w00t!  First AOW picture!

This is a Quicksilver brand pen gun.  It's a first gen gun, all stainless steel and brass.  

Here's a good picture of it:  img212.imageshack.us/img212/5606/pengun1ic3.jpg

The brass ring part in the center is the divider between the barrel (the lower part) and the rest of the gun (the upper part).  One unscrews the barrel from the gun itself, inserts a .22lr cartridge (Colobri or CB Long if you're smart), and screws them back together.

To cock the gun, hold the pen gun so the clip faces downward.  Pull back on the knurled brass knob until the clip falls down and catches.  

img81.imageshack.us/img81/1120/pengun2bl6.jpg

It's now cocked and ready to fire.  The shooter pushes that clip back upward and BANG!

Finally, that brass end of the gun is really a thread protector.  Thus.....

img212.imageshack.us/img212/4930/pengun3vw8.jpg

It cost $300.00 all said and done.  I'm happy with it.  

Mike

This next AOW is still incoming; still awaiting ATF approval on the transfer.  Come to think of it, it's time for another status check on this puppy...

This is an original Smith & Wesson 1917 .45acp with military proofs / US property marked, completely original with original untouched grips, no sanding or refinishing whatsoever!

Unfortunately, back when these guns were just inexpensive revolvers, a shooter bought it and had the rifling completely bored out of the barrel.  Sickening to consider today, but remember-- these were cheap shooters back then.  It's truly a "smooth bore handgun" (unlike a 'shotgun' style, a nifty gun in its own right!), so it was registered it as an AOW.

He also had a choke tube of sorts attached to the end of the barrel.  He had it registered as an AOW and used it exclusively for snake shot.  The gentleman got older, decided to part with it, and sold it to a C3.  I saw it, thought it was nifty and cheap, and decided to buy it.

Here's a pic of the gun as it is now:  img84.imageshack.us/img84/5870/pix43439843dc2.jpg

Here's a close-up of that choke tube thingy:  img81.imageshack.us/img81/9578/pix43439953me0.jpg

If nothing else, the parts are worth what I paid for the gun.  If I like it as a snake gun, fine and dandy.  If not, perhaps I'll be able to find an original matching barrel and restore it to Title I status.  

Finally, the dealer told me I should do a FOIA to determine if the gun (even as a re-made AOW) is older than 50 years.  It may be C&R.  Here's to hoping!

Mike

Originally Posted By David_Hineline: The AOW AR15 pistol was a nice way to get around the 94 AW ban, but I see no point in it now. Now that pistol gripped Rem 870s are available I would go with that over a mossberg.

Unless you're in a place that disallows 'assault' pistols but is okay with AOWs...  I'm surprised it isn't seen more often in New York State, Connecticut, etc.....

Total agreement on the Remingtons, at least when it comes to the Serbu series.  (I still don't have any experience with factory AOWs from either manufacturer.)  I got to shoot Serbu's Mossberg 500 and their Remington 870.  I thought the recoil difference would only be slight due to the rem's heavier weight...  Nope-- it was a NIGHT AND DAY difference.  Some folks thought it was due to Remington back boring the barrel..?  No clue-- except I know that the recoil on the 870-based Serbu was there but managable while the 500-based Serbu was ugly.

img84.imageshack.us/img84/5881/serburemaowgk4.jpg

Sold this Serbu Rem 870 to a friend right before he have up his SOT (retiring from being a FFL entirely this year).  I don't regret getting it to him, but I still wish I had it.

Perhaps I'll buy another...

Mike

Consider this a placeholder for a 'project' AOW that's inbound.  

Sitting down to let others take turns,

Mike

Ok, here....

Nice Stinger, Osprey21!

Mike

Here's mine.

8" bbl. Mossy AOW - $300 (1990) + $5 for stamp.  3200 rounds fired and counting.
Pound for pound the most fun Title II item I've owned.

Factory Mossberg 590 AOW 14" bbl, Speedfeed pistol grip and Tacstar side saddle.
Pat
0-1-25

I'm planning on having my FFL/SOT help me build & register (tax free) an AOW based on the bicycle pump gun in the recent film Munich.  Then transfer the AOW to me for $5.

Originally Posted By hk33k2: Factory Mossberg 590 AOW 14" bbl, Speedfeed pistol grip and Tacstar side saddle. Pat 0-1-25

Isnt that a SBS and NOT an AOW?  No vertical foregrip...

