I got a FART from family for Christmas.  Just ordered a Frankfort screen using a gift card.  Thanks for the link!  I’ll be cleaning brass like mad shortly.  Thanks to everyone for all the tips so far.

Hello all, got one of those FART wet tumblers this year! I've only used vibratory until now.

I'll need to ask for the mixture 'formula' for 1k count .223,  any suggestion(s) are appreciated men.

I plan to do the 1k for my first run today. I have Dawn and Lemishine. Should I use distilled water, will this give better results?

Thanks
Bishop3

Everyone’s water is different.  I would never use this thing if I felt like I needed to pay for distilled water each time.  So my answer is no to that

Personally I use 2 or 3 tablespoons of soap depending on how dirty it is.  Then 1 heaping teaspoon of lemishine.

Got it, they will go in the wash today. My only other concern would be recovering the pins. I have an idea flushing/rinsing cases with water through my 'old' media strainer or something to that effect. I do have the FA magnet. I'll work my plan & figure out a process eventually for media recovery. I do not have the rotary media separator so we'll see how this goes.

Thanks

How did you separate media before, when using a vibratory tumbler?

I used a standard media separator. Looks like a plastic bowl type strainer.

ETA: I'm going to order the mesh screen/strainers for the wet tumbler today.

I'll go ahead and post my FART process start to finish.  I am still developing this so it is subject to change.

Tools:
FART and the pins that came with it
Frankford platinum wet/dry media separator
Frankford strainer caps
Frankford magnet
Frankford brass dryer
Armor All Wash And Wax
Lemi Shine
Old Beach towel

I didn't buy any of the Frankford stuff on amazon though - I got a better deal at Brownell's using a discount code, they support this site, and they are easier to work with in case of a warranty issue or I am not happy with something down the road.

Seal up one side of the FART.  I had some trouble with mine sealing well, still do.  I use some pool o-ring lubricant/dielectric grease (just anything that is 100% silicone) to get a good seal and mark one side with a sharpie to never remove.  Then I work only from the other side.

Get the pins into the FART.  You can use the magnet, but normally I just pour them in from the media separator.  You don't need to get 100% of the pins in, some will stick to the media separator, but this is no big deal and saves a ton of time trying to transfer them with the magnet.  Once in a while I will use the magnet to transfer, just to remove all the brass residue from the separator.

Pour in about 9-10 lbs of brass.  This is around 700 cases of .223, and 1000 cases of 9mm.  Frankford says they can handle 1000 .223 cases but I get better results with a little less.

Pour in 3 tablespoons (measured) of detergent, and 1 heaping teaspoon of LemiShine.  You might have to adjust this for your water/results.

Fill the water in between 2-3" above the brass, or 2-3" below the neck (full) and do not find much difference at all.  I use HOT water.  I find hot water creates a vacuum as it cools and reduces leaks.  Probably doesn't matter.

Tumble for 3 hours.  If I really need the primer pockets to be spotless, it often takes 4 hours.

Take the tumbler to the sink, and CAREFULLY remove the sealed cap.  You have to be careful as pins will stick to the sides and can go flying and in your sink drains.  I then run COLD water into the FART until the soap bubble stop overflowing.  Install the strainer and retaining ring, and dump the water.  Refill with cold water, and repeat this one more time (3 water dumps).  Then I fill it back up with cold water and carry this to my media separator.

The full load of water is usually perfect for the media separator fill level as the water helps the pins fall out of your brass.  Then I put the lid on and tumble for longer than you feel like should be necessary.  I don't ever want any pins left in my brass.  The Frankford media seperator sucks.  It is weak, wobbly, and leaks even with the lid on.  But it is better than anything else I have so I just work on a small portable plastic table and lay some old towels around to deal with water spillage.

I take the lid off, and move the media separator containing the brass to the lid, and rotate it dry.  I do this to watch for any pins that might shake out, just to measure that I am wet-separating long enough.

Then I lay out a big beach towel on the floor, and pour the brass from the media separator into it, and picking up both ends, roll the mass of brass from end to end in the air.  I started doing this because I was getting water spots on my brass (hard water here) even when using my brass dryer.  This step eliminated that.

Then I transfer the brass to my dryer/dehydrator.  I just let it dry for 3 hours - while I start another batch in the tumbler.  People say 1 hour is enough, but I have not found that to be true, for the inside of bottleneck rifle cases to be completely dry.  For 9mm, 1 hour seems to be plenty.


This written process may seem like a lot, but it really isn't.  I am processing brass so much faster in way bigger batches than I ever was before.  I didn't realize how much old brass I had laying around in different stages of processing, until I got this thing.  Now, I am about 90% done going through all of it.

