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Posted: 12/6/2002 2:23:44 PM EDT
I have an opportunity to buy an excellent condition police trade extended tube 8-shot parkerized Ithaca Model 37 for $189 from my local law enforcement gun shop. It is exceptionally clean, looks to have been carried little and shot even less. My friend at the store says the ones they picked up in a trade with a county sheriff's dept. were reserve guns that sat in an armory for the past thirty years or so. I believe him, based on the condition. I believe this one dates from the 60's or 70's. I have not owned an Ithaca 37 before, what is the opinion on them as far as reliability and quality? Is this a good deal? Thanks for any input.
Link Posted: 12/6/2002 2:34:02 PM EDT
Link Posted: 12/6/2002 2:50:06 PM EDT
Buy it! or I will.

We have an old 37 here at the shop that is just a sweet shooter. Very light and 100% reliable.

-Z out
Link Posted: 12/6/2002 3:03:37 PM EDT
All steel, bottom feed & eject. This is a gun that lives with hot loads.

The auto-disconnector is fun too. ( had one from LVPD.)

It's a steel at that price, I'd buy it. (pun intended)
Link Posted: 12/6/2002 3:05:31 PM EDT

I have not owned an Ithaca 37 before, what is the opinion on them as far as reliability and quality?

Outstanding and terribly underrated. A John M. Browning design (descended from the Remington Models 10/17/29).


Is this a good deal?

Yes. I'd be interested in an 8-shot DSPS as well. Please IM or email me the dealer's contact information.


Are these are the ones where you can hold the trigger back and work the pump and it'll fire as you slam the pump forward?

More than likely, yes. The 37 retained its slam fire feature until 1987. Even on the newer guns, rounding up the older slam fire parts shouldn't be a problem.
Link Posted: 12/6/2002 5:14:48 PM EDT
I love mine. Kicks like a mule on steroids though. One day at the indoor range, I discharged 75 shells. My shoulder was killing me for days.
Link Posted: 12/8/2002 6:09:51 AM EDT
I like mine:

Link Posted: 12/8/2002 6:46:39 AM EDT
Link Posted: 12/8/2002 7:04:09 AM EDT
Buy it, it's a great gun at a great price. A gun like that would bring about $225-$250 here easy.

I probably see 20 Remingtons for every Ithaca in for repair. A good design.


Balming
Link Posted: 12/8/2002 7:28:59 AM EDT
I guess Slufstuff ain't going to give anyone else the dealer's contact info.
Link Posted: 12/8/2002 7:41:11 AM EDT
I had one, but I didn't much like the action, or the "double clutch." Mine actually had to be repaired fot FTE problems and I sold it (& don't regret it). But I just prefer 870s so take my comments accordingly.

Balming:
"I probably see 20 Remingtons for every Ithaca in for repair. A good design."

No flame, but there are probably 200 rems for each Ithica.

Robert
Link Posted: 12/8/2002 7:44:51 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/8/2002 8:53:26 AM EDT by Jim_Dandy]

I had one, but I didn't much like the action, or the "double clutch." Mine actually had to be repaired fot FTE problems and I sold it (& don't regret it). But I just prefer 870s so take my comments accordingly.

No flame, but there are probably 200 rems for each Ithica.

Robert


You don't understand the design and neither did the individual performing the repairs. Please take that accordingly.
Link Posted: 12/8/2002 8:50:28 AM EDT
Jim, I take it your comment was toward Robert, and not me, correct?


Balming
Link Posted: 12/8/2002 8:52:47 AM EDT

Jim, I take it your comment was toward Robert, and not me, correct?

Correct. I inadvertently included the entire post.
Link Posted: 12/8/2002 9:09:01 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/8/2002 9:10:31 AM EDT by BusMaster007]
Go for it!

Here's a site for sights:

MMC
www.mmcsight.com/index.html

MMC Shotgun Ghostring:
www.mmcsight.com/shotgun.htm

I put these on my Beretta 1201FP.
Coincidentally, the same set will fit an Ithaca 37 due to the receiver contour.
Maybe I should pick up an Ithaca!

Be sure to check out MMC's links page, too.

Link Posted: 12/8/2002 9:13:23 AM EDT
Jim_Dandy You said "You don't understand the design and neither did the individual performing the repairs. Please take that accordingly."


