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Posted: 5/4/2002 9:29:58 AM EDT


Avg. Cost - $1,065
10 round magazine
2.25 lbs.

Survived being dropped out of a helicopter at 30ft smacking into conrete over and over again and then firing 1000 rounds without a problem.
Being frozen to -44 degerees F and then fired without a problem.
Fired 10000 rounds without cleaning...no problems.

I recently made a post about a WC KZ-45 and its smaller brother... I'm know making this post and see what kinda replies I get

Thanks in advance.
Link Posted: 5/4/2002 11:45:49 AM EDT
They are nice pistols but they won't shoot Wolf ammo reliably. To me this is a problem, a defensive firearm should be able to shoot whatever ammo that might become available during times of trouble.
Link Posted: 5/4/2002 11:57:44 AM EDT

Originally Posted By VA-gunnut:
They are nice pistols but they won't shoot Wolf ammo reliably. To me this is a problem, a defensive firearm should be able to shoot whatever ammo that might become available during times of trouble.



Here we go again. You just precluded about half the guns on the market.
Link Posted: 5/4/2002 12:08:54 PM EDT
Avg. Cost - $1,065

What gun dealer is this?
Link Posted: 5/4/2002 12:09:24 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/4/2002 12:10:06 PM EDT by schapman43]
They're great guns. I would buy the one at the local shop in the salesman didnt hammer on the slide trying to lock in back when the new little lock thingy was engaged. Doubt it did the gun much good.

Avg cost around here is $889 was $869 before the last price hike.
Link Posted: 5/4/2002 12:12:45 PM EDT
Really for under $1000 I will go out and get one like the one in the pic just need to know who sells them for that price.
Link Posted: 5/4/2002 12:15:00 PM EDT

Originally Posted By brouhaha:
Here we go again. You just precluded about half the guns on the market.



Actually I thought I had just narrowed it down to just Glocks

Actually the one thing I see wrong with the 9mm Glocks is they may have difficulty with some of the sub gun ammo with the hard primers that are in circulation.

Thats why I go with the .40
Link Posted: 5/4/2002 12:25:17 PM EDT
MachineGun Kelly's here in Vegas had them for around $780, just a few weeks ago. Keep looking, boss!
Link Posted: 5/4/2002 2:03:38 PM EDT
hell i live in mississippi i thought everything was cheaper here lol
Link Posted: 5/4/2002 7:40:36 PM EDT

Originally Posted By MAXX77:
Really for under $1000 I will go out and get one like the one in the pic just need to know who sells them for that price.



They were banned in California on 1/1/00 thanks to SB23. The threaded barrel is a no no. Furthermore, they are not on the CA approved list and it is unlikely they will ever be approved.

I don't know if you can even buy a used one with a non-threaded barrel.
Link Posted: 5/4/2002 7:59:08 PM EDT
Sweet gun....with a killer price. What the hell, it's only money right? If we ever get concealed carry here, that will be my first choice carry gun, followed by a Sig.
Link Posted: 5/4/2002 10:53:04 PM EDT
I believe this will be my gun... actually my first pistol other than CO2 and paintballs lol.. i've always loved H&K and have always wanted the Tactical... i still love 1911's but i believe the H&K will win the slot for my first "real" pistol
Link Posted: 5/4/2002 10:57:19 PM EDT
Actually i live in Idaho but for now im in California dont even have any weapons here in California to much bullshit around these places haha.
Link Posted: 5/4/2002 11:16:30 PM EDT
Check the price on this website pretty good

http://www.impactguns.com/store/hk_tactical_45.html
Link Posted: 5/4/2002 11:37:59 PM EDT
Link Posted: 5/4/2002 11:50:25 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Troy:
Semi-auto pistols with threaded barrels are "ssault weapons" in the PRK, so the Tactical is not for sale here.

-Troy



PRK?
Link Posted: 5/5/2002 12:37:25 AM EDT

Originally Posted By MAXX77:

Originally Posted By Troy:
Semi-auto pistols with threaded barrels are "ssault weapons" in the PRK, so the Tactical is not for sale here.

-Troy



PRK?



