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Posted: 12/13/2016 3:40:31 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I specifically inquired with a game warden about potentially using a .50 Beowulf for deer season. He informed me that it was not an approved round and he seemed uncertain as to what it was. I explained to him that it was used on an AR platform. He replied "we don't need those types of rifles in the woods." I was thinking of buying an upper if it was legal in Ohio. Bought a Henry All Weather .45-70 instead. Impressed a 175" 10 pointer with it. That's the problem, because they don't understand these "types of rifles". Ugh. Sorry for the slowness and lack of updates gents. Things are crazy busy with me. Not only with the holidays, but we're in the middle of selling one home, and buying another. I'm going to try and get a generalized draft worked up that calls for a simplification of the PCRs rules for approved calibers. It's our job as ethical hunters to ensure we are using a round capable of taking game, I don't think it's their job to test all this stuff at our expense, before allowing us to use it. This will not only make their life and ours easier, but if they really are "testing" all these calibers, it will save money. |
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Posted: 12/15/2016 9:55:22 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'll sign a petition to legalize the 450 BM for deer hunting. Let me know when or how to add my signature. Me too. This |
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Posted: 12/15/2016 11:53:15 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I specifically inquired with a game warden about potentially using a .50 Beowulf for deer season. He informed me that it was not an approved round and he seemed uncertain as to what it was. I explained to him that it was used on an AR platform. He replied "we don't need those types of rifles in the woods." I was thinking of buying an upper if it was legal in Ohio. Bought a Henry All Weather .45-70 instead. Impressed a 175" 10 pointer with it. Why introduce the idea of an AR? It only muddles the issue. As others mentioned, I'd think the focus should be on the cartridge, not the platform. |
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Posted: 12/21/2016 2:17:16 PM EDT
[#4]
OK, I've finally put aside time to work up the petition. Below is the text that I have thus far in the document. I'm going to just cut and past it here so we can edit it, then once we all agree that it's good, I will save the document and share in here via Google docs so the signatures can be saved and added to the original document. Once we have a good amount of signatures, I'll send it along to the ODNR.
We can then make a new document with similar text to send to the Ohio Statehouse, so we can attack this from both fronts. If you want like to add or make any edits to the following, please do so with your added verbiage or edits in BOLD. Thank you all for your patience and willingness to help this cause. Petition to Simplify Equipment Regulations for Deer Hunting in Ohio Petition summary and background: To make the regulations on approved equipment, firearms, and calibers easier to understand and remember for hunters during Ohio Youth, Gun, and Bonus Gun whitetail deer seasons. Action petitioned for: We, the undersigned, are concerned citizens who urge our Public leaders to act now to simplify the gun regulations during deer hunting seasons, specifically with regard to the allowable cartridges for legally taking whitetail deer using pistol caliber rifles. Instead of having a specific list of approved calibers, we the undersigned urge the Ohio Department of Natural Resources to simply the regulations to allow for any straight walled pistol cartridge of .30 caliber and larger to be used during Youth, Gun, and Bonus Gun whitetail deer seasons. It is up to us, the ethical hunters in Ohio, to ensure we are choosing a cartridge that is sufficient for an ethical and safe harvest. By simplifying these regulations and removing the specified caliber list, ODNR will open the door for more hunters and sportsmen to enjoy whitetail deer hunting with the equipment they are more familiar and comfortable with. |
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Posted: 12/21/2016 3:15:57 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
OK, I've finally put aside time to work up the petition. Below is the text that I have thus far in the document. I'm going to just cut and past it here so we can edit it, then once we all agree that it's good, I will save the document and share in here via Google docs so the signatures can be saved and added to the original document. Once we have a good amount of signatures, I'll send it along to the ODNR. We can then make a new document with similar text to send to the Ohio Statehouse, so we can attack this from both fronts. If you want like to add or make any edits to the following, please do so with your added verbiage or edits in BOLD. Thank you all for your patience and willingness to help this cause. Petition to Simplify Equipment Regulations for Deer Hunting in Ohio Petition summary and background: To make the regulations on approved equipment, firearms, and calibers easier to understand and remember for hunters during Ohio Youth, Gun, and Bonus Gun whitetail deer seasons. Action petitioned for: We, the undersigned, are concerned citizens who urge our Public leaders to act now to simplify the gun regulations during deer hunting seasons, specifically with regard to the allowable cartridges for legally taking whitetail deer using pistol caliber rifles. Instead of having a specific list of approved calibers, we the undersigned urge the Ohio Department of Natural Resources to simply the regulations to allow for any straight walled pistol cartridge of .30 caliber and larger to be used during Youth, Gun, and Bonus Gun whitetail deer seasons. It is up to us, the ethical hunters in Ohio, to ensure we are choosing a cartridge that is sufficient for an ethical and safe harvest. By simplifying these regulations and removing the specified caliber list, ODNR will open the door for more hunters and sportsmen to enjoy whitetail deer hunting with the equipment they are more familiar and comfortable with. I'm not a wordsmith so the particulars will be up to others but the word "simply" should be simplify. Good work, thanks for taking the horns on this. |
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Posted: 12/21/2016 3:57:14 PM EDT
[#6]
I wouldn't try to get fancy and get more calibers in, I would go with matching the wording of the allowed pistol "straight-walled cartridges .357 caliber or larger."
