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Posted: 2/6/2006 9:02:06 PM EDT
i have searched for information on this board. but i can't seem to find any.
I am looking into getting a 12 gauge Shotgun. i don't know anything about shot guns. or which brand is good. my budget would probably be less then $400. and which one would be alot better? Semi-auto or Pump Action? and this gun would mainly be for range fun and home defense AND just to add to the collection. Thanks alot
Link Posted: 2/6/2006 9:07:30 PM EDT
You couldn't find any info? When every other thread is Mossberg vs Remington?

I would tell you to just get a Mossberg 590 and see how it goes from there on accessories. The first thng I would reccomend getting would be a light if this is for home defense. You can get the surefire built-in light for about $200 or you could go with some other home made setup.

But anyways, there is tons of info here. Better to learn and come to your own conclusions rather than have a bunch of strangers just tell you.
Link Posted: 2/6/2006 9:32:04 PM EDT
i'd go for a pump. it's reliable and very easy to use... remington 870, mossberg 500/590, benelli nova, or winchester 1300... it's all good. any one of those guns would serve you well and be less than $400. there's really no point in arguing which would be best for you.

my advice is to pick out a few you like, take a look at each gun, and decide what's best for you. which one fits you the best? which would you feel the most comfortable with? don't let us decide for you, just let us help guide you in the right direction. you'll be much more happy with your purchase if you get the one that you want. whenever you have a chance, go to a sporting goods store and handle of few shotguns and get an idea of what you want. that would be the absolute best place to start.



Link Posted: 2/6/2006 9:35:10 PM EDT
Go to the gun store, handle them, play with the actions, and compare prices. I like a mossberg 12g, with the ability to shoot 3 1/2" , 3", and 2 3/4", versitile for all types of hunting, and home defense. but an 870 is a really good shotgun also.
Link Posted: 2/6/2006 9:48:28 PM EDT
For what you plan to use it for, a Remington 870 Express HD would be a good choice. The 870 is better shotgun than the Mossberg pumps. It has a steel receiver vs. aluminum on the Mossberg. It's the King of pump shotguns, and probably has more aftermarket upgrades available than any other shotgun, so you can customize it later on if you wish.
Link Posted: 2/6/2006 9:56:05 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/6/2006 9:57:39 PM EDT by sta1treeman]

Originally Posted By Mike_AK:
For what you plan to use it for, a Remington 870 Express HD would be a good choice. The 870 is better shotgun than the Mossberg pumps. It has a steel receiver vs. aluminum on the Mossberg. It's the King of pump shotguns, and probably has more aftermarket upgrades available than any other shotgun, so you can customize it later on if you wish.

I have to agree, an 870, is a higher quality shotgun, the selling point, at least for me on the mossberg, is the ability to chamber different size shells. Correct me if I'm wrong, a remington that will chamber 3 1/2"s is more than $400, but that might not be an issue for you. I own both, an 870 wingmaster, great bird gun, and an 835 mossberg, great for turkey, geese,and deer, it really does boil down to your own needs, and which you like best.
Link Posted: 2/6/2006 11:44:23 PM EDT
From my reading, the Internet consensus is that the Remington 870 is the best damn pump shotgun ever made. I've got an 870 Police, model 4901. I also just bought a Winchester 1300 Ranger Compact for my GF to shoot. It seems a good gun, although we haven't shot it yet, but it isn't as "industrial strength", "heavy duty", as the 870P. I recommend that you get the best. Get a Remington 870 Police. You will have the top of the line Combat pump shotgun. If it costs more, save and pay it. This gun is solid and will last beyond your lifetime.

Every 870 has a steel receiver, and the 870P (I'm not sure about the Wingmaster) has an aluminum trigger guard (not sure on the Express trigger guard either). The Winchester 1300 has an alloy receiver and a plastic trigger guard. That plastic looks really cheap, and it's the one thing I dislike, looking at and handling the gun. One of your other options is the Mossberg 590 series. If you want one of those, and you want a home defense gun, look into the 590A1 which is more solid than the standard 590 models. With the 590A1 you even get a bayonet lug. I used to have a 590A1 but my current Combat shotgun is an 870P.

For more opionions and advise, check out Shotgun World and The Firing Line, among others.

GL
Link Posted: 2/7/2006 5:21:43 AM EDT
Remington 870.
Link Posted: 2/7/2006 5:23:05 AM EDT

Originally Posted By sta1treeman:

Originally Posted By Mike_AK:

I have to agree, an 870, is a higher quality shotgun, the selling point, at least for me on the mossberg, is the ability to chamber different size shells. Correct me if I'm wrong, a remington that will chamber 3 1/2"s is more than $400, but that might not be an issue for you. I own both, an 870 wingmaster, great bird gun, and an 835 mossberg, great for turkey, geese,and deer, it really does boil down to your own needs, and which you like best.



