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Posted: 3/20/2002 3:43:04 PM EDT
After completing my post-ban M4 I have decided my next purchase should be for a long range rifle. Since I can't afford a 50, I've settled on a police 308. My local shop will sell me a Remington PSS (new) for $699 and they think they can get an FN for $750 (without the new stock). Which would you get and why? Or is there another rifle I haven't considered that I should? Any suggestions on scopes? I don't want to spend more than $300-$400 for optics. Thanks for your input.
Link Posted: 3/20/2002 5:15:30 PM EDT
If you are looking to save money dont do it on the optics. I would recommend buying a Remington 700VS and spend a good $600-700 on optics. The VS is almost the exact same as the PSS with a different stock.
Link Posted: 3/20/2002 5:24:36 PM EDT
Hello,
I think that you should buy a good used Pss or VS. you have a much more wider selection for upgrading both new and used parts .
here's a link to a Good buy on Gunbroker for a Pss also for that 300 to 400 price you should be able to pick up a good used Leupold . i will list a link where you can check out a couple of my Remingtons also , any questions drop me a email .
TargetShooter2

http://www.gunbroker.com/auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=3385026

my Link
http://cards.webshots.com/cp-19938869-dgJO-album/33442159wPrBdd
Link Posted: 3/20/2002 5:26:49 PM EDT
I agree... Trying to save money on optics will screw you. I went with a 700PSS in 300WM, badger rail and rings, and a Leupold VariX III Long Range M3 Illuminated with a mil-dot reticle. The VS is probably just as good as the PSS.

If you are strapped for cash, I would suggest more $$ on optics and maybe a Savage rifle - buy a better stock for it later.
Link Posted: 3/20/2002 6:02:23 PM EDT
take a look at the remington LTR (light tactical rifle) itll do everything a PSS will do out to about 800m and beyond. you really only lose 80fps going from a 26'' tube to a 20''. PLUS its almost 2lbs lighter and a lot damn handier.

AND THE BEST THING IS...

I have one for sale! all set up, and as NEW!
sorry, i had to stick that in.

but seriously, email me if you are interested
Link Posted: 3/20/2002 6:34:08 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/20/2002 6:39:17 PM EDT by SIX]
NotSoFast - great name BTW.

You and I are in the exact same boat.

Other rifles to look at:

Savage @ $400 the stock and trigger will have to go - but can be done over time - in the end you will have as much into it as a Remmy a Win or a FN.

Win M70 Stealth - same HS stock as Remmy and current FN. Super cool / reliable controled feed feature. Great rep. Hard to find. Price @ $570

Remmy 700 P or PSS - Remmy has had some Q/C issues of late. Some are reporting bent barrels. The only diff between the varmit guns and the P or PSS is the palm swell in the HS stock. I just got one last week for $685.

FN Police Mod - I had one offered to me for $725. I thought long and hard about it too. I have read that the mag springs and weak and there have been some with issues relating to the safety. Most everyone is amazed by the out of the box accuaracy. Though some question the long term durability of the chrome lining of the bore.

In the end I chose the Remmy 700 P b/c that is what *most* (I wanna be very careful when I say this) folks are shooting. Thus, everyone makes parts for it, the web is littered with info on how to tweek it, reloads - OAL and other issues. Having said that, Savage has a very strong following over at www.snipershide.com.

One last thing, from what I have read - I would not own a Remmy with a detach mag. If I had to have a detach mag model - FN all the way. See snipershide for reasoning on Remmy DM mods. Also from what I understand the hinged floor plate mods are getting harder to come by right now.

FWIW - I decided not to purchase a used gun. I wanted to know the history of the barrel. I am buying it for long range (600 - 900 yrd) accuracy. I don't want to inheret Bubba's gun that HE decided to true the bolt face on or HE decided he had some revolutionary way of breaking in the barrel. If you can find someone who sounds serious as in the ad states "432 logged rounds" (as in they actually keep a shot log) this *might* be worth it.

Rings / Bases and Scopes

I too am trying to do this on the cheap.

Base - yeah, no question - Badger, Loopy, IOR those would be cool and all but...

I went with a Ken Farrel one piece steel 20 MOA base. It looks good too. Cost? Less than half of a Badger. www.kenfarrell.com

Rings - I think I am gonna use Burris "Z" rings @ $30.00

Glass - hmm well I agree - you have to spend the cash on the glass. However, I think that there are alternatives.

1. Used - browse the Emporium over at www.snipercountry.com/forsale/display_reverse.asp Some great stuff will turn up over there.

Also, if you do your homework on Loopy and know via the number on it what it is worth and what you can do to it - picking up an old used one is not a bad way to go. You can send it to www.premierreticles.com/ to have the reticle and / or turrets changed.