Originally Posted By BlackDog714: Originally Posted By hk33k2: Factory Mossberg 590 AOW 14" bbl, Speedfeed pistol grip and Tacstar side saddle. Pat 0-1-25 i4.photobucket.com/albums/y143/HK33K/AOW.jpg Isnt that a SBS and NOT an AOW?  No vertical foregrip...

No buttstock so it is an AOW and not an SBS.

prebans

I remember reading about your shot revolver some time ago although I'm not sure where.

It seems somewhere in the early 1950's a gunsmith came up with the idea of turning revovlers into mini-shotguns, he even advertised the conversion service in the classifieds in the back of the American Rifleman. The ATF ( ATTU back then I think ) finally caught wind of this and examined a converted revolver, determining that it was a shot pistol and classifying a revolver with the rifling removed to be an AOW.

IIRC this ruling was in 1953, the gunsmith promply stopped the conversions.

I think that the AOW with, say a copy of the classified ad and a copy of the ATTU ruling would make it a heck of a lot more interesting than a plain old rifled barreled Title 1  revolver.  

Edited to add apparently they flip/flopped on this :

Revenue Ruling 57-6

      A rifled bore pistol or revolver of the conventional type is
    not a firearm as defined in section 5848 of the Internal
    Revenue Code of 1954, but a smooth bore "pistol or revolver"
    is a firearm as so defined.
      Revenue Ruling 54-159, C.B. 1954-1, 251, revoked.

    Revenue Ruling 54-159, C.B. 1954-1, 251, holds that the
removal of the rifling from the barrel of .38 and .45 caliber
revolvers and the use of standard revolver cartridge casings, hand
loaded with shot, do not remove such weapons from the
classification of revolvers.
    The Internal Revenue Service has reconsidered, for
classification purposes under the National Firearms Act (chapter 53
of the Internal Revenue Code of 1954), the status of a pistol or
revolver, designed or redesigned to fire through a smooth bore,
primarily fixed ammunition consisting of the case, primer,
propellent charge and "shot" rather than fire, through a rifled
bore, fixed ammunition consisting of the case, primer, propellent
charge and a "bullet."  As a result of the comprehensive ballistics
and practical comparative tests, the weapons have been classified
as follows:
    A rifled bore pistol or revolver of the conventional type
meets the basic requirements of a "small projectile weapon" as
defined in sections 179.35 and 179.37 of the Regulations related to
Machine Guns and Certain Other Firearms, even if loaded with "shot"
cartridges for the reason that it is designed most proficiently
from a ballistics standpoint when discharging a "bullet."
Accordingly, a rifled bore pistol or revolver of the conventional
type is not a firearm as defined in section 5848 of the Code.
    On the other hand, a smooth bore pistol or revolver fails to
meet the basic requirements of a "small projectile weapon" even
when loaded with "bullet cartridges" for the reason that the weapon
is designed to function most proficiently from a ballistics
standpoint when discharging "shot," equalling the potential of
shotguns with comparable specifications.  Therefore a smooth bore
handgun is not a "pistol or revolver" as defined in the regulatory
definitions referred to above and is not entitled to exception from
the provisions of chapter 53 of the Code.  Accordingly it is held
that such a weapon is a firearm as defined in section 5848(1) and
(5) of the Code and as such is subject to the provisions of the
National Firearms Act (chapter 53 of the Code).  
    Revenue Ruling 54-159, C.B. 1954-1, 251, is hereby revoked.
However, under the authority of section 7805(b) of the Code, this
ruling will be applied without retroactive effect.

