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Posted: 12/14/2005 3:37:20 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/12/2006 3:54:12 PM EDT by myitinaw]
I just purchased a Kahr Auto Ordnance M1 Carbine
AOM 140. A full review/range report will be forthcoming

http://www.auto-ordnance.com/ao_aom110_f.html

later this week. Here's some Pics:











I finally took the M-1 Carbine to the range today, and in a nutshell
What a Piece of Shit! I used 5 different 15 rd, new G.I. Magazines, and the 10rd
Kahr/AO supplied magazine. I used two brands of 30 Carbine Ammo. Sellier & Bellot,
and Magtech.
The weapon constantly jams, or wont feed at all. or when it does
load a cartridge into the chamber, the firing pin will not even put a dimple
on the primers. And it never fired more than 4-8 rounds without a malfunction
occurring. My range buddy was as dismayed as I.

I cannot recommend the purchase of this rifle. Sad but true...
If one wants a reliable shooter, purchase the proven GI models.




myit

Link Posted: 12/14/2005 3:40:53 PM EDT
w00t!
that is nice. Is that the optional oak stock? looks very sharp
Link Posted: 12/14/2005 3:54:53 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/14/2005 3:55:35 PM EDT by Sukebe]
Aside from the pot belly stock, it looks like a nice war time M1 carbine repro.
Link Posted: 12/15/2005 5:59:28 PM EDT
How much did that set you back? Can you put a barrel band bayo lug on it? Just curious, been looking at a Remington that is here in MS, but not wanting to pay what they want for it!
Link Posted: 12/15/2005 6:03:19 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/17/2005 12:46:14 PM EDT by myitinaw]
With all of the upgrades, etc it was $600 + tax,
a bit high [for an m1 carbine], but the dealer has saved
me a bunch of money on many transactions. The bayonet
lug/shrowd can be attached. I ordered one from Sarco.
I am taking it to the range soon, an update will be
forthcoming.

Impact Guns has the Auto Ord. M1 Carbine
Model# AOM 110 listed for $548.17

www.impactguns.com/store/602686313018.html

Link Posted: 12/15/2005 6:05:49 PM EDT
Like the stock!!!! Nice rifle!
Link Posted: 12/16/2005 12:59:54 PM EDT
What upgrades did you add to it?

The only downside I found after getting my AO/Kahr over a year ago is that ammo was somewhat expensive. Gander Mountain currently has the Winchester stuff at $15.99/50 (or $0.32 per round), and Georgia Arms has their brand made with new components for $160/1000 (or $0.16 per round). I got into reloading partly because of the carbine, and can roll my own for about $0.09 per round.

Have fun with it!
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 8:35:13 PM EDT
updates?
Link Posted: 12/24/2005 4:04:36 AM EDT
yea hows that puppy shoot??
Link Posted: 12/24/2005 4:55:47 AM EDT
How do you like it?
Link Posted: 12/28/2005 4:58:25 AM EDT
Updates?!
Link Posted: 12/28/2005 6:48:08 AM EDT
Yes! Updates!

Someday, I'd like to pick up a Kahr M1 Carbine.
Link Posted: 12/30/2005 12:43:52 PM EDT
Enjoy
I've had one for about a year now no complaints.

Link Posted: 1/8/2006 7:45:02 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/8/2006 7:45:42 PM EDT by danpass]

Originally Posted By myitinaw:
I just purchased a Kahr Auto Ordnance M1 Carbine
AOM 140. A full review/range report will be forthcoming

http://www.auto-ordnance.com/ao_aom110_f.html

<snip>




Link Posted: 1/12/2006 3:36:17 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/12/2006 3:55:18 PM EDT by myitinaw]
See Original Post for Range Report!
Link Posted: 1/12/2006 3:41:41 PM EDT

Originally Posted By myitinaw:
See Original Post for Range Report!






linkee no workee perhaps
Link Posted: 1/12/2006 3:46:54 PM EDT
working now sorry...
Link Posted: 1/12/2006 4:13:25 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/12/2006 4:22:43 PM EDT by danpass]
wow.