2. Nikon will have a Mil Dot this spring. Nikon is good glass at about half the price of loopy.

3. If you gotta go cheap - you can take a chance on the Tasco Super Sniper. Although, they do not have good press - esp the side parralax adj mod. However the Bushnell Elite 4200 6-24 x 42 Mil Dot for $385 might be a *decent* deal.


Good luck. Do me the favor - post your info here so I can compare notes.
Link Posted: 3/20/2002 6:47:38 PM EDT

Win M70 Stealth - same HS stock as Remmy and current FN. Super cool / reliable controled feed feature.

Sez who? I thought this thing was pushfeed. Most of the other Wins went to pre-64, this one stayed push feed.

And who the hell sez there are issues about the FN SPR chrome bore giving out? Cites please? Or is that "sites" please? Never heard this one and I am inclined not to believe it. Nor have I heard bad stuff about the mags or really anything else about this rifle.

I would (and did) take an FN over a Rem because while a Rem can be a beautiful thing, it isn't always. Besides, everyone and his grandma shoots one.

Sightron has gotten good reviews and it is half the price of a Leupold. I have a Leupold OTOH and haven't looked back.

Link Posted: 3/20/2002 6:55:52 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/20/2002 7:00:57 PM EDT by SIX]
Ease up there Chairborne.

First - "many say" the feed / extraction system of the win is a cool thing - how is that. After all this is one of those personal preferrence things.

Two - as my post cleary states Though some question the long term durability of the chrome lining of the bore. Now, why are some asking this? I dunno - one person was merely thinking about how damm hard it is to apply an even chrome job to the barrel. For a group of shooters that reaches for the bore paste or turns to bore lapping - that is a legit question. For the record - I have read no derrogatory reviews / experiences with the FN other than the minor stuff with the mag and safety. Like I said, I took a long look at one. They are supposed to be awesome.

And you are right - Remmy has had some QC issues as of late.


BTW - a site with a cite or two regarding the FN SPR - 216.219.200.59/cgi-bin/ubbcgi/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=1&t=000497 There are a few more - nothing worth not getting one over.

Link Posted: 3/20/2002 7:40:17 PM EDT
nsfmf

i've got a 700vss had friend who does custom finishes camo it for me. i'd put it up against just about any of them. i found it at a show for 550.00 a couple of years ago. as far as scopes go tasco, yes i said tasco makes a nice sniper scope can get them in either 10x or 14x they have eched mildot retical and target knobs very nice for around 330.00 they were supose to be the navy contract scope for a couple of years and they still have them, the ones i've looked through are the best scopes for the money. i think i saw a ad in shotgun news one time.as clear as any 600.00 scope i ever seen.
Link Posted: 3/20/2002 11:57:17 PM EDT
No worries SIX, I am pretty "eased" at the moment. Thanks for the link. I have never seen anything about the safety problems before, and because I have never used my safety except to function test the rifle, I guess I will have to play with it a bit more to be sure no problems arise.

Anyway, re push feed vs. controlled feed, I *think* when Win went back to the pre-64 action they did so with all the rifles except the "precision rifles," (varmints) the ostensible reason being that the old push feeds were theoretically capable of more accuracy. In spite of that, the SPR is both controlled feed and chrome-lined, and there seem to be no questions about its accuracy potential.

As a general rule, a chrome-lined barrel is *far* more durable than a non-lined barrel. Never heard of a problem with any other chrome lining (AR and AK for example) giving out prematurely. Of course, most people don't use that bore paste stuff on AR/AK bores either, so perhaps the effect of that on chrome is a legit question. But I haven't heard of bore past ruining any chrome to date.

As I understand it, this is the same barrel as used on the MAG, or at least it came from the same blank and gets the same chrome, so I would think any machinegun barrel on a bolt action rifle would last just about forever.
Link Posted: 3/21/2002 4:16:00 AM EDT

Originally Posted By schapman43:
If you are looking to save money dont do it on the optics. I would recommend buying a Remington 700VS and spend a good $600-700 on optics. The VS is almost the exact same as the PSS with a different stock.


I agree


GIB
Link Posted: 3/21/2002 4:35:22 AM EDT
Skip on the Remington....Q/C suck and so does their customer service. Don't believe me, go over to www.snipercountry.com and ask around. These guys can be a little snobbish, but the knowledge there is great.

If you want to do this cheap at least initially, go with a Savage. Out of the box it will shoot with pretty much anything factory, and while the stock is weak, it will take time for that to show. Spend the bulk of your money on high quality optics, and mounting for them. Then in a year or so, when the factory stock begins to show it's ugly side, replace it with an aftermarket stock and be happy. Slip a good trigger job in when the opportunity presents itself.

If money is not so much of a consideration, go with the FN SPR, or even a custom job. The guys at snipercountry can turn you onto a couple of excellent guys to build a rifle for you, and you will get exactly what you want. The guys they will reccommend will take excellent care of you as most of these men operate far more on word of mouth than anything else. Be prepared to wait if you go this route, as it can take time.

just my .02
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