I am not a hunter, either.  Nor do  wish to be a meal.  Usually, when out in the wild, I carry a .44 Mag.  (629 with a 3" barrel).  The advice given by others to be aware and wary is the way to go - prevention.  If attacked, and you don't (one usually doesn't) have time to make noise, empty whatever you have into the chest.  

Out West, I carry a Marlin 1895 .45-70.  Their bears can beat up our bears.

Quoted: I think we should all get our Redhawks bobed n ported down to 2 inches myself.

mmmmmm....Super Redhawk Alaskan
http://www.fadedempire.co.uk/firepower/firepower-pics/alaskan.jpg
Its on my list of guns I need to buy.

Quoted: The 10mm glock sounds good. I saw a 10mm MP5-10 cut through a lvlII vest in a norma spec load.

KogaShuko, can you clarify the vest rating you saw get cut up?  I'm not doubting you at all, just that I couldn't decifer the exacting level.  Level II?  A 9mm fired from a rifle barrel can penetrate a Level II IIRC.  A full power 10mm fired from a rifle barrel would be wicked, to bad there aren't many 10mm carbines out there.

Quoted: Will this fit in your ruck? www.au.af.mil/au/awc/systems/dvic559.jpg

u mean in the backpack

I would advise you not to give him one.  It's unlikely he'll be able to use it without thumbs, but why take the chance?

How about one of those AK pistols?

My brother had the opportunity/need to shoot a charging black bear a couple years ago. It started 15 feet away, at most, his .416 was leaning agains the cabin within reach, but no round chambered. The bear charged and was no more than 2 feet away when he fired, the 400grain bullet pretty much turned its head to jelly.
He didnt even have tim to be scared. So whatever you have, make sure its close by!

Quoted: Quoted: I think we should all get our Redhawks bobed n ported down to 2 inches myself. mmmmmm....Super Redhawk Alaskan www.fadedempire.co.uk/firepower/firepower-pics/alaskan.jpg Its on my list of guns I need to buy.

That thing has NO porting at all!

Quoted: Quoted: Hey Noob, How many bears have you killed, skinned, and disassembled? Your ignorance is showing... I may be new to this site, but it dosnt mean I'm new to hunting, firearms, tactical weapons etc. I did only recently take up bear hunting like I said 4 years ago, and your only allowed one tag per year.the first year I didnt get one because I assumed like most people that bears like meat and filled my bait stations with it.  now I only use doughnuts and fruit. yes, I do gut skin and process all the game I kill. my count is 3 bear, and 58 deer. how many have you taken, sparky? I gave up, he sits in a stand over bait and calls himself a hunter. Bears are apparently, at least in MN, fuzzy cuddly wuddly things that do not eat meat. let me guess, you chase your bear down when you go hunting? oh no, thats right, the bear is hunting you....I fergot, sorry

I have 8 black bears.

I only killed one over bait, and it is one of the very few things that I have ever regretted killing.  I won't hunt over bait again.

I have also killed 6 of the great bears and have witnessed another dozen killed.

You have killed 58 deer?  lol...I killed 44 this year(so far).  

Please do not refer to me as Sparky.

Learn to spell, Junior.

click here

J75, I looked at an Alaskan today at a show.  Mighty tempting.  I'm moving away from .44 Magnum in the interests of simplification.  So, when I find new homes for some of my .44 stuff, an Alaskan may have a home.  My only use is for protection when in woods or on my boat, to discourage a shark that won't take no for an answer.  I have to do some research to see which does better in short barrels, .45-70, as in the Magnum Research pistol, or the Alaskan.  My bet is on the Alaskan because of the powder burning speed.  

Quoted: I killed 44 this year(so far).

My initial impression is that the Missouri Department of Conservation would not look favorably upon the killing of 44 deer by one man, in one year, in the "Show Me State."  Other than visiting Springfield and Branson to visit family I don't know any details on the MO bag limits.  How many hunting licenses (other states included) might you be using bubba?  Or are you using a special "farmer's" permit or something?

Please forgive me if I'm wrong in my assumption but it just doesn't sound legal.

Quoted: Quoted: I killed 44 this year(so far). My initial impression is that the Missouri Department of Conservation would not look favorably upon the killing of 44 deer by one man, in one year, in the "Show Me State."  Other than visiting Springfield and Branson to visit family I don't know any details on the MO bag limits.  How many hunting licenses (other states included) might you be using bubba?  Or are you using a special "farmer's" permit or something? Please forgive me if I'm wrong in my assumption but it just doesn't sound legal.

Alabama, Mississippi,Kentucky, Missouri, Texas, Arizona, and New Mexico.  And Sonora.

Alabama Lease allows 2 deer a day with a 70-odd day season.  Plus we culled 82 does in Alabama alone.  I assure you all were Legal kills.  None were wasted.

Furthermore, Northern Missouri allows unlimited harvest of antlerless deer for $7.00 each.