I've got an Iver Johnson (commercial copy) thats been awesome.

www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=6&f=6&t=192321


I think something untoward is going on (or maybe something is not going on )


Stripped it down yet?

edit: Link added www.surplusrifle.com/m1carbine/rifledisassembly/index.asp
Link Posted: 1/13/2006 6:05:29 AM EDT
Did you buy it brand new (unfired)? - Either way, did you break it down and clean everything before you shot it? It might have cosmoline caked in all the crevices. That could be interfering with the firing pin, etc. If cleaning doesn't do the trick, it sounds like you probably need to get some "wolf" heavy duty springs for it. If you don't get wolf springs, try getting one of the "high speed" action springs. Those have a little more power than the standard ones. Also, when you clean it, make sure to flip it upside down when cleaning the bore so none of the solvent/oil will get down in the gas system. M1 carbines are very sensitive to that. When I first got one, I made that mistake and it immediately stopped recocking. I had to remove the gas piston nut and take a pipe cleaner and clean out the hole coming from the barrel, etc. Once I did that, it shot fine.

Good luck with it. Once you get the kinks worked out, I'm sure you'll love it.
Link Posted: 1/13/2006 7:11:11 AM EDT
I've heard about Kahr/Auto Ordnance rifles being hit or miss out of the box. Send it back to them, give them one chance to make it right before trashing it too much.

Every once in a while, someone, somewhere, is bound to get a lemon.
Link Posted: 1/13/2006 2:37:43 PM EDT
Looks like one of the newer production AO guns, distinctions being the stock, simple flip sight, and the non-bayo-lug barrel band. I have an earlier production AO. It doesn't run real well at all with S&B .30 and it won't feed Federal JSPs either. Semi-auto breechloader!

Mine actually came with a parked Underwood GI mag, I was surprised. No problems with it. Before you feed it to the wood chipper, try running down some PMC .30 carbine. Mine runs perfectly with it. Also evaluating the Wolf .30 carbine, but I haven't shot much (like a couple rounds) of it yet. Good luck with it!
Link Posted: 1/14/2006 2:15:44 PM EDT

Originally Posted By timb3:
Did you buy it brand new (unfired)? - Either way, did you break it down and clean everything before you shot it? It might have cosmoline caked in all the crevices. That could be interfering with the firing pin, etc. If cleaning doesn't do the trick, it sounds like you probably need to get some "wolf" heavy duty springs for it. If you don't get wolf springs, try getting one of the "high speed" action springs. Those have a little more power than the standard ones. Also, when you clean it, make sure to flip it upside down when cleaning the bore so none of the solvent/oil will get down in the gas system. M1 carbines are very sensitive to that. When I first got one, I made that mistake and it immediately stopped recocking. I had to remove the gas piston nut and take a pipe cleaner and clean out the hole coming from the barrel, etc. Once I did that, it shot fine.

Good luck with it. Once you get the kinks worked out, I'm sure you'll love it.



Big +1 on this. Mine needed a good cleaning when I got it, and it hasn't skipped a beat since. Be sure to take it apart and clean the trigger group. Use a thin layer of good quality grease on the locking lugs and slide tracks. A decent oil elsewhere (pivot points for the trigger and hammer, spring-to-hammer contact or whatever it's called, and wherever else is appropriate).

An alternate range report: I took my Kahr/AO M1 carbine to the range today and fed it a mixture of WWB ammo along with some of my reloads and it functioned without error. It shot as well as my AR at 25 & 50 yards indoors (winter in MN is coooold!), and it has a better trigger. I've had it for about a year and a half with several thousand rounds fired and I couldn't be happier with it.

