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Posted: 3/13/2006 11:25:56 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/16/2006 1:07:09 PM EDT by BUCC_Guy]
So I was at a local store yesterday and saw a Polytech M14 for $650.

It is KILLING me. I'm trying to fund a 9mm AR build and I just bought a nice FAL on an impulse in December. All of this toy buying is hard on a college budget!


I know I want an M1A for the collection and it doesn't get any cheaper than this. Mags are a bitch to get in it, might need to dremel a wee bit. But the thing looks spotless. Couldn't find a lick of carbon and the bore is nice.


Is this the deal of a lifetime or should I just wait it out and get one on the net? M1As are not my speciality, but I recall hearing good things about the Polytechs.

Oh, and it has a fake flash hider and no bayo lug.

- BG
Link Posted: 3/13/2006 2:31:21 PM EDT
The price is about right from what I have seen. What are you refering to about the mag issue? I had a Polytech and had no problems with GI mags fitting.

BTW I wish I had not sold that Poly.
Link Posted: 3/13/2006 2:42:52 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Sajer:
The price is about right from what I have seen. What are you refering to about the mag issue? I had a Polytech and had no problems with GI mags fitting.

BTW I wish I had not sold that Poly.



The mags are really tight. Have to be lined up real nice and rocked back "smartly." The guy working the counter actually had to let me put the mag back in to re-rack the rifle... he couldn't manage to do it.

I looked at the mechanism... I think a dremel could take care of it.


- BG
Link Posted: 3/13/2006 4:24:49 PM EDT
Polytech is a POS, from what I've read. Soft bolts, soft barrels, excessive headspacing, etc. were some of the problems.

These are not to be confused with the "Norinco" brand of M1A's. These are ok with the steel hardness, again, from what I've read.

My .o2
Link Posted: 3/13/2006 5:53:46 PM EDT
If you can get one for $650 thats definitely one I'd be interested in.

If you can push it down to under $600 based on the mag catch issue I'd snag it in a hurry.

However, the following are things you should consider before getting one.

Bolts: Yes, the bolts are soft and the headspace will grow over time, but we're talking about several thousand rounds of use. The first thing you should do if you get it is to get the headspace checked. If its good, you're good to roll. If not, you should look into have a USGI bolt fitted to the receiver. The best method to have this done is to have the receiver modified to allow USGI bolts to drop in.

Gas cylinders: Not sure if its the case, but I'm really thinking these are carbon steel and not stainless steel. The part is parked, matches the rest of the rifle and has started to rust a bit. Also, the gas pistons won't interchange with a USGI one, so if you need a new one its going to have to be a chinese one.

Rear sights: It seems to work loose a bit, but then again, so does my WWII lock bar sight, so I think thats just the sight not being tightened down as much as it should be.

However, these are just things to think about. The bolt issue I believe is the most pressing concern that will, at some point, probably have to be dealt with. Overall they're good M14's that can turn in impressive groups with good ammo and a good shooter. For the price I think they're probably the best buy for a starter M14 type rifle at the moment.

This is based on my real world experience along with what I've gathered from other shooters. While I'm sure there are some who will disagree with me, I'd really only listen to those with actual experience. If it says anything, Poly's around here that are at the $650 or less mark aren't for sale for very long...

Link Posted: 3/13/2006 7:02:48 PM EDT

Originally Posted By BobCole:
Polytech is a POS, from what I've read. Soft bolts, soft barrels, excessive headspacing, etc. were some of the problems.

These are not to be confused with the "Norinco" brand of M1A's. These are ok with the steel hardness, again, from what I've read.

My .o2



Yep, they're a piece of crap. Can I have the address and phone number of the gun shop ? Do they take Visa or Mastercard ?. I had one of those back in the 90's and all my children were born with hairlips. Listen to bobcole, he says they suck and he works at gunshows !

Did I ask you for their address ?
Link Posted: 3/13/2006 7:50:29 PM EDT
I would be very tempted at that price. From what I've heard I'd get it and have the GI bolt mod done and not worry about the rest unless it becomes a problem. I'd love an M1A but the price kills me.
Link Posted: 3/13/2006 8:14:19 PM EDT
Got mine for $600 3.5 years ago. I don't shoot it much because the BRD hit me HARD (4 AR's now) and the ammo costs more, but I've put about 2500rds through it without a hitch.

I'd see if they'll dicker down a little (towards the $600 range) and check the headspacing on it.

After that, shoot the piss out of it.

