Those 4+1 guns are maddening. My RRA middie with the M261 .22 kit in it does that with two kinds of ammo. With every other kind, it just sort of flings them in the general direction of the target.

My son's Romanian M69 .22 rifle also shoots 4+1 on almost every group, with every type of ammo. For those four shots, it's the second or third most accurate .22 rifle we own. Counting all five, it's more like the second or third LEAST accurate.

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: I'm make it easy for you guys that want to piss on the Ruger Mini's. I will put up the title on a built Mini-14 against any of your Ar-15's in 223 for a 20 round straight group.  Tightest group takes both guns home. Note: I'll will print sub MOA for the 20 round group, so you better pack yourself an extra diaper to wipe away the tears as you watch your rifle leave with me. Dano, I hope you will do this. It would be great if you could smoke em. It's your challenge so scope out the specs of your rifle, ammo and match conditions. As far as taking on multiple shooters, that is your call. It would be your right to make it just one guy ( this first to accept the challenge was Tim84K10.) RAF are you comfortable being the impartial scoring party or can another MOD step in? Shooting for pinks. Gotta be an ARF.com first. JR I could be impartial, but since I've whipped lots of shorty ARS with my Mini, and posted about it here, some people might claim I was biased. I would guess this is something the site would not want to be involved in.

YOU have whipped other shooters with your Mini while they were shooting ARs, I don't see your Mini whipping anything.

I two years ago whooped a couple of suit and tie types at Buffalo Range. They were shooting new, commercial SA, Inc Garands and I was shooting a Romanian SAR 1. Both at 100 yds, through the irons and I humiliated them.

Now, obviously no AK is more accurate than a Garand, but these two clowns couldn't shoot. They were cocky, rich spoiled types and couldn't even print the paper for a three shot group. The insisted it was the "30 mph crosswind" which was actually about 7mph.

After I spanked them with my AK, they said something must be wrong with the rifles....or the ammo.I then printed about a 2" group with Danish with one of their Garands.

They deserved it. I bet the whole ride home in their Lexus they didn't say a word to each other purely out of shame.

I will shoot one of my 20" ARs or one of my carbines with standard trigger set ups against your most match tuned Mini anyday, anyday, anyday and so will the vast majority of shooters.

RAF look what you did?

You got the patriots neck all red and he is ready to take you on too.


Will somebody with a Mini 14 agree to shoot the shit with Carlos Havecock.

Dano523 where are ya????????




JR

I just bought a new Mini on Monday from the local Academy, I put a Nikon Buckmaster 3x9-40 on it just because.

Why did I buy one you ask? Because I have always wanted one, I like the way they look.

Needless to say I was not expecting a match rifle, just a plinker, something I could throw in my truck or sling over my shoulder and take a walk on our property with.



To the Mini bashers I say    and have a nice day, because I'm happy with mine.

Quoted: Needless to say I was not expecting a match rifle, just a plinker, something I could throw in my truck or sling over my shoulder and take a walk on our property with.

You are one of the many that understand what the rifle is actually intended for/capable of.
Pretty sure it's called a "Ranch Rifle" for a reason.
Can you kill a coyote at 100 yards with one?  You bet you can.
Should you expect surgical accuracy?  Of course not.

There are those that , ahem, claim more.
I tend to steer clear of those guys.

That's a nice looking joint, LA. I have yet to see my first "new model" Ranch Rifle. I'd like to have one, but not at anywhere near what they want for them.

What kind of groups do you get at 100 with it?

Quoted: My point has always been that most Minis are not worthless junk, and even if many are disappointing in accuracy, that this is easily and inexpensively remedied. ...simple and inexpensive remedies are available for its problems....you can spend less money accurizing a Mini up to acceptible standards than I have seen people spend on their shorty ARs installing doo-dads of questionable utility.

RAF, could you share with us some of these easy and inexpensive Mini-14 accuracy mods? I'm interested.

Improving the stock mini.

1.You need to glass the action into the stock. The factory fit is way too loose, and lacks the needed barrel/receiver consistency to the stock to achieve constant barrel/receiver tension/placement.

2. The barrel is way too thin, so the options are to either tension sleeve it, or just replace the less than stellar production barrel with heaver custom unit.

3. Since it is a Ruger, the trigger is going to break way too heavy.  A trigger job will crisp and bring the pull weight down to usable 3.5 lb level.

4. The gas system is ported too large for most ammo, and it tends to over work the system. If you going to run stock barrel lengths, you can sleeve it for a smaller fixed port or install an adjustable system to the factory unit to tune it for your loads.



Full blow custom,

1. Double lug the receiver and use tension screws for receiver/ stock lock-up instead of the single point trigger group in the bedded lam stock.

