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Posted: 2/14/2002 8:02:25 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/16/2002 7:24:19 PM EDT by pulsar110]
I am looking for people that have bought guns from Hesse. Yes I already know their guns can be of poor quality but Im looking for guys that have been burned by them.
My own little story. I was burned by Hesse and got no satisfaction from them. So now I have another plan but I want to know about others as well. Thanks for your help.
Bobby
Link Posted: 2/14/2002 8:47:10 AM EDT
Well, I can kind of help. My cousin bought an AR from him. Then he bought a Ciener conversion kit. He found that he can not put the conversion kit in the upper....it does not fit. He took it to a gunsmith and was told that the upper was not properly drilled. He called Hesse, Hesse said "does it work with the 223 carrier"? My cousin said "Yes", and that was the end of it.

On the other hand, I have a Hesse Kevlar lower for my dedicated .22 upper, and it works great. It is not as nice to the eyes as my Bushmaster, but it was cheaper and hasn't caused me any problems.

Can you expand on your problems with Hesse? I am curious now.

Brad
Link Posted: 2/14/2002 7:18:41 PM EDT
I bought a complete AR from them a year and a half ago. Long time I know, Im not home very much so Im just now getting around to dealing with this problem. It has a .17 Rem barrel so ammo choices are one brand period. When I asked Hesse they told me to try Winchester ammo. So I looked for Win ammo. Well Win either never made ammo in that caliber or havent for some time. Anyway I talked to the people at Hesse about 3 times on this gun and got nowhere with them. Now I have sent it to a gunsmith that has ARs and works on them and he gave me a long laundry list of stuff that was wrong with my upper. The bolt carrier was way out of spec. The headspace was .010 in excess. The gas block was glued on and in the wrong place plus the port was way too big. This is just the beginning.
So here is my plan. I have the next 2 months off from work so I am going to build a website and am looking for others that have been screwed by Hesse. The only possible way to avoid this is for Hesse to start making thing right for a few people. This overhaul job to make my upper right is going to cost around $500 bucks. So Im out to take it out of thier sales if nothing else. Sorry about the rant guys. Thats my story. Any additional info would be nice and appreciated.
Link Posted: 2/14/2002 7:36:13 PM EDT

Originally Posted By pulsar110:
additional info would be nice and appreciated.



You have time? You have a desire to fix your firearm? Why aren't you going to court?!?! This would easily fall under small claims court since the amount can't be that high and you'll receive immediate financial relief.
3 Questions:
1) Did you buy the gun in your state from an FFL dealer in your state?
2) Do you have the receipt proving #1?
3) Do you have the written documentation from the gunsmith of the "laundry list?"

Do you understand the concept of product liability and how a mishap with a gun COULD put them out of business? Hesse will settle this before getting to court, most likely fixing or giving you a new weapon. No court in their right mind would ever let them get away with the faulty workmanship you mentioned.

The only problem is getting jurisdiction in your state if they are located out of state. However, case law will give you jurisdiction if you bought the gun IN YOUR STATE. Also helps if you bought it brand new.

Link Posted: 2/14/2002 7:46:09 PM EDT
I bought two Hesse FAL receivers to build rifles for friends. After having a problem with both that "just shouldn't have happened," I e-mailed Hesse. The guy replied with a one word response of "so?" In their defense, I later did get a longer explaination out of them, and I got the rifles together. The receivers were also only 60% of the price of the next cheapest competitor. I haven't test fired it yet, but I have a strong feeling that if I do have a problem, they'll be no help.z
Link Posted: 2/14/2002 8:04:03 PM EDT
minman72,
I have just gotten to where I know what all was wrong with it. The only problem I have with what you have said is that they put a 1 year warranty on the gun. I bought it a year ago last august, so Im about 7 months out of the warranty. Small claims court has been a thought of mine but I dont really know how far I could get there so maybe you guys could help me a little more on that line. As for the gun I bought it brand new and had it special ordered through my local FFL and paid the FFL for it. Im not sure if I have the receipt anymore but the FFL will have records of it. I also have the laundry list from the gunsmith. As for states I live in Utah and Hesse is in Minnisota. Thanks for the help guys.
Link Posted: 2/14/2002 9:09:39 PM EDT
If I were you, I'd make some calls tomorrow about jurisdictional requirements for an individual to bring a small claims court dispute. IF you can get jurisdiction, you have nothing to lose and everything to gain. If you are friendly with your FFL dealer, you might want to have him make some calls to Hesse to try and get results. Personally, I think Hesse will come through for you. A list like you describe is a potential for disaster in other products and they will know that. Your other option is to threaten with publicity and negative websites, although you'll most definately have injunctions against you within no time AND you'll need someone like me to defend you! (AND I AIN'T LEAVIN GOOD OL NYC!) I would definately push Hesse more while pursuing the small claims and your FFL. If you need any help once you find out about jurisdiction, email me.
Greg
Link Posted: 2/14/2002 10:36:28 PM EDT
You want to know about my Hesse woes? Okay...

