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Posted: 2/11/2013 6:46:28 PM EDT
[#1]
Most excellent, thank you Tim!
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Posted: 2/11/2013 7:18:30 PM EDT
[#2]
Awesome, thank you sir!
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Posted: 2/11/2013 7:25:43 PM EDT
[#3]
Just to cover your ass Tim, you might want to put a disclaimer on that...
"Tim is not a lawyer, certified legal document preparer, paralegal, gypsy, or necrophiliac. He may have stayed at a Holiday Inn Express last night. Use this document at your own risk." 
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Posted: 2/11/2013 8:47:56 PM EDT
[#4]
Downloaded....thank you sir
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Posted: 2/11/2013 9:28:51 PM EDT
[#5]
Quoted:
Just to cover your ass Tim, you might want to put a disclaimer on that... "Tim is not a lawyer, certified legal document preparer, paralegal, gypsy, or necrophiliac. He may have stayed at a Holiday Inn Express last night. Use this document at your own risk." Done. |
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Posted: 2/11/2013 9:38:02 PM EDT
[#6]
Good work brother! I use the one I made years ago, but seriously this is a great tool and is very generous of you for the members who have never had a trust.
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Posted: 2/11/2013 9:50:12 PM EDT
[#7]
How many Trustees can you add to a Trust? I might need to redo mine, as I want to add a few people to it....
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Posted: 2/11/2013 10:23:42 PM EDT
[#8]
This is setup as a single person trust. For more people I tell folks to get quicken or a lawyer. Shit gets complicated quick.
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Posted: 2/11/2013 10:25:15 PM EDT
[#9]
Thank you!
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Posted: 2/12/2013 12:36:14 AM EDT
[#10]
I would strongly advise having an attorney spend 20 minutes fixing the problems with this template. There aren't a lot of them, but they're important.
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Posted: 2/12/2013 12:42:52 AM EDT
[#11]
Quoted:
I would strongly advise having an attorney spend 20 minutes fixing the problems with this template. There aren't a lot of them, but they're important. Well shit man, help us out. Although this has worked for the ATF several hundred times, if there are legalese issues let folks know. |
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Posted: 2/12/2013 12:52:51 AM EDT
[#12]
1. This is not legal advice, I am not your attorney, and do not rely on what are merely my introductory thoughts. SEEK THE ADVICE OF A LICENSED ATTORNEY WHO IS WELL-VERSED IN TRUSTS AND ESTATES.
2. I am not a trust expert, so there is a substantial possibility that I am wrong. That said, I see at least two issues after a cursory glance. 1. It appears to be set up so that, upon death of the grantor/trustee, the "successor" becomes both the trustee and beneficiary. If this happens, legal and equitable interests merge and the trust dies. So the beneficiary would be left with illegal possession of an NFA item. 2. For a trust to be valid, the trust property must exist at the time of creation. This appears to contemplate the creation of a trust to be funded with property later acquired, which I understand to be a no-no. Again, do not, under any circumstances, rely on anything I've said other than "SEEK THE ADVICE OF A LICENSED ATTORNEY WHO IS WELL-VERSED IN TRUSTS AND ESTATES." Godspeed, gentlemen. |
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Posted: 2/12/2013 7:47:02 AM EDT
[#13]
2. For a trust to be valid, the trust property must exist at the time of creation. This appears to contemplate the creation of a trust to be funded with property later acquired, which I understand to be a no-no. when I formed mine, I assigned " one US Dollar, serial number xxxxxxxx" to and have always kept that dollar in it, then add or subtract other things as needed....
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Posted: 2/12/2013 9:09:06 AM EDT
[#14]
Nice form, now where is the langauge about dealing with a beneficiary who becomes a prohibited possessor, or other gun related issues?
The problem with the trust is we do not know what the BATF wants in the trust. So, my fear is one day Eric Holder wakes up and says he wants a trust actually addresses gun ownership issues. But I doubt the feds would ever really do anything like that. |
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Posted: 2/12/2013 1:45:39 PM EDT
[#15]
Thank You Tim.
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Posted: 2/15/2013 10:34:16 AM EDT
[#16]
Quoted:
1. It appears to be set up so that, upon death of the grantor/trustee, the "successor" becomes both the trustee and beneficiary. If this happens, legal and equitable interests merge and the trust dies. So the beneficiary would be left with illegal possession of an NFA item. Godspeed, gentlemen. No different than a lot of NFA items. That's what a Form 5 is for. |
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Posted: 3/15/2013 10:10:22 PM EDT
[#17]
thank you
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Posted: 4/2/2013 5:46:16 PM EDT
[#18]
Thank you, but what's with this "going away"?