My 870 super mag was $400 brand new. It will chamber low brass to 3 1/2 inchers.
Link Posted: 2/7/2006 5:46:57 AM EDT

Originally Posted By buckfever34:

Originally Posted By sta1treeman:

Originally Posted By Mike_AK:

I have to agree, an 870, is a higher quality shotgun, the selling point, at least for me on the mossberg, is the ability to chamber different size shells. Correct me if I'm wrong, a remington that will chamber 3 1/2"s is more than $400, but that might not be an issue for you. I own both, an 870 wingmaster, great bird gun, and an 835 mossberg, great for turkey, geese,and deer, it really does boil down to your own needs, and which you like best.



My 870 super mag was $400 brand new. It will chamber low brass to 3 1/2 inchers.

Other than an O/U I got last year, I haven't priced shotguns lately, it seems the 870 super mag was more than $400 when it came out, but if they are selling for $400 now, or always were, I'm going to look at getting one. I can't say enough about the 870. I always liked the 3 1/2 for deer or geese, that is why I bought the mossberg, at the time a benelli was out of my price range. A 870 in 3/12 for $400 sounds like a good deal to me.
Link Posted: 2/7/2006 6:27:16 AM EDT

Originally Posted By GunLogic:
With the 590A1 you even get a bayonet lug.

the regular 590 has a bayonet lug as well...
Link Posted: 2/7/2006 6:47:57 AM EDT
You can find 870s ( and Mossbergs, I suppose ) for next to nothing at pawn shops.

Pick up a beater for 150 or so and then get it modded (or not) as you desire.

Pretty hard to wear out an 870. So get it used, get it refinished
(or do it your self with Lauer Duracoat) and then mod by shortening barrel, installing ghost rings,
extended mag tube, shortened stock, tac light etc...

And you can typically find an older Wingmaster, all steel (if that matters to you) versus the new Express guns that have some plastic in them.

Link Posted: 2/7/2006 9:14:39 AM EDT
Remington 870. They are easily upgradeable and can be had for great prices from police trade-ins or new. If you're new to shotguns, do some research on what to look for before buying at a pawn shop. I've seen some pretty knarly ones that look good from the outside...
Link Posted: 2/7/2006 9:46:20 AM EDT
thanks for the info everyone. another question what do Chokes do?
Link Posted: 2/7/2006 5:11:27 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/7/2006 5:14:09 PM EDT by GunLogic]
Chokes constrict the muzzle end of the bore. Their purpose is to tighten the pattern beyond what a cylinder bore (non-constricted muzzle) would allow.

See here.

GL
Link Posted: 2/7/2006 5:23:37 PM EDT

Originally Posted By GunLogic:
Chokes constrict the muzzle end of the bore. Their purpose is to tighten the pattern beyond what a cylinder bore (non-constricted muzzle) would allow.

See here.

GL



thank you sir. that makes alot of sense now.
Link Posted: 2/7/2006 5:26:10 PM EDT
You're welcome.

GL
Link Posted: 2/7/2006 7:36:13 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/7/2006 7:37:22 PM EDT by ECS]

Originally Posted By azn226:
this gun would mainly be for range fun and home defense AND just to add to the collection.



I'd recommend a standard field gun, pump action, with a 28" barrel. I'm partial to the Remington 870 myself. They are tough as nails. And a field gun is perfectly acceptable for home defense also. If you want a 'nice' 870 you might take a look at the Remington Wingmaster. My definition of 'range fun' is shooting clays (skeet and sporting mostly).
Link Posted: 2/8/2006 10:40:42 AM EDT
alright here's an update. i went to the store this morning before work. i walked out with a remingtion 870 police 18" shotgun. the shotgun was onsale for 287.99 which was not a bad price. walk out was 314.26 after tax and i bought a box of birdshot for 3.50 i'll take pictures when i get home. thanks for the advice everyone.
Link Posted: 2/8/2006 10:52:58 AM EDT
A Coach gun with BIRD SHOT is all you need!
Link Posted: 2/8/2006 11:17:29 AM EDT

Originally Posted By azn226:
alright here's an update. i went to the store this morning before work. i walked out with a remingtion 870 police 18" shotgun. the shotgun was onsale for 287.99 which was not a bad price. walk out was 314.26 after tax and i bought a box of birdshot for 3.50 i'll take pictures when i get home. thanks for the advice everyone.

you did good... now go buy a case of shells and practice. if you plan on using the gun for HD, you'll want to be familiar with every aspect of how it operates.
Link Posted: 2/8/2006 11:26:25 AM EDT

Originally Posted By chips:
you did good...



+1


Originally Posted By chips:
... now go buy a case of shells and practice. if you plan on using the gun for HD, you'll want to be familiar with every aspect of how it operates.



+1,000,000,000
Link Posted: 2/8/2006 11:28:18 AM EDT

Originally Posted By chips:

Originally Posted By azn226:
alright here's an update. i went to the store this morning before work. i walked out with a remingtion 870 police 18" shotgun. the shotgun was onsale for 287.99 which was not a bad price. walk out was 314.26 after tax and i bought a box of birdshot for 3.50 i'll take pictures when i get home. thanks for the advice everyone.

you did good... now go buy a case of shells and practice. if you plan on using the gun for HD, you'll want to be familiar with every aspect of how it operates.