Here in NY our troopers often refer to the Ithica's ability to engage the weapon in a fire when being pumped position as a "double clutch." I don't care for this feature b/c I think it's unsafe). I have never believed pumping out rounds with this feature to have any tactical merit and to the contrary, in the hands of a novice or merely a person unfamiliar with the feature, the double clutch is an increased safty issue.

I don't quite understand your pronouncement. How, in the complete absence of specific information, were able to infer from my post that I did not understand the design and neither did the gun smith performing the repairs. Especially when the repairs to my Ithica involved a broken exractor and had nothing to do with the Ithica's unique features. Please explain.

In any event, I was quite clear about my preference and my points only 1. that the Ithica had to be repaired, when I never had to send my 870 to the doc and 2. a one-in-twenty repair ratio between Ithicas & Remington may not really indicate that Ithicas fail less. Do you disagree?

My comments were candid and accurate to my experience. I expect people want to hear all opinions, good and bad when they make inquireys here. I know I do and that I often benefit more from hearing posters problems than just the raves.
Link Posted: 12/8/2002 9:55:45 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Jim_Dandy:

Jim, I take it your comment was toward Robert, and not me, correct?

Correct. I inadvertently included the entire post.



Jim, do you ever post anything that isn't condescending or insulting to other members? It's too bad we all aren't as informed about everything as you claim to be. I appreciate you expertise, just not your insulting way of showing it.
Link Posted: 12/8/2002 9:58:01 AM EDT

Here in NY our troopers often refer to the Ithica's[SIC] ability to engage the weapon in a fire when being pumped position as a "double clutch." I don't care for this feature b/c I think it's unsafe). I have never believed pumping out rounds with this feature to have any tactical merit and to the contrary, in the hands of a novice or merely a person unfamiliar with the feature, the double clutch is an increased safty issue.

You're from New York and you can't spell Ithaca correctly? The feature is called "slam fire" and was quite common on shotguns designed prior to WWII (like the Winchester Model 12). Your comment has absolutely NO bearing on safety and is a matter of personal preference ONLY. If you had read the entire thread and not the parts you liked, you'd have known that the Ithaca Model 37 has not been produced in this manner since 1987. Converting one version of the 37 into another is a very small matter indeed.


I don't quite understand your pronouncement. How, in the complete absence of specific information, were able to infer from my post that I did not understand the design and neither did the gun smith performing the repairs. Especially when the repairs to my Ithica involved a broken exractor and had nothing to do with the Ithica's unique features. Please explain.

Uh, well, gee, I guess it was this piece of wit:

Mine actually had to be repaired fot FTE problems and I sold it (& don't regret it).

Did you not post that?


a one-in-twenty repair ratio between Ithicas & Remington may not really indicate that Ithicas[SIC] fail less.

Strictly subjective comment which you have no way to prove. The 37's design has been around in one shape or another since 1908 and served quite well with the military from WWII through Vietnam. That says a little something right there.

Don't take it as a flame, just take it accordingly.
Link Posted: 12/8/2002 9:59:33 AM EDT

Jim, do you ever post anything that isn't condescending or insulting to other members?

Please be more specific.
Link Posted: 12/8/2002 11:26:53 AM EDT
I'm not quite sure how I provoked you, maybe its just your disposition? But let me respond.

Correcting my sbellink? but not answering my question regarding your pronouncement. Sounds like your evading the question son.

So.....How, in the complete absence of specific information, were able to infer from my post that I did not understand the design and neither did the gun smith performing the repairs. Especially when the repairs to my Ithica (oops there I go again - I’ll just have to leave NY) involved a broken extractor and had nothing to do with the Ithaca's unique features. Please explain.

My comments in reference to the slam fire (or colloquial double clutch - whichever you prefer) were related to my opinion about safety or tactical advantage. You evaded that as well. You acted as though these comments were superfluous, to wit: "If you had read the entire thread and not the parts you liked, you'd have known that the Ithaca Model 37 has not been produced in this manner since 1987." Well Jim, if YOU had read the original question you might have noted the shotgun in question "dates from the 60's or 70's" hence my comments regarding the double clutch were and remain appropriate.

FWIW I was not discussing how easy it would be (for us mortals) to change stock items or do home repair, I was discussing a stock feature. I was recounting my experience and giving my opinion. Slufstuff, may or may not have known about this feature and will now be free to keep or change the feature according to his preference. If I happened to point him towards an issue with this weapon that even two people disagree on, so much the better.