The positives are much larger batch sizes, cleaner brass, much cleaner primer pockets, and that the consumable costs are pretty low.  The negatives are the initial expense, the tumbler motor is REALLY LOUD when tumbling, and dealing with dumping of the dirty water.  I use my kitchen sink, but I remove anything that could get contaminated from the area each time, and then clean the sink and wipe down the surrounding area when I am done.  

Some people are tumbling without the pins, but I do not find dealing with them is troublesome at all.  I have had a few stick sideways in a primer pockets (short pins) and a few stick in .308 necks.  I discard these pins when that happens.

If I was only going to do smaller batches, I'd get the FART lite.

Zero regrets.  I only regret not getting into this sooner.  I'm wondering now that I am caught up, would I really prefer a smaller FART lite.  Time will tell.

My batch is running right now. What about the Armour All Wash & Wax (detergent ?), how do you use that in the process?

Thanks for posting up your brass cleaning process. I'm glad I got into the wet tumbling.

Eta: I used Dawn dish soap as the detergent in this first batch.

I use that instead of Dawn based on some recommendations in this thread.  It is said that this leaves a light coating of wax on the brass, which aids in sizing straight wall pistol slightly, and also reduces tarnishing of the brass over time.  I have verified I could feel the difference when sizing 9mm cases, but have not verified the benefits from long term tarnishing or not.  It is also cheaper than dawn if used in the same quantities, not that it matters.

Good to know, I'll get a bottle to try out!

Got one of these from Santa.  I have a bunch of plastic buckets that are about 2-3 gallons.  I drilled 5/16 holes in the bottom of one bucket and sit it cockeyed inside a bucket with no holes.  I pour brass/pins into top bucket and use garden hose and my hand to mix the brass around and make the pins fall into the lower bucket.  Takes about 1 minute to get all the loose pins to drop through, then I nest the buckets and mix the brass around in the standing water which gets all the pins out of the insides of the cases.  Repeat 1-2 times and pins are all out and brass is rinsed.  Takes under 10 minutes, maybe under 5.  

I use tap water, cheapest lemon dish soap available(lot of soap, 2-3 large squeezes), and a bit of lemi shine.  Mirror finish on my brass.  Seems to clean better when the drum is nearly full of water, I leave maybe an inch of air in the top.  

Attached File

Does it help when belling the case mouth so don't have to tumble the brass in corn cob media to get a dusty coating on the inside?

First attempt 676 -
.223 cases.
A couple of tablespoons (2 generous squirts) Dawn detergent, 45 ACP case of Lemishine, tap water, 3 hour spin:

Attached File


It took a few rinses to recover pins.

Now to dehydrate in my oven a couple of hours.

Pretty satisfied thus far.

Primer pockets, could go another hour possibly
Attached File

When the tumbler is running it looks like brass gets stranded by the lid and isnt tumbling. Anyone else seeing this or having this happen?

Doesn't seem to be enough to matter.  I just turned out my first 100 rounds after processing a huge load of brass, and some of them stuck really bad there, while others not at all.  I'll have to do something different if this is the norm I think.

Not in mine, but you have the FART lite.  Is that a small load?  Have you tried filling it with less water and allowing for more air?

Never saw that, is there water in it?  I don't see soap suds

There is water in it, I'll try less and see what happens.

Also yes, it is the Lite model. Frankly, I think the tub is poorly designed around the mouth of the tumbler.

I did my first couple batches in my new FART.  I drain it in my bathtub.  I bought a circular magnet to put on the drain to catch any stray pins.  Pins are no big deal.  My issue so far is the damn soap and bubbles.  It seems no matter how many times I fill and empty the tumbler, there is still a ton of soap on the brass when I use the media separator.  

I loaded up another batch and put a lot less Dawn in this one.  I'll do the separator then hit it again with water  and then go to a towel.

you have the small FART or the big FART?  The big one has caps on both ends and I just put the optional screen on one end and leave the top end open and hose the bejesus out of it, no soap issues.

Once the pins are separated you can put the brass in a bucket of water and rinse the brass some more

I rinse mine with water while in the separator so soap suds are a non-issue.  Most of the suds get poured out anyway when I dump the water before dumping the brass into the separator.  I pour in a sloppy capful of Armorall and a 45 shell full of Lemi-Shine.  I've never had to go for more than an hour for clean brass.  If you're still getting a pop from the expander die, you can run more Armorall in the next batch.  Don't use hot water for wash or rinse, luke warm at best.  You can also try lubing the brass with One-Shot.  What I do is put 3-400 pieces of brass in a 1 gallon plastic bag and then several shots of One-Shot.  Shake the bag around for a couple of minutes and then try a few in the die to see if runs easier.

