Warning

 

Close

Confirm Action

Are you sure you wish to do this?

Confirm Cancel
Member Login
Posted: 8/2/2002 6:31:12 AM EDT
If you can't realize the practical and tactical advantages of a Dissipator, then I would challenge you that you have never had to employ an AR or any weapon for that matter in a real world situation.

This being the case, your opinion in the matter of "What is best" is purely based on what you imagine looks coolest or what you have seen in pictures of "Navy SEAL's" useing.

Haveing used the AR/M16/M4 in the "Real World" let me EXPLAIN if I may the advantages of the Dissipator design for those who can't figure it out.

The very name of the design is a ringer as to one of the great advantages. Heat Dissipation, and not just that but better protection during this cool off period.
If you have ever had to(And I can't imagine you have) transition from AR to sidearm or cross sling your weapon to climb a fence/wall then you can appreciate the extra length of the hand guards without the extra length of hot barrel sticking out past them to burn your leg, arm, hand or whatever.

This simple advantage will come into play over and over again as you continually fire your weapon, and then carry on with a second activity. It could be that you get back into your car to chase someone. You need to climb something, you are simply rideing an ATV and are fireing on the move. This important advantage cannot be realized until you do something else besides fire from a bench out at the range or take pictures of your weapons to post on the net. Just think about all the activities that you claim to need a lighter weapon for, and then imagine actually doing them. Don't you think that the barrel might just get hot, and that you may find yourself in a situation that you must run and jump and not have to worry about landing on a hot berrel.
The examples are endless and I am sure that someone else could give me one.

Next the obvious advantage of the carbine length barrel and all that goes with it, and the included longer sight radius of the M16. This has been explained over and over.......
I would only add that a 20" M16 can be used as a CQB weapon if need be.

Last the weight issue. I agree that the original design with HBAR was a bit heavy, but now with the fluted version or M4 contur, a Dissipator can be had at a very managable weight and still have the advantages of protection and length.

Last, let me say that if you are offended by my post because you have actually used your weapon in the real world, then you shouldn't be because this post was not for you. If you are offended because you don't agree, then don't be. Everyone is allowed an opinion, mine is just backed up with some experience/ common sense.
If you are offended because all you ever do is take pictures or you AR and shoot it from the bench if at all, then too bad poser.
Link Posted: 8/2/2002 6:39:04 AM EDT
There are A lot of people on this board who have used firearms, both long guns and pistols in combat, LE or tactical situations. Don't act like you're the only one who's been there and done that. You ain't that special or unusual.
Link Posted: 8/2/2002 6:42:16 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Sukebe:
There are A lot of people on this board who have used firearms, both long guns and pistols in combat, LE or tactical situations. Don't act like you're the only one who's been there and done that. You ain't that special or unusual.



Never said I was. Read the whole thing.
Link Posted: 8/2/2002 6:42:32 AM EDT
hey doorkicker? what brought this on? you wake up with your dick in a knot? take it easy fella...
Link Posted: 8/2/2002 6:45:09 AM EDT

Originally Posted By redray:
hey doorkicker? what brought this on? you wake up with your dick in a knot? take it easy fella...



Well, I wanted to respond to the Dissipator thread, but I didn't want to contribute to it's longevity. So I started this one. I guess I should have explaind that.
Link Posted: 8/2/2002 6:45:16 AM EDT
Most inconvenient thing about the shorty is that damned hot barrel swinging wildly scorching everything it touches after you've transitioned.
Takes a minute to go through BDU trousers, but damn you know it's there when it does!



Link Posted: 8/2/2002 6:49:36 AM EDT

Originally Posted By TimJ:
Most inconvenient thing about the shorty is that damned hot barrel swinging wildly scorching everything it touches after you've transitioned.
Takes a minute to go through BDU trousers, but damn you know it's there when it does!






Exactly what I was saying. It hurts like sh!t. Funny that you feel the barrel touch and just about the time you realize that it is the barrel, you get the burning sensation.
Link Posted: 8/2/2002 7:21:42 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/2/2002 7:25:45 AM EDT by UrbanMarine]
When I climb walls, fences, and etc... My M4 slings on my back.

I have two sidearms.
One in my leg holster and one on my vest holster.

