Exactly.

I know it's easy enough to do a batch of fingerprint cards and passport photos yourself, but with SilencerShop there are only two things you need to do (after using the kiosk once); Purchase a tax stamp and Docusign.

Both can be done from the convenience of your phone, and take mere minutes at most. It takes longer to call the Tech Branch to check on the status of your Form 4 than it does to submit one through SilencerShop.

Whether it actually adds time to the process or not has been debated, but we have at least one poster in this thread claiming that SilencerShop Form 4s are being processed faster. I know it's anecdotal, and a small sample size, but this forum is where I get most of my ATF gossip and these are the things I like to read about.

OP, I can understand being upset about feeling lied to, or lack of customer service. Customer service is a very big deal to me, but I also understand it can be a matter of perspective. Just as the previous claim of SilencerShop forms being processed faster, your claim is anecdotal and also a small sample size. Additionally, negative experiences can often build in intensity the more you stew on it, and can be easily blown out of proportion.

As of right now, I have no reason to avoid using SilencerShop based on your one bad experience with them. I like the service that SilencerShop offers, and will continue to use them for my needs based on my perception of the value added.

You are welcome to do otherwise, but please don't get upset when people refuse to heed your warning based on your one bad experience. I appreciate you bringing the issue into the open for others to consider, but it sure sounds to me like you're now firmly in the territory of "Stop liking what I don't like".

Now that you've said your piece, go ahead and file your Form 4s and then update this thread in 6 months. I'd really like to hear back from you on the the actual number of days it takes for both methods, so we can add to our sample size for future reference. Who knows, you might even be surprised by the results.

I just ordered a can from my toilet... the ease of use outweighs a possible 10-15% extended wait.

That's the best place to order from. Keep the wife's prying eyes away.

Left my AOW F4 out the other day and the wife asked what was so special about this one that it was $5 versus all of my other green $2 stamps. 

That's gold.

I wish they did batches twice a month (or more), but their service is totally worth it...and I will continue to gladly pay for it.  It's so much better than the ATFs attempt at eForms, they are not even in the same universe.

That, and you don't have to get anything notarized (which is not a big deal if you are at home, but I'm working overseas, and fresh out of notaries).  It takes about 20 seconds to drop a form 1 once you're in the system.

I'm glad OP brought this delay to light, I just assumed a month to cash it was the new normal. I am not upset but now that I know that along with my LGS now doing prints and pictures on sight for free I will most likely use the LGS.
The Powered dealer was an hour drive each way so even if I only go there once to get the can it ends up being as much time as doing the paper work at LGS that is 2 minutes from home.

Lol nice

^This, I was 20 stamps in prior to 41F, my first 3 Post 41F forms have been through SS. At this point the wait doesn't bother me, the ease of the kiosk submittal, trumps any lingering impatient feelings...

Horseshit. You chose a disgusting attack on my mother and a disease. You should be banned.
If all you wanted was to present a "foil" there are thousands of other ways to use as a comparison.

You wrote: "I've used the Silencer Shop Kiosk for 4 Form 4 Applications, beginning in April....." That doesn't specify whether you bought directly through SS or had your local dealer add your incoming transfers to his SS inventory, allowing SS to process your Form 4's. Being that 99% of all Form 4's processed by Silencer Shop are for purchases FROM Silencer Shop, you can surely understand why it's pretty darn logical to assume you bought those silencers from SS.

Whether you found my post constructive, mean spirited or materially false is laughable. I don't give a shit. Your sole reason for your post was to trash Silencer Shop. That's not constructive, is mean spirited and based on their excellent reputation materially false. Your reputation is the one suffering, not Silencer Shop.

Fixed.
So you only have one FFL/SOT where you live?
Again YOU MAKE YOUR OWN CHOICES IN LIFE. You chose an FFL/SOT that prefers the Silencer Shop system.

Whether I took it "seriously" is immaterial. You made a disgusting attack on another members family. You should be banned. Never once in my 8400 odd posts have I used such a "foil" as you call it. Yet in your 220 posts you have. Proud of yourself sport?

 
You can stick your apology.

I’ve probably done close to 30, if not more F1 & F4’s thru the SS kiosk since July ‘17. I’ve had checks cashed within a week, and a couple took almost 2 months, but the vast majority of them were cashed at around 2 weeks.

It doesn’t bother me that using SS might delay the cashed day due to them sending in a 15lb box of forms and mine are somewhere in that mess.