WIZZO
Link Posted: 3/13/2006 8:25:13 PM EDT
I have one that I picked up several years ago for about the same price. Good shooter, haven't had a problem one with it. I would buy another in a heartbeat.
Link Posted: 3/13/2006 8:25:14 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/13/2006 8:26:14 PM EDT by Bigger_Hammer]
+1 on working the seller to be a little flexible.

Not all the PolyTechs had soft bolts (that was primarily the very early guns that had the soft bolt issue.) the receivers are FORGED and excellent (closest to U.S.G.I. spec according to "Different" (and if there was anybody I'd defer to on M-14 / M-1A it is the guy who literally wrote the book!!)

You can get a new hardended bolt for about $100 fro MARSTAR in Canada (the Can-Nuks can still get good guns at affordable prices - (Thanks for giving us "the Monica" too Bill Frick'en Clinton!!)

WARBIRD does a good U.S.G.I. bolt conversion if that is your choice. About $300 but he reparks the whole gun so if you wanted to "un-neuter" it with a real flashider / bayont lug ect... that would be the time to do it!)

The Noricinos and PolyTechs are the VERY SAME GUNS - just marked differently based on the importer.

Check out Differents history of the Chinese M-14 on his web site. Good Reading!

Good Luck on your purchase - (You ARE going to purchase it right???)

BIGGER_HAMMER
Link Posted: 3/13/2006 8:34:56 PM EDT

Originally Posted By BUCC_Guy:

I looked at the mechanism... I think a dremel could take care of it.


- BG



Do not take a dremel to the rifle. Some mags, even USGI mags, fit a little tight. Out of my 20 USGI mags, 1 fits a little tight but is still usable in my Poly. Sometimes it's the mag, sometimes it's the stock. try those before ever considering a dremel.
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 6:17:40 AM EDT
Well folks, I appreciate the input but I hesitate based on the following:

1) Financially, I'm in bad shape. I'm selling an upper to fund a 9mm build and I already "put it off" long enough.
2) If $650 is a nice price, that is one thing. But if I have to invest a few hundred more to make it perfect, the price isn't that great to begin with.
3) There is no sense trying to get the "good deal" now and have it kill my bank account when I could just get the average deal in the future and not have it kill me.



Again, I appreciate the input. If anyone in CT wants the location on the rifle, throw me an IM.


- BG
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 6:43:46 AM EDT
I've got a Poly M14. The headspace was a bit excessive so I installed a GI bolt, and put in a GI trigger group and op rod just for the fun of it.

It shoots quite well and I've experienced no parts breakage on it. I'd like to lose the fake flash hider but apart from that I'm happy with it.
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 1:12:23 PM EDT

Originally Posted By BobCole:
Polytech is a POS, from what I've read. Soft bolts, soft barrels, excessive headspacing, etc. were some of the problems.

These are not to be confused with the "Norinco" brand of M1A's. These are ok with the steel hardness, again, from what I've read.

My .o2





Yeah thats what every person who WANTS one usually says......


BTW Polys have the BEST recievers vs domestic M1A's.
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 2:06:17 PM EDT
Dude, just buy it
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 4:55:24 PM EDT

Originally Posted By weptek911:

Yep, they're a piece of crap. Can I have the address and phone number of the gun shop ? Do they take Visa or Mastercard ?. I had one of those back in the 90's and all my children were born with hairlips.




Had you advanced beyond 1st grade & could read, you would have read that I wasn't the one saying I knew where it was for sale.


Listen to bobcole, he says they suck and he works at gunshows !



No, I do not work at gunshows, I also wrote from what "I've read". Again, you don't know how to read.

No doubt you lose IQ everytime you shit. No wonder team members avoid the general non-team forums with braying jackasses such as you've demonstrated.
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 4:58:13 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Ineedhelp:

Originally Posted By BobCole:
Polytech is a POS, from what I've read. Soft bolts, soft barrels, excessive headspacing, etc. were some of the problems.

These are not to be confused with the "Norinco" brand of M1A's. These are ok with the steel hardness, again, from what I've read.

My .o2



Yeah thats what every person who WANTS one usually says......
BTW Polys have the BEST recievers vs domestic M1A's.




You're whistling up the wrong tree here, sir. My AR-10 gets me by just fine & when I ever do get my M1A, it will say "Springfield" on it. YMMV.
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 5:40:03 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/14/2006 5:53:31 PM EDT by weptek911]

Originally Posted By BobCole:

Originally Posted By weptek911:

Yep, they're a piece of crap. Can I have the address and phone number of the gun shop ? Do they take Visa or Mastercard ?. I had one of those back in the 90's and all my children were born with hairlips.