Quoted: J75, I looked at an Alaskan today at a show.  Mighty tempting.  I'm moving away from .44 Magnum in the interests of simplification.  So, when I find new homes for some of my .44 stuff, an Alaskan may have a home.  My only use is for protection when in woods or on my boat, to discourage a shark that won't take no for an answer.  I have to do some research to see which does better in short barrels, .45-70, as in the Magnum Research pistol, or the Alaskan.  My bet is on the Alaskan because of the powder burning speed.

I like the Alaskan in 454 cuz you can practice with .45 colts all day long, and then bump up to the 454's for some real fun.

and....I just think that snubby revolvers look cool

So basically the best rifle/handgun combo the next time I visit my sister's lodge in Sitka, AK would be the following


M1 Garand with blacktip AP ammo
Desert Eagle .50 AE

I have 8 black bears. I only killed one over bait, and it is one of the very few things that I have ever regretted killing.  I won't hunt over bait again. I have also killed 6 of the great bears and have witnessed another dozen killed. You have killed 58 deer?  lol...I killed 44 this year(so far).   Please do not refer to me as Sparky. Learn to spell, Junior. click here

SOOooo, how do you hunt bear then? to my knowledge the only ways to take bear are long range open country shooting and over bait, whether it is naturally falling bait (IE acorns) or a bait station.

I'm afraid that I don't have the luxury of traveling to unlimited hunting zones around the country, up until the last 4 years it has been 1-2 deer a year. recently the population has been exploding and the limit has been 5 per person per year.  so for me, 58 is a pretty good record.  I hunt for food for me and my family.

with that said, I don't even know why you are arguing with me... you agree that black bear attacks are very rare.   If you are as seasoned hunter as you claim to be, you know that a bear can be killed with a .357 mag or even a .45 ACP, you may never have hunted with either but if it can be killed with a bow then certainly a well placed .45 can bring one down.  
you think that he should use solids and that's fine, but I know that a .357 mag SP will take em down because that is what my brother in law used.
you may not like the choice of a 1911 for defense against bears. but I'm sure you will agree that if you ARE attacked that every tenth of a second counts.

average top speed of a black bear is 30 MPH
that means that a black bear can cover roughly 22 feet in 0.5 seconds

I have carried my 1911 on my hip on and off duty almost every day for the last 3 years, and practice is a religion. when bad guy makes a threatening move and pulls the box cutter out of his coat pocket,  the 1911 is out of the holster and on target without any conscious thought on my part, a reflex action.  On the other hand, I KNOW that I wouldn't get a shot off with my .44 mag 6" SRH. it would probably take me a good 3-4 seconds to get it out of the holster.
since the guys handle is Bikecop, I took a guess that me might be in law enforcement and would probably have practiced more with one of the 1911's, or might even carry one on duty.
he could carry a 45-70 revolver but it doesn't mean a thing if he cant get it out fast enough.

Blackmagic94
Save yourself a lot of trouble (and bullshit). Sitka is heavy forest and vegetation, carry a 45-70 Levergun. If you feel as if you need a handgun for backup choose a large Revolver.

Quoted: I have 8 black bears. I only killed one over bait, and it is one of the very few things that I have ever regretted killing.  I won't hunt over bait again. I have also killed 6 of the great bears and have witnessed another dozen killed. You have killed 58 deer?  lol...I killed 44 this year(so far).   Please do not refer to me as Sparky. Learn to spell, Junior. click here SOOooo, how do you hunt bear then? to my knowledge the only ways to take bear are long range open country shooting and over bait, whether it is naturally falling bait (IE acorns) or a bait station. I'm afraid that I don't have the luxury of traveling to unlimited hunting zones around the country, up until the last 4 years it has been 1-2 deer a year. recently the population has been exploding and the limit has been 5 per person per year.  so for me, 58 is a pretty good record.  I hunt for food for me and my family. with that said, I don't even know why you are arguing with me... you agree that black bear attacks are very rare.   If you are as seasoned hunter as you claim to be, you know that a bear can be killed with a .357 mag or even a .45 ACP, you may never have hunted with either but if it can be killed with a bow then certainly a well placed .45 can bring one down.   you think that he should use solids and that's fine, but I know that a .357 mag SP will take em down because that is what my brother in law used. you may not like the choice of a 1911 for defense against bears. but I'm sure you will agree that if you ARE attacked that every tenth of a second counts. average top speed of a black bear is 30 MPH that means that a black bear can cover roughly 22 feet in 0.5 seconds I have carried my 1911 on my hip on and off duty almost every day for the last 3 years, and practice is a religion. when bad guy makes a threatening move and pulls the box cutter out of his coat pocket,  the 1911 is out of the holster and on target without any conscious thought on my part, a reflex action.  On the other hand, I KNOW that I wouldn't get a shot off with my .44 mag 6" SRH. it would probably take me a good 3-4 seconds to get it out of the holster. since the guys handle is Bikecop, I took a guess that me might be in law enforcement and would probably have practiced more with one of the 1911's, or might even carry one on duty. he could carry a 45-70 revolver but it doesn't mean a thing if he cant get it out fast enough.

