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Posted: 12/13/2005 6:57:51 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/14/2005 8:49:32 PM EDT by voilsb]
Tomorrow's Today is the stick-day for my CLS class. I get to stick someone with an IV. I also get to be someone's test-boy for their first stick.

Yippee!


Video Here
Link Posted: 12/13/2005 7:00:12 PM EDT
Damn, look what I miss out on by joining the Navy & the Air National Guard.

Don't forget to bring your CLS bag to future LCRs!
Link Posted: 12/13/2005 7:02:06 PM EDT
My first CLS course was in Korea.... I didn't have a battle buddy for "stick day"....Neither did the Katusa that didn't speak any english.....we didn't have a translator for the class....that was a bad day.
Link Posted: 12/13/2005 7:08:38 PM EDT
My cousin and his wife are in the same unit in the AF, they just went through the CLS class at Ft Lewis and got to stick eachother.
Link Posted: 12/13/2005 7:21:53 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/13/2005 8:10:17 PM EDT by tweeter]

Originally Posted By PCR-00:
My first CLS course was in Korea.... I didn't have a battle buddy for "stick day"....Neither did the Katusa that didn't speak any english.....we didn't have a translator for the class....that was a bad day.



hey PCR, didn't we have this conversation already? "Hey, I've got an idea... since we're all from the same unit, let's mix everybody up!"


CLS? try IRL with NODS and none of the folks getting stuck "speak the American too good".

13 sticks while wearing NODS with only two collapsed veins in about 45 minutes. Yeeha.
i kept having visions of catching Hep A from some damn dirty Kurd from sticking him and then myself accidentally.


GOOD LUCK DUDE
Link Posted: 12/13/2005 7:37:59 PM EDT
I used to teach the Combat Lifetaker class....

Good luck, and when you get your bag...Dont do anything stupid.
Link Posted: 12/13/2005 8:06:38 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/13/2005 8:07:06 PM EDT by WRF]
I was in Swedish hospital ONCE and the vampire came to poke me, the vacuum broke the Dude panicked threw a pillow over it and ran off, leaving me to bleed I pulled the needle out and rang the nurse. The nurse apologized and said it was his first day. I wouldn't let him touch me again.
Link Posted: 12/13/2005 8:16:26 PM EDT
This is like the sixth CLS class I've been signed up for, but the first one I've ever actually gone to.

Tomorrow will be an interesting day, for everyone. I promise there will be video
Link Posted: 12/13/2005 8:22:44 PM EDT

Originally Posted By voilsb:

I promise there will be video



Just remmember you are with Soldiers, doing Medical procedures...

Dont break any HEPA law's, or violate any Privacy issues...

Link Posted: 12/13/2005 8:30:12 PM EDT
And now you get to find out who's squeamish at the sight of blood. You'd be surprised--

When I was doing my clinicals for the Medical Central Service course ten years ago, part of the "final" was to do standby sterilizer detail in an OR during an open-heart. (Actually a coronary arterial bypass graft.) If you didn't keel over, you passed. My class passed about 43%. (I passed, by the way.)
Link Posted: 12/13/2005 8:32:23 PM EDT
Needles make me squeemish, but I had to give my horse anti-biotic injections for two weeks. I just dealt with it.
Link Posted: 12/13/2005 8:49:25 PM EDT

Originally Posted By R-32:

Originally Posted By voilsb:

I promise there will be video



Just remmember you are with Soldiers, doing Medical procedures...

Dont break any HEPA law's, or violate any Privacy issues...


