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Posted: 2/7/2002 11:30:34 AM EDT
After reading some of the posts on 1911forum and here, I have to ask.

Why is it that people defend the 1911 religiously?

I have shot my great-grandfather's 1911 many times. It does handle well and it was obviously built to handle the recoil of the 45. But, at least in my mind, it is not the beginning and the end of handgun development.

Is it just affection for the gun or solid reason that leads to the overenthusiastic zealous defense of this pistol by its owners?

So, what is it that the owners are so offended by anyone saying the 92fs is just as good, or the Sig 220, or the USP? Is it just a statement about some of the owners, or is it really based on the merits of the gun.

Personally, I withdrew my order for a RRA 1911, after I shot a 9mm. I just liked it more and while I will buy a 1911, I just don't see why 1911 owners in particular seem bigoted towards anything else, especially the beretta 92fs ( which I agree is not a perfect pistol, but neither is the 1911 ).

Just curious and I am not looking to start some stupid flame war over which is better 45 v. 9 or 1911 v Sig, etc...

I am just curious what is about the gun or the owners that inspires such a single minded defense of the gun by some of its owners.

Link Posted: 2/7/2002 11:59:51 AM EDT
Uh-oh, here we go again.

Hey Darin, ever wonder why the Harley-Davidson is so popular? Same thing.
Link Posted: 2/7/2002 12:03:49 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/7/2002 12:06:18 PM EDT by ECS]
Please!

A moment of silence for John Moses Browning.
Link Posted: 2/7/2002 12:15:45 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/7/2002 12:18:44 PM EDT by Boomholzer]

Originally Posted By Darin_Marple:
But, at least in my mind, it is not the beginning and the end of handgun development.



Darin,

It can be considered the beginning and is still often the standard of auto-loading handguns today.

Kind of gives you a feeling for how much Firearm technology has progressed in the last 100years.

I'm still waiting on the release of the Colt M41-A 10mm case-less, explosive-tipped Pulse-action rifle.
Link Posted: 2/7/2002 12:18:04 PM EDT
Actually, the only two handguns I own are a Springfield 1911 and a Beretta 92FS. I like 'em both.
Link Posted: 2/7/2002 12:21:28 PM EDT

Originally Posted By ECS:
Please!

A moment of silence for John Moses Browning.



LMAO
Link Posted: 2/7/2002 12:21:29 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Santyth:
Actually, the only two handguns I own are a Springfield 1911 and a Beretta 92FS. I like 'em both.



Huh. I have the 92FS and am picking up my Springfield 1911 on Friday. Good choices, I guess.

If it's good enough for the Army...

Viper Out
Link Posted: 2/7/2002 12:22:15 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Chairborne_Ranger:
Uh-oh, here we go again.

Hey Darin, ever wonder why the Harley-Davidson is so popular? Same thing.



Its not the bike its the image/mystique/lifestyle. I get you, thanks.
Link Posted: 2/7/2002 12:23:20 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Steelviper:

Originally Posted By Santyth:
Actually, the only two handguns I own are a Springfield 1911 and a Beretta 92FS. I like 'em both.



Huh. I have the 92FS and am picking up my Springfield 1911 on Friday. Good choices, I guess.

If it's good enough for the Army...

Viper Out



Hey, I am right there with ya'll, except I might go the Kimber route...
Link Posted: 2/7/2002 12:33:57 PM EDT
Yea, I like the Kimbers.
Link Posted: 2/7/2002 12:35:11 PM EDT
If you enjoy the configuration flexibility of an AR-15, you'll love the 1911. You can get slide assemblies for .45ACP, .45 Super, .40S&W, 10mm, 38 super, 9x23, 9x19, 357 Sig, 22LR, longslides/standard/commander and compact slides, ported/unported, adjustable/fixed sights, optics/lazers, custom grips/triggers, ambi safeties and more. They're fun pistols to work on and shoot. Bored with your 1911? Spend a few minutes, change the configuration and go shoot a completely different gun.
Link Posted: 2/7/2002 12:52:57 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/7/2002 1:05:02 PM EDT by AJohnston]
The 1911 is the best combination of power, speed, accuracy, ergonomics, and size. Inherent of the design the gun is easy to shoot and user friendly. When correctly fitted the gun is as reliable as any handgun can be and subsequently is the standard by which all other handguns are judged. The gun has with stood the test of time and been found to be more than adequate for it's job... stopping (or better yet winning) fights at close range.

