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Posted: 6/4/2003 5:09:21 PM EDT
As usual, when the UPS man dropped a package of gun stuff on my porch today, it brought a smile to my face. Unfortunately, that smile turned into a scowl of disgust soon after.

I had ordered a Surefire weaponlight for my Mossberg M590. This is supposed to replace the stock fore-end, and has an integrated pressure switch with turns on the flashlight. Unfortunately, it won't fit on a M590 with a bayonet lug, like almost all of them have.

When I called Surefire, the guy in the service department said, "Nope, they won't fit on a M590 without milling off the bayonet lug.". When I asked him why the f#$k they don't alert potential buyers to this in their advertisements, he had no answer for me. This problem, which will effect everyone who tries to install their product on a military-dress M590, isn't even mentioned in their assembly literature. In fact, the illustration isn't even a M590, its a standard M500 with 5 round magazine.

In other words, Surefire advertises a product that's supposed to drop onto a popular firearm, most of which have a certain feature that makes their product unusable without extensive modification. Nice engineering and marketing, you idiots.

So, if you want to put a weaponlight on M590 and don't want to hack up your gun, don't buy the Surefire product until their engineers pull their heads out of their asses.
Link Posted: 6/4/2003 5:20:58 PM EDT
I will join your crusade against Surefire and never buy another one of their products.
Link Posted: 6/4/2003 5:42:26 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/4/2003 5:48:47 PM EDT by Cixelsyd]
They have a model for 590s with bayo-lugs. You bought the wrong one. I'll try to find it. It's called research.

Model# 623A01 Surefire - Mossberg 590, 6V shotgun tactical light, for 20 inch with the Bayonet lug



CHRIS
Link Posted: 6/5/2003 7:37:15 AM EDT
hey, wanna sell yours?
Link Posted: 6/6/2003 12:42:18 PM EDT
I find it interesting that you were able to provide this information, but the person who works in the customer service department of Surefire said that there was no such thing as a fore-end that would work with a M590 without modifying it.

Maybe you could call Surefire and tell them something about their own products.
Link Posted: 6/6/2003 7:32:32 PM EDT
Link Posted: 6/7/2003 5:27:19 PM EDT
The only problem with this setup is the bayonet lug is now useless:

590 w/Surefire #623A01 foregrip


But, you still have the option of switching back to this:

Link Posted: 6/8/2003 3:26:27 PM EDT
According to the customer service guy at Surefire, they only sell one model for Mossbergs now, because people didn't like the variant with the very low flashlight position with respect to the barrel.

The problem can be solved with a little bit of redesign, which Surefire seems reluctant to do (even though they've had years to do it). As its currently designed, the fore end doesn't even completely cover the existing inner forearm, leaving .250" of the "U" shaped bracket exposed. When fully retracted, the back of the plastic fore end is .850" away from coming into contact with the reciever. If the whole fore end were set back this distance, the light would easily clear the bayonet lug. The front end would have to be slightly redesigned so that the cap would still have something to bear against when it is tightened.

Oh well, it doesn't look like they are going to take my advice anytime soon. They would rather inconvenience customers than be proactive.
Link Posted: 6/8/2003 5:49:15 PM EDT
Link Posted: 6/8/2003 10:55:45 PM EDT
I still laugh every time I see someone with a 590 that has a bayonett lug. Worthless.
Link Posted: 6/8/2003 11:09:01 PM EDT

Originally Posted By TheFNG:
I still laugh every time I see someone with a 590 that has a bayonett lug. Worthless.



You've clearly never been on the receiving end of a blade. What is so worthless about an additional tool? What harm can it do relative to the clear additional benefit?

Don't laugh so hard - you may get the hick-ups.
Link Posted: 6/9/2003 3:59:27 AM EDT
Sorry but I can't agree more! I think a bayonet is the most ridiculous thing I have ever seen on a shotgun except for the military. Even in the pictures I have seen from Iraq and Afghanistan of shotguns in battle I do not remember seeing a bayonet. I operated in CQB hundreds of times. The last thing I would want is a knife swinging around in a tight spot. If someone had to deploy their personal shotgun, more than likely it would be inside their house with other people present. In those conditions I would not want some knife sticking out from the end of my gun. Now if it is a bayonet charge across the back forty, that's something different. MIKE.
Link Posted: 6/9/2003 4:11:12 AM EDT

Originally Posted By mike103:
If someone had to deploy their personal shotgun, more than likely it would be inside their house with other people present.



Exactly. So would you rather HAVE to discharge you firearm in thos circumstances? Why have a robber / assailant ponder whether you really have ammo or are willing to shoot, when the bayonet alone shows the deadly force available.

Sorry, but I don't picture myself maneuvering through my own house playing "CQB." I picture myself standing my ground and telling some mother fucker that continuing on his current path is ill-advised. I think the bayonet clearly helps to reinforce this message.

If I foresee myself doing "CQB" stuff, I will grab a carbine.



Adam
Link Posted: 6/9/2003 4:35:55 AM EDT
Well that's why we live in America, everyone can do what they want! No bayonet for me! MIKE.
Link Posted: 6/9/2003 5:24:29 AM EDT
Ha-Ha- "I picture myself standing my ground and telling some mother fucker that continuing on his current path is ill-advised. I think the bayonet clearly helps to reinforce this message".
If staring down the barrel of a 12GA dosen't scare them neither will your puny knife;)
Link Posted: 6/9/2003 6:15:35 PM EDT
Bayonet on a home defense gun = Fuel for lawyers.
Link Posted: 6/9/2003 6:51:55 PM EDT
For the record, I don't own a bayonet, and don't have any plans to buy one and put it on the gun. At 20", the barrel is on the long side for a combat shotgun and makes negotiating narrow hallways and doorways more difficult.

Adding another half foot or so of sharp steel accomplishes the following:

- it turns the firearm into a fairly inefficient and clumsy spear, a weapon type that I don't really have the time or inclination to train myself with. (I'd rather be practicing shooting than stabbing dummies)

- It greatly reduces its efficiency in its primary task: functioning as an effective CQB FIREARM. When you spend any reasonable amount of time practicing negotiating corners in shoot houses, you really start to appreciate the very short (14") guns. Adding a bayonet is going in the wrong direction towards making this gun efficient at this task.

- It does make the firearm look much more cool. This is probably the real reason most people get them. If you are putting your M590 over the mantle, and you want to impress your buddies, they might "ooh" and "ahh" a little bit more if it had a bayonet on it.
Link Posted: 6/13/2003 12:20:17 PM EDT
Hey guys,

Thanks for the info on the issues with the Surefire light - I won't be getting one, I guess, as it looks like too much of a hassel.

I bought the M590 partly because it's the current military shotgun (to be replaced by Benelli's M4), and being in the military, I wanted to have the military weapon. For me, the bayonet and lug is part of the weapon. As someone else mentioned, I don't feel the need to deprive myself of another optional tool. The comment about Afghanistan is strange though, as I don't remember seeing pictures of anyone with bayonets on rifles either...

Anyway, I always thought it would be handy if someone developed a light mount that would clip onto the M590 bayonet lug just like a bayonet. It would be easy to install and remove, and although it might rattle a tiny bit (wouldn't if designed properly), it would be quite handy. It could either be operated with a constant on/off switch on the light, or perhaps a pressure switch on the end of a coiled telephone-style cable stuck to the side of the slide (that wouldn't be my preference though).

Just my thoughts,

Dave
Link Posted: 6/15/2003 4:17:25 AM EDT
Try the Surefire M69 mount.It's got rails like the RIS/RAS and you can adjust the flash light on the rails or add more of them.
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