What's a HEPA law? And who cares about privacy. I won't break OPSEC, though (not like it's a concern, here).
Link Posted: 12/13/2005 8:52:11 PM EDT
HIPAA is a lame-ass set of federal regulations pertaining to health information. I'm pretty sure that it doesn't apply to CLSers. Just make sure you don't include any personally identifiable information.
Link Posted: 12/13/2005 8:54:20 PM EDT
As long as you're not dragging each other around on a leash, getting in naked pyramids or smoking cigarettes whilst pointing at your battle buddy's genitalia, in said video, you should be OK.
Link Posted: 12/13/2005 9:05:38 PM EDT

Originally Posted By JS98010:
As long as you're not dragging each other around on a leash, getting in naked pyramids or smoking cigarettes whilst pointing at your battle buddy's genitalia, in said video, you should be OK.

Link Posted: 12/13/2005 9:08:38 PM EDT
Oh, and be thankful that the CLS course doesn't cover administration of Foley catheters.



It doesn't cover that, right?
Link Posted: 12/13/2005 11:27:48 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/14/2005 12:15:55 AM EDT by R-32]

Originally Posted By JS98010:
Oh, and be thankful that the CLS course doesn't cover administration of Foley catheters.



It doesn't cover that, right?



No...

The CLS course is nothing more than a advanced First-Aid class with I.V. thrown in.

It is a good class and I think anyone that is E-4 up or in any leadership position should have the option to take it. (if they want to, because I as a former Medic did not want anyone that was a little Blood Shy around me when time is ticking, and the patient may not be.)

Prob's that used to come up...

Monday morning PT formations came pretty early, and Soldiers after a hard weekend of drinking would start going to the Combat lifetaker of the plt and ask for I.V.'s, We also had the Moron's that did try to do the I.V. beer bongs...( That can kill you dead!).

SARS If you dont know what the hell you are talking about....(HIPPA and HEPA are two different Worlds)...You can figure it out.

Voils Just remmember "Infection Control, and Universal Procautions" "If it is wet and not yours...Dont touch it without protection!..(That will cover HEPA/BSI for your hands on testing, and written testing.)

As for "Privacy" .... Remmember that very first page in your Medical Jacket? It is a copy of the Privacy Act, You signed it! and Medical has to follow it! Any Info you pass on to a MEDIC or higher ref your patients condition is subject to it. Anything more than Known conditions...like Blood type, and what the patient is allergic to is not for anyone's info other than the Medical persons and the Soldier. (example... You are doing a head to toe on a soldier, and find out he only has one nut,,Dont go down the road and tell the guys in the plt later on after you had a couple of drinks, Or say for some strange reason you get to look at a medical jacket of a soldier and find out he has had some sort of STD...You cant tell anyone other than the Medical people that need to know it.)

The reason I bring this up, At North Fort I did a CLS class. We did have Video of the I.V. sticks, and a soldier did throw a stink...It turned out to be a big mess...If they dont want it on video, Dont do it!. (Im not saying you would have in the first place, We all know that Soldier are HAM's and love to joke around, but there are a few that are looking for a excuse, or like to be pro vict's)


Now, Put in for Ft Sam, and get it over with!
Link Posted: 12/13/2005 11:32:32 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/14/2005 12:04:00 AM EDT by Scollins]

Originally Posted By Ductapeman:
And now you get to find out who's squeamish at the sight of blood. You'd be surprised--

When I was doing my clinicals for the Medical Central Service course ten years ago, part of the "final" was to do standby sterilizer detail in an OR during an open-heart. (Actually a coronary arterial bypass graft.) If you didn't keel over, you passed. My class passed about 43%. (I passed, by the way.)



When my wife had our second daughter a few weeks ago, the anesthesiologist was like "don't watch, I don't want you to faint" when he was putting in her epidural (long ass needle that goes into your back!") I was like, "Yo beoootch, I'm not phased by blood or needles." So I made it a point to watch as he did it. Fucker.

I don't get bothered by blood or needles. Giving blood is usually a good indicator. Either you can or you can't. I typically watch when they put the needles in too.

I've always thought a crash EMT course would be rather handy knowledge to have for TEOTWAWKI/SHTF/BBQ....
Link Posted: 12/13/2005 11:47:34 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Scollins:

I've always thought a crash EMT course would be rather handy knowledge to have for TEOTWAKI/SHTF/BBQ....