I much more enjoy having a nice beer, having brain thoughts about what guns I can SBR and filing a complete F1 before the rational side of my brain tells me that it’s the dumbest thing ever and it serves no purpose. That’s how I F1’d a 7mm rem mag down to 10.5 or so.

I haven’t shot my guns in 2018 so convenience at the sake of a longer wait doesn’t bother me

Like I said, if you go back to when they introduced the Form1 service, you'll see plenty of discussion on the merits of the Silencershop system. Makes things easier, costs some $. So same thing here, might be some time delay, but you can buy easier.

If my local kiosk dealers were more accessible and known to me, I'd probably give it a go. That said, I find the idea that they do so many forms so that leads to delay a bit off. They also have a system pretty well established and automated I think. If they can't print forms/prints and toss in an envelope in 2-3 minutes, meh. That said, I worked at a dealer years ago and I'm sure there's enough errors (From customers) to delay their system here and there.

... am I in GD? Or did I make a wrong turn at Albuquerque?

You mean to tell me you shoot your guns? And get them all dirty?

The real problem is with the ATF and how they process the paperwork.   Nothing is processed in order.  Just look at the NFA tracking.   They enter, cash & approve based on their own timeline.  It doesn’t matter who or how your forms with CC or check is sent because it’s the GOV processing and they could careless how it’s done.

Bro at that rate we may never ColaWar, you make me sad

ETA: Did my first Kiosk run using the Form 1 side though and it took exactly 31 days from Form1/Tax Stamp purchase to ATF check cashed. With that said at what looks to be 6 month waits right now on Form 1's & 4's no big deal really. I can remember the short-lived but glorious Efile Form 1 days (under 60 day approvals) to the not so past year long Form 1's. Besides now that I am in the system I can have my SOT/FFL do them directly and buy my cans from anyone (SS=TX=Tax).

I just have to point out that the best part of this thread is all the side bar discussion of you guys buying cans while being on the can Makes this thread totally worth it.

The rest of all the opinions on the SS business model is also entertaining. Bottom line, if you like their model, roll with it.  If you don't then do it in what ever other way you want.  Other than being misinformed about the timeline from form 3 approval to being physically mailed to my dealer I liked the process and my subsequent purchases will be through them.  Now I know roughly how long it will be from ordering  at SS to being physically at my dealers range so I can test drive them for at least 6 months.

Remember when Eforms F1 was 30 days or so?

Lol
Seriously, bought my MP5 around thanksgiving and it’s unfired

Its all good. I have a ton of guns unfired. And silencers. Life happens.

For a Form 1, you don't need them to be near you.  Upload a trust (or buy their service), mail them fingerprints, upload a photo.  Then, go to the shitter, drop a deuce, and be finished with the form 1 before it's time to do the paperwork.

My first SBR took 45 days and I remember getting antsy about it.

I guess your reading comprehension needs some work then.  Any reasonable person would have read that not as an attack, but as a baseless statement - just as yours was baseless.  The fact that you can't see that is, frankly, staggering.

I guess you can read my mind now as well.  "My sole purpose was to trash Silencer Shop."  That.is.impressive - the way you can divine my intent, will, motivation and purpose.  Especially when it is WRONG.  I'm an ardent free market capitalist.  I believe in disseminating information where there is a lack of it so people can make informed decisions.  Others have found my information useful and have changed course.  Still others have read my comments, considered them and determined that the additional delay is worth the "simplification".  I do not begrudge them that at all.  They have made a decision that is informed.  It actually helps me, if you think about it, because my application will slide in before theirs now.

Nothing in my posts have been false . . . materially or otherwise.  Your logic isn't working out.  Just because a company's reputation is "excellent" doesn't mean that they won't do things poorly at some point.  In fact, there is a clear history of successful companies getting "too big for their britches" and start doing really crappy things to their customers.  Silencer Shop lied to me.  And they lied about batching their forms.  That is fact.  Beyond that, when they were telling me that the information the prior representative had told me was false, they said that they had "several occurrences" of similar behavior, so they thought they may know who was doing the lying.  Feel free and call their compliance department to confirm that my conversation took place.  You certainly don't have to take my word for it.

I get it.  You spend A LOT of time on AR15.com.  A LOT.  That doesn't give you a basis for saying things that aren't true.

OMG.  So melodramatic.  I said "Your statement is false. You have no basis for making that statement, just as I have no basis for saying [comment about you]".  The statement was offered because it wasn't true.  You are the one who keeps on going back to it . . ."  Keep on clutching those pearls though, buddy.