Most of my bears have been spot and stalk.  

In my opinion,  AND I do believe my opinion carries considerable weight due to the fact that I have shed a notable amount of blood,  I do not think a 1911 is a good choice as a bear gun, when used as a back-up, regardless of the ammo or shot placement.  

First of all, let's back up.   45acp is a great round and will kill black bears all day long.  I have a couple and carried one for several years.  I have shot a lot of small game with one,  as well as finished a few deer with one.  I have seen the wound channels they are capable of producing.

Second, I have crawled inside a few bears and seen how they are assembled.  When every thing goes well,  It really won't take much to kill one.  On the other hand,  A bear shoulder and a deer shoulder are not similar.  A bear's skull is rather heavy and its hide is very tough.  I don't think a 45acp can enter a bear skull from the nasal pasage and smash another 18 inches of spinal column.  Remember the whole idea is to STOP an attacking bear,  he will die soon enough but you want to stop the attack post hast.

There is a huge difference between hunting bear and stopping an attack.  If you have a momma sow that is hormonal to begin with, and now she thinks you are a threat to her cubs, she is gonna be on a high that would challenge the Boers or the Beatles.  I will shoot bears all day long with a 357 or 45,  But it is not how I want to end a fight.

I carry a .454 while I am in serious bear country and I hope I never need it. (That's why God invented .375H&H's).

Have you ever seen an enraged bear?  They are indeed rather quick.  And brutally strong,  even your Minnesota black bears.  I am not gonna risk my life if a more suitable cartridge is available.


If you don't believe me,  Go kill a hog use his guts, skull and plate as balistic jelly.  Leave them
intact to the carcass.  A small bear is three times as tough.

I never did say that it was a good choice, there are many better arms out there.  but out of the two types of guns he listed as options in either .357 mag or .45 ACP, I would go with speed over power.  anyone would probably be scared shiftless if the first time they seen a bear in the wild, its charging down on them at 30 MPH.  fear will impede the thought process and motor function.  that is one of the reasons that any good cop will practice as often as he can.  you train you musicals to perform a specific task so that when the time comes, that silky smooth draw is an involuntary reaction to danger.  

I am under no delusions that a .45 ACP will penetrate a bear scull. I said in my first post to not shoot for the head.   unless you can get it right in the mouth or nose, neither cartridge will do anything but piss it off. and in an under pressure situation(especially one you have never been in before) accuracy will not be on your side.  If a bear is charging you, then then shoulder plates will be off to the sides and you should have a clear shot below the head and in the top of the ribcage, aim dead center between the arms and a little on the low side.  this will give you about an 8 inch target(well, depending on the size of the bear)

we both agree that the more power the better, especially in a defective situation.  In my opinion, at least in my case, if I had to choose between the two, I would go 1911.  with the 1911 I know that I will get off at least one shot, I doubt that I would be able to get out my .357 mag in time(or my .44magfor that matter).
also I think that a 1911 would be easier to bring to bear after it already has you on the ground, at least easier then a long barreled wheel gun.  

Quoted: Blackmagic94 Save yourself a lot of trouble (and bullshit). Sitka is heavy forest and vegetation, carry a 45-70 Levergun. If you feel as if you need a handgun for backup choose a large Revolver.

That is what my brother in law carries on guides, but seriously though a M1 would be a good choice as the recoil is reduced over a bolt, it semi auto, and reloads quick.  


I hate wheel guns, not my cup of tea.  

On a side note, Alaskan Brown Bears make black bears look like jack rabbits.  

Quoted: So basically the best rifle/handgun combo the next time I visit my sister's lodge in Sitka, AK would be the following M1 Garand with blacktip AP ammo Desert Eagle .50 AE

Yeah if you want a FTL on your second shot cause you were too scared to hold it properly. Plus the .50 is not as powerful as you may think.

Nothing more powerful in auto pistol design.  Again, I hate wheel guns, the ergos suck and reloading under stress is much more difficult compared to slamming a magazine home.  

Quoted: Nothing more powerful in auto pistol design.  Again, I hate wheel guns, the ergos suck and reloading under stress is much more difficult compared to slamming a magazine home.

I agree with you on the reloading, but you really hate wheel gun ergonomics?  I find them to be some of the most natural pointing and best feeling handguns there are.

Never liked the way a GP100 Ruger felt in my hand and I hated the double action trigger pull.  

Black bear 180-600 pounds .357 158 grain JSP(allmost as good as hard cast )!

Bigger bear 600-1200   at least a .45 colt with a cor-bon 310 grain hard cast!

S&W 500 also comes to mind!!!

You know that with the right slug any twelve guage will get-er-done!!!!


Bob