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Posted: 2/15/2018 8:30:24 PM EDT
[#1]
Hmm... Wonder if they can do a "pistol" in the bullpup config? Shave off the toe of the buttstock, leave it a small, flat plastic plate.
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Posted: 2/15/2018 8:46:57 PM EDT
[#2]
lol I'm blind
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Posted: 3/1/2018 10:45:16 PM EDT
[#3]
All videos are from late jan and early Feb of this Year 2018. NOW that was when they were posted not actually filmed. But most of these seem to be polish Youtube gun channel type videos so those dates are probably form late last year and early this year. First two videos have snow on the ground.
Newish Vid of Troops sighting in and some training?? Anybody Speak Polish?? VIDEO Of Soldiers. Video with something that looks like SHOT show range day. Glocks, SIG, Polish SHOT show day at the range VIDEO!???? Also New vid of some kind of test with SCAR 16, Bren, HK416, Beryl, and MSBS GROT. VIDEO |
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Posted: 3/4/2018 10:05:52 AM EDT
[#4]
Importers and "US office" have been showing Radom products since the wall came down.
Very little of it has ever come to fruition. They haven't even sold regular 9mm handguns.. |
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Posted: 3/6/2018 12:33:16 AM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
LINK to video showing conversion to Bullpup Configuration!!!!!! Notice the area right behind the mag well near the trigger guard area thats the bolt release. Notice how the Bolt release goes up when locking back the bolt. Then levers down to release. Much better than a little nub on some rifles like the Robinson XCR. This is a 3 year old video the grenade launcher has changed. The AFG styled rear end has changed to just straight flat on the bottom with the trigger at the rear. |
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Posted: 3/20/2018 9:44:12 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The bolt release is a little nub ? Either you have gigantic giant hands or need to take a closer look at one again. The regular assault rifle type model has the bolt release somewhat like an ACR or a XCR. BUT its more a lever that you push down on the back of. Think of a paddle mag release in the trigger guard area of the Walther handguns, and just turn it around back facing you then move it just a little further out. |
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Posted: 4/5/2018 9:03:29 AM EDT
[#7]
Hi everyone,
Greetings from Poland. April is the month of realease a civilian version of MSBS Grot in Poland. I hope it will soon arrive to the USA. Hype in Poland is enormous but we want a foreign review and of course a meltdown:) MSRP in Poland is estimated to be around 8000 ZL so it will be the a lot cheaper than CZ Bren - 9500 ZL. Below we can see Grot S16 FB-M1 
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Posted: 4/5/2018 2:28:41 PM EDT
[#8]
Thanks for sharing the update, and welcome to the site!
I think there are a lot of us that eagerly await the MSBS/Grot coming to the US, so hopefully the release goes well in Poland. Awesome pictures! |
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Posted: 4/5/2018 7:28:46 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Hi everyone, Greetings from Poland. April is the month of realease a civilian version of MSBS Grot in Poland. I hope it will soon arrive to the USA. Hype in Poland is enormous but we want a foreign review and of course a meltdown:) MSRP in Poland is estimated to be around 8000 ZL so it will be the a lot cheaper than CZ Bren - 9500 ZL. Below we can see Grot S16 FB-M1 https://i.imgur.com/LxA4yrq.jpg https://www.milmag.pl/files/news/gallery/0/711/grots16_04.jpg https://farm1.staticflickr.com/817/40534414284_a771180e9f_b.jpg |
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Posted: 4/5/2018 7:57:17 PM EDT
[#10]
Interesting. There seems to be a bit of a Hexhead screw fetish taking place.
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Posted: 4/5/2018 9:18:52 PM EDT
[#11]
Do we have a weight yet?
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Posted: 4/5/2018 9:22:43 PM EDT
[#12]
Cautiously optimistic
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Posted: 4/5/2018 10:32:30 PM EDT
[#13]
Interested.