Originally Posted By Triangle-66: prebans I remember reading about your shot revolver some time ago although I'm not sure where. It seems somewhere in the early 1950's a gunsmith came up with the idea of turning revovlers into mini-shotguns, he even advertised the conversion service in the classifieds in the back of the American Rifleman. The ATF ( ATTU back then I think ) finally caught wind of this and examined a converted revolver, determining that it was a shot pistol and classifying a revolver with the rifling removed to be an AOW. IIRC this ruling was in 1953, the gunsmith promply stopped the conversions. I think that the AOW with, say a copy of the classified ad and a copy of the ATTU ruling would make it a heck of a lot more interesting than a plain old rifled barreled Title 1  revolver.   Edited to add apparently they flip/flopped on this : Revenue Ruling 57-6       A rifled bore pistol or revolver of the conventional type is     not a firearm as defined in section 5848 of the Internal     Revenue Code of 1954, but a smooth bore "pistol or revolver"     is a firearm as so defined.       Revenue Ruling 54-159, C.B. 1954-1, 251, revoked.     Revenue Ruling 54-159, C.B. 1954-1, 251, holds that the removal of the rifling from the barrel of .38 and .45 caliber revolvers and the use of standard revolver cartridge casings, hand loaded with shot, do not remove such weapons from the classification of revolvers.     The Internal Revenue Service has reconsidered, for classification purposes under the National Firearms Act (chapter 53 of the Internal Revenue Code of 1954), the status of a pistol or revolver, designed or redesigned to fire through a smooth bore, primarily fixed ammunition consisting of the case, primer, propellent charge and "shot" rather than fire, through a rifled bore, fixed ammunition consisting of the case, primer, propellent charge and a "bullet."  As a result of the comprehensive ballistics and practical comparative tests, the weapons have been classified as follows:     A rifled bore pistol or revolver of the conventional type meets the basic requirements of a "small projectile weapon" as defined in sections 179.35 and 179.37 of the Regulations related to Machine Guns and Certain Other Firearms, even if loaded with "shot" cartridges for the reason that it is designed most proficiently from a ballistics standpoint when discharging a "bullet." Accordingly, a rifled bore pistol or revolver of the conventional type is not a firearm as defined in section 5848 of the Code.     On the other hand, a smooth bore pistol or revolver fails to meet the basic requirements of a "small projectile weapon" even when loaded with "bullet cartridges" for the reason that the weapon is designed to function most proficiently from a ballistics standpoint when discharging "shot," equalling the potential of shotguns with comparable specifications.  Therefore a smooth bore handgun is not a "pistol or revolver" as defined in the regulatory definitions referred to above and is not entitled to exception from the provisions of chapter 53 of the Code.  Accordingly it is held that such a weapon is a firearm as defined in section 5848(1) and (5) of the Code and as such is subject to the provisions of the National Firearms Act (chapter 53 of the Code).       Revenue Ruling 54-159, C.B. 1954-1, 251, is hereby revoked. However, under the authority of section 7805(b) of the Code, this ruling will be applied without retroactive effect.

Interesting-- thank you!  This gun was amnesty registered with the original date of acquisition being 1954.  Came from Delaware-- the only state (so far) to specifically ban "smooth bore handguns."

I'll have to look for that ad-- THANK YOU!

Mike

Mossberg 590A1 factory AOW converted to "serbu super shorty" by Mark Serbu.  Truly a blast to shoot.

Joe

here is my Ithaca M37 AOW

I just brought this home today paper work showed up yesterday at my dealers. Couldn't ask for a better way to ring in the new year.

Originally Posted By HunterCO: I just brought this home today paper work showed up yesterday at my dealers. Couldn't ask for a better way to ring in the new year.

have you fired it yet??

Originally Posted By HunterCO: I just brought this home today paper work showed up yesterday at my dealers. Couldn't ask for a better way to ring in the new year. i25.photobucket.com/albums/c63/HunterCO/Serbu.jpg

Very nice.  What is it and where can I get one?

www.safetyharborfirearms.com/KEG_12/keg_12.html
or
serbu.com/top/superShorty.php

Wow.  I wish I could have some of those so badly......

Stupid Iowa.

Love the shotgun AOW's by the way.

How are these small shotguns handled?  

All I remember is years and years ago thinking I would be "tacticool" and put a pistol grip on my Mossberg 500... One shot of 00 buck and I threw the pistol grip away and went back to the standard stock.  Damn that was uncomfortable.

Sorry I don't have a pic to contribute.

Originally Posted By tucansam: How are these small shotguns handled?   All I remember is years and years ago thinking I would be "tacticool" and put a pistol grip on my Mossberg 500... One shot of 00 buck and I threw the pistol grip away and went back to the standard stock.  Damn that was uncomfortable. Sorry I don't have a pic to contribute.

first of all you don't shoot them from the hip. You don't shoot a 44 mag from the hip, why would you fire a 12ga from the hip?

The proper technique for this weapon is...

Shoot from eye level, sight down the barrel, weapon fully extended at arms length. With strong hand (trigger hand) PULL back, with support hand PUSH forward.

plus with the short barrel recoil is not as bad as with a 18 inch barrel.

Originally Posted By JThomas: Very nice.  What is it and where can I get one?

What David said that is a Serbu super shorty I upgraded to a mossburg 500. I also had sling mounts added and the front sight. The sling mounts are on the other side you can't see them in the picture. I also got the holster as you can see in the pic.