Allot of what attracts users to the gun is it's single action trigger. Often imitated but never duplicated, the 1911s phenomenally designed trigger mechanism is what keeps a great many users and knowledgeable gunmen in constant use and defense of the gun. Aside from the gun simply working, the trigger allows the operator to work the gun easier and put hits where on target where they need to be with less effort than other designs. As we all know, hitting is the purpose of shooting and a handgun that lends itself well to that task deserves whatever accolades receives. The 1911 is one of those guns.

The simplicity of the design allows for all of the parts to work together with minimum effort and optimum efficiency. The gun is essentially over-engineered, all of the parts are by and large far more than what is required to do their job. This helps with the extreme durability of the weapon with directly correlates with the weapons reliability.

The 1911 is also redundantly safe. Original designs utilize a total of 3 safeties; two manual (the thumb safety and grip safety) and one passive (the disconnect). Later designs (Colt's series 80 guns) have incorporated a fourth safety that locks the firing pin until the guns trigger is manipulated. This addition is up for debate almost as much as the gun itself but never the less just helps to make the gun adaptable to a wider array of users. The 1911 is as safe as any inherently dangerous instrument can be and safer than most, but we all know where the ultimate safety lies.

This is only the beginning. The 1911 can be made to accomplish any task a handgun should be used for. Games, hunting, plinking, fighting you name it. The fact that the 1911 is able to do what it does with such efficiency has made it a top choice for decades. Is it right for everyone? No, but what is. There is no perfect handgun, the 1911 or any other, but in knowledgeable hands the Government Model may just be the best. YMMV
Link Posted: 2/7/2002 1:32:45 PM EDT
How many high end (don't say something like CZ-75B) single action pistols are there?

Aren't really any choices, if ya want single action.

I don't understand why people like double actions. I hate double actions. Your AR isn't double action, is it?
Link Posted: 2/7/2002 2:03:20 PM EDT


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally Posted By Chairborne_Ranger:
Uh-oh, here we go again.

Hey Darin, ever wonder why the Harley-Davidson is so popular? Same thing.

Its not the bike its the image/mystique/lifestyle. I get you, thanks.



Well, no, not exactly, although image might have a *little* to do with it.

The 1911 is an old design, the oldest automatic that is still alive and kicking, and it retains is viability as a fighting weapon in the face of plastic guns, hi-caps and crunchentickers.

It is an AMERICAN-designed pistol and has served the U.S. Military through wars or "conflicts" for almost a century. It is one of the most famous firearms ever produced.

Like the HD M/C, it can be endlessly assessorized. In fact, I bet you could build one out of the Brownell's catalog if you were so inclined.

It has a certain panache to it that pistols without the history or ancestry just don't have.

It was a .45 all those years when those European wusses were shooting 9mm or even lighter pistol rounds.

It has a great, or potentially great, SA trigger and excellent user-friendly controls.

What's not to like? Oh, you can't clear it without taking off the safety? Learn not to point the gun and keep your finger off the trigger and you won't have a problem. Too many parts? True, compared to, say, a Glock. Also the extractor design could use fixing. But overall, again, what's not to like?
Link Posted: 2/7/2002 2:12:20 PM EDT
I don't know what it is but check out what the swat teams are packing as there sidearm and also what alot of special forces still use that must mean something and also the marines are rebuilding about 500 old 1911's
Link Posted: 2/7/2002 2:32:56 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Chairborne_Ranger:

It was a .45 all those years when those European wusses were shooting 9mm or even lighter pistol rounds.




The .45 definitely has more punch than 9mm, and has a higher Fecalation Factor, that's for sure.

M@
Link Posted: 2/7/2002 3:24:22 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/7/2002 3:26:55 PM EDT by Santyth]
Might I suggest that this would be a good topic for GD over at the handgun forums?

handguns.ar15.com
Link Posted: 2/7/2002 3:50:25 PM EDT
Of all the handguns I have shot, the 1911 has been the most accurate for ME. It may not be so for everyone, but I have found that I shoot it more accurately than any other handgun I have tried.