Link Posted: 1/14/2006 2:41:45 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/14/2006 2:42:29 PM EDT by PocketG]

Originally Posted By myitinaw:
I just purchased a Kahr Auto Ordnance M1 Carbine
AOM 140. A full review/range report will be forthcoming

http://www.auto-ordnance.com/ao_aom110_f.html

later this week. Here's some Pics:

www.img4free.com/thumbs/myitinaw/dcp0996.jpg</a>

www.img4free.com/thumbs/myitinaw/dcp0999.jpg</a>

www.img4free.com/thumbs/myitinaw/dcp0998.jpg</a>

www.img4free.com/thumbs/myitinaw/dcp1000.jpg</a>

www.img4free.com/thumbs/myitinaw/dcp1012.jpg</a>

I finally took the M-1 Carbine to the range today, and in a nutshell
What a Piece of Shit! I used 5 different 15 rd, new G.I. Magazines, and the 10rd
Kahr/AO supplied magazine. I used two brands of 30 Carbine Ammo. Sellier & Bellot,
and Magtech.
The weapon constantly jams, or wont feed at all. or when it does
load a cartridge into the chamber, the firing pin will not even put a dimple
on the primers. And it never fired more than 4-8 rounds without a malfunction
occurring. My range buddy was as dismayed as I.

I cannot recommend the purchase of this rifle. Sad but true...
If one wants a reliable shooter, purchase the proven GI models.




myit




What a shame, the Auto-Ordnance M1 carbine I bought 7 month ago shoots great. The only jams I had were from shitty mags. The mag that comes with it out of 500 rounds no jams what so-ever. My AO shoots very accurately at 100 yards, I mean nailing bowling pins one after another.
Link Posted: 1/14/2006 3:08:47 PM EDT
Any way you can get this thing fixed?
Max
Link Posted: 1/14/2006 5:59:54 PM EDT
Your description of malfunction is not adequate for anyone to make a diagnosis nor provide helpful suggestions.

Did the bolt fail to lock when feeding a round?
Does the extractor and ejector move when you push on them?
Did the bolt fail to pick up a new round when the action cycled?
Did the new round not feed into the chamber, but got hung up on the feed ramp or chamber's edge?
Does the gas piston move under its own weight when you tilt the carbine muzzle up, then muzzle down?
Were the bolt lugs and op rod greased properly?
Did you notice any brass shavings or copper rubs? If so, where were they?
Link Posted: 1/29/2006 12:51:15 PM EDT
Having not read this thread, I just brought one of the walnut stocked version home.
$569.95 new in box.
With WWII guns going for between 600 and 1K around here, I figured I am at least getting a
warranty and brand new gun.
I REALLY hope I havent gotten a turd here, reassurance, or tips, guys?

DaddyDett
Link Posted: 1/29/2006 2:14:32 PM EDT

Originally Posted By DaddyDett:
Having not read this thread, I just brought one of the walnut stocked version home.
$569.95 new in box.
With WWII guns going for between 600 and 1K around here, I figured I am at least getting a
warranty and brand new gun.
I REALLY hope I havent gotten a turd here, reassurance, or tips, guys?

DaddyDett



Clean it up good, work the slide a fair bit, and take it out shooting. They come pretty tight, but once broken in operate like a swiss watch. I've got well over two thousand rounds through mine and it's great.

Link Posted: 1/29/2006 2:57:10 PM EDT
Their Thompsons are the same quality...


Trust me, I know...
Link Posted: 1/29/2006 3:02:40 PM EDT
Sorry to hear about it man.
Unfortunately, there is just no way to produce a copy of a weapon like the M1 Carbine or M1 Rifle.
Link Posted: 1/29/2006 6:43:48 PM EDT

Originally Posted By thedoctors308:
Sorry to hear about it man.
Unfortunately, there is just no way to produce a copy of a weapon like the M1 Carbine or M1 Rifle.



I don't get this. There are far more non-Colt 1911s around and everyone thinks their Kimber or Springfield is great. Armalite and Bushmaster are ranked as equal to Colt by many (The "ABC" rule). Lots of folks swear by their Springfield M1A.