As for how these are handled Donner is 100% correct in his post above. They are not bad to shoot if you use the proper technique. I did cover the front grip on my Serbu with rubber to make it a little fatter and to make it more comfortable.

Originally Posted By prebans: Sold this Serbu Rem 870 to a friend right before he have up his SOT (retiring from being a FFL entirely this year).  I don't regret getting it to him, but I still wish I had it. Perhaps I'll buy another... Mike

For you Serbu owners:  Why did you get it in the first place?  I don't know why but I like the look of it and I'm really thinking of getting one.  I'd likely get the Rem 870.  Small Arms Review had a short write-up so that's when I started obsessing about it.

Also, why did you go for the AOW instead of the SBS?

Originally Posted By C-4: Also, why did you go for the AOW instead of the SBS?

While I don't have either yet I would think some have AOWs because their states don't allow SBS, another reason is I don't believe you need to file paperwork to take AOWs interstate while you do with SBSs. I have an AR pistol I am getting ready to do one or the other to, I am shipping the action off to Orion Arms this week to get the engraving. I guess I'll have to decide once it comes back.

Originally Posted By sharps54: Originally Posted By C-4: Also, why did you go for the AOW instead of the SBS? While I don't have either yet I would think some have AOWs because their states don't allow SBS, another reason is I don't believe you need to file paperwork to take AOWs interstate while you do with SBSs. I have an AR pistol I am getting ready to do one or the other to, I am shipping the action off to Orion Arms this week to get the engraving. I guess I'll have to decide once it comes back.

I'd go with the AR SBR.  You'll love it.

Originally Posted By C-4: Originally Posted By prebans: Sold this Serbu Rem 870 to a friend right before he have up his SOT (retiring from being a FFL entirely this year).  I don't regret getting it to him, but I still wish I had it. Perhaps I'll buy another... Mike For you Serbu owners:  Why did you get it in the first place?  I don't know why but I like the look of it and I'm really thinking of getting one.  I'd likely get the Rem 870.  Small Arms Review had a short write-up so that's when I started obsessing about it. Also, why did you go for the AOW instead of the SBS?

The short package is nice.  They're great out in the desert (I'm in AZ) for snake protection.

Why AOW?

1.  $195.00 in tax savings;

2.  Only banned in 5 states;

3.  No 5320.20 when you travel interstate.

Why SBS?

1.  You can use a buttstock;

2.  You can use a rifled slug barrel;

3.  Costs the same to MAKE as an AOW;

4.  The gun itself is less expensive than an AOW.

FWIW,

Mike

Originally Posted By Reverend_Deadboy: Wow.  I wish I could have some of those so badly...... Stupid Iowa. Love the shotgun AOW's by the way.

I thought Iowa allowed AOWs..?

Mike

Originally Posted By prebans: Originally Posted By C-4: For you Serbu owners:  Why did you get it in the first place?  I don't know why but I like the look of it and I'm really thinking of getting one.  I'd likely get the Rem 870.  Small Arms Review had a short write-up so that's when I started obsessing about it. Also, why did you go for the AOW instead of the SBS? The short package is nice.  They're great out in the desert (I'm in AZ) for snake protection. Why AOW? 1.  $195.00 in tax savings; 2.  Only banned in 5 states; 3.  No 5320.20 when you travel interstate. Why SBS? 1.  You can use a buttstock; 2.  You can use a rifled slug barrel; 3.  Costs the same to MAKE as an AOW; 4.  The gun itself is less expensive than an AOW. FWIW, Mike

Thank you Mike.  Do you know who makes Rem 870 SBS's?  I looked on Serbu's site and they don't list SBS's.  

Originally Posted By prebans: Originally Posted By Reverend_Deadboy: Wow.  I wish I could have some of those so badly...... Stupid Iowa. Love the shotgun AOW's by the way. I thought Iowa allowed AOWs..? Mike

Only non shotguns based AOWs

Originally Posted By David_Hineline: Originally Posted By prebans: Originally Posted By Reverend_Deadboy: Wow.  I wish I could have some of those so badly...... Stupid Iowa. Love the shotgun AOW's by the way. I thought Iowa allowed AOWs..? Mike Only non shotguns based AOWs

Talk about a state splitting hairs.