Kimber, Springfield Armory, Wilson Combat, Les Baer....the list is endless.
Link Posted: 2/7/2002 5:39:26 PM EDT
Mmmmmm! Someone say 1911? I get to pick mine up tomorrow. Its just something that everyone should have. No collection is complete without a couple. Pick one up, it says it all!
Link Posted: 2/7/2002 7:46:59 PM EDT
The 1911 is the most combat proven semi auto pistol ever. From the time it entered service in 1911 right up to this very day it is still in active service for a reason. There simply isn't anything better for the job that needs to be done. My Remington Rand M1911A1 is stock original 57 years old and still frequently shot. It maintains it's legendary reliability and adequate combat accuracy. I'll put it up against any current Sig, Walther H&K or Glock now or in another 57 years if I'm still around.
Link Posted: 2/7/2002 7:59:14 PM EDT

Originally Posted By notsubby:
How many high end (don't say something like CZ-75B) single action pistols are there?

Aren't really any choices, if ya want single action.

I don't understand why people like double actions. I hate double actions. Your AR isn't double action, is it?



Great Single Action Semi Autos: 1911, Browning Hi Power and the Awesome Sig P210.
Link Posted: 2/7/2002 8:08:56 PM EDT

Originally Posted By ECS:
Please!

A moment of silence for John Moses Browning.



The God of firearms!
Link Posted: 2/7/2002 9:50:20 PM EDT
For me it was the first handgun i shot.I have always liked the look of them as a kid watching magnum pi.I tfits well in my hand and shoots very good.I have shot sigs,glocks,berettas,smiths,revolvers,but still prefer the 1911 nothing like thatcrisp triiger and 45 stopping power.All the other guns i mentioned were great guns and i tried before i bought but cant stand the doublestack mags and there triggers.The sig did feel nice though p220.
Link Posted: 2/7/2002 10:20:00 PM EDT
simply put --- a Colt 1911 has got SOUL
Link Posted: 2/7/2002 11:21:43 PM EDT
It's ALL pure PREFERENCE.

The key to accurately shooting a handgun is in the handle or how you hold it... Some people, such as myself, have smaller hands... I like it for the following reasons:

1.) Single Stack Frame - Slim, sleek, sexy, but most importantly ===> COMFORTABLE, and BEFITTING! Beretta, Glock, and HK USP & MK Series, ANY double stack does not fit well with me, and we all know FIT is the most important thing to look for. 1911A1 fits all hands!

2.) Safety - 1911A1's have TWO active safeties, compared to the Beretta's ONE. Not only is this good, but the thumb safety is in a FAR better place than that of the Beretta. PERIOD. The Beretta's safety is a pain in the ass! The 1911 has options for extended safety which puts it in prefect reach. This sort of fits in with the "Feel" of reason #1.

3.) Slide Release - 1911A1's can have (and often do) extended slide releases, that way smaller hands don't have to "CANT" the frame in their hand to release the slide, making reloads infinitely faster.

4.) Parts Availability - The 1911A1 has been around for so long that there is a HUGE market for them, and replacement parts are dirt-cheap.

5.) Power - I don't care about velocity, expansion, ft/lb energy levels, etc... It's just proven that the .45 ACP can stop humans (and some animals) almost immediately, 9mm sometimes isn't as effective...

6.) Cost - For a 9mm Beretta in a single stack configuration, I could buy 2 RRA 1911A1 pistols for that much, or buy a great Kimber Custom Classic Stainless .45 for that price. Plus you'd STILL have to deal with the ergonomically F*cket Up safety. I'd rather take the Kimber any day.

7.) Ammo - Surplus ammo costs about the same as the 9mm in certain cases (based upon sportsmansguide prices), and you literally get "More BANG for your buck".

Sh!t, I could go on & on all day about this. I just wish they made a 1911A1 in 9mm that was RELIABLE, springfiels & others just aren't as reliable as the .45 ACP versions. I think a .40 Kimber would be great, but I'd never shot one, so I'll not trust a gun I haven't shot yet...

-iNuhBaDNayburhood
Link Posted: 2/8/2002 6:04:30 AM EDT
Ever shot metal plates with a nine, then switched to a 45?
Link Posted: 2/8/2002 6:39:44 AM EDT
Alot of good reasons. I can start to see why people like the gun so much.

I guess I won't really know until I own one, but hey, thanks for your time.
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