Where did you get this figure?  I highly doubt that is anywhere near accurate.  And if it's not accurate, then your "pretty darn logic[al] assum[ption]" isn't that logical.  I'd be willing to believe it's about 50%, but it's not 99%.

For instance, I'd estimate that my FFL has about 50 silencers in stock on the shelf (they're large).  They sell them, and each one of them is processed using the Silencer Shop kiosk.  Beyond that, for me, my FFL doesn't stock the silencers that I tend to want (TBAC, B&T), so I have to order them from online shops.  Those are also processed through the Kiosk.  I would say that at that kiosk alone, maybe 20% of applications are purchased from Silencershop.  Just a guess, but it ain't nowhere near 99%.

Unless you work for them (which would call into question your objectivity), how would you come to know that number?  Or did you just make it up?  Facts are stubborn things.

People like you get into big trouble when they make assumptions that aren't accurate.

So I'm at about 5 weeks since they mailed my form 4..
I'm also getting impatient

As we all know, those who play the NFA game, one very important personality trait you must have......

Patience.

I get it. But it's my first time..

My reading comprehension is fine.
You don't spend much time here for apparently good reason. Go back in your hole.

You call it melodramatic. I call it disgusting.
Stick your phony apology.
Fucking '15er's

Actual experience in the gun business.
Actual experience in the silencer business.
Actual experience as a SS Powered By Dealer.



I'm a kitchen table dealer and have more than that in stock. You're a riot.

.
Once again...……"nothing is processed through the kiosk" is proof that you don't have the slightest inkling of how a silencer transfer is processed by SS. The kiosk is only for scanning your prints....ONCE. It is not needed to buy or transfer a silencer.

I'm a Powered By Dealer, meaning I accept SS transfers, but I also use distributors other than SS.

 
I think our assumptions of you are spot on.

See above.

Continue the discussion

I ordered from Silencer Shop on June 15th.  Did my picture with their Android app the same day.  Did my fingerprints at their kiosk at my local dealer on June 16th.  Form 4 was mailed June 21st.  Check was cashed July 9th.

This is my first NFA item and their process seems simple and efficient.

Form 4 mailed: 06/19
Check cashed: 07/11

According to SS the average is 32 days, mine took a week less. My previous one was cashed 21 days after being mailed.

I'm not sure how many of you came over from the other thread, but if you just do it yourself, the ATF will cash your check two days after they receive it.  Contrast that to the 5 weeks each that I had with three separate attempts with Silencershop.  It's a trade-off between simplicity and efficiency.  But Silencershop doesn't tell you that. . . that's why I'm here . . . ha!

My recent SS submission, which was my first post 41F purchase and they mailed my docs to the NFA Branch within 2 days of me completing the Docusign for the Single Shot Trust.

Mailed by SS 6/27
Check cashed 7/12

Yes its longer than the 1-3 days all my pre 41F checks took to get cashed but the benefits of the SS system including the Single Shot Trust is well worth the extra days wait imo.

This. Except is use UPS Stores for digital prints.

Yeah it might kind of look bad.  Your wait could go up if there is a huge increase with orders...

They batch ship the forms so your five weeks is going to be off.  If your form 4 is the first in the pile your wait maybe 5 weeks (if they were swamped from another companies out of their control having a sale/promotion) if its last in the pile it maybe 4 days like you had mailing it yourself.

I wonder if they batch check the checks cashed as well.  They may mail a single check for the entire batch, probably not...  If not and if your form 4 was in a batch of 1001 form 4’s.  Rather then matching up 1001 checks with 1001 form 4’s, with maybe 1001 differenct online customers orders numbers. They check for when all checks show cashed and all 1001 form 4’s get the same cashed date even if it was cashed that actual day or 2 weeks earlier...

They are a business trying to supply a service to make the nfa process easier.  They are in the business of making money.  To provide said service it has to be at a price a customer is willing to pay.  Labor/salaries/benefits/insurances/taxes, and skilled data compiling, it all cost money. If they had to mail every form 1 or 4 individually, that $25 service fee would go up, and it take more employees to package each individual form, then mail each individual form.  Amazon doesn’t provide anything close to this type of service don’t expect it happen in a 2 days (which usally ends up being 4-5 days...)

In your 5 weeks vs 4 days, did you include the time it took you to get your fingerprints taken, have passport photos taken and printed, research the proper way to print and fill out forms, then actually print and fill out forms according to the law, attach finger/photos, write checks, or drive and buy money orders, include nfa compliant trust possibly notorized,  place in envelopes, drive to post office and pay to be certified mail, then track, then check cashed date, then call nfa to verify form’s were in the system?

