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Posted: 4/3/2006 1:12:02 PM EDT
is there any place to buy them or are they LE and military issue only
ive searched everywhere but nothing
Link Posted: 4/3/2006 1:32:34 PM EDT
I know that ammuntionstore.com has smoke grenades, i know for a fact since i saw they had some at a gun show recently. However, for $40 per can I think they are too expensive. I talked to a LE friend and he said that his department's price is around $28 (just for a price reference). The grenades are made by ADS ( i think). I did a google search and you can find some quality info.

On the flash bangs, which would be fun as hell to play with, i think those are only for LE/military type folks since they have pyro in them.

---DK

please excuse my poor grammer
Link Posted: 4/3/2006 10:25:45 PM EDT

Originally Posted By xLucidx:
is there any place to buy them or are they LE and military issue only
ive searched everywhere but nothing



when our tac team practices with flashbangs we have to send in paperork to ATF everytime we use one so i believe they are mil/leo only.
Link Posted: 4/3/2006 10:26:43 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/3/2006 10:28:31 PM EDT by eggrolly]
WTF would you need bangers?
Link Posted: 4/3/2006 11:26:29 PM EDT
pesky roommates taht wont wake up
Link Posted: 4/3/2006 11:31:43 PM EDT
Flashbangs are Destructive Devices. You can own them, but you have to register each one before you take possession and pay a $200 tax on each.
Link Posted: 4/4/2006 9:49:40 AM EDT
why not?
Link Posted: 4/4/2006 10:47:46 AM EDT

Flashbangs are Destructive Devices. You can own them, but you have to register each one before you take possession and pay a $200 tax on each.


Negative

You can buy them at either cavarms or rangerjoes but you gotta be LE or Military, you don't have to pay any tax on them, unless LE and Military are exempt which i don't think so. I don't remember which website it is it's been awhile.

They are fun, Nothing says April fools like throwing a flash in their room (just make sure they don't have a gun next to them)
Link Posted: 4/4/2006 10:50:30 AM EDT

Originally Posted By eggrolly:
WTF would you need bangers?



Same reason the police do
Link Posted: 4/4/2006 8:18:55 PM EDT
exactly
its just something cool to have
never know you might actually have to use one some day
Link Posted: 4/5/2006 7:19:48 AM EDT

Originally Posted By nationwide:

Originally Posted By eggrolly:
WTF would you need bangers?



Same reason the police do



Are you police? If not then you do NOT have the same reason as the Police
Link Posted: 4/5/2006 8:33:09 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Delta068:

Flashbangs are Destructive Devices. You can own them, but you have to register each one before you take possession and pay a $200 tax on each.


Negative

You can buy them at either cavarms or rangerjoes but you gotta be LE or Military, you don't have to pay any tax on them, unless LE and Military are exempt which i don't think so. I don't remember which website it is it's been awhile.




I don't know what you are talking about, but it is not a flashbang.
Link Posted: 4/5/2006 11:11:06 AM EDT

Originally Posted By eggrolly:

Originally Posted By nationwide:

Originally Posted By eggrolly:
WTF would you need bangers?



Same reason the police do



Are you police? If not then you do NOT have the same reason as the Police



You're a cop, aren't you?

There are legitimate, lawful uses for Noise Flash Distraction Devices in civilian hands. Nuff said.
Link Posted: 4/5/2006 11:40:10 AM EDT
Batch114 sells new production ALS smoke grenades on the EE.

www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=7&f=90&t=316746

Av.
Link Posted: 4/5/2006 1:33:15 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Combat_Jack:

Originally Posted By eggrolly:

Originally Posted By nationwide:

Originally Posted By eggrolly:
WTF would you need bangers?



Same reason the police do



Are you police? If not then you do NOT have the same reason as the Police



You're a cop, aren't you?

There are legitimate, lawful uses for Noise Flash Distraction Devices in civilian hands. Nuff said.



He needs to peel the protective plastic wrap off his shiney new badge before he posts again!
Link Posted: 4/5/2006 3:12:04 PM EDT
I volunteer as a FF and we use smoke grenades quite often during live fire exercises in confined structures. You should be able to purchase these without any trouble.

The flashbangs on the other hand, need to come from LE or Military because of the pyro as previously indicated. During a recent live fire exercise, we had one genious that soaked the carpet of a donated house with too much gasoline and threw a flashbang in to start the fire. The fire spread real fast and the chiefs were sweating it out on that one.
Link Posted: 4/5/2006 3:16:42 PM EDT

Originally Posted By eggrolly:

Originally Posted By nationwide:

Originally Posted By eggrolly:
WTF would you need bangers?



Same reason the police do



Are you police? If not then you do NOT have the same reason as the Police



WRONG!