When Tromix closed, I panicked and looked and saw that Hesse carried a Tromix 50 AE upper. It was a lot cheaper than what Tony Rumore charged so I figured something was up but decided to order anyway (along with two mags). Shipment was quite speedy. The upper came two days after I ordered but it was missing both magazines. Fit/finish of the upper was poor; the rear lug was too small for the pin to go through, the rear sight roll pin was smashed and didn't go completely through the other side, the handguards were mounted off-center, and the bolt carrier looked like it was chiselled with hand tools. My guess is that Hesse bought a few components from Tromix and hacked it together.

For the missing mags, I call up Hesse who says he's sure they were packed. Double checking verified that they weren't so he tells me I have to file a claim with UPS. Why doesn't he do it? Well, it's not his problem. A couple of weeks later, the UPS guy comes to pick up and inspect the packaging. His second question is why I'm dealing with UPS instead of Hesse. Even the UPS driver thought Hesse was being shitty with me. Nice, huh?
Link Posted: 2/15/2002 2:08:46 PM EDT
I've heard NOTHING but bad things about Hesse. I'm suprised people still buy from them. Apparantly Hesse doesn't read the news or belong to any forums...I question how they sleep at night. Sadly, I'm sure they're backlogged 3 months with orders so why do they care!?!

In addition to AR woes, I know people have been having issues with converted Saiga's and RPK's and other AK gear from Hesse. But the price of a Hesse is delicious to the misinformed. Hesse's prices take advantage of those who don't have a lot of dough sittin around to buy the premier shit. Almost bought a Hesse Saiga myself till I found out EAA Corp had a similar product. Bought it, inspected it, shot it, and so far so good.

I'd be curious to hear about someone's direct conversation with Hesse regarding their obvious gap in quality control. I'm SURE they MUST know they have a poor product...but like I said, money talks.

Good luck to anyone with Hesse stuff. If I offended anyone I apologize, just giving an opinion, hokie out
Link Posted: 2/15/2002 4:32:02 PM EDT
Link Posted: 2/15/2002 4:34:46 PM EDT
Link Posted: 2/15/2002 8:53:51 PM EDT
I bought an empty box fromthe a few months ago!The guy said he had one stripped Izzy HB left, so my FFL charged it. A few days later we get an empty box.I got the same story as Wadman...not my fualt, check with UPS.I ave two words....F*CK hesse!
Link Posted: 2/15/2002 9:19:52 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Ghostface:
I bought an empty box fromthe a few months ago!The guy said he had one stripped Izzy HB left, so my FFL charged it. A few days later we get an empty box.I got the same story as Wadman...not my fualt, check with UPS.I ave two words....F*CK hesse!



Hello, I'd like to order a big box of MAIL FRAUD? Yes, I'll be paying by IMAJACKASS Bank VISA card. Do I want insurance for that? Does that cover medical insurance for all of the banging of my head into the wall? No? DAMN!
Link Posted: 2/16/2002 2:44:20 AM EDT
Eesh!!! Wow, those are some horror stories...

Sounds like Hesse is fully aware then how poor a reputation they have.

Which makes them soul-less cause they deliberately sell and market a poor product to law abidin' citizens who shell out a lot of cash they don't have, with no regrets or cares about quality...that really sucks. What a scam!

Hesse = Bad News

Okay, I'll stop ranting now...lol...happy shooting...hokie out
Link Posted: 2/16/2002 2:18:18 PM EDT
well guys this is the reply that I got from Hesse today.