I have the big one and those screens too.  I'll do that.  I don't know why I didn't think of it.  My mind was stuck on only taking one cap off.

I've never used the included screens, I just use one of the lyman sifters on a bucket.

Dump all of the brass into the sifter, shake the hell out of it, pins are in the bucket.

Run a large magnet through it a couple times.

Remove pins from bucket, dump brass in, fill bucket with water a couple times while swishing them around by hand, done.

https://www.amazon.com/Lyman-Products-Turbo-Sifter-Separator/dp/B00TFZ27B6

Had no idea you guys weren't using a regular separator like this.  The right equipment makes a huge difference.

What is the consensus on the "best" media separator or are they all about the same?

The best is the BIG Dillon one.  However, it would suck for wet tumbling because it is too big, filling it with water would be a pain, and it doesn't have a lid so it would make more of a mess.  Unless you are processing HUGE quantities.  Some have bought two dillon units, and just used the second one as a lid.

I have the Frankford with tumbler and lid, and it is mediocre at best.  It was poorly designed as the lid allows pins and water to leak out while spinning it.... and it is flimsy.  But I have processed 15k 9mm and 5k 5.56, along with many batches of .357, 44mag, 30-06, etc.  Its holding up fine.

I used to have the RCBS, which STM/MEC/others directly copied.  I am not sure how good that it - as it has a flat flanged, non-overlapping lid, which would leak water while spinning from what I can tell.  It's biggest defect was a WEAK hinge, and does not appear improved.  It eventually fell apart on me and I pitched it when I got a Dillon, for dry tumbling.

There might be others out there.

I've used the STM for 6-7 years and 25-30k rounds.  Works great in the kitchen or outside on the picnic table.  You're not going 30,000 rpm with the thing so water leakage is a non-issue.  You can use it with the top/bottom off or on, it doesn't matter.  I've popped it off the hinges hundreds of times and it still works fine.  I think some people are overthinking a relatively simple operation.  Spend more time on the fun part of testing and shooting your loads.

I've reached STM Baller status.

Got my first stuck pin, I mixed some small primed cases with my large primed cases so sorting the cases after they've been tumbled.
Stuck in the flash hole

Attached File


As suspected, the pin is out of spec, it's the top one.  I trashed it.  What's weird is the magnet on the stick didn't detect this pin, maybe the 45ACP case was just too heavy for the pin to stick.

Attached File

My recent spins with hot tap water, 2 good squirts of Dawn detergent & a 45 case full of Lemishine Booster. I rinse three times in a 5 gallon bucket, use a separator/strainer with cold water and remove pins with the magnet as I go with the rinse(s). Also the pins fall into bucket for retrieval. Attached File

Attached File
Attached File


I've ran 3 batches this way so far with stellar results. So far so good, my next batch will be with the Armor All Wash n Wax.
In hindsight after corn cob & walnut vibratory cleaning,
could've started wet tumbling alot sooner. I like the bling!

Thanks for all the tips.
How much Armor All for my next spin?
Attached File

Just to follow up... I am just finishing up a run of 5000 9mm loads, using Berry's and Extreme 147RN plated with VV N320.

My first 100 were pretty sticky, about 50% of the time.  My last 4900 were flawless.  I did two things:

1.  I pulled the powder drop funnel/expander and polished the expander portion in a drill.  I started with some coarse grit sandpaper, and worked my way up to 2000 grit, putting a mirror finish on it.
2.  I backed off the amount I was expanding just a little bit

After this, I could occasionally barely feel one case stick to the expander, but it was so light it took no additional force.  Very smooth.  Most cases did not stick at all.  I have no idea if the Armor all wax had any bearing on this.  I'd need to try some test batches later with dawn vs armor-all wash n wax to see.

I use 3 tablespoons.  Seems to work and keep it sudsy.

They look good.

How long was the run?  How the primer pockets look?  What you doing to dry the cases?

Thanks!
My average run is 3 hours.
The primer pockets are mostly shiny completely cleaned to very good. I'm satisfied with the 3 hour spin.  

After '3 rinses' in cold water, I'm using the folded towel method back and forth to dry & this works well.
Then I take my wife's old baking sheet, spread out cases on it (she noticed this the other day) goes in my oven on 'dehydrate mode' preset 150 deg. for an 1-2 hours depending on the case.

For me the process isn't much trouble and I'm becoming more efficient on the rinse and pin transfer. I've found that 3 rinses gets it done for me. I do like the results, it is definitely worth the time to do it.