Everybody has a right to have and use the same equipment as the police!
Link Posted: 4/5/2006 3:45:50 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Sd_Kfz_182:

Originally Posted By eggrolly:

Originally Posted By nationwide:

Originally Posted By eggrolly:
WTF would you need bangers?



Same reason the police do



Are you police? If not then you do NOT have the same reason as the Police



WRONG!

Everybody has a right to have and use the same equipment as the police!



+1.

Stow that crap.
Link Posted: 4/6/2006 5:30:18 AM EDT
All animals are =,
but some are more = than others.

That is how it all starts.


So, back on topic.
Has anyone found a good place to pick up both?
What is considered a "fair" price for these?
Link Posted: 4/6/2006 7:26:14 AM EDT

Originally Posted By MOS2111:
All animals are =,
but some are more = than others.

That is how it all starts.


So, back on topic.
Has anyone found a good place to pick up both?
What is considered a "fair" price for these?



Flashbangs ARE DD's. If you pay the transfer tax, file all paperwork, and find someone who will sell you one, have at it.

A link to a member selling ALS smoke's was posted above. They are legal to own in most areas.

Av.
Link Posted: 4/6/2006 8:56:23 AM EDT
Thanks.
Smoke only then.
Link Posted: 4/6/2006 9:15:47 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Combat_Jack:
Flashbangs are Destructive Devices. You can own them, but you have to register each one before you take possession and pay a $200 tax on each.



I don't see why.
Chuck Schumer said they can't injure or kill anyone!
Link Posted: 4/6/2006 9:21:53 AM EDT
I'm having a hard time finding a reason that Non L.E. personnel would need flash bangs.
I mean.. they're fun for barmitzvas and such, but lets get real. They're diversionary devices for making dynamic entries. And there's no one here who can convince me of a need to be making entries on anything. It's a far stretch to justify that as DEFENSIVE.

There are plenty of pest control devices out there if you have pigeon problems.
Link Posted: 4/6/2006 9:31:17 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/6/2006 9:36:00 AM EDT by nationwide]

Originally Posted By demigod:
I'm having a hard time finding a reason that Non L.E. personnel would need flash bangs.
I mean.. they're fun for barmitzvas and such, but lets get real. They're diversionary devices for making dynamic entries. And there's no one here who can convince me of a need to be making entries on anything. It's a far stretch to justify that as DEFENSIVE.

There are plenty of pest control devices out there if you have pigeon problems.



Really? Here's a quick scenario I pulled from my royal arse:

You are in a NOLA scenario.

You have wiminz and/or youts in your care.

Between your front door and your BOV is Lootie and the Ghettofish.

Knowing that outside of the local region, the Federal and State Gov't are still operational, do you:

Open up on the crowd with your RDIAS

-or-

Throw a flashbang or two, and make for your BOV and to safety?

The fact of the matter is sometimes calling 911 is not an option, and you can't use deadly force just because you have the means.

It is important for self sufficient individuals (yes, I know... the bane of legitmate Gov't) to have all the tools available for their use, if they so chose to equip themselves.

Live prepared, I say!

ETA: My point being, sometimes a private citizen can be reasonably expected to act in an offensive manner, rather than strictly defensive. But the totality of circumstances clearly indicates that this would be a defensive action.
Link Posted: 4/6/2006 9:40:57 AM EDT

Originally Posted By nationwide:

Originally Posted By demigod:
I'm having a hard time finding a reason that Non L.E. personnel would need flash bangs.
I mean.. they're fun for barmitzvas and such, but lets get real. They're diversionary devices for making dynamic entries. And there's no one here who can convince me of a need to be making entries on anything. It's a far stretch to justify that as DEFENSIVE.

There are plenty of pest control devices out there if you have pigeon problems.



Really? Here's a quick scenario I pulled from my royal arse:

You are in a NOLA scenario.

You have wiminz and/or youts in your care.

Between your front door and your BOV is Lootie and the Ghettofish.

Knowing that outside of the local region, the Federal and State Gov't are still operational, do you:

Open up on the crowd with your RDIAS

-or-

Throw a flashbang or two, and make for your BOV and to safety?

The fact of the matter is sometimes calling 911 is not an option, and you can't use deadly force just because you have the means.

It is important for self sufficient individuals (yes, I know... the bane of legitmate Gov't) to have all the tools available for their use, if they so chose to equip themselves.

Live prepared, I say!

ETA: My point being, sometimes a private citizen can be reasonably expected to act in an offensive manner, rather than strictly defensive. But the totality of circumstances clearly indicates that this would be a defensive action.



FugginA!


I hope to God that I would never need a flash bang or smokers, but they would be nice to have
just in case. Good hypothetical scenario nationwide.