We stand by our published repair policy which states Hesse Arms will
"offer service on its products for a period of one year from the date of purchase" Simply return the product with an RA number and we will address the issues that you have. We, of course, cannot condone or approve of third parties finding and/or charges.

Because of the way I was treated on the phone by these people I sent to a third party to be fixed. Ideas on how hard to push this matter?

Link Posted: 2/16/2002 2:38:33 PM EDT


Because of the way I was treated on the phone by these people I sent to a third party to be fixed. Ideas on how hard to push this matter?




Hesse
Link Posted: 2/16/2002 3:04:21 PM EDT
www.angelfire.com/ak5/rpkman/

I hope this isn't representative of all of their product.
Link Posted: 2/16/2002 6:49:03 PM EDT
Interesting...

Follow up question: Has ANYONE ever directly asked Hesse Arms if they're truly aware of their horrid reputation? And if so, what do they have to say for themselves? I'm sure someone here must have yelled at them during a phone conversation...just curious...
Link Posted: 2/16/2002 7:22:33 PM EDT
In my few conversations with thme I didnt do any yelling although it was tempting. As far as things are here I really dont want to flame them too much but it needs to be known what they are doing to their customers. Basically my point is boys lets not get into a lible(spelling) situation here or we could all be in trouble. as for me i just want them to make things right with me concerning my gun. thanks for everyones help. by the way does anyone know of any case history of Hesse being sued?
Link Posted: 2/16/2002 8:17:06 PM EDT
I saw one of their HAR 25s. They had a big scratch around the handguard. It was neatly refinished with a majic marker.
Link Posted: 2/16/2002 9:18:40 PM EDT

Originally Posted By pulsar110:
well guys this is the reply that I got from Hesse today.


We stand by our published repair policy which states Hesse Arms will
"offer service on its products for a period of one year from the date of purchase" Simply return the product with an RA number and we will address the issues that you have. We, of course, cannot condone or approve of third parties finding and/or charges.

Because of the way I was treated on the phone by these people I sent to a third party to be fixed. Ideas on how hard to push this matter?




For the sake of the children, push man, PUSH!

If you have the time and more importantly, the PATIENCE, then persist. If they can get away with making a profit on shitty product, then they win. Contact the ATF and tell them about the potential dangers involved and ask them to investigate. Contact the Consumer Protection Agency in your state and theirs filing complaints. When did you first contact them? Lie. You contacted them 9 months after purchase and was told to seek 3rd party opinion, which they later told you was useless after the warrantee ran out. I'm a firm believer in Karma and I don't think that a white lie will send you to hell, it just evens the playing field. I'm sure Hesse has other complaints against them by the Consumer Board, now file with the State Attorney General's office, that'll give a lot of headaches.

Before you do all that, give them one last chance, informing them of your intent to file the complaints. If they don't change their minds and help you, god help them, because it'll cost them more than $500 after all is said and done. (Especially if they have many prior complaints.)

www.ag.state.mn.us/
www.timduffy.com/gov_links/state_consumer_links.htm
Link Posted: 2/17/2002 1:01:35 PM EDT
Link Posted: 2/21/2002 4:59:08 AM EDT
I live in Minnesota, and see him at every gunshow up here. Before I bought my upper from him, I told him that I had heard many negative comments about his product. He told me that he stands behind his product 100%. I told him that I was worried about his lower fitting my upper (I had heard this was a problem) and he told me that if it didn't fit to contact him and he would make arrangements to have it fixed or get me a new lower. I carefully examined all of the lowers he had, and chose the best of the lot. So far, so good......

I know that I would never by anything from him with out first inspecting it. I also know that I am not buying anything more from him because of all of the horror stories I have read here. I think I got lucky with the lower I bought. I really wanted another lower, and didn't have much money at the time, so his seemed to be the best choice.

I also know that he is not up to speed on his "Assult Weapon" laws. When I bought my lower I asked for a "BATF legal non-collapsable tele-style stock" (exact words). He put on a Rock River Arms Six position collapsable stock. After paying for this, and halfway to my car, I realized that the stock did collapse. I went back to see him. When I asked him about the legality of having a collapsable stock on a Post Ban lower, he told me that I should "probably fix it so that the stock doesn't collapse anymore". He didn't have any of the non-collapsable stocks, so I kept, in the event that I could seel it or one day buy a pre-ban AR. I ended up selling it to a cousin and buying a Bushmaster BATF legal non-collapsable stock from a board member.