Point being I do not have to worry about heat from my M4 burning me. My hands can move fast to my holsters. Plus, I am a team player and my team covers one another when going up and over. I've only burned myself once when some brass flew back into my vest. Thanks for the info on the Dissipator. Different people have different styles of shooting and carrying. The man is just telling people something they might not know.
Link Posted: 8/2/2002 8:05:41 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/2/2002 8:06:38 AM EDT by Citabria7GCBC]
everyone is welcome to there own opinion. just because mine is that i dont like the dissipator, does not mean i am not knowledgeable about ARs...sure the dissipator has advantages and dissadvantages, but what doesnt.
Link Posted: 8/2/2002 8:06:31 AM EDT
If all of us did what people out in the "real world" did, what would be the point of living here in fantasy land?
Link Posted: 8/2/2002 8:10:00 AM EDT
Gee, I didn't realize that I was a poser just because I've never had to carry or use an AR during the course of my employment. Of course, being a lawyer, it'd be kind of hard to justify doing so.

Might want to try a decaf, Doorkicker. There's lots of brands out there that taste just as good as the real thing.
Link Posted: 8/2/2002 8:19:45 AM EDT
I only pretend to even own AR's as I dont live in the real world.
Link Posted: 8/2/2002 8:36:07 AM EDT
Burned by the barrel when transitioning? What are you guys, all thumbs? I've never been burned once while transitioning from rifle to spotting scope.
Link Posted: 8/2/2002 8:46:31 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Zardoz:
Burned by the barrel when transitioning? What are you guys, all thumbs? I've never been burned once while transitioning from rifle to spotting scope. hr


LOL glad to see some people still have a sense of humor.
Link Posted: 8/2/2002 8:49:51 AM EDT
It happens to me all the damn time. Bust into a crackhouse, charge into their living room, go prone, flip out the bipod and open the Butler Creeks. Shoot a bunch of drug-crazed BGs. Jump up to clear the next room and burn my hand folding my bipod back in. It sucks. But seriously, I know what you mean. I get stupid at the range every now and then and grab my 22-250 or 30-06 wrong after a bunch of shooting. Then I look for something inexpensive to throw.
Link Posted: 8/2/2002 8:52:25 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/2/2002 8:53:19 AM EDT by m193]
Flashbang1=PIECE OF SHIT


Originally Posted By Flashbang1:

Link Posted: 8/2/2002 8:58:17 AM EDT
The concept has been around for damn near 40 years. I'm certain it has been rejected and ignored by the military for very good reasons.

The ONLY time I ever burned myself on ANY AR15/M-16 was as a semi-careless private on range detail with an M-16A1 and nearly a thousand rounds of opened ammunition we didn't want to have to go though the hassle of turning back in and thus properly disposed of downrange on full auto. This is a lesson you only have to learn ONCE. For those unable to learn and who continually manage to burn themselves, I guess there's always the Dissipator.



The very name of the design is a ringer as to one of the great advantages. Heat Dissipation



Bzzzzzzzzt. Wrong. The longer handguard actually RETAIN heat, reduce cooling capacity, and extend the period needed for the weapon to properly cool.

Anything that can be done to a Dissipator to lighten it up can also be done to a carbine. Comparing apples to apples, the standard carbine will always be lighter.

The standard carbine also won't have the sight tower way out on the end where it's more prone to snagging or getting hung up. But I guess that's just not an issue in the "real world", now, is it?

Lastly, "rideing an ATV and are fireing on the move"? Are you for real? Go back to your Navy SEAL fantasies and leave us real world users alone, Walter Mitty.
Link Posted: 8/2/2002 9:17:37 AM EDT

Originally Posted By m193:
Flashbang1=PIECE OF SHIT



Well, that was uncalled for.
Link Posted: 8/2/2002 9:27:53 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/2/2002 9:29:33 AM EDT by s0ulzer0]

Originally Posted By eswanson:

Originally Posted By m193:
Flashbang1=PIECE OF SHIT



Well, that was uncalled for.



No doubt. WTF?
I laughed at it - does that make me a POS?
If so - EAT ME!

Link Posted: 8/2/2002 9:41:01 AM EDT

Originally Posted By s0ulzer0:

Originally Posted By eswanson:

Originally Posted By m193:
Flashbang1=PIECE OF SHIT



Well, that was uncalled for.



