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Posted: 1/24/2006 2:14:01 PM EDT
So I got a springfield, and would like some info on how to identify the cheesy parts so I can replace them. I have been told SA has used some parts of chinese and other questionable origins at various times. I would like some advice on basic accuracy and reliability improvements. I would rather drag my nuts through a mile of razor wire than deal with springfield on any warranty issue, so I am not worried about voiding it. (they are thieves and world class A**holes, but that is for another thread) I just want to make sure it is right. Heard about the shimming and/or unitizing of the gas system and the extractor kit. Heres what I hope is enough info. I have a loaded model with a NM-SS medium weight bbl. black wrinkle stock. Reciever marked "US Rifle M1A / Springfield / Armory / 159624 I bought it NIB, but was on the shelf a while as all the coupons were a couple years outta date. Front sight NM 062.

Upper left of trigger housing numbered

7267030-I

The bolt is numbered

77L86-SA and below it- F00088, the last 8 seems alittle out of kilter. Both numbers on the rear of the bolt, topside. Bottom marked E8

Oprod numbered

7267064-2
SA

Rear Sight has an SA

I guess the SA mark is supposed to be sprinfield armory, but do they have someone make them overseas for them, or is this a US made rifle, and are they as good as GI? Any experience with sa's mount? Got the 3rd Gen and an 8x42 on it. What parts would you upgrade if you were me (or maybe sell it and shell out a few hundred more?) Thanks all by the way, I have already gleaned alot from these boards.
Link Posted: 1/24/2006 3:16:24 PM EDT

Have a question for you...if you dislike SA and their products so much, why did you buy one?
Link Posted: 1/24/2006 3:21:20 PM EDT
Tagged.

___________________________



Link Posted: 1/24/2006 3:34:02 PM EDT
I wanted an M1A for years and pretty much thought the sprinfield were the best. Had a real bad customer service issue when buying the mount and some other ods and ends after the rifle purchase. . Started researching and found out there could be some issues. Like I said my personal distaste for a company is a different topic. I just mentioned it because most people would advise not to mess with something that is reasonably well made and under a warranty. I want the best rifle I can and its why I spent the money on this. If I need to spend more, I will. I am new and posted this for some friendly advice, thanks for making me feel so welcome.
Link Posted: 1/24/2006 3:40:06 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/24/2006 5:11:13 PM EDT by H2O_MAN]

Originally Posted By m14phreak:
So I got a springfield, a loaded model with a NM-SS medium weight bbl. black wrinkle stock.



Hey Phreak, before you go swapping parts - how does it shoot?

BTW, 159624 was made in Sept/Oct of '03. < corrected

If you want the best send it to Smith Enterprise and get the full
Crazy Horse conversion with SEI and GI parts.
SEI currently has a 60 day window to work on civilian rifles.
Link Posted: 1/24/2006 4:00:34 PM EDT
Shot about 600 through it so far, learned the hard way not to use wolf--heated up and stuck in the chamber--thats the only failure so far. Got it field stripped right now doing a more detailed cleaning, thats when I got all those various numbers. Iron sight shoots so far, keeps any I dont screw up on a shoot nc predictably at 1-200yds. Just got the mount set up, took it out once with the Eo tech and shot the mount loose, okay learned about the blue locktite. So got it set up again and just slapped an 8x32 POSP weaver on it I had laying around. Gonna wait to commit on a higher end scope till I do some more research on that end, but the russian jobber looks mean and has damn good optics. Got a cheekpiece in the mail, probably weekend after next to get a good day in- got the kid on the way to do list..........I went through all these boards and linked through to some other board about how to tell chinese this from Gi that and the extractors got to go, etc. I just want to ID what I have and get some feedback on tricking it out (if I even need to)
Link Posted: 1/24/2006 4:41:49 PM EDT
Checked out Smith, one day....one day... Was thinking more stuff I could do myself to start.
Link Posted: 1/24/2006 4:42:05 PM EDT
All your parts are Springfield Armory Inc / commerical parts.
Link Posted: 1/24/2006 4:43:46 PM EDT
So are these mil-spec? Where do they make them? Metallurgy commentary?
Link Posted: 1/24/2006 4:52:35 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/24/2006 5:00:01 PM EDT by varoadking]
Well, fellow ARFCOMer's...