I haven't been by EVCIII in awhile, but appreciated all the help and great customer service. Sorry to see you go anywhere. |
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Posted: 4/8/2013 11:31:28 PM EDT
[#19]
So what specifically would need to be amended for this blank to "look" correct to you? Any way we can get the download corrected or updated to "look" correct?
Thanks, Matt ETA: Would it be asking too much to have the blank updated with a sample of what the names are supposed to look like? are the names supposed to be in CAPS like the colors are? What about the colors, are they supposed to remain colored after entering the appropriate names? sorry for all the ?'s, I just really want to get on this boat 
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Posted: 4/9/2013 3:27:10 AM EDT
[#20]
Found this, does it look correct you you guys?
ETA, Trust Stuff (Declaration and Certification) Sorry for all the large pics before. Thanks guys, Matt |
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Posted: 4/14/2013 12:48:02 PM EDT
[#22]
I do not know how to U/L a word document. If somebody would like to tell me how to do it, i would be more than happy to do that.
Thanks, Matt ETA, Hope this will suffice as a word doc. just download, unzip and then open in Word. Trust Stuff |
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Posted: 6/3/2013 6:15:41 PM EDT
[#23]
How many people have used this in the past and worked with the ATF ?
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Posted: 8/22/2013 1:43:19 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
1. This is not legal advice, I am not your attorney, and do not rely on what are merely my introductory thoughts. SEEK THE ADVICE OF A LICENSED ATTORNEY WHO IS WELL-VERSED IN TRUSTS AND ESTATES. 2. I am not a trust expert, so there is a substantial possibility that I am wrong. That said, I see at least two issues after a cursory glance. 1. It appears to be set up so that, upon death of the grantor/trustee, the "successor" becomes both the trustee and beneficiary. If this happens, legal and equitable interests merge and the trust dies. So the beneficiary would be left with illegal possession of an NFA item. 2. For a trust to be valid, the trust property must exist at the time of creation. This appears to contemplate the creation of a trust to be funded with property later acquired, which I understand to be a no-no. Again, do not, under any circumstances, rely on anything I've said other than "SEEK THE ADVICE OF A LICENSED ATTORNEY WHO IS WELL-VERSED IN TRUSTS AND ESTATES." Godspeed, gentlemen. I am always amazed that people pay thousands or tens of thousands of dollars to purchase their Class III firearms and devices, items that if owned incorrectly can have very serious criminal consequences, but do not want to work with experienced lawyers to get it done properly. Rather, they seek legal advice on the internet. |
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Posted: 8/26/2013 10:46:35 AM EDT
[#25]
Tim is your website down at the moment or something happened ?
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Posted: 8/26/2013 12:07:18 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Tim is your website down at the moment or something happened ? Ah crap. Ya, need to find another way to host this. |
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Posted: 9/7/2013 7:07:34 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Ah crap. Ya, need to find another way to host this. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Tim is your website down at the moment or something happened ? Ah crap. Ya, need to find another way to host this. Any update? I finally got off my lazy ass and want to get a can going. |
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Posted: 9/8/2013 12:09:44 AM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Ah crap. Ya, need to find another way to host this. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Tim is your website down at the moment or something happened ? Ah crap. Ya, need to find another way to host this. Google docs is free and seems to work well for hosting docs - Thanks for GIVING this valuable resource to the community |
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Posted: 9/12/2013 1:33:33 PM EDT
[#29]
Does any one have a copy of this document they wan to share?
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Posted: 9/12/2013 1:46:14 PM EDT
[#30]
Try this link guys; sorry been very busy lately.
https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B_yGl-vYf2DCdkFGQmVGaEhiNzA/edit?usp=sharing |
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Posted: 11/3/2013 1:50:51 AM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
when I formed mine, I assigned " one US Dollar, serial number xxxxxxxx" to and have always kept that dollar in it, then add or subtract other things as needed.... Quote HistoryQuoted:
2. For a trust to be valid, the trust property must exist at the time of creation. This appears to contemplate the creation of a trust to be funded with property later acquired, which I understand to be a no-no. Or simply add one of your Title 1 firearms onto the trust...which is can be removed at a later date once you have items added. |
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Posted: 6/30/2014 4:02:28 PM EDT
[#32]
Looking into getting a can and found this law firm that is doing gun trusts in only a handful of states, Arizona being one of them, for $125.
Having an actual law firm behind it makes me feel better than using quicken. I did a bit of looking around and they seem legit. http://thefirearmlawyers.com/ |
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Posted: 1/30/2015 1:06:49 PM EDT
[#33]
Ok so here is a dumb question. When it is filled out and notorized, where does the paperwork go then? Just submit it with whatever form you are sending to ATF or does it need to be filed with the state somewhere?