You would also need to dig into whether the pistol regs are set in law, or decided by ODNR. |
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Posted: 12/21/2016 7:53:13 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I wouldn't try to get fancy and get more calibers in, I would go with matching the wording of the allowed pistol "straight-walled cartridges .357 caliber or larger." You would also need to dig into whether the pistol regs are set in law, or decided by ODNR. I tend to agree to keep it the same as pistol. But I'll sign anything, thanks for doing this. |
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Posted: 12/21/2016 10:08:32 PM EDT
[#8]
I do like the fact it's worded .30 cal and larger straight walled cartridge. This should also be the calibers for handguns too. Since they already allow 38 special I see no reason why 380, 9mm, 327, 30 carbine, and 9x18 can't do the same job with a good expanding hallowpoints. I feel the barrel length of the handguns and rifles should still have a minimum length of 5"
I'm in on signing too. Definitely like simplifying regulations! |
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Posted: 12/21/2016 11:08:47 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'm not a wordsmith so the particulars will be up to others but the word "simply" should be simplify. Good work, thanks for taking the horns on this. Ah, good catch!! |
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Posted: 12/21/2016 11:10:49 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I wouldn't try to get fancy and get more calibers in, I would go with matching the wording of the allowed pistol "straight-walled cartridges .357 caliber or larger." You would also need to dig into whether the pistol regs are set in law, or decided by ODNR. While I agree, I personally would like to see .30 caliber be used, as that would open up rifles like the M1 carbine, which IMHO can be plenty sufficient for taking whitetail with the right loads, and is a very handy little rifle for busting brush, etc. Good points on that last part, I'll try and research that when time allows. |
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Posted: 12/21/2016 11:13:02 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I do like the fact it's worded .30 cal and larger straight walled cartridge. This should also be the calibers for handguns too. Since they already allow 38 special I see no reason why 380, 9mm, 327, 30 carbine, and 9x18 can't do the same job with a good expanding hallowpoints. I feel the barrel length of the handguns and rifles should still have a minimum length of 5" I'm in on signing too. Definitely like simplifying regulations! This is why it's always good to have several heads working on this. I agree on the 5" minimum. |
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Posted: 12/21/2016 11:35:25 PM EDT
[#12]
In before the guy with his .32ACP tells us it's a good deer cartridge
IMHO it's going for too big of a step. The ODNR seem pretty darn conservative, no way they want guys shooting small pistol rounds at deer (380, .32 etc.) I mean, the guys had to lobby to get them to add the .450 marlin last year. Current: Handgun: With 5-inch minimum length barrel, using straight-walled cartridges .357 caliber or larger Change to: Handgun/Rifle - 5-inch minimum length barrel, using straight walled cartridges .357 caliber or larger Seems like a nice small step, that gets us some of cool cartridges. Like I said before, Ill sign anything you put out there - thanks for the time. |
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Posted: 12/22/2016 11:44:38 AM EDT
[#13]
Sorry if I wasn't clear, but as stated above I think for the ODNR route you should stick with matching the wording from the allowed pistols.