People's Republik of Kaliforinastan
Link Posted: 5/5/2002 12:42:38 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Troy:
Semi-auto pistols with threaded barrels are "ssault weapons" in the PRK, so the Tactical is not for sale here.

-Troy



Sorry what i meant is I am a resident of ID is it available there
Link Posted: 5/5/2002 6:15:27 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/5/2002 6:24:35 AM EDT by JAFO]
gunsamerica

They are available in ID. Also, if you plan to carry, another option is get a USP .45 fullsize and get a tactical barrel from H&K or a couple other mfg's. This just leaves you with hard sights instead of adjustable, but you get the longer o-ring threaded or non-threaded barrel.

edited:
err... what I meant to say was, find one for the price you like, then have it transferred to your ID FFL. I know here in WA I can save money by buying out of state. The cost of shipping plus FFL fee is usually lower than the very high sales tax here.
Link Posted: 5/5/2002 8:04:48 AM EDT
Check www.sportsmanswarehouse.comsee if there is one near you.
Link Posted: 5/5/2002 9:09:26 AM EDT
closest one is in oklahoma is looks like and i live Mrs.Shitty hehe so thats like 1000 miles
Link Posted: 5/5/2002 9:42:24 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/5/2002 9:45:21 AM EDT by Muad_Dib]
The Tactical is a fantastic pistol but would not be my first choice for concealed carry. If you've never handled one you might be suprised at just how tall the front site really is. Snag city! A better choice for CC would be a standard USP .45 fullsize or compact.

I've been reading the gripes about Wolf ammo and USPs. I'm going to call bullshit on this one. I've never seen a USP or Tac that won't eat absolutely everything you feed it, including "horrible" Wolf .45. This is another one of those rumors that spreads like wildfire from a bunch of know-it-alls who've never even handled the gun that they're presently flaming. But I digress.

The major differences between the standard USP and the tactical are these:
Tactical has a match grade trigger grouping which makes for a smoother DA pull. I've never noticed much difference between a standard or a match trigger during single action pulls.
Tactical also has the extended, threaded barrel with o-ring lockup.
HIGH profile front sight and adjustable rear sight.

You can buy all these parts seperately and piece together your own "tactical" out of a USP. Of course it won't say tactical on the slide and you'll pay more in the end. I've seen a few guys do this with .40 and 9mm pistols since the Tac isn't available in those calibers.

The major reason to buy a Tactical? To create a reason to buy a suppressor of course!

Vermilion,
I'd be interested to know where you got your information about the "helicopter drop" and freeze testing. I've never heard of such a thing. Why would you drop it from a helicopter hovering at 30ft? It would cost a lot less to just drop it from a building or ladder.

Edited to add:
It doesn't have a 10 round mag. The standard magazine for the USP.45, Tactical, and MK23 is 12 rounds. The floorplates are different for each model but you can interchange USP & Tac mags without a problem. The MK23 floorplates has a lip that only fits the mag well on that pistol.
Link Posted: 5/5/2002 10:08:25 AM EDT

The major reason to buy a Tactical? To create a reason to buy a suppressor of course!


Sounds like a great reason to me


Vermilion, I'd be interested to know where you got your information about the "helicopter drop" and freeze testing. I've never heard of such a thing. Why would you drop it from a helicopter hovering at 30ft? It would cost a lot less to just drop it from a building or ladder.



I have no idea if the helo drop is valid or not but, it would not suprise me in the least knowing HK.

With HK money is of no concern, so conducting a drop from an SF taxi seems like a valid overblown HK test vice a ladder. If you gents have ever worked with helo's than you know that the rotor wash would accelerate that misfallen HK tactical and slam it into the deck with a lot more force than dropping it from a 30ft ladder.

I've seen lots of things get "Planted" into the ground from gravity and it's helper "Rotor Wash". The worst being Marines with combat load not paying attention on the rope.

Ugly stuff!!

Semper-Fi Do or Die, 03 out!!