Good luck in dealing with Hesse!
Link Posted: 2/21/2002 5:47:40 AM EDT
I do not personally own a Hesse HAR-15, but my friend owns one (with the canadian-style heavy barrel).

First thing that I noticed is that:
1. Lower fits Upper EXTREMELY tight, I think this is due to slightly mis-drilled pin holes.
2. Finish is good & durable, better than my OLY Arms.

I can attest to the reliability of these rifles. If you get a HAR-15 that works, expect it to really WORK A LOT like an AK-47! My friend bought it at a gunshow new, and when I inspected it as he brought it home I noticed it had NO LUBRICATION, NO OIL, NOTHING in it, it was BONE DRY! I warned him to open it up & lube the whole damn thing. BUT, he was too afraid to try it disassembling it, so HE DIDN'T LUBE IT, EVER! (I didn't know this until about 2 years after he bought it!)

So, we went shooting a lot in the past 2 years, and I **KNOW** that he has put AT LEAST 12,000 rounds of cheap-ass wolf through his rifle, and he recently switched his rifle's diet to Winchester "White-Box" in 1000rd bulk packs. So after 12,000 wolf, and 1000 winchester, he kept it at my house overnight.

I opened it up (Difficult, need wooden dowels to pound out take-down pins), and to my surprise, he NEVER lubricated the rifle! It was clearly NEVER maintained, as there was TONS of THICK buildup of powder residue, dirt (he dropped it in the sand once with port open), and it was so gummed up in there, there was only about 2-3mm of crap stuck to EVERYTHING in the trigger/sear/hammer area, the upper receiver needed to soak all-night in Break-Free CLP, and a good wipedown/scrub in the morning!

After scrubbing everything, I inspected it, the bolt performed without a single hiccup in that duration. The bolt carrier had TONS of scratches (from powder & dirt grinding at it for 2 years), but none were very deep... I good polishing with steel-wool got that looking purty & smoothly functioning in upper.

I then proceeded to run about 25 CLP soaked pipe cleaners through the gas tube which was horrible! Then there was the chamber & barrel to deal with... I immediately asked him if he had ever disassembled & lubed it, and he said, "No, my wife reminded me that EVERY time I take something apart I lose parts or cannot figure out how to get it together, so I didn't lube it... BUT I oiled the outside now & then!"

To make a long story short (too late), it was the dirtiest rifle I had ever seen, but after shooting it for the past 2 years without a single hiccup, and NO LUBRICATION, and through 13 cases of ammo, 12 of which were wolf... I just must say that this rifle performed like an AK47. IT's the AK47 of the AR15 world in my opinion, sometimes you get lemons, sometimes you get good ones, sometimes not... Inspect them at a gunshow if you can.

One thing is certain: It's reliable if you get one that works well.

-inuhbadnayburhood
Link Posted: 2/21/2002 7:57:30 AM EDT
Well one thing is for sure. It will work very nicely when Charles gets done with it. All that I really want from Hesse is for him to make it right with me. I didnt feel like I could send it to him because of his attitude and he already messed it up once. So why should I give him another chance to mess it up again?
I am really glad that someone has had good luck with him.
Link Posted: 2/27/2002 6:27:54 AM EDT
I just came across this thread and though I would add my two cents worth. Last year I purchased a Hesse 17 rem barrel he was selling here on AR15. First it took over 2 weeks to get it, after continuous emails to Hesse as to its location. Finally get it, the finish is horrible, can't even describe it. I was told in one email from Hesse that any .936" gas block would fit, the barrel actually mic'd .988" well that's just alittle off. Emailed him back, took 3 days to get a responce, ended up having to buy a block from him. It didn't fit, emailed him again, I was informed to heat the block and slide it on. Well, it took and Oxy/Acetelyne tourch and alot of pounding from a large ball pein hammer. The barrel was full of crud, so apon cleaning it, realized that the burrs had not been removed from the inside of the gas port when it was drilled, couldn't get the cleaning rod through. I ended up having to put a round through to clean it out. It's all assembled and parkerized, looks great now, no idea as to accuracy, only have 4 rounds through it. This has been a hassle from start to finish, I can say that I won't deal with Hesse again.
Here's the finished product www.angelfire.com/oh3/2ndamendment/images/17.jpg
Link Posted: 2/27/2002 9:18:48 AM EDT
did you drill the gas port hole yourself? one of the problems with mine is that hesse drilled it in the wrong place lengthwise and the wrong size.
Link Posted: 2/27/2002 9:20:21 AM EDT
here is part of the list of what was wrong with my 17.