...thought I'd share the contents of an email I just got from our friend "m14phreak" as a further reply to my question above:


Dont be a such a dick, put on my shoes for a second. I bought a couple mounts
and odds and ends from SA (none of which were cheap) when I got my rifle a few
months ago. 16 weeks later SA debited my account for more money with no notice
and f-ed up my checkbook..I got a reciept 10 days later. When I called they
were complete pricks and said I was undercharged when I paid for it over the
phone to their operator. When I buy something from a merchant, I do not give
them lifetime access to my bank account. They have my phone, e-mail, and
physical address and could have called and I would have gladly paid them if I
owed them (or anyone) something. If you could have heard some of the shit they
talked to me over the phone you would be pissed off too. I dropped close to two
grand and got a f-u. That sir, sucks.



She seems to be the sensitive type...

Link Posted: 1/24/2006 4:54:28 PM EDT

Originally Posted By H2O_MAN:

BTW, 159624 was made in Sept/Oct of '93.




Believe that would be '03, not '93.
Link Posted: 1/24/2006 5:02:06 PM EDT

Originally Posted By m14phreak:
So are these mil-spec? Where do they make them? Metallurgy commentary?



No, not mil spec. Cast in Taiwan. Except for the bolt I think.99% of the time, you'll have no problems with them. If you get caught up in the gotta have USGI parts craze that so many of us have, prepare to pay out the nose for parts.

Unless you've got no better use for your money, it's at the point now it makes more sense to just use the dang rifles and not get too paranoid over who made what.
Link Posted: 1/24/2006 5:02:58 PM EDT

Originally Posted By 13foxtrot:
All your parts are Springfield Armory Inc / commerical parts.



Not so, most of the smaller parts are USGI. It would have been way to expensive to make them all new.

I foolishly bought the SA Garand. I have had no problems with it and it is more accurate than my CMP USGI Garand. Still I like the USGI better.

I would have been smarter to have bought a Fulton Armory USGI. However, that is water under the bridge and I am not going to take a bath on the SA by selling it.

I called SA after hearing some of the complaints on my model. I was told all the main parts were new and the smaller parts were like new USGI. I don't have any other info and which are which.

Good luck!

Philip
Link Posted: 1/24/2006 5:08:04 PM EDT

Originally Posted By bishopm14:

Originally Posted By m14phreak:
So are these mil-spec? Where do they make them? Metallurgy commentary?



No, not mil spec. Cast in Taiwan. Except for the bolt I think.99% of the time, you'll have no problems with them. If you get caught up in the gotta have USGI parts craze that so many of us have, prepare to pay out the nose for parts.

Unless you've got no better use for your money, it's at the point now it makes more sense to just use the dang rifles and not get too paranoid over who made what.



Your bottom line is correct but your are wrong about the casting of the receiver.

It was cast in Australia but Lithgow. BTW, it is NOT the same inferior casting shown at the Fulton Armory website. Yours is a quality casting but it isn't as good as a forged receiver. Still, unless you plan to use it in battle for the next four years, you wouldn't notice the difference in the recreational world uses.

Philip
Link Posted: 1/24/2006 5:09:32 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/24/2006 5:16:10 PM EDT by H2O_MAN]

Originally Posted By bishopm14:

Originally Posted By H2O_MAN:

BTW, 159624 was made in Sept/Oct of '93.




Believe that would be '03, not '93.



Oops! You are correct sir.

Ya know the 0 is right next to the 9 - I'm gifted with fat fingers
Link Posted: 1/24/2006 5:09:43 PM EDT
Smart-aleck too...sent you that so as not to turn this into a "why I don't like springfield" post, the other guy got one too. If you have some grizzled internet gun guru wisdom to disperse, lets hear it. Or do you just post around to show how much cooler you are than us? Lighten up!
Link Posted: 1/24/2006 5:11:28 PM EDT
Oh yeah--I am as sensitive about direct insults as you are about your beloved armory.
Link Posted: 1/24/2006 5:22:46 PM EDT
Sorry got caught up with th bs and didnt see these. Thanks guys, now I am getting to what I wanted to know. I have 2 GI bolts. They are obviously used, but the faces look pretty good. I started gathering parts here and there a few years ago. By the time I could afford the rifle, I had a good stash of GI mags, the tools, and some springs and pins. So can a used bolt be put in another rifle? Should I swap a firing pin from the GI to the sa? Glad about the reciever, thats one of the sites that started my thinking about all this.
Link Posted: 1/24/2006 5:22:51 PM EDT
your bolt is commercial forged, should last a LONG time. Rest of your parts are cast.