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Posted: 4/6/2018 3:52:12 AM EDT
[#14]
Some tech specs:
Caliber: 5.56×45 mm NATO/.223 Remington ( we call it polish .223 wylde) Overall length: 681 mm (26.81”) with folded stock or 903 mm (35.55”) with stock fully extended Barrel length: 406 mm (16”) Barrel twist: 1:9 Weight: 3.7 kg (8.16 lbs) Next production series will have replacable AR15 trigger. |
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Posted: 4/6/2018 11:43:19 AM EDT
[#15]
OH MY GOD SWEET BABY JESUS IN THE MORNING!!!!!
    
OH YES YES YES !!!!!!! UH wait one I need a shower!! Back in a minute. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Hi everyone, Greetings from Poland. April is the month of realease a civilian version of MSBS Grot in Poland. I hope it will soon arrive to the USA. Hype in Poland is enormous but we want a foreign review and of course a meltdown:) MSRP in Poland is estimated to be around 8000 ZL so it will be the a lot cheaper than CZ Bren - 9500 ZL. Below we can see Grot S16 FB-M1 https://i.imgur.com/LxA4yrq.jpg https://www.milmag.pl/files/news/gallery/0/711/grots16_04.jpg https://farm1.staticflickr.com/817/40534414284_a771180e9f_b.jpg |
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Posted: 4/6/2018 12:07:37 PM EDT
[#16]
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Posted: 4/6/2018 12:14:38 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Some tech specs: Caliber: 5.56×45 mm NATO/.223 Remington ( we call it polish .223 wylde) Overall length: 681 mm (26.81”) with folded stock or 903 mm (35.55”) with stock fully extended Barrel length: 406 mm (16”) Barrel twist: 1:9 Weight: 3.7 kg (8.16 lbs) Next production series will have replacable AR15 trigger. |
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Posted: 4/6/2018 6:07:19 PM EDT
[#18]
Looks good, but if this preview is any indication, I hope they get QC squared away with the stock.
Note, there's an interesting claim in the comment section of that SS article that there will be a later, 2nd gen version which will have a modular trigger pack. |
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Posted: 4/6/2018 10:16:11 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Looks good, but if this preview is any indication, I hope they get QC squared away with the stock. Note, there's an interesting claim in the comment section of that SS article that there will be a later, 2nd gen version which will have a modular trigger pack. Some tech specs: Caliber: 5.56×45 mm NATO/.223 Remington ( we call it polish .223 wylde) Overall length: 681 mm (26.81”) with folded stock or 903 mm (35.55”) with stock fully extended Barrel length: 406 mm (16”) Barrel twist: 1:9 Weight: 3.7 kg (8.16 lbs) Next production series will have replacable AR15 trigger. Per the article Lets see wobbly stock. I won't put up with a wobbly stock. I use a Magpul MOE SL. If it wobbled I wouldn't use it. Hummmm We shall see. M3 PMAGs no go. UH OH thats not good as its the only ar15 mag I stock. I wonder why? Jesus if it takes STANAG mags it should take a M3 PMAG. This version you can't swap out the trigger. Better fix that or my SBR fantasy won't work because of the hated 922r. Trigger is also heavy and has a short reset. DAMNIT this is now a let down. Shit well hell. One important thing it has a lot of 922r parts to swap out to make it ready for SBR'ing. 1:Muzzle Device Replaceable 1/2x28 threads according to the link. 2:American made magazine body 3:American made magazine follower 4:American made magazine floor plate 5:AR15 pistol grip. 6:AR15 trigger 7:AR15 hammer 8:AR15 disconnector 9:Trigger housing to put into lower receiver is one part also if it uses it. Hopefully sheet steel stamping formed then folded. The easiest to set up. I guess. Hell thats 8 parts if it doesn't use USA made trigger housing. 9 if it does. Get someone to make a hand guard for it say MAGPUL MOE SL hand guard type and boom thats 10. Not sure what is needed on this gun. But it is easy peasy off the shelf stuff to get to 8. |
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Posted: 4/10/2018 11:28:28 AM EDT
[#20]
I CAN'T WAIT!