I'll do a batch or 2 of 45  this week with the Armor All.
Attached File

Attached File

I wish I had an explanation as to why I like the shiny brass so much.  I'm on my third batch in my new FART.  I'm trying some different chemicals beyond just Dawn and Lemishine.  

It's so damn shiny.  

It's definitely a lot more work, but it's worth it.


Dat shine tho

I need to work on my method for drying out the pins.  Been leaving them in the bottom of the FA Media Separator, then pouring as much water out as possible.  The bottom has a little screen to catch stray pins, but most of the pins are one wet glob and as you tilt the tub more and more vertical the pins will avalanche and fall out in one big bunch.

So now I pour the pins into another bucket, a 5 gallon one, able to pour a lot more water out before they all start to avalanche.  Then I pour them into bottom of the media separator, use the transfer magnet to round up the strays,  and every few hours swirl them around.  Takes a day or so for them to dry out

I'm sure if I let them sit in the summer sun for a few hours they'd dry out fast, but it's winter and colder

Why do you care if the pins dry?  Mine have been wet for a month, and 25k cases.

At this moment they are underwater.

I have the Lite as well and have noticed this. I have noticed cases become stationary at the lid as well. I have used the HF tumbler for years so the Lite is a nice upgrade. I have ran a couple loads in the Lite but will have to document water amount, cases and pins to see if this can be corrected. Doesn't seem to have much affect on outcome. Brass has been pristine including primer pockets.

I thought they'd rust, stainless steel can rust eventually

I just store the pins in the tumbler itself.  I don't dry them.  I don't see the point.

I pour them into the bottom or top half of the strainer bucket and pour the water out.  I then put them on a cookie sheet or cake pan and leave them out in the sun to dry.  You could also stick then in the oven for an hour or so to dry them.  I store them in a tupperware container with the tumbler.   I'm confused as to why this seems so hard.

It isn't hard.  People are simply discussing what they do, and what works for them.  Some people actually enjoy the process of reloading, including brass processing (which is what this thread is dedicated to).   I disagree with your statement on "overthinking".  We are all here to learn and discuss.

This is what I do.  I even saw a youtube video where someone stored them with an inch of water in a tray.  I imagine if I knew I were not going to use the tumbler for a month or so, I might leave the pins out in a plastic tray, and just let them air dry over time.

I'm learning too, on my 10th batch or so.  I don't want to ruin $40 worth of pins.

Think I'll store in the drum with the straining caps on it, will allow all the water to drain, they'll be in the drum where they need to be eventually.

I use a wire mesh style bathroom trashcan as my brass separator.

Pour the brass and pins into the trashcan and shake vigorously over a 5 gallon bucket until the pins come out.

Pour the brass into a coffee can and fill with water to get rid of the suds. Pour back through the wire trashcan to remove any stuck pins.

On the subject of drying the pins I simply don't!

I have had my FART for 3 years and my pins stay wet in the tumbler all the time.

Just got my tumbler last week. Got the large one with the magnet off Amazon for $163, which I thought was a great deal.

Been tumbling up a storm here. Haven't been reloading for years, but been collecting all my brass.

Tumbled about half my 223 I have, about 4k so far. Now working through my pistol brass. Experimenting with the times and soap mixtures.

Fill halfway with brass and started with 60 min, no pins-tap hot water, Dawn 2 squirts and lemishime about tbsp. clean but not super shiny

bump it up to 90 min-Real shiny but dulls a little after it dries.

Added More dawn and less lemishine and it seems to stay shiny after it dries.

Now trying car wash soap I had (McGuire's  brand) with lemishine on the pistol brass.

Air drying on all of the brass.

Just tried this for the first time this morning got good results.  Seems to leave some type of waxy film on the brass, hard to tell. Already had some so didn't go out and buy this just for WT

Attached File
Attached File

Here's my ghetto sound dampening system

I love it!!!  I hate how loud mine is.  It’s easily twice as loud as my vibratory tumbler.  If my garage door is open and someone is walking their dog nearby they always look toward my house with a puzzled face.

Frankford needs to make the motor and gearing quiet.  There is no good reason for it to be this loud.

A heads up for people just getting started with wet tumbling - make sure your brass is completely dry before storing, especially if you're using an airtight container.  At the very least, leave the containers open for a few weeks or check them periodically to make sure you don't have moisture in them.  The moisture WILL make the bling go away!

You could throw a Harbor Freight moving blanket over that to make it even quieter.  Might want to leave an air opening in the bottom for motor cooling.