Had you advanced beyond 1st grade & could read, you would have read that I wasn't the one saying I knew where it was for sale.


Listen to bobcole, he says they suck and he works at gun shows !



No, I do not work at gun shows, I also wrote from what "I've read". Again, you don't know how to read.

No doubt you lose IQ everytime you shit. No wonder team members avoid the general non-team forums with braying jackasses such as you've demonstrated.



Okay , so you no longer work at gun shows. That doesn't appear to stop you from offering ill-considered opinions on things you know nothing about, or coming across as a know-it-all, gun-store geezer type. Seriously, if you don't have any first hand knowledge, why don't you stay quiet ? Why don't you stay in the safety of TEAM where you belong ?

As far as reading comprehension goes, this whole satire thing is lost on you, so just go stay where it's safe okay ? Or at least limit your opinions to guns you have actually owned or at least shot. It seems pretty ridiculous to call something a POS when you've never even handled one.

Sorry you don't like being confronted on the value of your opinions. I'll bet you get that a lot.


edit ** By the way, I actually owned a Norinco M14. It shot great and I never had any trouble or malfunctions with it. I only sold it because I needed to have an A2 configuration AR15 before the AWB took effect. I now own a Springfield M1A and I'm still trying to tweak it to get it right.

Link Posted: 3/14/2006 5:47:42 PM EDT

No doubt you lose IQ everytime you shit. No wonder team members avoid the general non-team forums with braying jackasses such as you've demonstrated.


Oh, but of course we team members wouldn't want to associate with those sniveling hoards of common folk. From time to time we do grace the proletariate with our insights, but only to permit them a glimpse of the exalted life on the other side. What say you BobCole, shall we retire to member's only area? We've paid our $15 and we shall be quite content to associate only with those of, how should I say, higher class. Besides, the air in there is ever so much more refreshing, being so heavily scented with our own fecal deritus. Of course, as you are all aware, the defecate of those chosen to be team members does not offend one's olfactory, in fact the sweet scent actually stimulates the phallus to grow. But of course, say you, that is how BobCole became the man he is today.

TRANSLATION: Bob Cole, you are a moron. A greasy waste of carbon with nothing, whatsoever, to add to any thread on which you post. You are low speed. You are high drag. And no membership will change that, even if you pretend you're better because of it. I fart in your general direction.

You can't even write a sentence that makes sense. "With braying jackasses such as you've demonstrated." How do I demonstrate a braying jackass? I didn't see any pictures of a braying jackass. Nor has anyone described one. I can be a braying jackass, figuratively, but demonstrating one seems more difficult. Maybe a "braying jackass" is some kind of gay sex move. That could be demonstrated, and it would explain your familiarity with the subject, but I've read the whole thread and I don't see any such demonstrations. Perhaps you should close the gay porn while reading ar15. That might eliminate embarrassing confusions like this one.
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 6:01:30 PM EDT

Originally Posted By BobCole:

Originally Posted By weptek911:

Yep, they're a piece of crap. Can I have the address and phone number of the gun shop ? Do they take Visa or Mastercard ?. I had one of those back in the 90's and all my children were born with hairlips.




Had you advanced beyond 1st grade & could read, you would have read that I wasn't the one saying I knew where it was for sale.


Listen to bobcole, he says they suck and he works at gunshows !



No, I do not work at gunshows, I also wrote from what "I've read". Again, you don't know how to read.

No doubt you lose IQ everytime you shit. No wonder team members avoid the general non-team forums with braying jackasses such as you've demonstrated.



Its really a shame when threads get hijacked by this kind of stuff. In fact, these petty squabbling and insult matches are why I haven't paid to become a member. I'm sure a lot of other people here are thinking what I'm thinking right now, so, I might as well say it.

I, along with many others, come to these forums for information pertaining to our interests and hobbies. Additionally, we come to ask legitimate questions and would like real answers. However, its unfortunate that when these discussions do come up and some individual decides to shit on the thread with personal insults and outright drivel.

If you're going to make sweeping comments on items that your only knowledge of is based on what you've read, then you'd better expect people to have people come down on you for that.

Also, from everything I've read on here the only "braying jackass" here is the one who decided to crap on this post by turning it into a 3rd grade pissing match. So, please BobCole, spare us mere mortals from the greatness which is the ARFCOM team member, we are unworthy of you and your REMARKABLY insightful and thought provoking comments which you have bestowed upon us this day. Do us a favor and take those insightful comments and be off to the wonderful world of team member forums where us mere mortals are not welcome, as if those are the comments I can expect to find there, you won't see me there anytime soon.

