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Posted: 2/22/2006 8:52:32 AM EDT
Just got my first AR and i would like to start building some other guns. If u go through the right paper work can i build a SBR and a AOW. So if it is legal has anyone tried to get a CLEO signature...is it even worth trying?

Thanks
Link Posted: 2/22/2006 9:00:39 AM EDT
AOW you are OK. No SBRs in Wa
Link Posted: 2/22/2006 9:06:56 AM EDT
huh so i can have a 10inched barreled shot gun but not a SBR...makes alot of sense.

thanks

I wonder if the CLEO in Bellingham is a cool guy?
Link Posted: 2/22/2006 10:11:24 AM EDT

Originally Posted By creedlemyerjones:
huh so i can have a 10inched barreled shot gun but not a SBR...makes alot of sense.

thanks

I wonder if the CLEO in Bellingham is a cool guy?



Your in a liberal college town where the chicks have hair under their arm pits, and the guys shave their legs.

Good luck to ya.
Link Posted: 2/22/2006 10:12:39 AM EDT

Originally Posted By R-32:

Originally Posted By creedlemyerjones:
huh so i can have a 10inched barreled shot gun but not a SBR...makes alot of sense.

thanks

I wonder if the CLEO in Bellingham is a cool guy?



Your in a liberal college town where the chicks have hair under their arm pits, and the guys shave their legs.

Good luck to ya.



Link Posted: 2/22/2006 10:16:15 AM EDT


Be sure to try the Gardenburger!



Link Posted: 2/22/2006 11:08:29 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/22/2006 11:08:52 AM EDT by Scollins]

Originally Posted By creedlemyerjones:
huh so i can have a 10inched barreled shot gun but not a SBR...makes alot of sense.



You can't have that either if it has a buttstock (or made from a shotgun that EVER had a buttstock.) If it is just a pistol-gripped shotgun with a 10" barrel, then it is an AOW, and possession is legal (all NFA rules apply.) Short barreled shotguns are a no-no in WA, just like SBRs.
Link Posted: 2/22/2006 11:25:37 AM EDT

Originally Posted By creedlemyerjones:
huh so i can have a 10inched barreled shot gun but not a SBR...makes alot of sense.





This is Washington, logic really doesn't apply, at least on this side of the mountains.

Link Posted: 2/22/2006 12:35:08 PM EDT
wow so i can even have a shorter shot gun. Yeah they really thought these things out. well i was hoping for better news.

Thanks fo the help!
Link Posted: 2/22/2006 2:56:33 PM EDT

Originally Posted By creedlemyerjones:
wow so i can even have a shorter shot gun. Yeah they really thought these things out. well i was hoping for better news.

Thanks fo the help!



No, you can't have an even shorter shotgun. It may seem like semantics, or nuances, but it's actually a critical point to understand.

SBR= not legal in WA
SBS= not legal in WA
AOW= legal in WA



RCW 9.41.010
Terms defined.

(5) "Shotgun" means a weapon with one or more barrels, designed or redesigned, made or remade, and intended to be fired from the shoulder and designed or redesigned, made or remade, and intended to use the energy of the explosive in a fixed shotgun shell to fire through a smooth bore either a number of ball shot or a single projectile for each single pull of the trigger.

(6) "Short-barreled shotgun" means a shotgun having one or more barrels less than eighteen inches in length and any weapon made from a shotgun by any means of modification if such modified weapon has an overall length of less than twenty-six inches.



An AOW fits neither of these and all though it may fire the same round as a shotgun does by definition it's not a shotgun nor a SBS and because it's not a SBS it's legal in WA.



Link Posted: 2/22/2006 3:04:49 PM EDT
Yeah if i was a law maker dude i think i might be just a little more concerned about the AOW than the SBS.
Link Posted: 2/22/2006 3:22:24 PM EDT

Originally Posted By creedlemyerjones:
Yeah if i was a law maker dude i think i might be just a little more concerned about the AOW than the SBS.




Against my better judgement...

Why?

AOW covers a large variety of firearms, not just stockless short barreled firearms that fire a fixed shotgun shell.

I'll post from the USC as it gives a defininition of AOW to work from.