Link Posted: 5/5/2002 10:19:50 AM EDT
Ahh, but Troy, that's not necessary True. You can get a USP tactical, just like how a buddy of mine has two Mark23's in Kaliban. What you need to do is find someone who already owned the tactical before the ban. And then do a private transfer sale, but when you do the transfer, make sure that a non threaded barrel is on the gun (bar-sto and some other company makes USP non threaded barrels that still have the o ring on them)you can still take the threaded barrel just don't put it on the gun. And there you go, USP is legally yours, and you do not have to register the sonuvabitch as an assault weapon. Stupid politicians.
Link Posted: 5/5/2002 10:38:10 AM EDT
I know of a friend who has another that is like a serious collector... over 1300+ weapons! and has been to all gn places and all that shit... and he said they throw them out of helicopters at 30 feet going 130 mph... so when you throw it out its going 130 mph also plus the rotor wash and smacking the ground at probably 200+mph and then they pick it up...throw a mag into it and fire off 1000 rounds without ANY failures... jus what ive heard.. most ppl are full of shit nowadays
Link Posted: 5/5/2002 12:11:05 PM EDT
well i jus bought that remington 700 PSS for around 960 then my bushy 16" was around 960 as well and this pistol will cost around that same figure... the only reason he's charging 1,079 bucks is because he's throwing in 2 extra mags plus the 2 extra that come with it... and about 250 rounds and the case and cleaning kit deal... so i think its a good deal for 2 extra mags and 250 rounds of whatever ammo i choose
Link Posted: 5/5/2002 12:20:38 PM EDT
ya know, that's a beautiful pistola and all, but my glock 19 can withstand the same conditions, and it only cost me 400.00
(i know, just flame me now.)
BTW, my next pistol WILL be a USP, so get off my back.
Link Posted: 5/5/2002 12:50:28 PM EDT
nah i dont flame anyone.. if im going to buy it im going to buy it... i dont care what anyone says most of the time... i like glocks my dad has a glock 19 and i've put a few hundred rounds threw it with him and i like it... but i like H&K better
Link Posted: 5/5/2002 12:56:39 PM EDT
BTW, are suppressors legal for lowly civilians to own in your state?
unfortunately GOD has to shit you a letter in MI for us to get one, so i'm looking at the unthreaded ones.
prob gonna get a .45 usp compact, not crazy about the DA trigger though.
Link Posted: 5/5/2002 1:09:57 PM EDT

Originally Posted By VA-gunnut:
They are nice pistols but they won't shoot Wolf ammo reliably. To me this is a problem, a defensive firearm should be able to shoot whatever ammo that might become available during times of trouble.



LOL!!
Link Posted: 5/5/2002 1:31:40 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/5/2002 1:34:06 PM EDT by VA-gunnut]

Originally Posted By Buddha:

Originally Posted By VA-gunnut:
They are nice pistols but they won't shoot Wolf ammo reliably. To me this is a problem, a defensive firearm should be able to shoot whatever ammo that might become available during times of trouble.



LOL!!




I am going to assume that you disagree with this statement. I guess every one has their own opinion on this matter, but I expect the pistols I depend on to be reliable with whatever I feed it.
Link Posted: 5/5/2002 2:17:05 PM EDT
i think me a GUNNUT are the only ppl here that would shoot wolf through ANY firearm.. i dont shoot it through my 700 PSS jus because i dont want too but i will prolly shoot it through my .45 and i shoot it all the time through my AR-15

I also agree with him about the being reliable all the time 24/7 366(leap year) days a year and so on so forth.

Quietshoez - there was a new law that passed here in mississippi that says something that mississippians can buy suppresors but cant be used in public unless you have class III or swat team or some BS like that...


OMG a thread of mine got over 30 replies
Link Posted: 5/5/2002 2:20:53 PM EDT

Originally Posted By HMC:

Originally Posted By quietshoez:
BTW, are suppressors legal for lowly civilians to own in your state?
unfortunately GOD has to shit you a letter in MI for us to get one, so i'm looking at the unthreaded ones.
prob gonna get a .45 usp compact, not crazy about the DA trigger though.



I own a USP Compact .45 and I love it. Trigger never seemed to bother me. What exactly do you have against it shoez?


the ones i tried just seemed long and "crunchy" to me, the SA pull was pretty sweet though. i still plan on getting one.
Link Posted: 5/5/2002 2:51:42 PM EDT
That gun costs more than my car.
Link Posted: 5/5/2002 3:31:03 PM EDT
I'd buy an HK Tac ONLY if I had a suppressor to put on it. The vast majority of people either can't buy a suppressor due to state laws, or will never bother to get one.