No doubt. WTF?
I laughed at it - does that make me a POS?
If so - EAT ME!




Ditto.
Link Posted: 8/2/2002 10:23:11 AM EDT

Originally Posted By eswanson:
Gee, I didn't realize that I was a poser just because I've never had to carry or use an AR during the course of my employment. Of course, being a lawyer, it'd be kind of hard to justify doing so.



I don't think you are a poser just because you don't use an AR as a tool. I think people that call something unfit as an effective weapon, yet they themselves have never had the need for said weapon are posers.

Don't get me wrong, alot(MOST) of my shooting is done on the range or in tactical training. But I would never make statements about a F-16 being unfit just because on ocassion I flew in a Cesna.

For the record, I am glad you are a lawyer with a gun.
Link Posted: 8/2/2002 10:29:51 AM EDT
Sorry, that just kind of rubbed me the wrong way. I'm sure no harm is meant by that. At one time I might have found it funny.

My son has Autism, so I guess I am just a little touchy about things like that.
Link Posted: 8/2/2002 10:40:35 AM EDT

Originally Posted By m193:
Sorry, that just kind of rubbed me the wrong way. I'm sure no harm is meant by that. At one time I might have found it funny.

My son has Autism, so I guess I am just a little touchy about things like that.



Seems a lot of people are testy today.

Everybody, we're goin' to Hooters and the first drink's on me!
Link Posted: 8/2/2002 10:43:35 AM EDT

For the record, I am glad you are a lawyer with a gun.


For the record, I'm a lawyer with a lot of guns.

m193 - After I posted, I figured it might be something like that. While it's not a very p.c. image, it's clearly intended to make fun of those who think anything that happens over the internet is serious enough to get worked up over. I've never thought of it as a slam on the Special Olympics or its participants.
Link Posted: 8/2/2002 10:44:46 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Gunbert:
Everybody, we're goin' to Hooters and the first drink's on me!



Please, please tell me you're talking about the Hooter's in Orland Park, Illinois. I'll meet you there.
Link Posted: 8/2/2002 11:59:06 AM EDT

Originally Posted By renotse:

Originally Posted By DoorKicker:

Last, let me say that if you are offended by my post because you have actually used your weapon in the real world, then you shouldn't be because this post was not for you. If you are offended because you don't agree, then don't be. Everyone is allowed an opinion, mine is just backed up with some experience/ common sense.
If you are offended because all you ever do is take pictures or you AR and shoot it from the bench if at all, then too bad poser.



As far as being offended it's only "mind over matter"

We don't mind....cause you don't matter



Is that "We" the posers feel?
Link Posted: 8/2/2002 12:09:41 PM EDT
Originally posted by estoner:
DISCLAIMER
I hope my post does not attract the same dim-witted and mindless aggression this time, but for some people certain habitual behaviors are engrained and therefore impossible to change.
If the troll activity begins as a result of this post I will promptly erase my comments as I have recently on other threads


Edited to add my disclaimer


BWAHAHAHWAHAHAHAAAA !!! A disclaimer !!!!
I hereby declare this troll activity.
***now try and be true to your word and PROMPTLY ERASE your comments.***


Link Posted: 8/2/2002 12:22:00 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/2/2002 12:32:59 PM EDT by estoner]

Originally Posted By SPECTRE:
Originally posted by estoner:
DISCLAIMER
I hope my post does not attract the same dim-witted and mindless aggression this time, but for some people certain habitual behaviors are engrained and therefore impossible to change.
If the troll activity begins as a result of this post I will promptly erase my comments as I have recently on other threads


Edited to add my disclaimer


BWAHAHAHWAHAHAHAAAA !!! A disclaimer !!!!
I hereby declare this troll activity.
***now try and be true to your word and PROMPTLY ERASE your comments.***



Please accept my sincere apology for bringing the attention of the self proclaimed resident troll SPECTRE to this thread. I have erased my postings. With the exception of this one to make Spectre look like a cry baby [>(]

Link Posted: 8/2/2002 12:28:00 PM EDT
Originally posted by estoner:
I have erased my postings.

Liar, I still see one of your posts on this thread.
Link Posted: 8/2/2002 1:36:56 PM EDT

Originally Posted By m193:
Sorry, that just kind of rubbed me the wrong way. I'm sure no harm is meant by that. At one time I might have found it funny.

