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Posted: 10/11/2001 3:03:27 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/11/2001 2:58:36 PM EDT by Smeghead]
WHAT IS THE STATUS ON THIS? OMG, THEY CANNOT TAKE MY M1 GARANDS, CARBINES OR 1911'S!!! NO FRIGGIN WAY!

WHAT IS THE LAST LINE OF DEFENSE BEFORE THIS BECOMES LAW?

From Illinois State Rifle Association
Posted By S. Jackson
10-11-1

This week, the U.S. Senate passed S. 1438, the Department of Defense (DoD) annual authorization bill, which contains a provision that is of grave concern to hunters and sport shooters.

Section 1062 of this bill provides the Secretary of Defense with the authority to require "demilitarization" of any "significant military equipment" that has ever been owned by the DoD. This would include all firearms (such as the venerable M1, M1 Carbine, and Model 1911, as well as all Civilian Marksmanship Program rifles, even "sporterized" surplus bolt-action Springfields!); firearm parts such as barrels, bolts, triggers, firing pins, sights, etc.; ammunition and ammunition components; and firearm accessories such as cleaning rods, oilers, and even cleaning brushes.

"Demilitarization" is the term for rendering such items permanently inoperable, and Sec. 1062 allows for this action to be carried out either by the owner or a third party, with the owner paying the cost, or by the DoD.

However, if the DoD determines it should perform the demilitarization, it can also determine that the cost of returning the demilled item is prohibitive, then simply keep the item, and reimburse the owner only for the fair market scrap value of the item.

Furthermore, this new authority would require private citizens to determine for themselves if an item they own is subject to demilitarization, and face criminal penalties for non-compliance. The DoD would be under no obligation to notify law-abiding citizens that items they have lawfully owned for years, and perhaps that their families have owned for generations, are suddenly subject to forced demilitarization.

This becomes extremely significant when one considers that U.S. military surplus has been "regularly and legally" bought, sold, and traded for centuries. Countless Americans own items that could be subject to Sec. 1062. It is likely millions of law-abiding Americans would be affected, and could unknowingly become criminals overnight without having done anything or having ever been informed.

The DoD already has the authority and responsibility to demilitarize any item it sells as surplus, so there is absolutely no reason to seek new authority to confiscate and destroy lawfully sold and lawfully owned items that are now the property of private citizens.

Be sure to contact your U.S. Senators at (202) 224-3121, and your U.S. Representative at (202) 225-3121, and urge them to strike Sec. 1062 from S. 1438, the "National Defense Authorization Act for FY 2002." the "National Defense Authorization Act for FY 2002." Act Today - Or Lose Your Heritage

This notification brought to you as a courtesy to the gun-owning community by the Illinois State Rifle Association.


Link Posted: 10/11/2001 3:06:44 PM EDT
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 3:11:54 PM EDT
Yeah, but this just passed the senate by 99-0! What's up with that? Don't these people read this stuff? Must be the communist senate we have now.
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 3:17:09 PM EDT
Those simple minded fools!
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 3:31:38 PM EDT
Went fishing today with all my guns and they fell overboard. So Sorry.

Link Posted: 10/11/2001 3:45:47 PM EDT
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 4:12:37 PM EDT
It is probably a Fu%king Rider tacked on a bill. Our system of government really sucks with bills having "Riders".........That and the electoral college.
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 4:19:17 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Nekkid80:
It is probably a Fu%king Rider tacked on a bill. Our system of government really sucks with bills having "Riders".........That and the electoral college.



Currently, we would have Al Gore for president without the Electoral college.

(best Spanish accent) Garands, we don't got no stinking Garands.
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 4:23:23 PM EDT

Originally Posted By LARRYG:
Currently, we would have Al Gore for president without the Electoral college.



We would have had Bob Dole before that. You can never say the Gore thing for certain.

Link Posted: 10/11/2001 4:32:53 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Nekkid80:

Originally Posted By LARRYG:
Currently, we would have Al Gore for president without the Electoral college.



We would have had Bob Dole before that. You can never say the Gore thing for certain.