Why would you want one otherwise? It doesn't shoot any better than a full sized USP, and has at least two major snag points that the USP doesn't have. It's also more expensive.

If the "cool factor" of having a threaded barrel on a pistol you can't/wont get a suppressor for is worth the lack of quick draw ability and you don't mind paying for things that have no purpose, by all means get one.
Link Posted: 5/5/2002 3:49:48 PM EDT
The only senario that I can imagine dropping that pistol from a heli would be if it had a Timex strapped to it.
Link Posted: 5/5/2002 4:00:44 PM EDT
Can't have a suppressor? Get an HK Expert. I own one. I've shot everything through it and never had a failure. Great trigger.
Link Posted: 5/5/2002 4:56:09 PM EDT
I have two USP.45's in fullsize and compact and I have used just about every brand of ammo out there including wolf. No feeding or malfunction problems of any kind with either one. I tried the tactical and the expert and really did'nt care for them, a bit too bulky and long and forget about the socom. Nothing but praise for the USP's from me.
Link Posted: 5/5/2002 6:12:58 PM EDT
im going to get one at the end of the year course next year i should have the money for the can to go with it :)
Link Posted: 5/5/2002 9:30:31 PM EDT
i do agree that the front sight is a bit big and all and that its kinda bulky but im not for real small guns... i have big hands and little things dont go very well with them.. i'm only 19 be 20 on june the 10th this pistol if from my dad for my 20th bday... so i cant get a ccw until i turn 21 and put the gun in MY name... any ideas on how to make him 100% sure he'll get it for me... i think he's worried ima go shoot up a school or some shit... i love my guns and all but im not gonna do something stupid and lose them plus if i wanted to shoot a school up i wouldnt use a pistol and if i did i wouldnt buy a badass one for over 1k i'd buy some cheap 9mm that cost 200 bucks... any ideas? i'm almost 100% sure he's gonna get it for me but i just want to be damn sure
Link Posted: 5/5/2002 10:05:48 PM EDT
Got 1000 rounds through mine. Love it. Sold a Kimber AND a Sig Sauer to pay for it, and don't regret it at all because the big Tac will outshoot either of them. The Tac will also outshoot any Glock in my humble opinion, because of the polygonal barrel with the O-ring. The O-ring makes a huge difference, oh by the way mean failure rate with the O-rings is 17,000 rounds but they still ship 4 extra ones with the gun just in case. If your Glock shoots 3 inch groups at 50 yards then feel free to tell me that my Tactical sucks. In my hands, my USP .45 Tactical is more accurate than my SAR-1 rifle (with handloads). No, you can't use it as a conceal piece unless your name is Andre the Giant, but there is no CCW in Missouri and I don't feel like committing a class B felony today anyway. Sure shoots like a dream in local IPSC/IDPA matches, and digests any ammo I put through it, including crappy Wolf steel cased ammo (only one box because steel cased .45acp will tear the crap out of the extractor/ejector on ANY handgun). At night it sleeps under my bed, wearing its UTL light for pajamas, with two mags of Winchester SXT +P hollowpoints and one mag of FMJ ball ammo to keep it company. I'll trust this gun with my life. Alot of HK products aren't worth the money, I have to wonder about people paying $250 for G3 scope mounts and the like, but this gun is worth every red cent.
Link Posted: 5/5/2002 10:09:51 PM EDT

Originally Posted By VA-gunnut:
They are nice pistols but they won't shoot Wolf ammo reliably. To me this is a problem, a defensive firearm should be able to shoot whatever ammo that might become available during times of trouble.