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Posted: 4/10/2018 1:13:03 PM EDT
[#21]
It lost me at no M3 mags. Thats ridiculous.
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Posted: 4/10/2018 9:13:11 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It lost me at no M3 mags. Thats ridiculous. |
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Posted: 4/10/2018 9:19:12 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Some tech specs: Caliber: 5.56×45 mm NATO/.223 Remington ( we call it polish .223 wylde) Overall length: 681 mm (26.81”) with folded stock or 903 mm (35.55”) with stock fully extended Barrel length: 406 mm (16”) Barrel twist: 1:9 Weight: 3.7 kg (8.16 lbs) Next production series will have replacable AR15 trigger. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Some tech specs: Caliber: 5.56×45 mm NATO/.223 Remington ( we call it polish .223 wylde) Overall length: 681 mm (26.81”) with folded stock or 903 mm (35.55”) with stock fully extended Barrel length: 406 mm (16”) Barrel twist: 1:9 Weight: 3.7 kg (8.16 lbs) Next production series will have replacable AR15 trigger.  Quoted:
It lost me at no M3 mags. Thats ridiculous. 
Hopefully these will be imported here. But not at that price...people will probably (wrongfully) consider that too high for a Polish made product. |
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Posted: 4/10/2018 9:24:21 PM EDT
[#24]
1/9?
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Posted: 4/10/2018 10:04:36 PM EDT
[#25]
Historically, Poland has always used 1:9 barrels. Beryl has a 1:9 barrel.
Guess that means it’s mil-spec now. 
ETA - I’m also not bothered by the Pmag issue. That’s actually pretty common for non-AR pattern Euro rifles and it looks like Poland has designed their own translucent polymer mag. I have enough USGI and Lancers that it doesn’t matter. Maybe Magpul should get rid of that stupid overinsertion nub. 
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Posted: 4/11/2018 8:26:05 AM EDT
[#26]
1/9 doesn't bother me. I shoot 55 grain. Unless its for social work where 62 and 64 bonded work well.
Assuming its the nub that doesn't allow the M3 to work look at the polish mag. There is a nub on there. Also wasn't the M3 mags supposed to take the place of the EMag so that it would work with the Euro Pattern Stuff?? If I have to grind down the nub on my M3 mags then fine. And thats assuming its the nub. What else could it be? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Historically, Poland has always used 1:9 barrels. Beryl has a 1:9 barrel. Guess that means it’s mil-spec now.
ETA - I’m also not bothered by the Pmag issue. That’s actually pretty common for non-AR pattern Euro rifles and it looks like Poland has designed their own translucent polymer mag. I have enough USGI and Lancers that it doesn’t matter. Maybe Magpul should get rid of that stupid overinsertion nub. |
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Posted: 4/11/2018 10:38:22 AM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
1/9 doesn't bother me. I shoot 55 grain. Unless its for social work where 62 and 64 bonded work well. Assuming its the nub that doesn't allow the M3 to work look at the polish mag. There is a nub on there. Also wasn't the M3 mags supposed to take the place of the EMag so that it would work with the Euro Pattern Stuff?? If I have to grind down the nub on my M3 mags then fine. And thats assuming its the nub. What else could it be? Quote HistoryQuoted:
1/9 doesn't bother me. I shoot 55 grain. Unless its for social work where 62 and 64 bonded work well. Assuming its the nub that doesn't allow the M3 to work look at the polish mag. There is a nub on there. Also wasn't the M3 mags supposed to take the place of the EMag so that it would work with the Euro Pattern Stuff?? If I have to grind down the nub on my M3 mags then fine. And thats assuming its the nub. What else could it be? Quoted:
Historically, Poland has always used 1:9 barrels. Beryl has a 1:9 barrel. Guess that means it’s mil-spec now.