2. Install a 26" broach cut barrel in 22PPC  (got to love the mini-30 action), after you have squared the action and faced/lapped in the bolt.

3. The trigger pack is mod’d out to a M-25 style FCG for a break weight just above 1.5 lbs.

4. Now that you are running a longer barrel, the stock gas system is too far back in the barrel from the muzzle and the gas system/port needs to be pushed forward.  Since you will need to make a new stock for the lugs/scope alignment anyway, you drop the carbine style gas system and install a M-14 piston gas type system father down the barrel.  The New Mini rifle is now a short action M-25 with a barrel long enough to do the PPC round justice.  And since you can shut off the gas system, if needed, you can run the rig as a bolt action using fire form cases sled’d into the action one shot at a time (read in the .3’s).  When it comes to a scope mount system, the Ruger is a rock solid system second to none, and a much better mount than anything currently offered for the M-14  rifles (barring tapping the receiver).  Granted that the new rifle looks very little like the shorter Mini, the receiver is still a Ruger mini, so the end product is a custom Mini.  

As RAF pointed out, the full blown is not something that you may want to do on a new rifle since the prices are much higher now, but back when you could get a used rifle for under $200, it justified the total build price/machining time since you would end up using the receiver, the bolt, and the FCG parts. The stock, the barrel,  and the old gas system with opt rod where sold off, so in the end, you dam near got the used rifle/needed build parts for free.

I like my mini for a carry gun when out knocking around on the home place.
Walking fences, checking cattle, what ever. It seems to carry nicer, I don't know why.
I have a scope on it, and it shoots just fine for me. I would rather shoot my ar but won't sell the mini. This rifle is the exception to the rule, the boy gets 2" groups with wolf and around 1" with better ammo. I never got that kind of groups, but then he shoots it about every other day.
Nice when you have your own range out the back door.

Using the same ammo would be bullsh--.  Every barrel likes different ammo.  Some may like the 68's, some may hate them.  Some like 55 grain fmjbt, some don't.  Half of learning how to shoot well with your weapon is choosing the ammo it likes.  If you were to do a postal match, the ammo that the shooter has found to be the best, including handloads, should be sufficient.  Just like any other match. (Besides Garand A matches).

The original intent of this thread was a guy simply asking for help on what to do about his Mini.  Many of you nice gentleman turned it into a pissing match about AR's vs Mini's.  I can't believe the crap he had to endure to try and gain some HELPFUL knowledge.

As usual, some of you don't know your butt from your brain.  Of course an out of the box mini is not  a stellar performer.  Although I'm sure there are a few.  But there are companies and people that specialize in this system.  Try Accuracy International for one.  There was a member here named M98codered that had a very accurate mini that was built to the hilt.  I admit, I've never seen him shoot so I'm taking it on faith but, he seemed to know his equipment well and I've no doubt the thing shot  well for him.  It was pretty nice looking too.  I wish he could chime in.

And for you patriot, it's ok if you to "give your opinion" but as soon as someone fires back it's because they're sensitive?  Seems like the pot calling the kettle black.  You seem to  have a complex, bragging to everybody how you whupped up on some guys with some garands with your AK.  Great.  Your a regular carlos hathcock.  I recall you telling everybody what a "sniper" rifle is and if it's not a bolt, oh wait, a winchester bolt, it's not a "sniper" rifle.  Have you changed your opinion now, seeing how you've been singing the praises of an AR?  Or are you going to tell me that AR's aren't "sniper" rifles too.

The nice thing would've been to try and help this guy out, but obviously some of you aren't capable.  Too busy making yourself feel good because you have an AR.  Oh wait, this isn't the AR forum either but this guy is being shunned for bringing up the MINI.  Hey ding a lings, it's a scaled down version of the M14.

Once again ignorance runs rampant in the M1A forum.  It's a shame too, becuase folks like Dano523 can be very helpful, but you need a microscope to find the info because you have Frick and Frack muddying the waters.  

My suggestion to Lowrez is to go over to battlerifles.com.  Those guys are much more civilized and it doesn't take as much effort to get what you're looking for.  I don't know if anyone over there knows Mini's though.  But there are many Garand and M14 guys that might know.  And also, google Accuracy International.  And also, if it was me I'd talk to the guy who built it for you.   And to whoever that builder is, Lowrez was nice enough to not mention names, please contact him and get this squared away.  