My son has Autism, so I guess I am just a little touchy about things like that.

Fact: Most humor is based on cruelty to others. If somebody doesn't find it offensive, most people won't find it funny.

I laughed. Yes, I recognize that it's cruel, but I laughed anyway. I can understand your position. How does it feel to be a member of an oppressed minority?

Think about this the next time someone tells a wife/blonde/Jewish/Polish/homosexual/black/Puerto Rican/name-your-favorite ethnic/stereotype joke.
Link Posted: 8/2/2002 1:43:24 PM EDT
Hmmm.... Didn't know there was a "fake" AR-15 world.
Link Posted: 8/2/2002 1:52:43 PM EDT

Originally Posted By eswanson:

For the record, I am glad you are a lawyer with a gun.


For the record, I'm a lawyer with a lot of guns.

m193 - After I posted, I figured it might be something like that. While it's not a very p.c. image, it's clearly intended to make fun of those who think anything that happens over the internet is serious enough to get worked up over. I've never thought of it as a slam on the Special Olympics or its participants.



Eswanson: Let's have a "lawyers with guns" shoot sometime. We'll invite some insurance adjusters, and some bitchy clients, and some snotty medical record clerks, and some more bitchy clients. We'll schedule it for a Monday afternoon after a real shitty day.
I can see this is going to take a bunch of ammo.
Link Posted: 8/2/2002 2:04:26 PM EDT
Retarded folks are a "repressed" minority?

Link Posted: 8/2/2002 2:08:03 PM EDT
If you are getting burned by the barrel of your rifle, then you probably do not have enought tactical gear attached to your body to prevent this from happening. To resolve this problem, please visit botatch tactical.[/joke]
Link Posted: 8/2/2002 2:31:23 PM EDT

Originally Posted By BYU:
If you are getting burned by the barrel of your rifle, then you probably do not have enought tactical gear attached to your body to prevent this from happening. To resolve this problem, please visit botatch tactical.[/joke]



No, what it means is that you do not yet have enought tactical equipment attatched to your rifle. You can usually tell by weight (18lbs. is about right), but if you have enough barrel poking out from you night vision, bipod, monopod, high power scop, aimpoint, can opener, bayonet, spare mag holders and other stuff you gotta have for a CQB carbine then you obviously are not prepared to raid crack houses.
Link Posted: 8/2/2002 4:42:21 PM EDT
Link Posted: 8/2/2002 5:58:19 PM EDT
This is my take on it (the Dissy thing, not the flaming thing). The Dissy is a slightly better weapon than a shorty; the shorty is slightly lighter. Soldiers tend to lug their rifles around more than fire them; they get M4s. CopNinja types do their job and then hit the donut shop, and don't have to lug their rifles 30 miles a day on beans and hay; they can use Dissys.

For me, a total poser, the irons are just emergency backups for the Aimpoint; the sight radius argument holds no water. If I want to shoot with irons, I have plenty of 20 inchers. I could certainly make a head shot with the shorty irons within 100 yards; does a civilian or a cop really need to do more?

It is kind of annoying how your hand can sometimes slip off the short handguards, but I suggest that a better solution is the medium length handguards offered by Armalite and RRA. Not as much of a weight problem there, and you get a longer sight radius to boot. That seems like a better solution to the shorty "problem."

IMHO, and with all due respect to the nonposers.
Link Posted: 8/4/2002 6:21:09 PM EDT
Guys,

New day, much better attitide.

I hope I didn't come off as too much of a total know it all asshole.

I certainly don't think that everybody not LEO/Military is a poser. I just get fed up with people obviously NOT in the know, making all incompassing statements about things they are totally NOT in the know about.

I like the Dissipator and can appreciate it's plus factors. I also like my M4 and would never sell either. I just wanted to explain the mis-understood Dissipator to the masses, that's all.
Link Posted: 8/6/2002 4:47:56 AM EDT

Originally Posted By m193:
Flashbang1=PIECE OF SHIT


Originally Posted By Flashbang1:
photo.starblvd.net/~flashbang/1-2-4.jpg




m193, take a joke. It was intended to be funny not a cruel attack on anyone. Grow up and bite the bullet.
Top Top