Shoot it, enjoy it.
Link Posted: 1/24/2006 5:24:39 PM EDT

Originally Posted By m14phreak:
Shot about 600 through it so far, learned the hard way not to use wolf--heated up and stuck in the chamber--thats the only failure so far. ... I went through all these boards and linked through to some other board about how to tell chinese this from Gi that and the extractors got to go, etc.



Good idea on the extractor. Replace that and shoot iron sights for a few outings to make sure
everything else is working - then look into upgrades and optics if you are satisfied with the rifle.

Check out the available surplus 7.62 ammo (not Indian) - I like Port, but it's hard to find.

As for optics, sometimes I wish I never bothered with them.
I have settled on the EOTECH and Leupold scout scope mounted forward of the receiver.

HTH ~
Link Posted: 1/24/2006 5:31:10 PM EDT
Regardless I will shoot the piss out of it. Bought it to have the ultimate in US MBR though. And I have never owned a weapon I didn't customize or one that couldnt be made better.
Link Posted: 1/24/2006 5:53:09 PM EDT
Bought the forward mount, wont fit on my bbl---anyone need one? Put the Eotech on the 3rd Gen mount for a bit, but its back on the AR. Found a 600yd range to work out rifle and glass weekend after next. Ill post a pic of this thing with this commie scope on it. Its a sight. Gotta finish cleaning it first. Why do you wish you didnt scope it, and what the hell is it with the apparently satanic indian ammo? Everywhere I go I am warned from the evil ammo from india.
Link Posted: 1/24/2006 5:54:06 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/24/2006 6:05:37 PM EDT by H2O_MAN]

Originally Posted By m14phreak:
Bought it to have the ultimate in US MBR though. And I have never owned a weapon I didn't customize or one that couldnt be made better.



Yeah, I've customized one and I'm working on another one.

You can enhance a US MBR


Originally Posted By m14phreak:
Why do you wish you didnt scope it,



My vision is not ideal for traditional scopes. I had a real fancy - state of the art Leupold
on my M14K and experienced a diminished exit pupil so I went back to iron sights and the
forward mounted Scout optic concept - both eye's open. I'm good to go now.

Link Posted: 1/24/2006 6:04:44 PM EDT
Just took the bolt out, and the roller fell right off. There is a groove in the center of the roller and the shaft it sits on. Is something supposed to hold this on--maybe in the grooves? Or is this normal?
Link Posted: 1/24/2006 6:19:33 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/24/2006 6:22:59 PM EDT by bishopm14]

Originally Posted By philipk:

Your bottom line is correct but your are wrong about the casting of the receiver.

It was cast in Australia but Lithgow. BTW, it is NOT the same inferior casting shown at the Fulton Armory website. Yours is a quality casting but it isn't as good as a forged receiver. Still, unless you plan to use it in battle for the next four years, you wouldn't notice the difference in the recreational world uses.

Philip



Well, I should've specified that I wasn't referring to the receiver at all. Wasn't trying to imply that they are Taiwanese made. But neither are they Aussie made Lithgows, (that would be SAI's fake Garand). As any good student of Different can tell you, M1A receivers are cast by our hockey playin', maple syrup drinkin' friends to the north.
Link Posted: 1/24/2006 6:27:00 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/24/2006 6:30:54 PM EDT by bishopm14]

Originally Posted By m14phreak:
Just took the bolt out, and the roller fell right off. There is a groove in the center of the roller and the shaft it sits on. Is something supposed to hold this on--maybe in the grooves? Or is this normal?



Not normal at all, there should be a small wire clip that holds the roller to the shaft. Usually, once they're on there removal requires carefully cutting or splitting the roller. Sounds like you might have reason to hold your nose and use SAI's warranty right off the bat.

