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Posted: 3/25/2002 4:36:06 AM EDT
I've narrowed down my search for an AR15 to the Bushmaster "shorty". 16" barrel with the A2 stock. Now my problem is the decision whether to get the removeable carry handle or not. How many out there use a red dot on their AR's? Is it worth it? Why should I get a removable carry handle?
Link Posted: 3/25/2002 4:47:20 AM EDT
I dunno, why should you?

Mine is the Rock River CAR 15 Elite Tactical, and it comes with an iron sight mounted on the rear rail. I am still using iron sights while waiting for my credit card to recover from the gun purchase.

Still puzzling over whether to leave the rear sight in place and mount a red dot (or 2X scope) on top, or pull it off and mount on the rail directly. I lean to keeping the irons as they are.
Link Posted: 3/25/2002 8:48:33 AM EDT


Do you use a red dot or have a flat top?


Most of my uppers are A1 or A2 irons.
Link Posted: 3/25/2002 9:10:03 AM EDT
If you're going to have a flat-top/dot setup, I think you should have both a flat-top and an A2. There is no substitute for a reliable weapon and the proficiency to use it.

However, Aimpoints/EOTechs/ACOGs etc. work well and are fun. And, after all, that is why you spend all this money now isn't it?


Link Posted: 3/25/2002 9:16:02 AM EDT
Might as well go with the flatop, down the road you can go back to a detachable carrying handle. IMHO my aimpoint comp makes the gun so much more fun.

I have had 3 ar's- all where flatops, all had a carrying handle, some primarily wore a red dot.
Link Posted: 3/25/2002 9:18:27 AM EDT
4 Aces, it depends on what you want. I have a flat top but don't use optics. I bought it thinking that I would. I agree with FMJ - There is no substitute for a reliable weapon and the proficiency to use it.

For me that meant a tritium front and irons. Zeroed at 50 yrds. Grab it in the dark, no muss, no fuss, 100 reliable.

If I wanna drive tacks - I'll grab my PSS.

Good luck.

YMMV
Link Posted: 3/25/2002 10:50:26 AM EDT
I took a somewhat different route that works toward my goal of light, simple and sturdy on my RR AR-15. I had an SSK Industries carry-handle conversion done on an SP1 upper. That involves cutting away the front portion of the handle, leaving only the rear portion with sight. Then a high rail is attached to the upper. When a red dot is attached (SSK recommends either the Aimpoint or UltraDot), the iron sights are immediately available in the lower portion of the dot sight. If the battery fails you just lower your head slightly and blaze away. Now this is a very specific conversion but I have no desire to use any other optics or attachments so it works for me. With my M-4 bbl I'm not planning any use beyond 200 meters and the irons will work fine for that. My rig is kinda like a race car, very purpose built and not intended to do eveything, just a few things very well.
Link Posted: 3/25/2002 1:07:33 PM EDT
If you are going to use magnified optics, I would get the flat-top. Even the scopes that are specifically designed to work on the carry handle, like the compact ACOGs, are really too high IMHO and make it difficult to get good eye relief. Magnfied optics with a quality mount work great on the rail, are quick to remove, and repeat zero.

I'd advise not to get the removable carry handle, and instead get quality backup irons like the ARMS#40 that will let you use a scope.

If you are going to get an unmagnified optic, it does not matter which way you go. The A2 is simpler and comes with "free" iron sights, but you have to buy a special gooseneck mount to get the scope lined up with the irons.
Link Posted: 3/25/2002 1:49:08 PM EDT
Due to a budget crunch I went with a BSA red dot.Low tech,and low cost it's been very reliable.Tightens my groups at the range and helps zap the critters in the field...if I do my part!I have an A2 Bushy.
Link Posted: 3/25/2002 1:58:11 PM EDT
It's easier to buy a flat top and add a handle later if you want than it is to buy an A1 or A2 and later wish you had a flat top. Been there, done that.

Now I'm very happy with my Bushmaster M4-style flat top, EOTech and the carry handle that I can slap on whenever I want.
Link Posted: 3/25/2002 3:24:56 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/25/2002 3:53:02 PM EDT by DarkNite]
I am a Hindu woman with a crew cut, so yes I have a red dot and a flat top ...

But seriously folks...

The only upper I have without a flattop is my preban HBAR Target. Yeah, I love shooting iron sights and I have BUIS' on all my ARs (well, not the one with the Elcan, but that's a PITA to work out and the thing is tougher than the rifle it's mounted too).

But...

I just really dig modern battle optics. The sleek lines and lethal functionality of a TA-01 NSN or the squat tube of a Comp M just enhance what would normally be just another semi-auto rifle into a high speed, precision guided weapon. You still have to master your firing mechanics; grip, trigger, breathing, lead, etc. But you can hit faster and with better effect with enhanced sights.

Last fall I held my annual 'Shooting Safari' at my favorite range. This is where I take a group of my friends who like to shoot guns but don't own any or have maybe one deer rifle out to try out the previous year's additions to my collection. The folks really can't hit squat with conventional sights, they just make a lot of noise and like to see the dust fly up. But I brought out the Elcan, the ACOG and the Comp M and they were busting party balloons at 100 and 200 meters like crazy.

I say go flat and go with an Aimpoint or Eotech. Get, and practice using, a good BUIS (I like Swan Sleeves, they have the ARMS 40 built in and protect your rail). Work on all your shooting mechanics, dry fire all the time, do breathing drills. But master that little red dot and you will see what all the fuss is about.
Link Posted: 3/27/2002 12:36:39 AM EDT
Flattop all the way...unless you're dead set on carrying your ar like a suitcase.
I use an a.r.m.s. swan with rear flip up sight..
I have an aimpoint....but would rather have something with a tritium backup..
Link Posted: 3/27/2002 2:35:33 AM EDT
I opted for a flat top upper and mounted a C-MORE Tactical "S" to it. It is based on an A3 carry handle with the "loop" from the handle milled off. A red dot system is integrated onto the base which gives you the regular A2 back-up iron sights through the heads-up display. No sights to flip up, no need to skip a beat if your electronics go down. It's the best system out there IMHO as long as you don't want magnafication.


Saleen
Link Posted: 3/27/2002 7:01:28 AM EDT
Thanks for all the replies. I appreciate it. I think it might be a flat top but I have another question about the carry handles...might be a new topic.
THanks again,
Four-Aces
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