Remember, these are the guys who told the legislators that they didn't need to pass the bill to allow silencers because they (ODNR) had the authority to allow that - but chose not to. Now as far as the .30 cal and larger, I agree that would add some good candidates, but I would save that for the legislature route. That was the reason for my comment on if the allowed pistols was codified into law somewhere. If it is, that would be the place to start for the legislative end of things. Use the wording in the current law and modify to allow .30 cal or larger smooth wall and 5" or longer barrels for pistols and rifles. If it isn't codified into law, then you'd have to start from scratch. At that point it might be worth a shot to try and get some traditional bottle necks in as well like 30/30. The less it looks like you're doing it to add modern rifles like the AR, the better. |
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Posted: 12/22/2016 4:38:23 PM EDT
[#14]
The other cool thing about the 450 BM is Ruger is producing a bolt action rifle. The ODNR fudds ought to like that....
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Posted: 12/22/2016 7:35:34 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It is up to us, the ethical hunters in Ohio, to ensure we are choosing a cartridge that is sufficient for an ethical and safe harvest. Reading over the petition a few times this sentence keeps sticking out to me. While I agree with the sentiment I worry that it might suggest that people may start choosing under powered calibers. I think that the petition works without it. To be clear I don't see this as a big issue with the petition but it just keeps sitting funny with me. |
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Posted: 12/22/2016 8:40:14 PM EDT
[#16]
This sounds good. I think the statewide hearings are in March. If we can get this the the Wildlife Council soon, it should be able to be proposed. If not, I think the Legislature would be the route to go.
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Posted: 12/22/2016 8:58:46 PM EDT
[#17]
I imagine a letter from an individual would make a louder statement than a petition.
Petitions, in my opinion, mean almost nothing. Also as said above, simple and incremental steps are effective when changing laws. Look at what the progressives have done over the last 100 years. |
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Posted: 12/23/2016 12:26:54 AM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
In before the guy with his .32ACP tells us it's a good deer cartridge
IMHO it's going for too big of a step. The ODNR seem pretty darn conservative, no way they want guys shooting small pistol rounds at deer (380, .32 etc.) I mean, the guys had to lobby to get them to add the .450 marlin last year. Current: Handgun: With 5-inch minimum length barrel, using straight-walled cartridges .357 caliber or larger Change to: Handgun/Rifle - 5-inch minimum length barrel, using straight walled cartridges .357 caliber or larger Seems like a nice small step, that gets us some of cool cartridges. Like I said before, Ill sign anything you put out there - thanks for the time. You make a good case here. I'm not against this at all. |
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Posted: 12/23/2016 12:31:28 AM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Sorry if I wasn't clear, but as stated above I think for the ODNR route you should stick with matching the wording from the allowed pistols. Remember, these are the guys who told the legislators that they didn't need to pass the bill to allow silencers because they (ODNR) had the authority to allow that - but chose not to. Now as far as the .30 cal and larger, I agree that would add some good candidates, but I would save that for the legislature route. That was the reason for my comment on if the allowed pistols was codified into law somewhere. If it is, that would be the place to start for the legislative end of things. Use the wording in the current law and modify to allow .30 cal or larger smooth wall and 5" or longer barrels for pistols and rifles. If it isn't codified into law, then you'd have to start from scratch. At that point it might be worth a shot to try and get some traditional bottle necks in as well like 30/30. The less it looks like you're doing it to add modern rifles like the AR, the better. Again, all good points. I will update the doc to reflect this, and we can push for the .30 cal at a later date. Because, hoenstly, right now, other than the M1, I can't think of any other .30 cal rifle I'd like to use, save a .309 or 30-06, but that's for another petition at a later time. Just to digress a bit on that, my idea is to push for the ODNR to allow a county by county vote on the use of high power rifles. While it's nice and flat up here, where I sometimes hunt in SE Ohio, it's damn near like I'm in the mountains. Albeit, I'm only about 15 miles form the WV border, but there are a lot of counties in Ohio that are plenty hilly enough, and have a low enough population of people to allow for high power rifles. Again, this is my opinion, but I don't see why we can't do this (and my local Wildlife officer actually thought that it wasn't a bad idea). Maybe after we see the results of this current petition (if we ever do), we can work up a new one on this subject. Please share your thoughts on this as well in you'd like. |
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Posted: 12/23/2016 12:32:21 AM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The other cool thing about the 450 BM is Ruger is producing a bolt action rifle. The ODNR fudds ought to like that.... There was one for sale in the EE recently. I drooled hard. I checked my distributors (I have my FFL), and I could not find one. I believe it's a special deal Ruger and some distributor have. I want one though. |
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Posted: 12/23/2016 12:32:32 AM EDT
[#21]
Double tap. Must have had my mouse in Binary mode.
