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Posted: 6/3/2003 8:25:26 PM EDT
I go with my Dad to pick up his new .45ACP Taurus revolver today at this pawnshop/gunstore today and within 5 minutes I notice/hear the following from this twentysomething part-owner/manager:
1)He sells this lady a .22 pistol for self-defense use, advising her to load the thing with CCI stingers.
2)He uses the word "clip" in conversation and on the tags on the guns.
3)He assures me that only the Taurus revolvers have moon clips (he used the word correctly!), that they are proprietary and that's that.
4)He goes on and on and on about how a certain brand of ammo (Glazer safety slug wannabe--I think it was Defender) came up "number one in lethality in that Strasbourg goat test."

This fellow has one of the largest inventories and best selections of firearms in town, but I really gotta wonder howinthehell he got into the business....
It's weird--almost every other gundealer in town is fairly well squared away but this dude was shocking!
Link Posted: 6/3/2003 9:09:17 PM EDT
1. Stingers are ok for self defence.

3. Taurus 45 acp uses a proprietary 5 shot
full moon . S&W 's are 6 shot BTW

2 out of 4 , he didn't do to bad for the typical G-store employee !
Link Posted: 6/3/2003 9:12:25 PM EDT
Strausborg tests were in like 1905, IIRC.
Link Posted: 6/3/2003 10:18:09 PM EDT
You said it was a pawnshop///gundealer.He sounds like the "chattycathy" type, some people just like talking. You should hear what he tells folks about some of the "antique" jewlery!......Legally its called "puffy talk" to sell you ANYTHING!.
Link Posted: 6/4/2003 3:25:49 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Combat_Jack:
Strausborg tests were in like 1905, IIRC.



Jack, the (if they were really done) tests were on French Alpine Goats around the early to mid 1990's. 600 GOATS!
It was to be a definitive test for handgun 'stopping power'.
The test you're referring to was for the .45ACP, and the test animals were cows. I can't recall the name used in reference to that one. (...it's 0400 and I'm not awake yet)
That's how I remember this incredible story, anyway!
Link Posted: 6/4/2003 5:05:13 AM EDT

Originally Posted By tangeant:
1. Stingers are ok for self defence.



If one is an expert shot and could reliably put the bullet exactly where you want it--this lady was saying how she'd have to bring the gun back in for cleaning after she'd shot it! I doubt she'd be able to put a bullet in the tear duct of a bad guy.


3. Taurus 45 acp uses a proprietary 5 shot full moon . S&W 's are 6 shot BTW


The taurus uses a stellar clip--the SW uses a moon clip. TOTALLY different heavenly body

And another thing: he's selling a ruger security six 357mag for fully twice the price I bought mine for last week--no big deal, just another thang that makes one go "hmmmm"....

ok, NOW I'm through bitching
Link Posted: 6/4/2003 9:25:20 AM EDT

Originally Posted By llanero:

Originally Posted By tangeant:
1. Stingers are ok for self defence.



If one is an expert shot and could reliably put the bullet exactly where you want it--this lady was saying how she'd have to bring the gun back in for cleaning after she'd shot it! I doubt she'd be able to put a bullet in the tear duct of a bad guy.



Stick the gun in the bad guy's ribs, squeeze the trigger, and then tell us it's not good for self defense. You'll see just how much damage that little .22 can do.
Link Posted: 6/4/2003 9:36:40 AM EDT
Here's that Defender ammo that he was talking about.

Magsafe Ammo Inc.


CHRIS
Link Posted: 6/4/2003 10:36:46 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/4/2003 4:01:19 PM EDT by tangeant]
Put a Taurus full moon clip " Steller " next to a new S&W full moon clip. They work on the same principle except the taurus is a 5 shot and smaller in dia. Plus S&W probably has a trademark on " Full Moon Clip " so Taurus had to come up with a new catchy name for it ....
Link Posted: 6/4/2003 9:00:30 PM EDT

Originally Posted By RobarSR60:
[
Stick the gun in the bad guy's ribs, squeeze the trigger, and then tell us it's not good for self defense. You'll see just how much damage that little .22 can do.



Yeah, I know how much damage that little .22 can do, having done my own "Strasbourg-in-Missouri-tests" on critters ranging from mere ounces to 100plus pounds. There is no doubt in my mind that it can kill quickly, just that (as you alluded to in your quote above)PLACEMENT becomes more and more of an issue as the "oomph" factor of a cartridge goes down.
And as placement becomes more of an issue, then the shooter's technical ability comes into play more...right? Or am I totally off-base here?

This lady wanted the pistol for self-defence and she looked pretty damned serious and sober while at the counter--it was obvious something was going on in this lady's life to bring her here. She needed a gun that would stop someone cold and the .22 can only do that with fairly narrow range of shots.

I guess what I'm saying is that the .22 pistol would be the ideal gun for this lady to learn how to shoot well and develop good technique, but it would not be the ideal gun for a survival situation. In a survival situation, the .22 pistol is more of an expert's gun (akin to using a .410 bore shotgun for upland game-hunting! Great for teaching youngsters how to shoot and lead, but when it comes time to actually kill something with it, you had better be pretty damn good with the thing).

On a slightly related note, when my mother took a job in the bad part of Phoenix, dad didn't buy her a .22 for her first pistol==he bought her a .38spcl and dragged her to Shooter's World until she learned how to shoot well AND use that pesky speed-loader thingy!
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