Link Posted: 4/6/2006 9:41:55 AM EDT

Originally Posted By demigod:
I'm having a hard time finding a reason that Non L.E. personnel would need flash bangs.
I mean.. they're fun for barmitzvas and such, but lets get real. They're diversionary devices for making dynamic entries. And there's no one here who can convince me of a need to be making entries on anything. It's a far stretch to justify that as DEFENSIVE.

There are plenty of pest control devices out there if you have pigeon problems.



It's a far strech for you to convince me that LE needs them anymore than I do.
What buisness is it of yours what I want them for?
Link Posted: 4/6/2006 10:08:52 AM EDT

Originally Posted By demigod:
I'm having a hard time finding a reason that Non L.E. personnel would need flash bangs.
I mean.. they're fun for barmitzvas and such, but lets get real. They're diversionary devices for making dynamic entries. And there's no one here who can convince me of a need to be making entries on anything. It's a far stretch to justify that as DEFENSIVE.

There are plenty of pest control devices out there if you have pigeon problems.



I am sure that a dude rummaging through my living room would be a lot easier to subdue without bloodshed if 4 million candlepower and 175 decibels rocked his world. Or I could just shine a light on him and have a much higher chance he makes the last foolish decision of his life.
Link Posted: 4/6/2006 11:36:30 AM EDT

Originally Posted By demigod:
I'm having a hard time finding a reason that Non L.E. personnel would need flash bangs.
I mean.. they're fun for barmitzvas and such, but lets get real. They're diversionary devices for making dynamic entries. And there's no one here who can convince me of a need to be making entries on anything. It's a far stretch to justify that as DEFENSIVE.

There are plenty of pest control devices out there if you have pigeon problems.



Why do people own Tannerite? It's fun to make noise!

There are many cases where owning a flashbang would come in handy. Home invasion for one. If bad guy is downstairs and I am upstairs, I can toss one down the stairwell. It not only distracts him, but it may cause him to leave my home without having to shoot him.

Hell, I own CS and a Stingball. They are two more options I have to choose from if someone were to break into my home. A Stingball will ruin somebodys plan to charge up the stairwell.

Av.
Link Posted: 4/6/2006 11:43:26 AM EDT
just roll your own.http://www.firefox-fx.com/
Link Posted: 4/6/2006 1:54:11 PM EDT
Some of the fantasy scenarios you guys come up with are rich!

Link Posted: 4/6/2006 2:02:24 PM EDT

Originally Posted By markm:
Some of the fantasy scenarios you guys come up with are rich!




I agree.
But that's what happens when some Barney Fife decides to tell people what they do and don't need.
Link Posted: 4/6/2006 2:19:04 PM EDT

Originally Posted By markm:
Some of the fantasy scenarios you guys come up with are rich!




WTF?

Oh yeah... NOLA didn't happen. It was a hiccup in the Matrix. There is nothing to see here. Move along...
Link Posted: 4/6/2006 3:30:45 PM EDT

Originally Posted By thedoctors308:

Originally Posted By markm:
Some of the fantasy scenarios you guys come up with are rich!




I agree.
But that's what happens when some Barney Fife decides to tell people what they do and don't need.



Exactly.

I don't need anymore reason to own a flashbang than perhaps I might want to toss one in the backyard from time to time for kicks.

Next you'll be telling me I can't buy the good fireworks in Florida.

...Wait. I forgot. You already can't.
Link Posted: 4/7/2006 5:28:31 AM EDT

Originally Posted By mattimeo:

I don't need anymore reason to own a flashbang than perhaps I might want to toss one in the backyard from time to time for kicks.



Man. I used to have these bad ass pest control 2000 devices for "agricultural use" . (I think that's what they were called)
But they had to be on par with an LE flashbanger. Too bad the feds shut the maker down because their output charge exceeded the legal limit for commercial ordinance.

Link Posted: 4/7/2006 6:46:46 AM EDT

Originally Posted By markm:

Originally Posted By mattimeo:

I don't need anymore reason to own a flashbang than perhaps I might want to toss one in the backyard from time to time for kicks.



Man. I used to have these bad ass pest control 2000 devices for "agricultural use" . (I think that's what they were called)
But they had to be on par with an LE flashbanger. Too bad the feds shut the maker down because their output charge exceeded the legal limit for commercial ordinance.




They probably exceeded the legal limit for commercial ordnance too. w00t!
Link Posted: 4/7/2006 8:44:33 AM EDT
I want some ALS pocket smokes just for the hell of it.
Link Posted: 4/7/2006 8:46:41 AM EDT

Originally Posted By triburst1:
I want some ALS pocket smokes just for the hell of it.



Go back one page - contact Batch114. He has them.

Av.
Link Posted: 4/7/2006 10:43:34 AM EDT

Originally Posted By triburst1:
I want some ALS pocket smokes just for the hell of it.