1. The gas block was glued onto the barrel and the set screws served no purpose but to be ornamental.

2. The handgaurds were also glued on which made them difficault to remove to continue to trouble shoot the problems.

3. The barrel headspace was excessive by 0.010 inches. This about 250% of the maximum safe limit.

4. The location and size of the barrel port were both in error. The specs for a 24" barrel call for a port that is 0.089 inches in diameter at a distance of about 8" from the muzzle. Your barrel had a port diameter of .120 and was 12" from the muzzle.

5. The bolt carrier was out of spec also. It was 0.025 inches short and the diameter was 0.005 inches to large. The carrier key was bent downward by 0.003 to 0.005 inches. Parts of the bolt and carrier were visibly battered and should never have been used.


Link Posted: 2/27/2002 6:32:49 PM EDT
My barrel came pre drilled for the gas port. As far as in the wrong place, that I have no idea. For the rounds that I have put through it, it didn't have any cycling problems. Granted I have not put enough rounds through it to know if there will be any further problems. I eliminated most of your experienced problems by using my own upper, BC, handguards, ect. Other than fit and finish, I had to counter sink the bottom of the barrel for the set screws. It's good to go now.
Link Posted: 2/27/2002 9:08:34 PM EDT
The problem generated by the port being in the wrong place and size was severe over pressure. it was to the point that it was blowing primers clear out of their pockets. something that was interesting was that one primer that blew out ended up inside the carrier key. turned out that the primer landed just right because it had to be lined up just right to go in.
Charles told me that he estimated that it was running somewhere around 90,000 cup. freakin nearly twice what it was supposed to be.
Link Posted: 2/28/2002 8:29:48 AM EDT
man, didn't run into any problems like that. I did notice some slight cratering on primers indicating slightly higher pressure but nothing excessive. Now you have to come to the question is this really worth fixing, if the price to fix overruns the initial cost of the rifle. I hope that you can get it all straightened out. I hope to get a few more rounds through mine next week, we are only in the teens here, makes it hard to get out and shoot. The Dr.
Link Posted: 2/28/2002 11:25:13 AM EDT
ooohhh i understand the temperature problem. the total to fix mine is a little over $500 total. i bought the whole thing from hesse and payed a little over $1000 for it. i know i know. if i knwe then what i know now i wouldve built it my self and saved alot. live and learn heh?
Link Posted: 2/28/2002 4:33:17 PM EDT
I think everyone on here has learn the hard way at one time or another, God knows I've done it a few times. That's why I went to building my own, if it doesn't work or breaks I have only my own a$$ to kick. Hopefully after all this your 17 turns out to be a tack driver. I'm keeping my fingers crossed that I can get mine to below 1/2 MOA. I've been lucky with all the rest of my AR's, but none are Hesse...
Link Posted: 3/1/2002 6:55:04 PM EDT
I think it will. Charles has been very good to understand what the whole deal is and what needs to be done. Ill know in 2 or 3 weeks how it performs.
Hope yours works out fine.
Link Posted: 3/3/2002 4:41:46 PM EDT
Will find out wednesday, I don't have a scope for it yet but going to throw some more rounds through it to season the barrel. I had figured on handloading for it so I'm not to concerned with wasting the factory stuff.