Gore won the popular vote, that is not disputed, and he would definitely be president without the electoral college. As for Dole, sometimes you win, sometimes you lose, sometimes you get rained out. In the Dole case, the electoral college can be good or bad, depending on your point of view.
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 4:57:22 PM EDT
It stil has to be reconciled in commitee and go back to the house and senate. It is extremely vague, will all veteran's have to be demilled ??? weren't we a weapons system ?????? If this does finally make it through it won't last 5 minutes in a court room.............
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 5:00:56 PM EDT
I find it unbelievable that after 9/11, they are still pushing for this BS and other gun control measures. The largest mass murder in history occurred with a single gun and you would think that it would make these people realize that they are completely full of it. This is so illogical. Oops, I forgot, their entire argument is illogical.
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 5:22:57 PM EDT
Why do they want to destroy the historical weapons that kept this country "FREE"? These guns are directly responsible for the freedom's we enjoy today.
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 5:40:12 PM EDT
Gore didn't win the Popular vote people. He supposedly won by 200,000 votes out of 100 Million Votes cast. I was talking to a classmate a while back, shortly after the election. This guy was former military and he said that if you took the total Military votes thrown out across the nation and give them to Bush 2-1. Bush woulda won the popular vote. In addition there were 5,000 Felon votes in Florida, Hundreds of thousands of absentee ballots in Kali. were never counted since Gore won by almost 1 and a half million votes in Kali. In Chicago there was a question over 100 - 200,000 messed up Chicago Butterfly Ballots. those ballots accounted for more than the difference between Bush and Gore in IL.
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 5:44:42 PM EDT
This sucks no matter how you look at it, but I wanna know what "significant military equipment" is. Tanks? Planes? Dragons? Or small arms?

Hey the DoD didn't even exist till sometime in the 1950s or so, back before then it was the Department of War. So if the DoD didn't exist, it didn't own anything.

While I am on alert, no reason to panic. Yet.
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 5:50:48 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Chairborne_Ranger:
This sucks no matter how you look at it, but I wanna know what "significant military equipment" is. Tanks? Planes? Dragons? Or small arms?

Hey the DoD didn't even exist till sometime in the 1950s or so, back before then it was the Department of War. So if the DoD didn't exist, it didn't own anything.

While I am on alert, no reason to panic. Yet.




I'm pretty sure small arms ar included. I would not be surprised if they included E-tools. Anything that can be used as a weapon. Shit, you use GI socks to strangle someone. This law is so effing stupid!

Write your congressmen. Write your senators too so they know you are watching them and paying attention.
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 5:51:48 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Smeghead:
These guns are directly responsible for the freedom's we enjoy today.



Although I agree that these weapons shouldn't be taken or destroyed, your above statement basicly says that guns kill people. Not trying to start anything here just pointing something out.
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 6:01:58 PM EDT
Who controls the Senate, the House, the White House?
Thought these people were for us keeping the right to bear arms? Maybe it does not really matter who's in control.

Link Posted: 10/11/2001 6:10:41 PM EDT
That means we have to demil our LBV's, ALICE, pistol belts, bayonets, frogs, ammo pouches........

fuckers.
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 6:33:35 PM EDT
there is no freakin way to enforce a law like
this. its a waste of time. i really don't think
this bill was brought up for the specific reason
of taking small arms. i could be wrong, so don't
chance it. write, call, email, your senators &
congressman!
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 6:45:45 PM EDT
This is not about godamn guns! It's bigger than guns! This is about the government takeing legally owned private property from US citezens! I dont fucking care what the property is.. this is ex post facto theft! We have the right to security in our posetions and papers...... hows that go ... for the literrally gifted...

What other shit can they pull out of there ass to steal from the public!
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 6:56:53 PM EDT
I don't own anything of theirs, but if I did they wouldn't be getting it back.

Anybody remember what their mothers told them about people who sell or give you something then want it back. There is a word for that. It was something like oh yeah INDIAN GIVERS.
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 7:09:37 PM EDT
Molon Labe.
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 8:43:14 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/11/2001 8:37:52 PM EDT by Ropes4u]
The question is would you destroy your guns? Personaly there are somethings worth dying for and I think freedom from an oppressive goverment is one of them.

Ropes

[-!-!-]

Link Posted: 10/11/2001 9:09:31 PM EDT
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 9:09:58 PM EDT
Nope. No one gets my Garand. Or carbine. Or 03A3. Or 1917. I ain't "demilling" nada . . .
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 9:31:54 PM EDT

Originally Posted By 7:
Went fishing today with all my guns and they fell overboard. So Sorry.




We didn't catch s#it either!!! It sucked, out for a day of fishing and shooting, tip over lost everything and didn't catch one damn fish. Lost everything!!! I think I'll take up golf.

Link Posted: 10/11/2001 10:01:37 PM EDT
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 10:31:50 PM EDT
The "lesser of 2 evils", eh?
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 10:44:26 PM EDT
WTF! Why are the Republicans bending us over on this one??