The fact that the design feature, at issue here, lingered, is meaningless. More significant is that the double clutch was discontinued, Yes?

Let me say for the record that it sounds as though you're very knowlegable, and your points (some of them) contributed to the thread. But, attacking people for their opinions is generally associated with persons of very limited scope.
Link Posted: 12/8/2002 11:54:38 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/8/2002 11:59:04 AM EDT by Jim_Dandy]

I'm not quite sure how I provoked you, maybe its just your disposition?

I'm not provoked. Just calling a spade a spade.


Correcting my sbellink? but not answering my question regarding your pronouncement. Sounds like your evading the question son.

No questions were evaded. Please go back and re-read the answers.


My comments in reference to the slam fire (or colloquial double clutch - whichever you prefer) were related to my opinion about safety or tactical advantage. You evaded that as well.

Actually, I didn't. I posted this in response:

Your comment has absolutely NO bearing on safety and is a matter of personal preference ONLY.



Well Jim, if YOU had read the original question you might have noted the shotgun in question "dates from the 60's or 70's" hence my comments regarding the double clutch were and remain appropriate.

I did read it and I responded with this:

Converting one version of the 37 into another is a very small matter indeed.

Your comment was therefore, N/A.


Slufstuff, may or may not have known about this feature and will now be free to keep or change the feature according to his preference.

It was mentioned wayyyyyyyyyyyy back in some earlier posts. The very first response, to be exact.


The fact that the design feature, at issue here, lingered, is meaningless. More significant is that the double clutch was discontinued, Yes?

Significant only to you.


But, attacking people for their opinions is generally associated with persons of very limited scope.

Let's set something straight here before somebody goes crying to the cyber JBTs. Your OPINION was challenged, but your character and person were never, EVER attacked or otherwise called into question. In other words, don't be so thin-skinned as to perceive any comment, disagreement, or heady discussion as a sleight or personal insult.
Link Posted: 12/8/2002 12:28:17 PM EDT
I'm no expert on shotguns, since I've only owned two in my life, a Winchester model 97 and an Ithaca, but I'll tell you this. I wish I had the Ithaca back.

I'd probably still have it if it had been one of the police models. Mine had a 28 inch Modified choke barrel; and I'm not a bird hunter.

If I ever do get the chance to pick up one of these police models, I'll grab it for a home defence gun. Love the bottom ejection (I'm a leftie), and that price is outstanding.
Link Posted: 12/8/2002 1:06:05 PM EDT
Link Posted: 12/8/2002 3:01:32 PM EDT
Jim_Dandy: Let me make this simple for you. You said:

"You don't understand the design and neither did the individual performing the repairs. Please take that accordingly."

For the third and final time I invite you to explain exactly how you arrived at the conclusion that I or my gunsmith did not understand the design.

You have repeatedly avioded answering this question(Please go back and re-read YOUR answers). In fact I find amusing the fact that you have gone to the trouble of copying my every comment, word-for-word, but somehow you failed to copy or respond to the central issue between us. Avoidance is not a sign of strength. If you cannot explain, please so indicate. Otherwise, I grow tired of attempting to engage in a discussion when you merely pontificate, distort, and attempt to bait.

BTW "cyber JBTs?" Are you referring to the mods here (you sound a little spooky)?

Link Posted: 12/8/2002 3:39:57 PM EDT

For the third and final time I invite you to explain exactly how you arrived at the conclusion that I or my gunsmith did not understand the design.

Uh, 'cause you posted this:

Mine actually had to be repaired fot FTE problems and I sold it (& don't regret it).

It implies that you sold it under a belief that it couldn't be repaired.


You have repeatedly avioded answering this question(Please go back and re-read YOUR answers). In fact I find amusing the fact that you have gone to the trouble of copying my every comment, word-for-word, but somehow you failed to copy or respond to the central issue between us. Avoidance is not a sign of strength. If you cannot explain, please so indicate. Otherwise, I grow tired of attempting to engage in a discussion when you merely pontificate, distort, and attempt to bait.

I've answered it, but you have failed to read that answer.


BTW "cyber JBTs?" Are you referring to the mods here (you sound a little spooky)?

There is one who is a petty tyrant.
Link Posted: 12/8/2002 5:15:59 PM EDT
Ah, ok, finally we arrive. So you state:

"It implies that you sold it under a belief that it couldn't be repaired"

But once I explained my statement and detailed the basis for my opinion, and you understood that you had incorrectly inferred my meaning, why then the continued rancor?

