim Kaine proposed a 4 Million tax increase 6 days after being sworn in. But hay, we still have the Republican State Congress!!!



What?!?
You mean now we are losing that now too?
Link Posted: 2/2/2006 5:56:02 AM EDT
To those who do not see how “volunteers translate into more voters” and would “seriously consider volunteering if understood the correlation”, the campaign asked you to volunteer, VCDL asked you, VGOC and GOA asked you. If you were on Cuccinelli’s mail list he asked you. The list goes on. Apparently some people see an obvious correlation. Yep. Everyone who’s committed to working sees the correlation and those who refuse to step up … cant see it. That’s ok, about 85% of the people in district 33 don’t see the correlation between voting and better government. So you’re in good company. That doesn't make the "I would if only you could convince me" cover story any less pathetic.

HardRock. You are not alone in your incredulity. Here’s what the VCDL sent out yesterday:

In the 33rd Senate race on Tuesday, the VCDL-PAC endorsed Mick Staton
LOST to MMM supporter, Mark Herring. The turnout was extremely low
and I'm sorry to say that gun owners did not do their part in that
election.

Mark Herring did not turn in a VCDL survey, but will soon see how he
views are right to keep and bear arms.

We MUST clean up the Senate and gun owners not turning out to vote
isn't going to get the job done. In less than two years we will have
the opportunity to re-elect Senators, let's not blow it. Remember:
every bad Senator that gets elected we are stuck with for FOUR YEARS.
Link Posted: 2/2/2006 6:03:36 AM EDT
I did not receive ANY request from ANYONE or organization to volunteer. I have lots of free time and probably would have done respondedif I had received a message from the vcdl about this. Having said that, volunteers affecting turnout is a very weak correlation.

Link Posted: 2/2/2006 6:28:40 AM EDT

Originally Posted By chapperjoe:
I did not receive ANY request from ANYONE or organization to volunteer. I have lots of free time and probably would have done respondedif I had received a message from the vcdl about this. Having said that, volunteers affecting turnout is a very weak correlation.




I guess you and I both missed this request for HELP from Hard Rock. Linky

I'm guilty, and since I wasn't part of the solution I'm part of the problem. But I think, we can all put the BS aside and say some people are willing to stand up and take action for what is a good cause like Hard Rock, Bubbles, and others, Etc Etc..while others will just make excuses why they couldn't help and hope everything turns out in their favor.

So, to turn a bad situation into good, lets move on and say "I learned a lesson and will pledge to help out the next time my rights, values, or way of life is threatend."

I confess, I didn't do my part in 2005, even though I was out of work for an extended period of time with a serious illness, I could have done more. I'll measure myself as a person in 2006 by my contribution to preserving what I believe in and I challenge those like me that didn't do their part in 2005 to pitch in this year.

Hard Rock, call me at 804-986-7409 if you need help, while travel up to NOVA is not an option during the week, I'll make calls or do whatever I can from Richmond.


Steve
Hallmark Small Arms
804-986-7409

Link Posted: 2/2/2006 6:34:20 AM EDT
Volunteers have a GREAT impact on turnout. Here's why...

1. Volunteers get the word out. Door to door, phone calls, meet and greets, etc.

2. Volunteers put a presence for the candidate in the community. Putting up signs and doing lit drops show people that the candidate has a lot of support which encourages more support.

3. Volunteers broaden the candidate's message over a much wider area.

4. Volunteers help the candidate by allowing the candidate to use his or her time more wisely to do media events, promotional stuff and solidifying his or her message while the volunteers do other things that would otherwise distract the candidate.

5. Volunteers represent the various interests to the candidate which strengthens the candidate's message and shore's up the base.

Without volunteers, no message gets sent out. No encouragement happens to get people to the polls, and the perception is that the candidate is weak. Trust me, volunteers help. I've been doing this for a long time and I have seen the impact of volunteers first hand.

And as for requests for help...

I posted two requests on this board for volunteer help. I got very little in response at all... but lots of people looked at the request. VCDL sent out several emails including one that had my name and phone number on it asking for help. I received zero calls from that. I made about 200 calls for volunteers (sorry I didn't call everyone on my list, I am only one person afterall... another point where volunteers are critical).

Virginia is one step closer to losing RKBA now. Excuses aren't going to fix the problem only action is. I sincerely hope that some of you step up to the plate to help reverse this trend before it's too late.

One other thing... several of my volunteers, including at least two here were not elegible to vote in this election due to where they live. Yet, they realized just how important this race was and they drove, some drove long distances, to help us out.