Are the U.N Blue helmets next?
Link Posted: 10/11/2001 11:28:49 PM EDT
So any point in contacting the Seante Armed Services Comittee members???

If it's passed the Senate is this a moot point?

Just call/write the House Armed Services Committee & hope for the best in conference???
Link Posted: 10/12/2001 1:38:18 PM EDT
"All your camo undies are belong to us"

- DoD
Link Posted: 10/12/2001 1:47:12 PM EDT

Originally Posted By cnatra:
WTF! Why are the Republicans bending us over on this one??

Are the U.N Blue helmets next?



The democrats who voted for this are irrational anti-gunners, but the republicans who voted for this are patriots concerned for our well being.
Link Posted: 10/12/2001 1:51:29 PM EDT
I still don't get it, or maybe I get it but I'm in denial.
Link Posted: 10/12/2001 1:57:33 PM EDT
Wonder what kind of "authority" that would be banging at the door? Sounds like a risky job to me! And I hope it is too! Its long passed time to be joking around with these morons.
Link Posted: 10/12/2001 1:59:27 PM EDT
It goes beyond demiling just the items that the military used to own... from an interview that I heard yesterday, it includes any weapon that the military used, owned, or tested. which includes a lot of other firearms as well.

Get on the line with your congress critter and yell!
Link Posted: 10/12/2001 4:27:59 PM EDT
What pisses me off is that the American people have paid for 100% of the stuff they say isn't for us. Well fuck them. If this bill passes, and they try to enforce it, we will be at the "Unintended Consequences" stage. An act of war on the good, gun & militaria owning people of America. A huge miscalculation.
Link Posted: 10/12/2001 4:31:33 PM EDT
Link Posted: 10/14/2001 4:59:31 AM EDT

Originally Posted By SNIPERm88:

Originally Posted By 7:
Went fishing today with all my guns and they fell overboard. So Sorry.




We didn't catch s#it either!!! It sucked, out for a day of fishing and shooting, tip over lost everything and didn't catch one damn fish. Lost everything!!! I think I'll take up golf.




Next time use dynamite. LOL
Link Posted: 10/14/2001 6:49:48 AM EDT
There's an easy solution to this problem. Just ship all banned guns to me and I'll hold onto 'em.
Link Posted: 10/14/2001 9:09:19 AM EDT

Originally Posted By trickshot:
What pisses me off is that the American people have paid for 100% of the stuff they say isn't for us. Well fuck them. If this bill passes, and they try to enforce it, we will be at the "Unintended Consequences" stage. An act of war on the good, gun & militaria owning people of America. A huge miscalculation.



HEAR, HEAR!
Link Posted: 10/14/2001 10:45:07 AM EDT
My Congressman is Rick Larson, a Democrat from Washington State. I called his Washington DC office on Friday to voice my opposition to Section 1062 of the bill.
Rick Larson is on the House Armed Services Committee, when I called I was told that Congressman Larson had sent a letter to Congressman Stump to voice his opposition to this section.
I was also told that his office had been recieving many complaints about the section.

I also called Duncan Hunter's office and was told that his DC office had recieved plenty of complaints about this section.

I suggest that each and everyone of you call your Reps up on Monday and let them know how you feel about this.


Link Posted: 10/26/2001 10:10:29 PM EDT
Link Posted: 10/26/2001 10:26:29 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/26/2001 10:22:40 PM EDT by cluster]
Link Posted: 10/26/2001 10:46:53 PM EDT
They aint getting my AR-15... I'd be happy to send one of the ammos express to them though (through barrel express...)
Link Posted: 10/26/2001 11:05:38 PM EDT

Originally Posted By raf:
Get a grip people!!! Write or e=mail your Congressional reps and STOP this madness in its tracks. Do it or else...

Write NOW!!!



What good can that do? Do you know that the congress does NOT give a hoot about your opinion, all you can do to him is to vote him out of the office, and that does nothing to get gun laws erased. This sucks but I wish I live in switzerland...
Link Posted: 10/27/2001 9:42:39 AM EDT
Boy, some of you guys' positive energy is just overwhelming. Write your damn congresscritters and stop whining. Writing does help.

And about the electoral college (this really pisses me off):

WE ARE A REPUBLIC. ALL CITIZENS HAVE EQUAL REPRESENTATION AND POWER. WE ARE NOT A SOCIETY OF MOB RULE, a.k.a "DEMOCRACY".
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