And somthing besides birdshot!, LOL, good buy, you can't go wrong with the 870, I think you will be pleased.
Link Posted: 2/8/2006 11:42:25 AM EDT
The 870 is great. The surefire forend for it is fantastic.

For a fun gun though, look at the Beretta autoloaders for sale at Wal-Mart. They are reliable and much more fun to shoot. An autoloader beats you up less. I really like their 20 gauge auto.

The saiga AK-type shotguns are very fun to shoot as well. Recoil is almost non-existent. Plus, they have that Kalashnikov action. I love 'em.

The mossbergs are great as well.

Shotguns are really all about feel. Try several and get the one that shoulders and shoots the best for you. On most shotguns, your eye is the rear sight. So, fit and feel are crucial.
Link Posted: 2/8/2006 2:56:44 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/8/2006 2:59:19 PM EDT by steveinct]
You can find good, used 870s for around $250. The major parts receiver/barrel last almost forever
unless you plan to shoot about a qtr million rounds in 10 years - then you can crack either receiver or
barrel extension.

Try before you buy. Review what you want it for. You can have a lot of fun with a shotgun - very versatile. One gun and with the proper barrel and choke selections you can not only have it around for
home protection, but take it to a club and shoot trap, skeet, 5-stand, sporting clays; you can hunt anything from quail , pheasant , ducks and geese up through deer and even boar and black bear at close range with properly sighted slugs at ranges less than 100 yards.

You can use it in 3-gun matches for the shotgun relay.

You can get exposure to almost all the disciplines in clay shooting, practical/tactical shooting and hunting with a good shotgun and two or three barrels and five choke tubes.

Make sure the gun FITS YOU correctly and find out where you "shoot" with it. No two are the same.
Some pattern higher or lower than others depending on a whole variety of factors.

A good used 1100 can be bought for $350-500 depending on grade and condition. I use an 1100 for trap and won't change. They do require a little more TLC than an 870 but the trade off is an 1100 beats your shoulder a LOT less than an 870
Link Posted: 2/8/2006 7:58:53 PM EDT
ok here are the pictures. Nevermind about the police part. i thought it was but i was wrong.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v260/azn226/gun/express2.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v260/azn226/gun/express1.jpg
Link Posted: 2/9/2006 2:49:03 AM EDT
Yup an Express. The "workhorse" do everything 870.

If you get a field grade barrel you'll need to remove the magazine extension (if it's removeable on that model, off hand I don't know) Mine are both over 25 years old and don't have the "dimples" inside the mag tube allowing for easy installationa and removal of mag tube extensions.

Or, you might just pick up another used, field gun that isn't rusty inside for $250-$300.

If you get one of the newer field barrels - a 28" one with three tubes: improved cyl; modified and full
will cover about 99% of basic wing and clay shooting if you want to try some flying targets.

You can often find bargains in the "used barrel" bucket at gunstores, too. I picked up a brand new
field barrel (older with a fixed choke) that was made 30 years ago for $85. I picked up a brand new
slug barrel with sights (the old imp. cyl. fixed choke type) with 2-3/4" chamber for $69 out the door.
Barrel was 30 yrs old and had NEVER been fired - not even a bluing scratch anywhere and still had
the old, reddish grease (albeit all gummed up and congealed) in the bore.

You can go to Wally World and buy the 100-rd value packs of #8 shot and shoot all the clay pigeon games. We even use that to drop plates in the shotgun stages of local IDPA matches
Link Posted: 2/9/2006 6:31:21 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/9/2006 6:31:40 AM EDT by cmeyer001]
Evaluation of different types of ammo for Defense Work

And read the above article in regards to ammo selection for defense work.

Draw your own conclusions.
Link Posted: 2/9/2006 6:37:02 AM EDT

Originally Posted By azn226:
alright here's an update. i went to the store this morning before work. i walked out with a remingtion 870 police 18" shotgun. the shotgun was onsale for 287.99 which was not a bad price. walk out was 314.26 after tax and i bought a box of birdshot for 3.50 i'll take pictures when i get home. thanks for the advice everyone.



FYI - Just so you know... The 870 you bought is not a "Police" model. Police models are built off of the "Wingmaster" action and will be stamped either Wingmaster (older ones) or Police (newer ones). What you have is a "Home Defense" model built off of the "Express" action. A lot of dealers like to call them "Police" models because they come with the mag ext. and matte finish but they are not the same thing. I'm not sure if dealers do that because they do not know any better or if its something more unscrupulous then that?

Either way, don't sweat it. The model you bought, while not as nice as a true "police" model, is still a fine shotgun. The price you paid is fair and it should serve you well. I just wanted to make sure you understood what you have.

Enjoy it
Link Posted: 2/9/2006 10:35:38 AM EDT

Originally Posted By cmeyer001:
Evaluation of different types of ammo for Defense Work

And read the above article in regards to ammo selection for defense work.

Draw your own conclusions.



Thanks for that link!

2guntom
454 Casull +
Link Posted: 2/10/2006 11:09:14 AM EDT
One thing I didn't see anyone say, was don't be afraid to put your face on the thing.
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