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Posted: 12/23/2016 12:33:51 AM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I imagine a letter from an individual would make a louder statement than a petition. Petitions, in my opinion, mean almost nothing. Also as said above, simple and incremental steps are effective when changing laws. Look at what the progressives have done over the last 100 years. While I don't necessarily disagree with you here, I'm taking the advice of the Wildlife Officer I spoke to. He made it sound like a petition style letter would have more weight than just something from me as an individual. |
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Posted: 12/23/2016 3:48:09 PM EDT
[#23]
There was a link somewhere to write letters/requests to the ODNR on this kind of stuff. I remember writing a short letter to get rifles allowed. Anyone know where that is? I think sending both is probably a good idea.
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Posted: 12/23/2016 5:50:00 PM EDT
[#24]
If no .30 cal then at least .355 cal!!! Who doesn't own the cheap and famous 9mm. It exceeds what the 38 special can do. Heck, even the 380 acp would be close to the same muzzle energy as the 38 special. Check out the numbers here of 380, 9mm, and 38 special at 5" barrel lengths.http://www.ballisticsbytheinch.com/calibers.html
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Posted: 12/26/2016 10:04:27 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
That's ridiculous. There are many cartridges on the approved list that are more than capable of 300 yards, and beyond... I'm not aiming that at you personally, just the idea the ODNR officer is portraying. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I've always heard the fear of hunters using high-powered rifles, but an ODNR officer once told me it wasn't a safety issue, but a conservation one. They didn't want someone to be able to reach out 300+ yds to hit that monster buck. You had to work for it. But IDK. That's ridiculous. There are many cartridges on the approved list that are more than capable of 300 yards, and beyond... I'm not aiming that at you personally, just the idea the ODNR officer is portraying. At TVP, I was hitting steel at 300 yds with my .357 levergun iron sights. With a scope it would have been effortless. So yeah, the govt's range argument is retarded. If you want less deer killed, reduce the tags. It's not rocket potatoes |
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Posted: 12/26/2016 10:07:09 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I specifically inquired with a game warden about potentially using a .50 Beowulf for deer season. He informed me that it was not an approved round and he seemed uncertain as to what it was. I explained to him that it was used on an AR platform. He replied "we don't need those types of rifles in the woods." I was thinking of buying an upper if it was legal in Ohio. Bought a Henry All Weather .45-70 instead. Impressed a 175" 10 pointer with it. "We don't need those types of rifles in the woods" Fuck you very much, officer. |
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Posted: 12/26/2016 10:17:08 PM EDT
[#27]
Nix the minimum barrel length from this as well. It's stupid. 18" to 28" shotguns perform almost identically within 70ish yds.
Shorter barrels just doesn't need to be prohibited, pistol or otherwise. Really the verbiage should change to an exclusion list of like air pellets, .22l & 32 acp. But ill sign whatever you draft up |
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Posted: 12/26/2016 11:30:06 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Nix the minimum barrel length from this as well. It's stupid. 18" to 28" shotguns perform almost identically within 70ish yds. Shorter barrels just doesn't need to be prohibited, pistol or otherwise. Really the verbiage should change to an exclusion list of like air pellets, .22l & 32 acp. But ill sign whatever you draft up I agree 100000000%. |
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Posted: 1/5/2017 1:23:23 PM EDT
[#29]
Tagaroo.