Link Posted: 3/3/2002 9:31:47 PM EDT
People would actually admit such a thing?
Link Posted: 3/21/2002 6:34:13 AM EDT
I'll ante a buck in the Hesse Arms pot...I have a Hesse Arms Kevlar lower. It is, by far, the best damn piece of hardware that I've ever bought, built or traded for. It went together perfectly & has functioned flawlessly on a variety of uppers in various configurations and calibers. On the service end...shipping was free, it went from his hand to mine and the follow-up was great...a handshake. So I can't add a log to the Hesse pyre. Sorry to read what Troy stated about Hesse Arms on site. I didn't read anything about encouraging to remain as an industry partner...musta missed that eh. I remember pulsar's rifle...I'll ask Robert about your stick this weekend. If your complaint is after warranty...then you have no complaint. You're asking for a break from a weapons manufacturer. Eghad man...I hope that you're asking kindly, humbly & in an adult manner. The chamber specs are nasty. If that was how it left his shop then you should do whatever's necessary to understand and resolve that. I'd ask Hesse to examine it. The rest of it's just bitchin'. An epoxied or soldered gas block makes for one hellofa seal. You make it sound like there was friggin elmers school glue on yours...now that ain't anywhere near the truth is it...lol. So I spoke with Robert several times this week and did mention the We Hate Hesse club that's been festering...he said all calls are welcome, but you do have to call or e-mail him, you can't just "say" you did. The best complaint, my opinion, is "my 22cal conversion unit don't work in my .223 HAR15"...hardeeharharhar...go by a a damn Ruger 10/22 and see if you can get a AR BC/B group to work in it! Yeppers, an extemely refukkingdikulus comparison to match a harsh & unrealistic whimper. Gosh, can you imagine how hard they all laughed at the shop after that guy called...whatta hoot. Better Thinkin'...Bud
Link Posted: 3/21/2002 9:37:20 AM EDT
Yes but after the way Hesse messed it up to start with how can I trust him to fix it right. with a laundry list like that and all of the others that have had trouble i wouldnt trust him any farther than i could throw him.
Link Posted: 3/22/2002 3:47:49 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/22/2002 11:00:51 AM EDT by Bud_Burma]
pulsar...hey B who else should you work with, eh? If you want to get the rifle back-up & running then buy a new/different barrel. If you want to help other shooters and possibly get the assistance of Hesse you really ought to consider a little "begging". You are out of warranty, eh...you posted about this very thing after your warranty expired(a'way back when on the Builders Board). Just look at your list of woes...considering that your gunsmith is most likely basing his specs on what a .223 should be: #1 is toast #2 is a whimper #3 is a valid concern #4 is probably toast...this is what a .223 specs at...is that the same for a .177? #5 is toast for (2) reasons. Those variations in spec are consistent with specs on new manufacture BC's AND "visibly battered and should never have been used"...ouch Bob. This inspection was done after you'd shot how many rounds? You left that part out. Simple as pie...you need help with a barrel that's shot. Consider that an attitude of "hey I need help" might get you farther than "hey I got fucht".Just a thought...Bud #############################################­###