ETA - I’m also not bothered by the Pmag issue. That’s actually pretty common for non-AR pattern Euro rifles and it looks like Poland has designed their own translucent polymer mag. I have enough USGI and Lancers that it doesn’t matter. Maybe Magpul should get rid of that stupid overinsertion nub. Looking at some of the videos, the Polish mag does have a pretty large ridge on the back, but short of looking at them side-by-side to see variances in positioning, it's hard to say. I'd put my money on that being the case though since it has caused compatibility issues in other weapon systems. Given that the ARX works fine with G2 Pmags, I'd imagine they'd work on the Grot/MSBS. Stupid nub. If someone wants to send me a Grot mag, I'd be happy to do a comparison.
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Posted: 4/12/2018 6:04:50 AM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: If someone wants to send me a Grot mag, I'd be happy to do a comparison. |
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Posted: 4/12/2018 9:54:01 AM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I have some 40rd Gen3 on hand, so I will compare them with Grot mag and try to seat them in Grot. I think it is the nub, but not the position, but rather size. I may interfere with bolt catch mechanism. But it's a guess now. We will be doing extensive testing for review, so hopefully I will have more info soon. I can grind the nub off a Gen3 but I would prefer not to. Wonder why they changed that. Do standard Gen2's fit and I would guess USGI aluminum mags being Stanag would fit??? From what I understand the Magpul stuff is popular over in in Poland, so I wonder why the GROT doesn't like Gen3's??? |
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Posted: 4/14/2018 10:40:27 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Historically, Poland has always used 1:9 barrels. Beryl has a 1:9 barrel. Guess that means it’s mil-spec now.
Even so, civilian market has moved to 1:8 or 1:7. I remember all the bitching about the ACR's barrel at launch. 
Or were people primarily complaining because Bushmaster was being cheap and/or lazy and using a Govt. profile barrel? |
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Posted: 4/14/2018 10:44:37 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
1/9 doesn't bother me. I shoot 55 grain. Unless its for social work where 62 and 64 bonded work well. Unless they're willing to change the twist-rate, it could hinder success with foreign buyers. Hopefully they'll eventually release 1:8 and/or 1:7 barrels...if not, the aftermarket might! @Montrala Does the Polish military use an M855-type round? Or M193? |
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Posted: 4/16/2018 7:59:16 AM EDT
[#32]
Quote History@Montrala
Does the Polish military use an M855-type round? Or M193? Quote History@Montrala
Does the Polish military use an M855-type round? Or M193? http://www.smallarmsreview.com/display.article.cfm?idarticles=1035 As early as January, 1995, the Tactical and Technical Requirements document was prepared for the new rifle by the ZM Lucznik SA, calling for “assault rifle chambered for the NATO-standard 5.56mm cartridge, effective at ranges up to 600m against troops and lightly armored vehicles” - the latter meaning that the rife grenade capability was again requested - and separate “short automatic carbine of smallest possible size, intermediate between assault rifle and submachine gun, chambered for NATO-standard 5.56mm cartridge, effective at ranges up to 400m against troops and lightly armored vehicles.”
The TTR required that Beryl would: fire both 5.56mm SS109 (STANAG 4172) and the older M193 ammunition; have a trigger mechanism capable of single, burst (three rounds) and cyclic fire; fire both NATO 22mm boom inner diameter and Polish Fosforyt rifle grenades; be capable of attaching optic and optoelectronic sights of the 5.56mm modernized PCO family (CK-3 collimating, LKA-4 optical, CWL-1 optics with laser and PCS-6 NV) |
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Posted: 4/17/2018 11:31:15 AM EDT
[#33]
Doesn't fix the one thing actually wrong with the ACR: weight. 8.19lbs? No thanks.