Dutch stood out in the rain, cold and bitter wind ALL DAY at one poll on Tuesday and did so without complaint. Dutch, please share how long of a drive you had to make to suffer that way... Dutch is someone that ALL of us should look up to. He went out of his way to make sure that we had representation at the polls even though this wasn't a race in his district. He is a role model that we should strive to be half as dedicated.

Other volunteers couldn't work the polls but they made calls, helped put out campaign signs, and even confronted the opponents volunteers who were tearing up our signs. Hell, one of my volunteers was in a bad car accident a week ago, he's on bed rest by doctors orders yet, he wanted to come out and stand at a poll all day. He's one of the very few that had a legitimate excuse and yet, he still wanted to help out.

Yet, one person told me he couldn't help out because his wife wanted him to stay home one evening to watch a TV show with her...

Freaking sad.

Mike

Link Posted: 2/2/2006 6:41:41 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Hallmark_Ent:

Originally Posted By chapperjoe:
I did not receive ANY request from ANYONE or organization to volunteer. I have lots of free time and probably would have done respondedif I had received a message from the vcdl about this. Having said that, volunteers affecting turnout is a very weak correlation.




I guess you and I both missed this request for HELP from Hard Rock. Linky




I think iff that was tacked it might have received more (at least my) attention.....
Link Posted: 2/2/2006 8:13:31 AM EDT
No I don’t want to say how far I traveled, how hard it was or how it impacted my family life. Hey, I’m not a hard core shooter like most of you guys. I don’t have a carry permit, calss 3 weapon or an assault rifle to protect. I’m not in danger of losing access to the little tiny indoor range I occasionally shoot at. I’m really pretty comfortable with the level of 2nd amendment freedom I have right now. However, I am a citizen and have a responsibility to protect the rights that others have died to give me. Anyone who cares knows that there is an organized, aggressive and well funded movement to eliminate our 2nd amendment rights. Loss of those rights is not going to happen over night it will take place incrementally. It is underway now. We can either be the ones who resist this attack on our rights and possibly on our children’s freedom; or we can cross our legs and expect that we will be taken care of by someone else. If you’re reading this you’re on the internet and you have e-mail. If that’s true you should be getting the VCDL newsletter. It’s free and you don’t have to be a member to get it. You can get on GOA’s action alert mailing list without being a member too. That said, if you really care you’ll read those notices, in search of how you can help. Or you won’t read those notices and you’ll cross your legs and expect that if there is merit to the cause someone will come directly to you and explain in explicit terms why you are justified in being led by the nose to perform some carefully choreographed task that is convenient and fun. Like I said in the beginning, I’m not a hard core shooter, I lurk here mainly to learn and be entertained by what you guys post. But as someone who is pretty much an outsider, I can assure you that there were many requests for help on this board that didn’t even merit a “well good luck with that” response. As a VCDL, VGOC and GOA member I can assure you that there was numerous requests to help out on this one. This was a golden opportunity to get a pro-gun senator in there. We all know that special elections get little participation from the voters. This is why this one in particular was custom made for US. When the dust settled all we needed was 9% of the voters. It would be nice if we didn’t have to participate in politics. We all have better things to do. But living in a representative republic is a contact sport. You either get involved or you allow yourself to be owned by someone.
Link Posted: 2/2/2006 8:41:32 AM EDT

Originally Posted By chapperjoe:
this was not an election I could have voted in right? I heard nothing about this at all.....

That turnout number is pathetic, but volunteers don't tend to increase turnout, they tend to sway the undecideds.


no shit! the first inkling i had was after the election was over and it was on the 11:00 news!

hope the lib north isn't an indication of things to come for prince william county! course, jeff frederick won by a sliver to the sacrificial goat, hilda "where am i?" barg...he might not be so lucky if his next opponent is conscious more than 10% of the time.
Link Posted: 2/2/2006 10:02:06 AM EDT
One more thing I forgot to say: If you're doing your part...I thank you. Back to lurk mode.
Link Posted: 2/2/2006 5:44:02 PM EDT
Alright, while I'm almost sorry that I started this thread just so I could take an ass-reaming from a few people who insist that if you don't volunteer, you're as worthless to the cause as the people who didn't even take time to vote, I guess the fact that your posts piss me off means there is some truth in what you say. SO, next time there is a call to action in my area, if it is within my means I will step up. The same argument of "every vote counts" (which I believe) defeats my internal argument that me volunteering wouldn't make a difference. I'm ex-Army and I've defended the rights we have, I guess I need to keep doing so, just without the uniform.
Archived [ARCHIVED THREAD] - Mick Staton loses District 33 Senate seat to anti-gun Herring :(
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