Long and short, lets stop shitting on threads. If you have something positive to add please feel free as constructive comments are what we're here for. If I wanted to hear grown men engage in pissing matches about who is dumber than the other one I'd turn on talk radio.

Oh, and also, lets come up with a new insult other than "you can't read." You've been using that one for a while and its clearly getting old.
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 6:03:27 PM EDT
IANALY

I'm glad it's not just me.
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 6:15:35 PM EDT
It is a sad state when American rifles are of inferior quality to Chineese. "When I get an M1A, it will say Springfield on it". I used to say that too. The Springfield rifles are crap. I work at a well known gun store/shooting range in Phoenix. Half of the rifles were so out of spec that a rubber mallet had to be used on the op rod to remove the bolt. The recievers are cast. Chineese recievers are forged, and held to better tollerances. Even the op rod is cast on the Springfields. The cheezy crinkle black spray paint that they use on the GI brown stocks flakes off while they are still on the display wall. I don't know how they get away with charging so much for a rifle bulit like a Ruger, but I wish people would quit buying them.

If you want a good rifle, get the Chineese rifle. I have had two, with thousands of rounds fired and no excessive headspace.

If you want a good American Rifle (the best), get one built on an LRB reciever, with GI parts. Not Springfield.
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 7:34:03 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/14/2006 7:51:15 PM EDT by AZ-Dave]
+111111111111111111 on the above that Weptek911 and Ianaly said about the EXPERT! Reading the constant drival gets old.

Now to get back to the thread----I would have bought it in a heartbeat, and I own 2 Springfield M1A's----I have known several people that have been running Poly's and Norinco's for MANY thousands of rounds with NO problems----it appears a small amount were put out that DID have problems---and of course Fulton Armory, Smith and a few others took advantage of the opportunity to recommend all these very necessary bolt changes/headspacing, heat treats, etc. for EVERY CHICOM rifle. Do you think they benfited from the RUMORS that ran rampent? Ask the Canadians what they think---they can still get them---for $3-400 AMERICAN!!!!!

ETA: I guess I got lucky with my 2 Springfields, they run 100%----LIKE THEY SHOULD for the damn price, but I think you stand a better chance of getting a BAD Springfield than a bad Poly/Norinco (and they're half the price)
Link Posted: 3/14/2006 8:16:47 PM EDT
To the original poster:

If you got the thing for $650 and only put another couple hundred into it, it will be the cheapest M14/M1A you will ever own. With a forged receiver and decent barrel.

For another $600 or so, you can have a Douglas/Barnett medium barrel supplied and installed, GI bolt supplied and fitted, GI parts for trigger and tuned to 4.5 lb., GI flash suppressor, etc. That's what Geoff Corn did for mine.

All together now, eveyone say "forged receiver." Repeat, lather, rinse.

If it says Polytech, Norinco, or LRB on the receiver it's forged.

If it says Springfield Armory, it's cast.

The GI M14 had a forged receiver.

In 2004, the gun shop owner who handled the transfer for my Polytech bad-mouthed the rifle as well. If it was still 1994 and all I had was a subscription to the American Rifleman I guess I'd say the same thing.

If you do get around to headspacing one of these, try and remember the M14 spec is 1.634. That's closing on a .308 no-go, but not on the field gauge.

Link Posted: 3/15/2006 5:00:36 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/15/2006 5:01:21 AM EDT by BUCC_Guy]

Originally Posted By mike047:
To the original poster:

If you got the thing for $650 and only put another couple hundred into it, it will be the cheapest M14/M1A you will ever own. With a forged receiver and decent barrel.

For another $600 or so, you can have a Douglas/Barnett medium barrel supplied and installed, GI bolt supplied and fitted, GI parts for trigger and tuned to 4.5 lb., GI flash suppressor, etc. That's what Geoff Corn did for mine.

All together now, eveyone say "forged receiver." Repeat, lather, rinse.

If it says Polytech, Norinco, or LRB on the receiver it's forged.

If it says Springfield Armory, it's cast.

The GI M14 had a forged receiver.

In 2004, the gun shop owner who handled the transfer for my Polytech bad-mouthed the rifle as well. If it was still 1994 and all I had was a subscription to the American Rifleman I guess I'd say the same thing.

If you do get around to headspacing one of these, try and remember the M14 spec is 1.634. That's closing on a .308 no-go, but not on the field gauge.