TITLE 26 > Subtitle E > CHAPTER 53 > Subchapter B > PART I > § 5845 Prev | Next

§ 5845. Definitions
Release date: 2005-08-31

For the purpose of this chapter—
(a) Firearm
The term “firearm” means
(1) a shotgun having a barrel or barrels of less than 18 inches in length;
(2) a weapon made from a shotgun if such weapon as modified has an overall length of less than 26 inches or a barrel or barrels of less than 18 inches in length;
(3) a rifle having a barrel or barrels of less than 16 inches in length;
(4) a weapon made from a rifle if such weapon as modified has an overall length of less than 26 inches or a barrel or barrels of less than 16 inches in length;
(5) any other weapon, as defined in subsection (e);
(6) a machinegun;
(7) any silencer (as defined in section 921 of title 18, United States Code); and
(8) a destructive device. The term “firearm” shall not include an antique firearm or any device (other than a machinegun or destructive device) which, although designed as a weapon, the Secretary finds by reason of the date of its manufacture, value, design, and other characteristics is primarily a collector’s item and is not likely to be used as a weapon.
(b) Machinegun
The term “machinegun” means any weapon which shoots, is designed to shoot, or can be readily restored to shoot, automatically more than one shot, without manual reloading, by a single function of the trigger. The term shall also include the frame or receiver of any such weapon, any part designed and intended solely and exclusively, or combination of parts designed and intended, for use in converting a weapon into a machinegun, and any combination of parts from which a machinegun can be assembled if such parts are in the possession or under the control of a person.

(c) Rifle
The term “rifle” means a weapon designed or redesigned, made or remade, and intended to be fired from the shoulder and designed or redesigned and made or remade to use the energy of the explosive in a fixed cartridge to fire only a single projectile through a rifled bore for each single pull of the trigger, and shall include any such weapon which may be readily restored to fire a fixed cartridge.

(d) Shotgun
The term “shotgun” means a weapon designed or redesigned, made or remade, and intended to be fired from the shoulder and designed or redesigned and made or remade to use the energy of the explosive in a fixed shotgun shell to fire through a smooth bore either a number of projectiles (ball shot) or a single projectile for each pull of the trigger, and shall include any such weapon which may be readily restored to fire a fixed shotgun shell.

(e) Any other weapon
The term “any other weapon” means any weapon or device capable of being concealed on the person from which a shot can be discharged through the energy of an explosive, a pistol or revolver having a barrel with a smooth bore designed or redesigned to fire a fixed shotgun shell, weapons with combination shotgun and rifle barrels 12 inches or more, less than 18 inches in length, from which only a single discharge can be made from either barrel without manual reloading, and shall include any such weapon which may be readily restored to fire. Such term shall not include a pistol or a revolver having a rifled bore, or rifled bores, or weapons designed, made, or intended to be fired from the shoulder and not capable of firing fixed ammunition.

Link Posted: 2/22/2006 3:37:00 PM EDT
the reason why i say that is becasue a AOW can be easly concealed. U know i am new to all this but do see where i am coming from?
Link Posted: 2/22/2006 3:51:20 PM EDT
You are now approaching the troll-light zone.....
Link Posted: 2/22/2006 3:53:16 PM EDT

Originally Posted By KA3B:
You are now approaching the troll-light zone.....



Link Posted: 2/22/2006 3:55:35 PM EDT

Originally Posted By creedlemyerjones:
the reason why i say that is becasue a AOW can be easly concealed. U know i am new to all this but do see where i am coming from?



I see where you're coming from but you seem to have tunnel vision on just one particular AOW, that's why I've posted the information that should help you understand the AOW concept.

Not all AOWs are stockless short barreled firearms that fire a fixed shotgun shell.

This is an AOW


The BATFE says that a wallet holster, in conjunction with a firearm for it, if you can fire the handgun, without removing from the holster and the holster disguises the look is an AOW.

The process for buying an AOW is the same as for buying a SBS, SBR, Supressor, or Full Auto, where they are legal of course.

Criminals don't submit an application form with their photograph, a fingerprint card, and a check for the transfer tax ($5 for an AOW $200 for everything else) and wait for months while the background check is processed before they can take possesion of their item.

Link Posted: 2/22/2006 4:05:28 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Phil_in_Seattle:
Criminals don't submit an application form with their photograph, a fingerprint card, and a check for the transfer tax ($5 for an AOW $200 for everything else) and wait for months while the background check is processed before they can take possesion of their item.



[libtard] They don't? We need to pass a law that requires criminals to submit an application form with their photograph, a fingerprint card, and a check for the transfer tax and wait for months while the background check is processed before they can take possesion of their item. [/libtard]
Link Posted: 2/22/2006 4:09:27 PM EDT
well i appreciate your guys help.
thanks
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