Quoted: Using the same ammo would be bullsh--.  Every barrel likes different ammo.  Some may like the 68's, some may hate them.  Some like 55 grain fmjbt, some don't.  Half of learning how to shoot well with your weapon is choosing the ammo it likes.  If you were to do a postal match, the ammo that the shooter has found to be the best, including handloads, should be sufficient.  Just like any other match. (Besides Garand A matches). The original intent of this thread was a guy simply asking for help on what to do about his Mini.  Many of you nice gentleman turned it into a pissing match about AR's vs Mini's.  I can't believe the crap he had to endure to try and gain some HELPFUL knowledge. As usual, some of you don't know your butt from your brain.  Of course an out of the box mini is not  a stellar performer.  Although I'm sure there are a few.  But there are companies and people that specialize in this system.  Try Accuracy International for one.  There was a member here named M98codered that had a very accurate mini that was built to the hilt.  I admit, I've never seen him shoot so I'm taking it on faith but, he seemed to know his equipment well and I've no doubt the thing shot  well for him.  It was pretty nice looking too.  I wish he could chime in. And for you patriot, it's ok if you to "give your opinion" but as soon as someone fires back it's because they're sensitive?  Seems like the pot calling the kettle black.  You seem to  have a complex, bragging to everybody how you whupped up on some guys with some garands with your AK.  Great.  Your a regular carlos hathcock.  I recall you telling everybody what a "sniper" rifle is and if it's not a bolt, oh wait, a winchester bolt, it's not a "sniper" rifle.  Have you changed your opinion now, seeing how you've been singing the praises of an AR?  Or are you going to tell me that AR's aren't "sniper" rifles too. The nice thing would've been to try and help this guy out, but obviously some of you aren't capable.  Too busy making yourself feel good because you have an AR.  Oh wait, this isn't the AR forum either but this guy is being shunned for bringing up the MINI.  Hey ding a lings, it's a scaled down version of the M14. Once again ignorance runs rampant in the M1A forum.  It's a shame too, becuase folks like Dano523 can be very helpful, but you need a microscope to find the info because you have Frick and Frack muddying the waters.   My suggestion to Lowrez is to go over to battlerifles.com.  Those guys are much more civilized and it doesn't take as much effort to get what you're looking for.  I don't know if anyone over there knows Mini's though.  But there are many Garand and M14 guys that might know.  And also, google Accuracy International.  And also, if it was me I'd talk to the guy who built it for you.   And to whoever that builder is, Lowrez was nice enough to not mention names, please contact him and get this squared away.

You are right, some of us don't know our butt from our brain and some of us just can't handle being wrong. M14's are not sniper rifles and neither are AR's. I've tried to be nice to you but now I will simply ignore you. Many of the comments I make like "The M14 is not a sniper rifle" or "AR's are more accurate than Mini's" are just common firearm knowledge statements, I'm sorry you and others can't grap that and mistake it for me having a complex.

Oh, and uh, the Mini may look like a little ity bity M14 but it is actually a much different rifle. I think it would be in your best interest to not call people names insulting their intelect considering several things you say are simply wrong.

I'm still waiting for just one of you to bring your match grade Mini 14's to our neck of the woods to shoot against our AR's. I'd like to be at Camp Perry when one of you bring up to a group of shooters that you are going to shoot your Mini's against AR's. That could be the funniest thing I see all year.

PS.....Hathcock used a Model 70

Well okay, I stand corrected, I've never broke down a Mini 14 So I don't exactly know what the differences are.  However, I'm almost certain it is a Gas operated, piston driven system.  Which would be more like an M14 than the AR.

You can state opinions all day long but the fact of the matter is you're wrong.
The army used the XM21 extensively in Vietnam as a sniper rifle.  Which was just an accurized M14.
The army and marines are using the m16 platform in a couple different variants for sniping presently.  

It may not be YOUR defenition of a sniper rifle but nevertheless still stands true.

Hathcock used the model 70 and his spotter on his first tour John Burke used an M14 with iron sights.  And on occaisions they both "sniped" the enemy from the same hide.  But I guess Burke doesn't count because it wasn't a model 70.  And also, according to the book "Marine Sniper" hathcocks first sniper kill was with an M14.  Sorry to confuse you with the facts, or maybe Charles Henderson was just full of crap.  In fact, you probably know more about it then all the people put together that researched this.  

Ignore = ignorant

But to the issue at hand, why is it that you can't help instead of cause discontent??

Quoted: Ok, guys.  Calm down.  No reason to get overheated. The solution for LowRez's problem has been stated early in the thread:  Send the thing back to the gunsmith with an accurate description of the problem.

Look RAF, some peoples mission on this board is to belittle other people and their choice of  firearms.  It's pretty obvious.  How this is helpful is beyond me.  Especially when they have no clue about what they're talking about.

Yeah the bolt on a mini is designed sooooo much differently than a M1 / m14.  Yeah, that receiver doesn't look anything like a m1/m14.  Yeah, that stock doesn't have a smilar line to it.  I think it's more like an AK.  Yeah.

You know they had a term for people that just butt in with no help at all and it  used to not be tolerated.    But hey, this is arfcom, I guess it's to be expected.