If I actually had an income, I'd jump on it. As it is, I'm placing an order for a 9mm upper and mag block (comes out, roughly, to what the Polytech costs) and that will tap me out completely.

- BG

EDIT: Any more bickering and the thread gets locked. If I see it correctly, the squabbling was over a misunderstanding anyway.

Link Posted: 3/15/2006 5:45:59 AM EDT

Originally Posted By IANALY:
I fart in your general direction.




I guess that better than being spit on....

Back to topic though, if I were in your position, I'd see if they could go down a bit on price then do layaway. You could argue that "the magwell is kinda tight and you're gonna have to fix it yourself" to get the price down...
Link Posted: 3/15/2006 5:36:28 PM EDT

Originally Posted By weptek911:

Okay , so you no longer work at gun shows. That doesn't appear to stop you from offering ill-considered opinions



Last I checked, this board's entire function was to allow the use of offering opinions. You have some proof otherwise, sir??????



on things you know nothing about,


A) I wrote what "I had been told" or "what I had read". How you got sand in your mangina over that is your problem, sir, not mine.

B) I was lucky enough to get issued a M-14 (one of the last, no doubt) as a Marine in 1976. By all means, treat us all to your level of vast experience on the M14/M1A rifles, eh????


or coming across as a know-it-all, gun-store geezer type.


You mean as opposed to an "asshole GD yankee know-it-all", sir?????????



Seriously, if you don't have any first hand knowledge,


I've talked to owners of both Polytech & Norinco models. Too GD bad if that doesn't fit your criteria.



why don't you stay quiet ?


Why don't you skip the threads you don't like or ignore the posts you don't like? Keep the sand out of your magina, in other words?????




Why don't you stay in the safety of TEAM where you belong?


Ah, yet another internet commando.


Or at least limit your opinions to guns you have actually owned or at least shot. It seems pretty ridiculous to call something a POS when you've never even handled one.


I have shot them. A good friend of mine has one, I don't. Simple enough for you, sir??????



Sorry you don't like being confronted on the value of your opinions. I'll bet you get that a lot.


Mostly from jackass loudmouthed yankess.


Link Posted: 3/15/2006 5:37:30 PM EDT

Originally Posted By IANALY:

How do I demonstrate a braying jackass?




Find a mirror.
Link Posted: 3/15/2006 5:39:59 PM EDT

Originally Posted By BUCC_Guy:

EDIT: Any more bickering and the thread gets locked.




Might want to delete my answers then, eh?
Link Posted: 3/15/2006 5:58:23 PM EDT

Originally Posted By BobCole:

Originally Posted By IANALY:

How do I demonstrate a braying jackass?




Find a mirror.




Dude,

I just gave you the internet equivalent of a slap upside your head with my cock, and that's the best response you can muster? Honestly. Why do you even try. Do you honestly think anyone here believes your inane babble now that you've claimed that your knowledge is from a "friend" who has a Norinco, mere moments after you claim your knowledge is based on having "read" about the chicom rifles?

You have no credibility. The reason you have no credibility has less to do with the fact that you make contradictory statements about weapons you've never touched, and more to do with the fact that you claim you have a friend. EVERYONE knows that's a boldfaced lie.

Please, call me a couch commando, or even better, tell me that you are rubber and I am glue, and that my words bounce off you and prove you're a giant fairy. Douchebag.

Link Posted: 3/15/2006 6:08:02 PM EDT

Originally Posted By BobCole:

Originally Posted By BUCC_Guy:

EDIT: Any more bickering and the thread gets locked.




Might want to delete my answers then, eh?



BUCC asked that we not bicker anymore in this thread, I'll respect that, but of course you won't because you ARE BobCole.

It's pointless anyway, other posters seem to have the same view of your credibility that I do.

My work is done here.
Link Posted: 3/15/2006 6:28:05 PM EDT

Originally Posted By IANALY:

I just gave you the internet equivalent of a slap upside your head with my cock,





Nothing like maturity on the arfcom soap opera.
Link Posted: 3/16/2006 5:44:59 AM EDT
Lock incoming when the mod logs on.

Thanks to the folks who were discussing the Polytech.

- BG
Link Posted: 3/16/2006 8:43:44 AM EDT

Originally Posted By BobCole:

Originally Posted By IANALY:

I just gave you the internet equivalent of a slap upside your head with my cock,





Nothing like maturity on the arfcom soap opera.




Nothing like the kettle calling the pot black...
Link Posted: 3/16/2006 3:21:57 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/16/2006 3:21:57 PM EDT by TREETOP]
Per author's request.
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