ETA: Since you don't like dealing with SA, and already have a couple USGI bolts, I would go ahead and install one of them, have the headspace checked if you can't do it yourself, and shoot the shit out of things.
Link Posted: 1/24/2006 6:32:12 PM EDT
Great, puke icing on shit cake.
Link Posted: 1/24/2006 7:18:25 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/24/2006 7:19:47 PM EDT by philipk]

Originally Posted By bishopm14:

Originally Posted By philipk:

Your bottom line is correct but your are wrong about the casting of the receiver.

It was cast in Australia but Lithgow. BTW, it is NOT the same inferior casting shown at the Fulton Armory website. Yours is a quality casting but it isn't as good as a forged receiver. Still, unless you plan to use it in battle for the next four years, you wouldn't notice the difference in the recreational world uses.

Philip



Well, I should've specified that I wasn't referring to the receiver at all. Wasn't trying to imply that they are Taiwanese made. But neither are they Aussie made Lithgows, (that would be SAI's fake Garand). As any good student of Different can tell you, M1A receivers are cast by our hockey playin', maple syrup drinkin' friends to the north.



Oops!

I misread the original post. I thought the person was refering to the SA M1 Garand.

The SA M1 Garand receiver is cast by ADI, Australia. I just check mine to see.

www.adi-limited.com/5-00-000-000-000.html

The M1A is cast up north.

Philip
Link Posted: 1/25/2006 11:51:27 PM EDT

Originally Posted By varoadking:
Well, fellow ARFCOMer's...

...thought I'd share the contents of an email I just got from our friend "m14phreak" as a further reply to my question above:


Dont be a such a dick, put on my shoes for a second. I bought a couple mounts
and odds and ends from SA (none of which were cheap) when I got my rifle a few
months ago. 16 weeks later SA debited my account for more money with no notice
and f-ed up my checkbook..I got a reciept 10 days later. When I called they
were complete pricks and said I was undercharged when I paid for it over the
phone to their operator. When I buy something from a merchant, I do not give
them lifetime access to my bank account. They have my phone, e-mail, and
physical address and could have called and I would have gladly paid them if I
owed them (or anyone) something. If you could have heard some of the shit they
talked to me over the phone you would be pissed off too. I dropped close to two
grand and got a f-u. That sir, sucks.



She seems to be the sensitive type...




I also got a friendly email, "Hello" from m14phreak.

Welcome to AR15.com.



_________________________



Link Posted: 1/26/2006 6:09:45 AM EDT

Originally Posted By m14phreak:
Great, puke icing on shit cake.



We're certainly the soft and senstitive type, aren't we? Like a porcupine...

I s'pose I'd better check my IM now for a "friendly" hello.
Link Posted: 1/26/2006 5:34:29 PM EDT
Naw, youre allright . How exactly am I supposed to react when they jump me unprovoked? Everybody else seems to be helpful and friendly? Why do I care???

Back to the rifle


I am actually impressed it shot so good with the rooler just sittin there. In a weird way it got a couple cool points. Give me a minute and ill post some pics.
Link Posted: 1/26/2006 6:07:00 PM EDT
http://server3.pictiger.com/img/5430/other/.jpg



http://server3.pictiger.com/img/5447/picture-hosting/.jpg



http://server3.pictiger.com/img/5467/picture-hosting/poopers-0033.jpg
Link Posted: 1/26/2006 6:13:17 PM EDT
Go look at these, if someones feelin charitable and can get them on the board I would appreciate it. I can go look at them with that, but it wont go up on the board...still learning...


Now, how in the hell did that happen? Certainly not cutting it off......So you see why they made the shiteliste.....dig the commie scope I put on there.....see I do have a pretty good sense of humor...
Link Posted: 1/26/2006 8:12:14 PM EDT
sharp edges on the bolt (not saying this is why it broke). I had one that hid just inside the roller and wanted to gouge my reciever. Inspect and deburr all parts.
Link Posted: 1/27/2006 4:25:13 PM EDT
Praise in public, rebuke in private (ie-the e-mails..).

This is the PUBLIC apology to colt-sbr, I misunderstood his post.
Link Posted: 1/27/2006 5:48:48 PM EDT

Originally Posted By m14phreak:
Praise in public, rebuke in private (ie-the e-mails..).

This is the PUBLIC apology to colt-sbr, I misunderstood his post.



Not necessary.

Hope you iron out the problems with your rifle.

_________________


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