Originally Posted By C-4: Originally Posted By prebans: Originally Posted By C-4: For you Serbu owners:  Why did you get it in the first place?  I don't know why but I like the look of it and I'm really thinking of getting one.  I'd likely get the Rem 870.  Small Arms Review had a short write-up so that's when I started obsessing about it. Also, why did you go for the AOW instead of the SBS? The short package is nice.  They're great out in the desert (I'm in AZ) for snake protection. Why AOW? 1.  $195.00 in tax savings; 2.  Only banned in 5 states; 3.  No 5320.20 when you travel interstate. Why SBS? 1.  You can use a buttstock; 2.  You can use a rifled slug barrel; 3.  Costs the same to MAKE as an AOW; 4.  The gun itself is less expensive than an AOW. FWIW, Mike Thank you Mike.  Do you know who makes Rem 870 SBS's?  I looked on Serbu's site and they don't list SBS's.

contact Mark, He has built them as SBS in the past.

Originally Posted By David_Hineline: Originally Posted By prebans: Originally Posted By Reverend_Deadboy: Wow.  I wish I could have some of those so badly...... Stupid Iowa. Love the shotgun AOW's by the way. I thought Iowa allowed AOWs..? Mike Only non shotguns based AOWs

Thank you for that clarification.  

%$#@!

Iowa's a nice state, but their gun laws sure do suck.

Mike

Originally Posted By C-4: Originally Posted By prebans: Originally Posted By C-4: For you Serbu owners:  Why did you get it in the first place?  I don't know why but I like the look of it and I'm really thinking of getting one.  I'd likely get the Rem 870.  Small Arms Review had a short write-up so that's when I started obsessing about it. Also, why did you go for the AOW instead of the SBS? The short package is nice.  They're great out in the desert (I'm in AZ) for snake protection. Why AOW? 1.  $195.00 in tax savings; 2.  Only banned in 5 states; 3.  No 5320.20 when you travel interstate. Why SBS? 1.  You can use a buttstock; 2.  You can use a rifled slug barrel; 3.  Costs the same to MAKE as an AOW; 4.  The gun itself is less expensive than an AOW. FWIW, Mike Thank you Mike.  Do you know who makes Rem 870 SBS's?  I looked on Serbu's site and they don't list SBS's.

Remington makes them as factory guns but it's hard to find them on the civilian market.  (I assume they have internal policies against civilian sales of factory NFA weapons.)  However, you can easily Form 1 your own Remington 870 SBS.

Mike

Remington makes them as factory guns but it's hard to find them on the civilian market.  (I assume they have internal policies against civilian sales of factory NFA weapons.)  However, you can easily Form 1 your own Remington 870 SBS. Mike

To make your own... on form 1, would it still be a $5 fee or would it then be $200? I already did a form 1 for an SBR... but that's $200.

Thanks!

Originally Posted By SBRguy: To make your own... on form 1, would it still be a $5 fee or would it then be $200? I already did a form 1 for an SBR... but that's $200. Thanks!

It would be $200 to MAKE an AOW as an individual.  An SOT can make one tax free then and TRANSFER it to you upon an approved $5 stamp.

$5 AOW transfer tax.

I'll add this one now too.

MAC .22 AOW

Single shot pen gun

Very nice.  What is it?

Originally Posted By JThomas: Very nice.  What is it?

Sorry about that, original post edited

MAC .22 AOW

Single shot pen gun

My first AOW jump through the hoops...but not my last. Ithaca mod 87 in stainless.



The case is 24" long for reference.

P.S. Anyone know where I can get the Pachmayer grip for Ithaca? Purty Please...?

When was that Ithaca 87  receiver manufactured?

Originally Posted By BurntPocketHole: i98.photobucket.com/albums/l263/BurntPocketHole/P8090126.jpg i98.photobucket.com/albums/l263/BurntPocketHole/P8090130.jpg i98.photobucket.com/albums/l263/BurntPocketHole/P8090131.jpg

Is that a suppressor on the .22 conversion?

Where did you get the butt cap?

Thanks!

Originally Posted By JThomas: Is that a suppressor on the .22 conversion?   Yes, Sir.  4"bbl, 6"can Where did you get the butt cap? Spikes Tactical "pistol plug" Thanks!

BPH

My new AOW build is complete!   Form 1 is approved and at my SOT's.  I'm picking it up sometime in the next few days.  It started life as a Mossy.  

There is a knack to firing these. You will find a hold/method that is best. This setup is the most comfortable for me. The mini shells are fun.

T/C Encore pistol registered as an AOW with a 12.5" 28 gauge barrel.

Originally Posted By wdlsguy: www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=59782&stc=1&d=1182651601 T/C Encore pistol registered as an AOW with a 12.5" 28 gauge barrel.

Nice!!