bdpbdsbs...and you bought the rifle with cash(from the wallet you keep right by your ass) huh? That building(which has more square footage than your house & has no vehicles in it) isn't a garage. You drove right by Hesse's home w/attached garage eh. Sounds like you started to work at getting your rifle repaired but QUIT after the first attempt.### Must not be very important to you. ### So now your warranty expired and you wanna wah-wah & throw shit...neeto dood, like great plan, eh. BTW...from open sights my Bushy 16" carbine shoots high and to the right(about 1/2 an ass from up it) at 1000 yds. Granted I have my eyes closed...who should I call at Bushmaster to complain to? hardeeharharhar
Link Posted: 3/22/2002 6:35:20 AM EDT
I have seen a .50 AE Hesse upper it looked ok enough but I was not impressed with how they modified the Bolt especially the extractor. It looked like it was filed with a carpenters file and not a machined part. I avoid Hesse based on all the bad things I have heard.
Link Posted: 3/22/2002 8:02:11 AM EDT
Wait, Wait, Wait....I'm still a little unsure, so what you're trying to tell me is, Hesse doesn't make a quality product?

Well I'll be damned, and all this time I thought they had...


Link Posted: 3/22/2002 8:30:26 AM EDT
My first AR was a hesse. I bought it directly from them ( out of his shop in his garage ). My problems are, 1. The gun shoots 2 inches to the right with the standard sights. I
sent it back in and nothing was done. I don't think it was even tested. I have since put on a scope. 2. Occasionally it will not fire I can here the hammer strike but the round has not been struck by the firing pin. When this happens it is hell pulling the bolt back. I am assuming that the chamber is to tight. I have had the rifle over a year and did not know better at the time. Also it was cheaper than anything else around here(I have learned a lesson about cheap!!) If I keep it very clean it will run a few hundred round before I start having problems with it. I wouldn't buy another one. I have seen them around brand new recently for 150 less than what I paid for mine awhile ago. I have put a bushmaster upper w/bolt and carrier onto the lower and that worked fine with no problems. Planning on buying a new bushmaster upper for it someday.
Link Posted: 3/22/2002 8:47:36 PM EDT
I cant blame you for standing by your friend. Thats what good friends do and Mr Hesse maybe a fine man. I cant say since I do not know him. Im not going to get into a pissin match with you here all I can do is lay out my side of my story. I talked to them 3 times while the gun was under warranty. Everytime I called the person I talked to was rude and abrasive. On one occasion I asked if the gun had been test fired. They told me that it had been with Winchester Ammunition. Winchester never made ammo in 17 Rem. To me that was a lie. Whatelse could it be? In addition I was told that the problem was mine and to live with it. Thats crap. The biggest mistake I made was buying this gun from them. The second was not being able to send it back to them and make them fix it while it was under warranty.
As for the things I listed that were wrong with it. That is the list that the engineer sent me after he took it apart to find out what was wrong with it. He has enough experience with these to qualify as an expert in court.
As for how many rounds I put through it. I went and looked through my books and found that it had 314 rounds through the tube. Thats my side of the story the way it happened as I see it.
Link Posted: 3/22/2002 10:14:10 PM EDT
Ah my Hesse story. A couple of years back I ordered their Dispatcher upper. To make a long story short they cashed my money order and promptly lost/disregarded my order and gave me over six months of runaround until I researched the money order to prove that they had indeed cashed it. They finally sent me my upper. The finish was moderate at best, but they had done a poor job of shaving off the bayonet lug and it looks like shit. The only thing I can say for the situation is that it is very accurate and reliable. Their customer service bites Bin Laden butt cheese

Link Posted: 3/23/2002 1:02:58 PM EDT
It would probably help Hesse more if he had a buddy who actually graduated from elementary school chime in on the discussion.
Link Posted: 3/25/2002 4:43:21 AM EDT
"The best complaint, my opinion, is "my 22cal conversion unit don't work in my .223 HAR15"...hardeeharharhar...go by a a damn Ruger 10/22 and see if you can get a AR BC/B group to work in it! Yeppers, an extemely refukkingdikulus comparison to match a harsh & unrealistic whimper. Gosh, can you imagine how hard they all laughed at the shop after that guy called...whatta hoot. Better Thinkin'...Bud"

After reading this several times, I was wondering if anyone could translate this?

You should tell your buddy to learn the laws that came about from the 1994 Crime Bill, being as he is a manufacturer of Post Ban lower receivers.

Brad
Link Posted: 3/25/2002 5:38:21 AM EDT
You know, I'm actually tired of recounting my Hesse experience and why they/he sucks so badly.
Link Posted: 3/25/2002 6:10:45 AM EDT
Bud_Burma, Yes I bought the rifle with my money. I Also sent it in with a problem that was not fixed. I stated what the problem was. Do I have to send it back more than once for the same problem? (What would be nice is if it would have worked out of the box). I also had other people shoot this rifle so it was not me shooting with my eyes closed. And yes I was not going to waste anymore time with getting it fixed. I decided I could live with it as I stated in my post. This is a free forum and I will post my experience good or BAD when someone asks for it.
Link Posted: 3/25/2002 9:35:06 AM EDT
At the local gun show last Saturday I saw a stripped Hesse lower receiver on sale for $260. I looked twice to be sure that was really the price, stifled a laugh, and moved on to the next table.

BTW, there were some excellent deals at the show -- that just wasn't one of them.
Link Posted: 3/25/2002 9:44:11 AM EDT
I didn't have a terribly bad experience with my Hesse-receivered FAL from Century. I did some judicious Dremeling of the feed ramps before it would feed reliably, but other than that, it worked like it was supposed to. Of course, this was probably because the Century (cough) "wizards" had assembled the parts on the stripped receiver.
Link Posted: 3/25/2002 10:06:36 AM EDT
No, because I am not a masochist.
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