Don't hold them in your hand. They're as loud as a rimfire when they start the discharge. And they get very hot!
Link Posted: 4/7/2006 7:31:36 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/7/2006 7:37:49 PM EDT by VA-gunnut]
Link Posted: 4/7/2006 8:30:26 PM EDT
I can't believe the people getting bent out of shape over flash bangs.

There is no basis for DEFENSIVE need.

Like Nationwide posted, a flashbang would be an excellent diversionary tool.

OTOH - If you were going to go thru all the hemroid of filing DD paperwork and getting locally approved storage then why not get the real deal - FRAGS

I figure if I'm going to piss someone off I may as well do a good job of it.
Link Posted: 4/7/2006 9:44:47 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/7/2006 9:46:18 PM EDT by dump1567]
Won't a 1lb. can of smokeless powder with a fuse hanging out make a pretty good flashbang? Just a thought.
Link Posted: 4/7/2006 9:47:42 PM EDT

Originally Posted By VA-gunnut:
Just because I can.

photos.ar15.com/ImageGallery/Attachments/DownloadAttach.asp?iImageUnq=46132

To bad you don't live in VA. We just did a Group Buy on ALS smokes, and we got them for $25 each.


ETA: As has already been stated; flashbangs are DDs and are regulated as such. So even if you could find a dealer that would sell them, you would still need a signoff on them. Not to mention that using it would not only cost a pretty penny for the FB, but the $200 tax on each one.




Damn. I'd like some more info on that. Maybe I can get a KY group buy going.
Link Posted: 4/7/2006 9:54:18 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/7/2006 9:57:43 PM EDT by ProfGAB101]

Originally Posted By dump1567:
Won't a 1lb. can of smokeless powder with a fuse hanging out make a pretty good flash? Just a thought.



Actually No.

I used to show people who got freaked out about Smokeless Powder confusing it with black powder or flash powder.

( I have an empty 100lb keg I use as a clothes hamper - the placards tend to catch peoples attention. )

I would pour out a few tablespoons worth of WW231 on the sidewalk and touch a match to it.

It just burns.

Kinda simular to plain gasoline.

Blackpowder or flash powder is completely different.

Blackpowder FFFFg is serious fast and dropping down FFFg, FFg, Fg. Single Fg IIRC was used in large cannon.

Flashpowder will explode out in the open - it does not need to be confined. It is serious stuff.
Link Posted: 4/7/2006 9:56:51 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/7/2006 9:58:54 PM EDT by Avalon01]
I see your ALS items and rase you two DD's.

1 live 20mm round

1 live ALS "Rubber Ball CS Grenade"




Av.
Link Posted: 4/7/2006 10:03:01 PM EDT

Originally Posted By eggrolly:
WTF would you need bangers?



Maybe for the same reason I needed that semi automatic, school yard mowing, cop killing, depleted uranium shooting, bayonet fixing, military machinegun with more thrusts per squeez that I lost in a tragic boating accident.
Link Posted: 4/8/2006 3:48:41 AM EDT
Link Posted: 4/8/2006 7:01:36 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/8/2006 7:02:25 AM EDT by Avalon01]
They are not bad. Much lighter than the standard frangs and metal bodied grenades. I also played baseball for several years, so I am used to thowing a ball oppsed to a cylinder.

They do seem a bit fragile, but I've never run around with one enough to test that assumption.

Av.
Link Posted: 4/8/2006 8:49:52 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/8/2006 8:52:12 AM EDT by dump1567]

Originally Posted By ProfGAB101:

Originally Posted By dump1567:
Won't a 1lb. can of smokeless powder with a fuse hanging out make a pretty good flash? Just a thought.



Actually No.

I used to show people who got freaked out about Smokeless Powder confusing it with black powder or flash powder.

( I have an empty 100lb keg I use as a clothes hamper - the placards tend to catch peoples attention. )

I would pour out a few tablespoons worth of WW231 on the sidewalk and touch a match to it.

It just burns.

Kinda simular to plain gasoline.

Blackpowder or flash powder is completely different.

Blackpowder FFFFg is serious fast and dropping down FFFg, FFg, Fg. Single Fg IIRC was used in large cannon.

Flashpowder will explode out in the open - it does not need to be confined. It is serious stuff.



Good to know.
Link Posted: 4/8/2006 12:09:48 PM EDT
ALS tactical smoke.

Link Posted: 4/8/2006 4:47:51 PM EDT
I want some Stingball Grenades and some Flashbangs

My Smokers are on the way
Link Posted: 4/10/2006 7:34:23 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Avalon01:
I see your ALS items and rase you two DD's.

1 live 20mm round

1 live ALS "Rubber Ball CS Grenade"

img.photobucket.com/albums/v240/avalon01/DSC00168.jpg


Av.



Make sure you dont blow your hand off like the teacher did when trying to squash a bug with a live 20mm shell.
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