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Posted: 1/30/2015 11:34:10 PM EDT
[#34]
You don't have to file a trust with the state, at least in Arizona. I believe it is just submitted with your form 4 to the ATF and they verify it is a legal trust in AZ and you are good to go.
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Posted: 3/28/2015 1:55:47 AM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Or simply add one of your Title 1 firearms onto the trust...which is can be removed at a later date once you have items added. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
2. For a trust to be valid, the trust property must exist at the time of creation. This appears to contemplate the creation of a trust to be funded with property later acquired, which I understand to be a no-no. Or simply add one of your Title 1 firearms onto the trust...which is can be removed at a later date once you have items added. How do you "add" an item to your trust? I don't see anything in the trust paperwork linked in this thread that states what the trust encompasses. |
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Posted: 3/28/2015 1:36:23 PM EDT
[#36]
The only thing you can change without getting it notarized is the schedule of assets /exhibit A or whatever it is called. You just write something new on it and it is updated. I believe.
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Posted: 4/16/2015 4:47:59 PM EDT
[#37]
I am submitting two form 4's today and my personal checks have my old address and my wife's name on them, so I called the ATF to find out if that made a difference. They said they don't care how the payment is received. She said "we just want your money".
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Posted: 9/16/2015 6:59:01 PM EDT
[#38]
This form just worked for me. I just picked up two new suppressors. 4 and half month wait right now for a form 4.
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Posted: 10/27/2015 1:20:16 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Looking into getting a can and found this law firm that is doing gun trusts in only a handful of states, Arizona being one of them, for $125. Having an actual law firm behind it makes me feel better than using quicken. I did a bit of looking around and they seem legit. http://thefirearmlawyers.com/ $99 currently for AZ. Thank you all, and damn you for costing me more money. 
I have three trustees, so I didn't want to use the form. I blasted off my application today. The acting Sheriff of Pima Co. is fishy on the NFA stuff and I don't want to take a chance of him dragging his feet on this. Not dealing with fingerprint cards and photos will be very nice too. I can see that I probably need another couple SBRs, a new .22 can, and a 9mm can to add to the collection. Possibly a titanium .223 or 7.62 can too. The good thing is this time I will be able to share.
Do you usually keep a copy of your trust with your tax stamp copy while at the range? |
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Posted: 11/11/2015 3:15:13 PM EDT
[#40]
I carry a copy with me. My FFL makes a shrunk down laminated copy of the stamp form when I pick it up and I just throw it in my range bag.
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Posted: 1/8/2016 9:53:26 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
$99 currently for AZ. Thank you all, and damn you for costing me more money.
I have three trustees, so I didn't want to use the form. I blasted off my application today. The acting Sheriff of Pima Co. is fishy on the NFA stuff and I don't want to take a chance of him dragging his feet on this. Not dealing with fingerprint cards and photos will be very nice too. I can see that I probably need another couple SBRs, a new .22 can, and a 9mm can to add to the collection. Possibly a titanium .223 or 7.62 can too. The good thing is this time I will be able to share.
Do you usually keep a copy of your trust with your tax stamp copy while at the range? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Looking into getting a can and found this law firm that is doing gun trusts in only a handful of states, Arizona being one of them, for $125. Having an actual law firm behind it makes me feel better than using quicken. I did a bit of looking around and they seem legit. http://thefirearmlawyers.com/ $99 currently for AZ. Thank you all, and damn you for costing me more money.
I have three trustees, so I didn't want to use the form. I blasted off my application today. The acting Sheriff of Pima Co. is fishy on the NFA stuff and I don't want to take a chance of him dragging his feet on this. Not dealing with fingerprint cards and photos will be very nice too. I can see that I probably need another couple SBRs, a new .22 can, and a 9mm can to add to the collection. Possibly a titanium .223 or 7.62 can too. The good thing is this time I will be able to share.
Do you usually keep a copy of your trust with your tax stamp copy while at the range? Just did mine. Guess we shall see Monday when it comes... SBR here we come! Jon |
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Posted: 5/19/2017 12:00:28 AM EDT
[#42]
Is this still the best way to go?
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Posted: 6/16/2017 10:45:01 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Is this still the best way to go? |
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Posted: 7/7/2017 11:05:57 AM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Since trustees now need to be fingerprinted , etc, an individual application is just as easy. |
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Posted: 5/12/2018 9:12:50 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted: no doing it because of the finger print cards. making it easier on the wife in case anything should ever happen to me. |
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Posted: 1/30/2019 9:33:02 PM EDT
[#46]
Thanks
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Posted: 6/5/2019 3:31:02 PM EDT
[#47]
Unpinned via OP request.
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Posted: 6/8/2019 12:56:05 AM EDT
[#48]
Thank you Tim. This time I'll do it.
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