This is intertesting, considering that I've personally capped 1K rds of Wolf ammo through my own Tactical w/o experiencing a single failure-
Link Posted: 5/5/2002 11:07:31 PM EDT
oh this gun WILL sleep with me.. under my pillow or underneath my mattress... i'm gonna see if my local gun shop has some old Black Talons... my dad still has a case of them in 9mm... i dunno if they made em in .45 tho so whats some good home defense ammo for the .45?
Link Posted: 5/6/2002 12:26:29 AM EDT
Vermillion--you really can't go wrong with any of the modern crop of hollowpoint ammunition. Winchester SXT is pretty much the same as the famous "Black Talon". Federal Classic JHP or the famous Federal Hydrashok, and don't forget Speer Gold-dots. Saw a police officer put a deer down in about 30 seconds with two 9mm Speer gold-dots once, the deer had been hit by a Volvo and was thrashing around pretty hard, but two gold-dots at close range and it wasn't even twitching 30 seconds later. By the way, the Tactical feeds all this stuff with complete aplomb, which I can't say was always the case with my Kimber.
Link Posted: 5/6/2002 12:48:56 AM EDT
i'll have to pick up a box or two of each when i get it...
Link Posted: 5/6/2002 1:05:25 AM EDT
Wats wrong with wolf? That's stuff is great, i use it all the time on my Norinco, and never fails for anything.

Only bad thing? Smells like fockin crap. I'd really like to know what exactly that ammonia smell is and whether constant exposure will knock out my brain cells. =D
Link Posted: 5/6/2002 1:08:36 AM EDT
i looooooove the smell wolf makes and q3131a and i like the smell of shot shotgun shells also... MMMMMmmmmmmm *goes outside at 4am and blasts a shotshell round into the air and grabs the shell and breathes in deeply* LMAO... nah im not THAT crazy....yet
Link Posted: 5/6/2002 1:37:06 AM EDT

Originally Posted By gunsmithdude:
Ahh, but Troy, that's not necessary True. You can get a USP tactical, just like how a buddy of mine has two Mark23's in Kaliban. What you need to do is find someone who already owned the tactical before the ban. And then do a private transfer sale, but when you do the transfer, make sure that a non threaded barrel is on the gun (bar-sto and some other company makes USP non threaded barrels that still have the o ring on them)you can still take the threaded barrel just don't put it on the gun. And there you go, USP is legally yours, and you do not have to register the sonuvabitch as an assault weapon. Stupid politicians.



You couldn't transfer it if it was registered as an assault weapon. If the seller modified it prior to the deadline then *maybe* so.
Link Posted: 5/6/2002 1:40:26 AM EDT

Originally Posted By gunsmithdude:
Wats wrong with wolf? That's stuff is great, i use it all the time on my Norinco, and never fails for anything.

Only bad thing? Smells like fockin crap. I'd really like to know what exactly that ammonia smell is and whether constant exposure will knock out my brain cells. =D



An ammonia smell would have me somewhat worried, that is if I wanted to reload the brass cases.

I guess this doesn't matter with Wolf, doesn't it have steel cases???? (Never used the stuff myself)

Ammonia is well known to attack and weaken brass, so if you ever notice this with brass cased ammo be careful!
Link Posted: 5/6/2002 1:48:14 AM EDT
Yup..steel casings for all =D. That stuffs so cheap, why the heck would u want to reload Wolf? Its good cheap fun if you ask me. Ever bumped 75 rounds of wolf? oh man, now THAT is a stinker. Really wonder about that ammonia stuff though.
Link Posted: 5/6/2002 9:38:08 AM EDT

Originally Posted By VA-gunnut:
They are nice pistols but they won't shoot Wolf ammo reliably. To me this is a problem, a defensive firearm should be able to shoot whatever ammo that might become available during times of trouble.




VA - fess up - you don't own one and you have no personal experience with HKs and Wolf. Your a raving Glock fan, and at the church of Glock they said HK sucks and you toe the line. And that's all cool and the gang.

But the statement above - is BS.

I own 2 HKs. I use Wolf for night matches cuz I dont want to be looking for brass in the dark. They feed and function fine. What they dont do: when you finish the stage with a live round in the chamber - the laquer heats up and sticks making it nearly impossible to unload and show clear(unless you do it pronto while it is still hot). Wolf will do that to ANY firearm.

Good luck to all.


ps - something tells me my Beretta's would not withstand the 30 foot drop test. Also, I am calling BS on the whole drop story.
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