FWIW: I bought that Ithaca because I had always heard good things about them (I was an active leo at the time and what was good enough for the NY State Police sounded good enough for me). I bought it used, primarily as a "guest gun" for use (on my upstate property) mostly by my best friend, a lefty so the bottom eject was perfect (I owed my buddy big time for taking me fishing on his boat every other weekend). My friend was not real gunny and had an unitentional discharge b/c he had not released the trigger when he racked the gun after shooting at a rabbit (no harm was done but I lost interest in having him hunt with me while using it). I found the stock safty with its safe/slam-fire/fire not the best design, especially for a guest gun. As I said, I never really liked the slide either, but I was admittedly preferential to the 870. Anyway, The gun remained in the safe until I called upon it for a pheasant hunt with another friend. During the hunt the extractor failed and my friend was forced to trade off with my gun. The experience killed that Ithica (which was doing duty as a back-up HD gun) for me and I got rid of it. I thought the experience (short version) was worth passing along here. Do you still disagree?

Link Posted: 12/8/2002 6:02:24 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/8/2002 6:05:49 PM EDT by Jim_Dandy]

Do you still disagree?

I don't even care anymore. The fact remains that the Model 37 is a very good and proven design. It shouldn't be condemned because of one individual's experience due to an extreme lack of familiarity.
Link Posted: 12/8/2002 6:15:29 PM EDT
I was not trying to be rude by not giving contact info for the dealer, I have not looked at the thread since there were 4 or 5 replies. If anybody wants to contact the dealer, here is the info:

Lawmen's Safety Supply Inc.
803-798-2253

They do not have a website AFAIK. I was quoted a price of $189 by a long time employee from whom I have bought many firearms over the past 20 years, the sticker price is $229. I do not know what their mail order policy is. I can also tell you that they have gotten two sets of police Ithaca 37's in trade, one group was fairly nice, the other was pretty worn from use. You would want to make sure you got one from the nicer group. The one I am getting is a standard 8-shot M&P model, but they also had a few DSPS rifle sighted models as well, at the same price. Hope this helps. Also, I have absolutely no connection with this business, other than being a 20 year regular customer.
Link Posted: 12/8/2002 7:34:48 PM EDT
Grab it! An Ithaca police gun under two bills is well worth having.

I had an Ithaca with a regular mag and a 28-inch barrel, I had problems with the mechanism that releases the shell from the mag onto the shell lifter.

Another guy I know had an Ithaca police gun and it had problems feeding.

It's still a great gun and if I saw a police version at the right price I would be on it.
Link Posted: 12/9/2002 7:55:23 AM EDT
My Ithaca 37 came to be via the Black Hawk County Sheriff's Dept. Still has the "car 25" sticker on it. It is not the extended mag version.

Been my deer gun for the last two years. Found a bird barrel for it this year so it now doubles as my pheasant rig.

Love the gun. Light weight. Swings wonderfully. Looks cool to me anyway (to many Adam 12 reruns when I was a kid).

Haven't yet worked up the courage to field strip the thing. Need to remove the buttstock to do it and the last person that did that torqued the stock screw in with a cheater bar.
Link Posted: 12/9/2002 7:59:53 AM EDT
One other thing. I beleive its a John Pederson design via Remington. I don't believe Browning had anything to do with it.

$189 is a very good price. I think I paid $175 for mine a couple of years ago. Parkerzied in good but not immacualte condition. Rarely see Ithacas in these parts (Iowa). Can't remember the last new one I saw.
Link Posted: 12/9/2002 8:16:55 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/9/2002 1:48:43 PM EDT by Jim_Dandy]

One other thing. I beleive its a John Pederson design via Remington. I don't believe Browning had anything to do with it.

Believe it. Irwin Pedersen designed the short-lived Model 1908 Remington. John Browning improved this into the Model 1910, which was also made as the Model 1917 (Model 10 if you wanted 12 gauge, Model 17 if you wanted a 20), and ultimately evolved into the Model 1929 (the latter being VERY close to the Model 37) before discontinuation in favor of the Model 31 Remington (a good gun in its own right).
Link Posted: 12/9/2002 1:56:54 PM EDT
Well, Slufstuff, you must've gotten the loyal customer discount. I called and was quoted $229 to $239 (which is still not bad) and $189 for one with a cracked or broken buttstock. They do mail order sales, but only ship Federal Express overnight.
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