Vol Fire dept, or Search and Rescue Team can hook you up with FR/EMT class, If you have a dept in your area that gives out the CERT class's you can get a pretty good First aid/CPR cert out of it.

I have been doing EMS in one form or another since I was 17, Started out with the First-Aid, First Responder, EMT, Military Medic, NREMT, Cal State EMT, Texas EMT,and WA State EMT.

It was fun at first, Now it is just something I do, but I am glad that I have the skill's.


Link Posted: 12/14/2005 5:45:32 AM EDT
Let us know how it goes. Our ODA did some pre-mission training before Sage. A few guys ended up with some pretty brusied arms from multiple attempted sticks :) I got mine on the 2nd try. Didn't go deep enough onthe first one. The vein was being deceptive
Link Posted: 12/14/2005 6:47:35 AM EDT

Originally Posted By tweeter:

Originally Posted By PCR-00:
My first CLS course was in Korea.... I didn't have a battle buddy for "stick day"....Neither did the Katusa that didn't speak any english.....we didn't have a translator for the class....that was a bad day.



hey PCR, didn't we have this conversation already? "Hey, I've got an idea... since we're all from the same unit, let's mix everybody up!"




Luckilly thats how it turned out....but that was at the END of the class...I was sweating for the first half. "Sheezus, this guy has NO idea what he's hearing or saying...and he's gonna put a needle in my arm"
Link Posted: 12/14/2005 7:08:03 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/14/2005 7:13:23 AM EDT by voilsb]

Originally Posted By JS98010:
Oh, and be thankful that the CLS course doesn't cover administration of Foley catheters.

It doesn't cover that, right?

I've never heard of it, so it's probably not covered. Learn me some?


Originally Posted By R-32:
The CLS course is nothing more than a advanced First-Aid class with I.V. thrown in.


It's nothing more than basic first-aid with an IV thrown in.


Voils Just remmember "Infection Control, and Universal Procautions" "If it is wet and not yours...Dont touch it without protection!..(That will cover HEPA/BSI for your hands on testing, and written testing.)
So HEPA has something to do with safety/sanitation? No problem.


As for "Privacy" .... Remmember that very first page in your Medical Jacket? It is a copy of the Privacy Act, You signed it! and Medical has to follow it! Any Info you pass on to a MEDIC or higher ref your patients condition is subject to it. Anything more than Known conditions...like Blood type, and what the patient is allergic to is not for anyone's info other than the Medical persons and the Soldier. (example... You are doing a head to toe on a soldier, and find out he only has one nut,,Dont go down the road and tell the guys in the plt later on after you had a couple of drinks, Or say for some strange reason you get to look at a medical jacket of a soldier and find out he has had some sort of STD...You cant tell anyone other than the Medical people that need to know it.)

The reason I bring this up, At North Fort I did a CLS class. We did have Video of the I.V. sticks, and a soldier did throw a stink...It turned out to be a big mess...If they dont want it on video, Dont do it!. (Im not saying you would have in the first place, We all know that Soldier are HAM's and love to joke around, but there are a few that are looking for a excuse, or like to be pro vict's)

Okay, I understand the concept behind the Privacy Act and all, I just didn't know how it would apply for someone's arm being on video while blood squirts everywhere. Seems to be of no real issue. I already asked the guy, and he's cool with getting taped.

By the way, this CLS class you taught where this problem came up ... you didn't happen to be teaching a bunch of POGs, did you?



Now, Put in for Ft Sam, and get it over with!

Uhh, why? Are they on jump status there?
Link Posted: 12/14/2005 7:55:24 AM EDT

Originally Posted By voilsb:

Originally Posted By JS98010:
Oh, and be thankful that the CLS course doesn't cover administration of Foley catheters.

It doesn't cover that, right?