Yet commercial copies of an M1 Carbine are dismissed out of hand, mostly by folks who have either never shot one or who saw a Universal (it looks sorta like an M1 carbine if you squint right).

Having looked at a variety of M1 carbines as potential "shooters" prior to purchasing my Kahr, I feel pretty confident that it is a better rifle than a 60+ year old USGI weapon IF you want to use it for shooting. It has no collector value, and it won't appreciate in value. But for a plinker carbine, I don't think it can be beat: you're not putting wear and tear on a collectors item, you're using a carbine that's still new and built to tighter tolerances so it is more accurate, and you're not going to feel bad if you want to "bubba-ize" it or something equally distasteful to carbine afficianados.

Link Posted: 1/30/2006 3:17:53 AM EDT
I agree, Chief. The plans for the originals should be in the public domain.
Modern manufacturing techniques and technologies should produce a higher quality, more consistant product.
I think the price I got was a result of my rifle not having a bayonet lug type band.I don't care! I have a 15" khukuri that will do just fine, I don't need no stinkin bayonet.

I greased the bolt channels, cleaned the chamber, and a little oil on the mag release etc..
She should be ready to test fire today.

DaddyDett
Link Posted: 2/4/2006 6:36:55 PM EDT

Originally Posted By ChiefPilot:

Originally Posted By thedoctors308:
Sorry to hear about it man.
Unfortunately, there is just no way to produce a copy of a weapon like the M1 Carbine or M1 Rifle.



I don't get this. There are far more non-Colt 1911s around and everyone thinks their Kimber or Springfield is great. Armalite and Bushmaster are ranked as equal to Colt by many (The "ABC" rule). Lots of folks swear by their Springfield M1A.

Yet commercial copies of an M1 Carbine are dismissed out of hand, mostly by folks who have either never shot one or who saw a Universal (it looks sorta like an M1 carbine if you squint right).

Having looked at a variety of M1 carbines as potential "shooters" prior to purchasing my Kahr, I feel pretty confident that it is a better rifle than a 60+ year old USGI weapon IF you want to use it for shooting. It has no collector value, and it won't appreciate in value. But for a plinker carbine, I don't think it can be beat: you're not putting wear and tear on a collectors item, you're using a carbine that's still new and built to tighter tolerances so it is more accurate, and you're not going to feel bad if you want to "bubba-ize" it or something equally distasteful to carbine afficianados.





I have a Rem 1911A1 like new(1945)and I just handled a Kimber that is close to the tightness,and finnish!!

I sold to my Ex-son -in -law an Underwood series B contracted M1 carbine that would be hard pressed to tell from new!!

The steel used is a sure different thing to take into propective,plus the dies and machining are not the same!!

I don't know why Khar can't get it right,maybe because all the old Thompsons(auto-ordinance)were investment castings(them machined by Caspian Arms) then hand fitted at New Hurley!!

Maybe its the machining(by caspian)or the hand fitting at Hurley!

But something is wrong!!!


Bob
Link Posted: 2/4/2006 8:14:02 PM EDT

Originally Posted By bobbyjack:
I have a Rem 1911A1 like new(1945)and I just handled a Kimber that is close to the tightness,and finnish!!

I sold to my Ex-son -in -law an Underwood series B contracted M1 carbine that would be hard pressed to tell from new!!

The steel used is a sure different thing to take into propective,plus the dies and machining are not the same!!

I don't know why Khar can't get it right,maybe because all the old Thompsons(auto-ordinance)were investment castings(them machined by Caspian Arms) then hand fitted at New Hurley!!

Maybe its the machining(by caspian)or the hand fitting at Hurley!

But something is wrong!!!


Bob



Exceptions to the rule. The average USGI 1911A1 is a rattle trap, as are most USGI carbines I have held.

For a shooter, I'll take my Springer 1911 and my M-1 Kahrbine, thanks....
Link Posted: 2/5/2006 9:41:45 AM EDT

Originally Posted By HK_Shooter_03:
Their Thompsons are the same quality...