I'll sign the petition once it is drafted. |
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Posted: 1/5/2017 11:06:13 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I like the way you thing brother!!!  Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I'd say we are better off focusing on the ballistics and particulars on the cartridges themselves and less about the types of firearms they are used in. Right, why does there have to be a list of cartridges, it should be: 1) greater than .357 2) straightwall 3) Muzzle energy greater than 500 ft-lbs Done and done! I like the way you thing brother!!! and yet, you can use a .410 slug 
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Posted: 1/12/2017 12:24:12 PM EDT
[#31]
FYI
BFA's Larry Moore has been working with ODNR Law Enforcement Supervisor Ken Fitz regarding specific straight-walled cartridges for deer. Mr. Fitz made the attached proposal for deer rule changes at the Ohio Wildlife Council meeting of 1/11/17. 2017 Deer Reg change.pdf Larry summarized the meeting as follows Ken made a presentation to the Ohio Wildlife Council on the proposal. He included:
· We’ve had safe seasons. · SWC is popular and Division has received requests for additional cartridges. Mostly these requests are cartridge specific. · He thanked me personally and gave lots of acknowledgement to BFA for our initial work, getting the OFBF on board and our continued working relationship with the Division. · Officers are seeing a few more rifles in the field – estimates 10% or maybe a little more. · Officers report no issues. · The proposal presented is a good balance of hunter opportunity without any safety issues. · It is easy to understand for the hunter and for the wildlife officer to enforce. JLE |
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Posted: 1/12/2017 1:26:48 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
FYI BFA's Larry Moore has been working with ODNR Law Enforcement Supervisor Ken Fitz regarding specific straight-walled cartridges for deer. Mr. Fitz made the attached proposal for deer rule changes at the Ohio Wildlife Council meeting of 1/11/17. 2017 Deer Reg change.pdf Larry summarized the meeting as follows JLE Quote HistoryQuoted:
FYI BFA's Larry Moore has been working with ODNR Law Enforcement Supervisor Ken Fitz regarding specific straight-walled cartridges for deer. Mr. Fitz made the attached proposal for deer rule changes at the Ohio Wildlife Council meeting of 1/11/17. 2017 Deer Reg change.pdf Larry summarized the meeting as follows Ken made a presentation to the Ohio Wildlife Council on the proposal. He included:
· We’ve had safe seasons. · SWC is popular and Division has received requests for additional cartridges. Mostly these requests are cartridge specific. · He thanked me personally and gave lots of acknowledgement to BFA for our initial work, getting the OFBF on board and our continued working relationship with the Division. · Officers are seeing a few more rifles in the field – estimates 10% or maybe a little more. · Officers report no issues. · The proposal presented is a good balance of hunter opportunity without any safety issues. · It is easy to understand for the hunter and for the wildlife officer to enforce. JLE Looks straight, simple and to the point. |
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Posted: 1/12/2017 4:15:04 PM EDT
[#33]
So umm looks like I need a Beowulf upper.
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Posted: 1/12/2017 6:23:42 PM EDT
[#34]
Do they have to vote on the changes, or when do they decide?
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Posted: 1/13/2017 8:04:32 AM EDT
[#35]
I believe they will take comments on these proposals at the spring open house sessions and then the council will vote on what they will adopt for the 2017/18 season.
Open houses will be held from 12:00 pm - 3:00 pm on the following dates: Saturday, March 4, 2017 At five locations throughout the state: Central Ohio: Wildlife District One Office 1500 Dublin Road, Columbus Northwest Ohio: Wildlife District Two Office 952 Lima Ave, Findlay Northeast Ohio: Wildlife District Three Office 912 Portage Lakes Drive, Akron Southeast Ohio: Wildlife District Four Office 360 E State St., Athens Southwest Ohio: Greene County Fish and Game Association Clubhouse 1538 Union Road, Xenia |
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Posted: 1/16/2017 11:45:45 AM EDT
[#36]
The Wildlife council got the proposal Wednesday to get rid of the 'list' and allow any straight-walled cartridge rifle with a caliber between .357 and .50 to be used. As long as there is no major opposition to these proposals at the open houses these are usually passed.
Meeting notes |
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Posted: 1/16/2017 1:33:15 PM EDT
[#37]
So should I go 450BM or 45 Raptor?