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Posted: 4/17/2018 12:16:26 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Doesn't fix the one thing actually wrong with the ACR: weight. 8.19lbs? No thanks. Just did some quick searching: Famas G2: 8.4 lbs M16A4: 8.79 lbs (loaded) L85A2 (i.e. SA80): 8.4lbs (UNLOADED) SCAR 16s: 7.25 lbs Sure, it's not as light as an M4... but it does have a piston system. |
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Posted: 4/17/2018 12:25:14 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
How much do you think it should weigh? Just did some quick searching: Famas G2: 8.4 lbs M16A4: 8.79 lbs (loaded) L85A2 (i.e. SA80): 8.4lbs (UNLOADED) SCAR 16s: 7.25 lbs Sure, it's not as light as an M4... but it does have a piston system. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Doesn't fix the one thing actually wrong with the ACR: weight. 8.19lbs? No thanks. Just did some quick searching: Famas G2: 8.4 lbs M16A4: 8.79 lbs (loaded) L85A2 (i.e. SA80): 8.4lbs (UNLOADED) SCAR 16s: 7.25 lbs Sure, it's not as light as an M4... but it does have a piston system. |
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Posted: 4/17/2018 12:26:02 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Interesting. There seems to be a bit of a Hexhead screw fetish taking place.
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Posted: 4/17/2018 2:48:02 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted: How much do you think it should weigh? Just did some quick searching: Famas G2: 8.4 lbs M16A4: 8.79 lbs (loaded) L85A2 (i.e. SA80): 8.4lbs (UNLOADED) SCAR 16s: 7.25 lbs Sure, it's not as light as an M4... but it does have a piston system. |
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Posted: 4/17/2018 2:51:17 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Three of those rifles were designed 20+ years ago. The one new one on your list is a full pound lighter. So yeah, this one should be at least that light. The Tavor X95 is under 8lb, the ARX-100 is under 7lb, and both are piston rifles. The Desert Tech MDR is 8.6lb and that's a .308. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: How much do you think it should weigh? Just did some quick searching: Famas G2: 8.4 lbs M16A4: 8.79 lbs (loaded) L85A2 (i.e. SA80): 8.4lbs (UNLOADED) SCAR 16s: 7.25 lbs Sure, it's not as light as an M4... but it does have a piston system. The Tavor is 7.5 lbs, but is a bullpup. The bullpup version of the GROT is also 7.5 lbs. I'm not saying the GROT is tiny... just that its weight isn't way off from similar rifles. |
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Posted: 4/17/2018 4:00:43 PM EDT
[#39]
But what rifles do you think are similar? I don't think it has any right to be similar to the FAMAS, L82, or M16A4. We've easily listed two non-bullpup modern 3rd gen 5.56 short-stroke gas piston carbines that are between 1-2lbs lighter than the GROT. The GROT weighs almost as much as the 805 Bren which everyone agrees is too heavy.
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Posted: 4/17/2018 6:03:12 PM EDT
[#40]
Looking at both rifles components, there is no way the grot is a full pound heavier. The 7.25 lb weight for the scar is a 14" unloaded I believe. The stated weight for the grot may be a loaded weight and/or may be for a 16" bbl.
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Posted: 4/18/2018 4:37:50 AM EDT
[#41]
GROT C16 FB-M1 empty mass with 406mm (16") barrel is 3650g (8.05lb), for bulpup with same barrel empty mass is 3750g (8.26lb).
Mass is almost same as empty wz. 96 Beryl with 475mm (18") barrel. Quoted:I have some 40rd Gen3 on hand, so I will compare them with Grot mag and try to seat them in Grot. I think it is the nub, but not the position, but rather size. |
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Posted: 4/18/2018 7:41:29 AM EDT
[#42]
delete
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Posted: 4/18/2018 9:22:26 AM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
delete |
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Posted: 4/23/2018 11:54:52 AM EDT
[#44]
Cool rifle but with its price point of 8000 ZL ($2400 USD), it will be close to $3k by the time it got stateside. I'd be all over it for $1600-1800 range (say a little more than the CZ 805 Bren). But no way would I pay 2x more than a Bren or more than a SCAR 16. If they can't get the price point down, it won't do well heee and only collectors or those that want it for sentimental purposes will get one. Small market means lack of significant aftermarket support too.