I've never heard of it, so it's probably not covered. Learn me some?




Foley Catheter
Link Posted: 12/14/2005 8:50:29 AM EDT

Originally Posted By WRF:
I was in Swedish hospital ONCE and the vampire came to poke me, the vacuum broke the Dude panicked threw a pillow over it and ran off, leaving me to bleed I pulled the needle out and rang the nurse. The nurse apologized and said it was his first day. I wouldn't let him touch me again.



I had that happen to me at Madigan Army Medical Center. But the chick/e-4 just jumped back and let my arm hose the room down in pretty red. My appendix was about to be removed, and I was in severe pain so the novelty was lost on me.

As for CLS, look around and pick a Soldier with some fecking brains to be your sticker/stickee. My last unit we all had to be CLS', and we did refreshers every six months. So by volume we got to see some pretty funny (read:dumbass) shit.
Link Posted: 12/14/2005 10:06:33 AM EDT
Mission accomplished!

One good stick, first-time Go, no blood whatsoever.

"Too easy"
Link Posted: 12/14/2005 10:11:56 AM EDT

Originally Posted By JS98010:
Foley Catheter

ewww
Link Posted: 12/14/2005 10:41:04 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/14/2005 10:46:06 AM EDT by R-32]

Originally Posted By voilsb:


Originally Posted By R-32:
The CLS course is nothing more than a advanced First-Aid class with I.V. thrown in.





It's nothing more than basic first-aid with an IV thrown in.





It may scare you to know, that things like Field Pressure Dressing's, 2 Man CPR, Checking Vital Signs,sucking chest wounds are not Basic First-Aid skills. ( I had a Paramedic with the Fire dept just blown away when she saw me put a Field Pressure Dressing on a guys leg after he got hit with a arrow, She and a lot of Fire dept type's have not seen/use things like that, they are used rapid transport,)

And they sure as heck dont get into Field Sanitation...
.

Link Posted: 12/14/2005 10:44:17 AM EDT

Originally Posted By voilsb:
Mission accomplished!

One good stick, first-time Go, no blood whatsoever.

"Too easy"



If you dod not get any blood for the "Flash" you miss'd!


Honestly...Good for you!.
Link Posted: 12/14/2005 3:24:57 PM EDT
Well, it's basic first aid because everything we covered (except the IVs) was covered in basic training. As well as a few other places (hip-pocket training in the guard, college ROTC, etc). None of the material, except the IVs (oh, and how to load an FLA by triage), was new to any of the soldiers.
Because of that, it's basic first aid.

And yes, I got blood for the flash. There was no blood outside the system. No blood spilt. Etc
Link Posted: 12/14/2005 3:45:35 PM EDT

Originally Posted By voilsb:

Originally Posted By JS98010:
Foley Catheter

ewww


Always better to be the giver than the receiver on this deal.
Link Posted: 12/14/2005 8:50:24 PM EDT
I've got the video processed and uploaded. You can check it out here. It's about 15.7 MB.
Link Posted: 12/14/2005 9:09:49 PM EDT
Damn.

You got the shitty end of that deal. Reminds me of the time in bootcamp when I hosed-down the Hospital Corpsman chick with some A+ all over her summer whites. I was amused.
Link Posted: 12/14/2005 11:36:56 PM EDT

Originally Posted By voilsb:
I've got the video processed and uploaded. You can check it out here. It's about 15.7 MB.



Dar he blows!

oh wait it's me!


Link Posted: 12/15/2005 6:42:49 AM EDT

Originally Posted By voilsb:
Well, it's basic first aid because everything we covered (except the IVs) was covered in basic training. As well as a few other places (hip-pocket training in the guard, college ROTC, etc). None of the material, except the IVs (oh, and how to load an FLA by triage), was new to any of the soldiers.
Because of that, it's basic first aid.

