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Posted: 4/10/2002 7:18:16 PM EDT
i might be building a frankengun for a friend. it would have a pwa DE-prebaned upper on a new kit lower. he wants to get into ARs for not too much money. im gettin him a deal on the upper, and im leaving the stripped lower to him. now, he wants to get an OLY lower, cause they are 80-90$. $80 gets you a cast t3, 90 gets you a forged. now, i can assume forged is better, but he just wants a reliable, but not pretty, AR. does the forged make a diffrence for his purposes?
Link Posted: 4/10/2002 9:25:42 PM EDT
Probably not in the AR's case. AK's have been cast or forged receivers & there's not been any problems with them AFAIK. Of course one always gets what one pays for!
Link Posted: 4/10/2002 9:38:24 PM EDT
Cast is ugly, but it functions the same.
Link Posted: 4/11/2002 5:45:32 AM EDT
Casting is not as strong - but if the rifle is only for plinking/target shooting, maybe some varmint hunting there should not be any issues.

But for only a $10 difference - I'd go with the forged and made sure I had the full strength possible. (Now if you were talking a $40 -$50 difference then the Cast is looking better).
Link Posted: 4/11/2002 5:56:09 AM EDT
I think the small price difference is minor when you think about how long he will probably have the gun and how much he will probably use it. Think about how much he'll spend on ammo, gun case, cleaning supplies, and other goodies. I would go with the better reciever from the start.
Link Posted: 4/11/2002 6:33:35 AM EDT
The AR rifle was designed to be forged and it's dimentions are engineered around forging. If it was designed to be casted like a Mini-14 you'd find that it would would have been engineered with different lines.

Why mess with an engineered plan to save $10 on a rifle that costs $600?
Link Posted: 4/11/2002 8:54:26 AM EDT
Cast should work fine, as the lower is the lesser stressed of the two halves.
That being said, for 10 bucks difference, I'd go with the sronger one.
JMO, YMMV.
Pit
Link Posted: 4/11/2002 9:51:58 AM EDT

If you want good pictures and descriptions of the difference between cast and forged, go to the Oly website: www.olyarms.com and go to their FAQ info on cast vs. forged lowers. This will have all the info you need.
Link Posted: 4/11/2002 10:15:08 AM EDT
uhh...did I understand that you're gonna put a preban upper on a new Olympic receiver?
Link Posted: 4/11/2002 10:19:58 AM EDT

uhh...did I understand that you're gonna put a preban upper on a new Olympic receiver?



That's what I read.
Link Posted: 4/11/2002 10:33:55 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Dukota:

uhh...did I understand that you're gonna put a preban upper on a new Olympic receiver?



That's what I read.



Good. I'm not crazy then.

Now, my mind is a little fuzzy on this part, but exactly how illegal is this?!

IOW, yer about to get yerself into some deep doo-doo. I hope I misunderstood your original post.
Link Posted: 4/11/2002 11:30:42 AM EDT
I bet he's gust getting the Pre-Ban at a better price than the post-ban, so I'm sure he'll modify it to make it legal.

with that said, I would say that cast will do the job but forged is way more cleaner, and for $10 more - get forged.
- Sulaco
Link Posted: 4/11/2002 11:40:27 AM EDT

Originally Posted By brouhaha:

Originally Posted By Dukota:

uhh...did I understand that you're gonna put a preban upper on a new Olympic receiver?



That's what I read.



Good. I'm not crazy then.

Now, my mind is a little fuzzy on this part, but exactly how illegal is this?!

IOW, yer about to get yerself into some deep doo-doo. I hope I misunderstood your original post.



AAAAAAAHHH­HH. that was a typo. it was supposed to be DE-prebaned upper. i have a pre ban A1 upper. im gonna have defected member dave hineline cut off the nastys. i am well aware of the laws. i know exactally what needs to be changed to make it post ban.


anyway. i have talked to him, and i think we decided to go with a RRA lower. thier only 15 $ more from gunsmoke.
Link Posted: 4/11/2002 11:17:29 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Forest:
Casting is not as strong -



How much weaker is it?

mark
Link Posted: 4/12/2002 11:18:41 AM EDT

Originally Posted By mattsd:
a pwa DE-prebaned upper on a new kit lower.



yah, i DID say what i ment. "de-preban" as in evils removed.
Link Posted: 4/12/2002 12:39:44 PM EDT

Originally Posted By budam:
How much weaker is it?

mark



Sorry I know just enough metalurgy to tell you a forged receiver is stronger than a well forged cast one (and much stronger than a poorly cast one).

I'm sure there is a metalurgist on this board with the hard numbers for strength differences between forged and cast parts.
Link Posted: 4/12/2002 1:45:34 PM EDT
I might be mistaken, but I seem to remember the original M16's and AR's were cast, not forged.
Link Posted: 4/12/2002 2:06:24 PM EDT
If you are talking about the lowers from FAC then I will just say that you should plan on waiting. I have had an order in since the beginning of Feb. and it doesn't look to be filled anytime soon. I orderd forged myself because they look nicer then the cast ones IMO.
Link Posted: 4/12/2002 9:00:14 PM EDT
i may be buying an RRA from an area guy. after what shipping and transfer would cost. its about hte same prive as the FAC oly lower.
Link Posted: 4/13/2002 3:05:19 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Forest:
Sorry I know just enough metalurgy to tell you a forged receiver is stronger than a well forged cast one (and much stronger than a poorly cast one).



What about cast turbine blades on an airplane? they are under much higher pressure, than any AR15 ever sees.

Are you sure that cast is always weaker than forged?

It would be reasonable to say that few if anyone knows how much, if any, weaker/stronger cast vs. forged. It depends on the company and technique being used.

My point in bringing this up is the "everyone says it is, so it must be..."

mark
Link Posted: 4/13/2002 3:35:17 AM EDT

Originally Posted By budam:

Originally Posted By Forest:
Sorry I know just enough metalurgy to tell you a forged receiver is stronger than a well forged cast one (and much stronger than a poorly cast one).



What about cast turbine blades on an airplane? they are under much higher pressure, than any AR15 ever sees.

Are you sure that cast is always weaker than forged?

It would be reasonable to say that few if anyone knows how much, if any, weaker/stronger cast vs. forged. It depends on the company and technique being used.

My point in bringing this up is the "everyone says it is, so it must be..."

mark



Different type casting goes on there than the AR15 which is aluminum! for $10.00 dollars difference I would get the forged!
Link Posted: 4/13/2002 11:58:01 PM EDT

Originally Posted By IAM_NAKID:
Different type casting goes on there than the AR15 which is aluminum! for $10.00 dollars difference I would get the forged!



Thank you for making my point!

Because something is cast does not make it bad. One needs to know the techniqes used to cast or forge.

If the difference is strength is 3%, would it be worth $10 more to buy a forging?
What about 1% difference?
What about 15% difference?

"Not as strong" can mean small to large difference. If someone gives you a relative value, ask for the data two points and compare them yourselves. If they do not know them, take their words with a grain of salt.

Take care,
mark
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