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Posted: 4/24/2018 5:14:52 AM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Cool rifle but with its price point of 8000 ZL ($2400 USD) |
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Posted: 4/25/2018 12:27:38 AM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Remember that this price includes 23% VAT (sales tax). To compare to US prices use 6500 PLN ($1890) as base price for your estimations. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Cool rifle but with its price point of 8000 ZL ($2400 USD) |
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Posted: 5/1/2018 9:55:38 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted: OH no you DIDN'T. Toast Toast Really 
Did you bring enough for EVERYBODY!! Jelly NOT JAM, Butter real butter not the country crock shit, Apple butter for the Southern Bells.
NO I didn't think so. Wait what 2 weeks UH .. 
Well Now good thing I like biscuits then UH.
/ / / / / / / / / / I really can't see your comparison to the XCR. I actually looked up the XCR pictures online. It however really does have a close resemblance to the ACR!!! Worst thing they could have done with the ACR was use the AR15 Barrel with Barrel extension. http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2016/02/13/taking-closer-look-difference-acr-msbs/ Meanwhile, people like me have been shooting our XCR’s since 2006 without so much as a hiccup. As for the “two weeks” thing, Robinson is and was a TINY company-shit sometImes takes longer than they want it to. What your ass can’t deny is that Robinson made good on every one of its promises for the XCR-L and to date is the only one of the Piston Driven Modular Carbines that lived up to its name, the Masada/ACR didn’t, the SCAR didn’t. Then for good measure, he shit on the SCAR17 with the XCR-M. Stop reading recoil and start buying guns, Bro. |
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Posted: 5/1/2018 10:29:22 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You sound like one of those internet haterz that bags in shit he doesn’t have experience with. Meanwhile, people like me have been shooting our XCR’s since 2006 without so much as a hiccup. As for the “two weeks” thing, Robinson is and was a TINY company-shit sometImes takes longer than they want it to. What your ass can’t deny is that Robinson made good on every one of its promises for the XCR-L and to date is the only one of the Piston Driven Modular Carbines that lived up to its name, the Masada/ACR didn’t, the SCAR didn’t. Then for good measure, he shit on the SCAR17 with the XCR-M. Stop reading recoil and start buying guns, Bro. The XCR has been the only real modular rifle for more than a decade. I don't give a shit about caliber conversions, I only wanted it in 5.56. Its a great rifle. |
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Posted: 5/3/2018 5:08:09 AM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You sound like one of those internet haterz that bags in shit he doesn’t have experience with. "internet haters" DAMN DUDE!! Meanwhile, people like me have been shooting our XCR’s since 2006 Good for you. you got a good one. Others haven't. without so much as a hiccup. As for the “two weeks” thing, Robinson is and was a TINY company-shit sometImes takes longer than they want it to. Yeah but we all know 2 weeks isn't really "Two Weeks" to Robinson. What your ass can’t deny is that Robinson made good on every one of its promises for the XCR-L "Did he really??" and to date is the only one of the Piston Driven Modular Carbines that lived up to its name, the Masada/ACR didn’t, the SCAR didn’t. Lets seem Modular Piston Driven Carbines. I had an ACR once I figured out that the barrel and the caliber change capability wasn't coming along I ditched it. BUT it could swap out barrels hand guard stocks parts and ect. The parts were never made available. BUT As I have said the ACR's main problem was it was designed to use and AR15 barrel with Barrel extension. As for the Scar the barrels came along once again a day late and a dollar short but JESUS they wanted alot for them. Then for good measure, he shit on the SCAR17 with the XCR-M. LOLOL Thats funny Dear!!! Stop reading recoil I look at it in the grocery store, while the wife is getting groceries too expensive pretty pictures but still just a rag. and start buying guns, Bro. Bro I mean Damn Bro I have guns I buy and sell guns sometimes 2 of each I mean WTF you want me to go out and buy a gun I have shot and just didn't care for it. Also I have only seen 1 in the shops around here. Three total in the last 10 years counting the $3000 XCR at the gunshow a few months after Sandy Hook and the one I shot. |
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Posted: 5/5/2018 12:06:55 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryComes with MLok handguard, ambi charging handle. Looks great. Will definitely get one when they come into the States.
Saw it had .223 marking. Is it 5.56 compatible? |
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