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Posted: 1/16/2017 4:51:23 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
So should I go 450BM or 45 Raptor? I'm leaning towards the 450 BM. What's the raptor cartridge? |
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Posted: 1/16/2017 4:55:03 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'm leaning towards the 450 BM. What's the raptor cartridge? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
So should I go 450BM or 45 Raptor? I'm leaning towards the 450 BM. What's the raptor cartridge? Never mind, I can use the Google. My take, it is the 308 based version of the 450 BM, which is 223 based. Looks badass. |
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Posted: 1/16/2017 5:05:54 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The Wildlife council got the proposal Wednesday to get rid of the 'list' and allow any straight-walled cartridge rifle with a caliber between .357 and .50 to be used. As long as there is no major opposition to these proposals at the open houses these are usually passed. Meeting notes 
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Posted: 1/16/2017 10:06:38 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Never mind, I can use the Google. My take, it is the 308 based version of the 450 BM, which is 223 based. Looks badass. |
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Posted: 1/18/2017 10:19:33 AM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
FYI BFA's Larry Moore has been working with ODNR Law Enforcement Supervisor Ken Fitz regarding specific straight-walled cartridges for deer. Mr. Fitz made the attached proposal for deer rule changes at the Ohio Wildlife Council meeting of 1/11/17. 2017 Deer Reg change.pdf Larry summarized the meeting as follows JLE Excellent! This is excellent news, and goes right in line with what we were trying to put together here. I may contact Mr. Moore and see if we should continue with this petition, or if he can use our help in some other way. Kudos to BFA. |
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Posted: 1/18/2017 10:20:53 AM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryTHIS! Here's hoping I can use my new Franklin Armory .450BM upper next year for deer on our new property! |
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Posted: 1/18/2017 9:16:18 PM EDT
[#44]
Have you guys seen this? If you are getting a negative reaction from ODNR regarding ARs for hunting there is a More traditionally styled hunting platform chambered in .450BM...
http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2016/12/29/ruger-american-rifle-450-bushmaster/ |
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Posted: 1/19/2017 1:31:57 AM EDT
[#45]
As reported at Buckeyefirearms.org: https://www.buckeyefirearms.org/bfa-applauds-latest-oh-div-wildlife-proposal-re-straight-walled-rifle-cartridges-deer-hunting
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Posted: 1/19/2017 10:36:57 AM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Have you guys seen this? If you are getting a negative reaction from ODNR regarding ARs for hunting there is a More traditionally styled hunting platform chambered in .450BM... http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2016/12/29/ruger-american-rifle-450-bushmaster/ Yup, saw this and want it. |
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Posted: 1/19/2017 11:02:31 AM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
As reported at Buckeyefirearms.org: https://www.buckeyefirearms.org/bfa-applauds-latest-oh-div-wildlife-proposal-re-straight-walled-rifle-cartridges-deer-hunting "It is proposed that this rule be amended to reflect that any straight-walled cartridge rifle, with a minimum caliber of .357 to a maximum caliber of .50 be allowed for hunting deer in Ohio. There have been three seasons of hunting deer with straight-walled cartridge rifles in Ohio and we have had no biological impacts to the herd or additional hunter incidents as a result. By defining the allowable rifles in the proposed manner it makes the rule easily understood and easily enforced; in addition it is inclusive of a great number of options in rifles." I could not have worded that better myself. This is exactly what we were proposing here, and I'm glad to see that others are for this more common sense approach. |
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Posted: 1/19/2017 11:44:38 AM EDT
[#48]
So if this goes through which caliber are you all thinking? I've wanted 50 Beowulf since I saw it on Future Weapons.
I know 50 Beo if very similar to 45/70, but how does 450 Bushmaster compare to 45/70? I'm really only interested because I would rather have my hunting rifle in an AR platform for faster follow up shots.
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Posted: 1/19/2017 10:27:17 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
So if this goes through which caliber are you all thinking? I've wanted 50 Beowulf since I saw it on Future Weapons. I know 50 Beo if very similar to 45/70, but how does 450 Bushmaster compare to 45/70? I'm really only interested because I would rather have my hunting rifle in an AR platform for faster follow up shots.450BM has the ballistics that impress me the most out of all the calibers I've looked at for the AR platform. The other one I want to build is a .45 Super, which can also shoot .45ACP. |
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Posted: 1/19/2017 10:28:15 PM EDT
[#50]
Oh, and I emailed Mr. Moore today, asking if he thinks we should continue with our petition, and if so if he cared if we mirrored some of his verbiage in our petition.
Will report back when I get a response. |
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