And yes, I got blood for the flash. There was no blood outside the system. No blood spilt. Etc



The SAM Splints, triageing patients, issuing "meds" (ibuprofin and pseudoephedrine) and the extra atropine PAM2Chloride and CANA, and knowing what to look for with proper atropinization, the "J" tubes (oropharangeal, spelling is off) aren't in the basic first aid that everyone learns. Plus a few other little things.
Link Posted: 12/15/2005 8:12:49 AM EDT
We got a PUMPER!!!

That sucks, but I guess everyone's first "stick" can't be great. Good thing you reminded him about the "diaper!"
Link Posted: 12/15/2005 8:45:25 AM EDT
you got the short end of the stick.

thanks folks, you've been a great crowd! My name's Tweeter and i'll be here all weekend!



BTW, that was an excellent stick you threw on that kid, and quick too. now go and practice with drunk friends in the barracks young paduan. you are a GO at this station.
Link Posted: 12/15/2005 8:49:12 AM EDT
Stay the fuck away from me!!!
Link Posted: 12/15/2005 11:23:29 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Unicorn:
The SAM Splints, triageing patients, issuing "meds" (ibuprofin and pseudoephedrine) and the extra atropine PAM2Chloride and CANA, and knowing what to look for with proper atropinization, the "J" tubes (oropharangeal, spelling is off) aren't in the basic first aid that everyone learns. Plus a few other little things.

SAM splints ... are intuitive. Nobody needed an explanation. J-tubes ... alright, you got me there. Triaging patients ... yeah, we'd been taught that prior to the class. Everyone knew how to do it already.
We didn't get taught anything about issuing meds. Extra atropine/2pam and cana are simply supplies, not training. It's like having extra field dressings.


So now it's: loading/unloading an FLA, using a J-tube, and administering an IV.

It's all pretty simple, though.




Originally Posted By Da_Bunny:
Stay the fuck away from me!!!

But I'm the one who did the good stick. It's the other guy you'd probably want to keep away. And his stick was pretty good, too, he just forgot to take the turniquet off.
Link Posted: 12/17/2005 1:59:25 AM EDT

Originally Posted By voilsb:
Originally Posted By Unicorn:
The SAM Splints, triageing patients, issuing "meds" (ibuprofin and pseudoephedrine) and the extra atropine PAM2Chloride and CANA, and knowing what to look for with proper atropinization, the "J" tubes (oropharangeal, spelling is off) aren't in the basic first aid that everyone learns. Plus a few other little things.

SAM splints ... are intuitive. Nobody needed an explanation. J-tubes ... alright, you got me there. Triaging patients ... yeah, we'd been taught that prior to the class. Everyone knew how to do it already.
We didn't get taught anything about issuing meds. Extra atropine/2pam and cana are simply supplies, not training. It's like having extra field dressings.


So now it's: loading/unloading an FLA, using a J-tube, and administering an IV.

It's all pretty simple, though.


I didn't say it was hard or anything. You didn't go over the signs to look for atropinization? When there is enough in the patient so that you stop giving it to him? Most of the stuff is gone over at one point or another by somebody, and most of it is simple review, but a person just out of basic probably hasn't seen much of it.
When I first went through there were to books we used. The first was just review of the basic self and buddy aid that everyone learns. The second was more indepth. Stuff that wasn't in the Skill level 1 book anyway.
Link Posted: 12/17/2005 9:51:14 AM EDT
We had the books, but didn't refer to them hardly at all. The only signs of atropinization I've ever been taught were at basic. We were taught (both in basic and cls) that you can administer a maximum of 3 atropine/2PamCl injections, but weren't given any information on what signs indicate sufficient dosage below the maximum (for example, for mild and/or moderate nerve agent poisoning).
All we were taught, in both places, was that if it's not severe, you administer one and wait a few minutes to see if their condition improves.


But I guess I'll just have to concede your point ... it's a simple first-aid class that covers a bit more than basic, but nothing your unit shouldn't have already covered by the time you get to CLS.
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