Again other companies out of their control having sales and promo’s is out of their control.  Do you want them to hire temp help everytime there is a sale with temp help possibility screwing up forms not being well trained and getting customers up in arms with tons of errors or rejected forms increasing the wait maybe x2. Or do you want them to have trained full time staff twiddling their thumbs waiting for a sale so they have something to do.  All it takes is a staple in the wrong place to screw up 2 peoples orders with the posibilty of increasing those waits twofold.

You seem to have it all down maybe you should start a business and give them competition and maybe they will “get their act together”

I have a question:

Do form 4s get approved in the order that they are received? Or is it random?

If it's random then you have no idea when you will be approved. You could be approved before someone who sent their paperwork in before you is, thus the difference in time wouldn't matter.

Generally speaking yes.  But there are lots of exceptions, and lots of things that can cause them to be approved out of order. But if you did a statistical analysis, yes there would be a strong correlation between when submitted and when approved.

I understand the concern of the OP and the extra time it takes when going through SilencerShop kiosk but its worth the extra time to me.  I have purchased my first 3 cans this year.  Two came from a brick and mortar and were actually the first two cans they've ever sold.  The third came from SilencerShop

First one was purchased from Capitol Armory and transferred to my local dealer that has a kiosk.  He received it on 2/26.  I had already done everything on the kiosk and I thought that was all that had to be done.  The dealer made an honest mistake and didn't submit it to SS.  I didnt know I was supposed to get a docusign email to sign it so I was delayed over a month because of that but it had absolutely nothing to do with a problem on SilencerShops end.  I sent them my Docusign on 4/8 and got my check cashed email on 5/1.  It took 17 business days from the day I submitted the Docusign email to check cashed.  Obviously there would be some extra time involved from the day you but the can to the day you get the Docusign email but since my situation was screwed up by the local dealer, I dont know how much time that adds.

Second one was purchased from local on 2/23 and cashed on 3/6 so 7 business days from the day I purchased it in store to check cashed

Third one purchased local on Fri, July 6th and cashed Thu July 12th,  4 business days to check cashed

Obviously I'm a small sample size but it shows that theres a good chance your check might take longer to get cashed at SilencerShop and if your local dealer is on the ball, you can possibly get your check cashed in the same week you make your purchase.

It does suck to add an extra month to an already long process but when you are already waiting 6-12 months, adding a month is worth it to me for the convenience and piece of mind that it is done right.  I think the dealer did everything right and all the paper work was filled out like it was supposed to be but until I have the cans in hand, I wont know for sure.  With the Silencershop submission, Im extremely confident that they have done everything correctly.

I realize that rolling your own prints isnt hard and a lot of people do it but Ive never done it and wasnt comfortable with it and didnt want to worry about getting it rejected so I went to the PD to get it done.  I had to order the print cards and wait for them to arrive.  Im in a rural area and my local sheriff  only does prints for CCW permit applications so I had to drive 35 min to a PD to get them done.  Then they charge $10 per card so it cost me $40 to have enough cards for 2 cans.  Then I had to get my photos and get them printed.  It was all time consuming and a general pain in the ass.   The only reason I didnt do Silencershop on those two was because I had store credit but now that Ive used that up, Ill definitely use SilencerShop the next time and gladly wait an extra week or month or whatever it takes

You know who you should AVOID - WALMART, KMART, TARGET, SHOPKO, CABELAS, BASS PRO, COSTCO, SAMS CLUB, SPORTSMANS GUIDE, TARGET SPORTS USA ECT ECT ECT ECT ECT - BASICALLY ANYTHING CUSTOMER ORIENTED... NOW STOP PROJECTING.

In the case of the check you sent yourself, was the Form 4 approved 5 weeks earlier than the ones handled by SilencerShop? For instance, was it approved in 5 months, vs 6 months for SilencerShop?

I'd like to see some definitive data showing a direct correlation between the date the check was cashed and the date the application was approved.

There has been at least one report in this thread that SilencerShop applications come back approved in the same time frame or sooner, despite the fact that the check is cashed at a later date.

Perhaps the ATF knows that SilencerShop's account is good for payment, so they begin the paperwork process immediately but wait to deposit the checks when convenient. Contrast that with a personal check from an individual, and it's in the ATF's best interest to confirm that funds are available before beginning any paperwork.

Does anyone have any concrete data that the date the check was cashed affects the overall time for approval?