Trust me, I know...


+1 on the Thompsons. Mine spent more time at the factory getting worked on over the year or so I had it than it did with me. I will never buy anything Kahr or AO again.
Link Posted: 2/6/2006 12:53:27 AM EDT
Do the AO/Kahr use the same barrels as the IAI M1 carbines? I heard their main problem was the chambers were too tight which lead to alot of its problems.

$600 seems high for a M1 carbine, I got a matching inland in good shape for $450 and a comercial sprigfield for $350.
Link Posted: 2/6/2006 2:39:42 AM EDT
Sorry to hear the dismal range report .

I've been actively looking for a good original M1 carbine .
The prices for real non re import , matching guns is insane
for a 50-60 year old weapon .

At this point I am ready to spend the $900 on a Fulton Armory
rebuild , since everything they use but the barrel is inspected
and tested USGI parts . They also come with a 30 day no questions
asked money back guaranty .

I have had the opportunity to inspect and shoot one of the Fulton
guns and I was impressed . Fit , Finish and Function were perfect
and accuracy at 100 yds was better then better then spec using
cheap Win ball ammo .

Hindsight being what it is , I'm kicking myself in the ass for not keeping
some of the M1's I owned in the past . Back when you could buy service
grade or better CMP guns for $75 all day long
Link Posted: 2/6/2006 4:08:52 AM EDT
Real sorry to hear yourcarbine's giving you troubles. I have read that while their guns are somewhat hit or miss, they always make good with their warrante services. Send it back if you cant fix it yourself.

I almost bought one of these just last month but I went for a plainfield for half the price instead. Ive already put 800rds through it with zero malfunctions. Im glad my inner cheapskate came out that day.
Link Posted: 2/6/2006 4:52:21 AM EDT
Wow, that's some range report. I wonder how Kahr could screw up a M1 Carbine so bad???
Link Posted: 2/6/2006 5:15:14 AM EDT

Originally Posted By LUGERMAN:
Wow, that's some range report. I wonder how Kahr could screw up a M1 Carbine so bad???



The same way Springfield screws up M1As so badly - mine had to be sent back to SA three times before they finally fixed it. Every manufacturer has lemons now and again, or at least that's how the story goes in the case of the SA M1A.
Link Posted: 2/6/2006 6:57:17 AM EDT

Originally Posted By ChiefPilot:

Originally Posted By LUGERMAN:
Wow, that's some range report. I wonder how Kahr could screw up a M1 Carbine so bad???



The same way Springfield screws up M1As so badly - mine had to be sent back to SA three times before they finally fixed it. Every manufacturer has lemons now and again, or at least that's how the story goes in the case of the SA M1A.



It's ironic then, what's going on with my guns.
My Socom 16 runs like a champ, My new Kahr M1 Carbine has serious issues.
It fails to feed in one way or another 90% of the time.
I called Kahr, whom seem to have a "can-do" attitude.
Kahr overnited me 2 ten rd. mags to test with, no help.
As a matter of fact, the ten rounders tend to rattle out of the gun after a couple rounds.
Kahr's Customer Service department is my next phone call after lunch.
I am VERY dissapointed that this rifle has problems.
So much for buying new, in order to get quality.
I am going to give Kahr one chance to get this right. After that, if it doesn't run,
I intend to request a full refund, or will take a P45 in it's place.

More to follow.


DaddyDett
Link Posted: 2/6/2006 7:05:19 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Matthew_Q:
I've heard about Kahr/Auto Ordnance rifles being hit or miss out of the box. Send it back to them, give them one chance to make it right before trashing it too much.

Every once in a while, someone, somewhere, is bound to get a lemon.



I spent $60 sending my K/AO Thompson back before gettin that pos back.

I should have saved that cash and sold it the first time.

Kahr's might be good pistols, but it seems over and over everything else they make is junk.

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