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Posted: 2/20/2006 5:14:40 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/20/2006 5:15:55 PM EDT by chapperjoe]
wow. If I was a 9mm fan, I'd jump on one of these (they can technically do ANY caliber in a KZ, as everything from teh mag release up is standard 1911. Yes I figured that out all by myself!). KZ grip is something special. They really did it right. And thank G-D I can keep my KZ now that my '94 has sold!:



Link Posted: 2/20/2006 5:16:25 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/20/2006 5:16:44 PM EDT by chapperjoe]
also looks like they got a hold of the HK P7 system here by the takedown release location. (also looks like they got ahold of some hi-point designers)


Link Posted: 2/20/2006 5:20:36 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/20/2006 5:23:22 PM EDT by ALPHAGHOST]
jeez....that KZ looks NICE!

tag for more info on it

anyone have any idea on a price range?
Link Posted: 2/20/2006 5:27:22 PM EDT
TAGGED!


The KZ looks like it could go on my wish list. Any idea on how the grip is? Larger then a normal 1911? smaller then say a G17?

Link Posted: 2/20/2006 5:36:20 PM EDT

Originally Posted By ICEAGE:
TAGGED!


The KZ looks like it could go on my wish list. Any idea on how the grip is? Larger then a normal 1911? smaller then say a G17?




All KZ grips are the same.

Here's what they did. The mag is wide on bottom and then about halfway up slopes around 15 degrees in and continues sloping to about 9/10s of the way up at which point he mag is the width of a std 1911 mag. then teh top area (approx one round tall) is the width of a 1911 mag. This way they were able to use straight 1911 parts from mag release up. Regular 1911 slides fit on my KZ lower and vice versa. I have not nor will I try and fire them though! just slide fit was tried. the grip area is ridiculously comfortable and they claim its acutally thinner than a std 1911 with std grips. I agree, though it is relatively more boxier. Think of this pistol as a standard 1911 top half covered by a thin veneer of polymer and then the lower half from mag release down is all polymer. All contact points are steel on steel, all parts save mag release are std 1911. I ahd to put mine up for sale, but I think I can keep it now. As a 9mm platform, if I ever have the money I would get one to join my P7M8 (which previously owned my 'only 9mm you'll ever need' mantle!).

If you have to use 9mm, this would aseem the way to go.
Link Posted: 2/20/2006 5:37:51 PM EDT
ETA: the grip is not as thick or boxy as a para ord hi cap frame. The area that looks like the para slope up top, is really the polymer shell thinning to meet the slide, not the pistol thinning where the mag ends.
Link Posted: 2/20/2006 5:40:10 PM EDT
All reports I have heard of the KZs have been bad. One CA agency that showed up to Gunsite all decked out with them had to have the whole lot of them replaced.

I like the concept, but the application has me very skeptical.
Link Posted: 2/20/2006 5:42:16 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/20/2006 5:45:04 PM EDT by chapperjoe]

Originally Posted By in_burrito:
All reports I have heard of the KZs have been bad. One CA agency that showed up to Gunsite all decked out with them had to have the whole lot of them replaced.

I like the concept, but the application has me very skeptical.



I'm about 1000 rounds in on a gun that's probably got 2500-3K rounds total. Nto the slightest hint of a failure. nothing but dependable. I cannot imagine what would have to be replaced on this pistol, much less the entire one. All moving parts, firing parts, slide, (save mag release and trigger bar - forgot that before) are straight 1911 - what could fail?

gun is tough, feels GREAT, reliable and more accurate than me as proven today when I thought sights were off and range buddy put 5 in an orange target for me! Only thing is teh original sights are fading and I'm gonna have them replaced with a TFO front and mepro adj rear with tritium bar.

I would consider these THE gun that others should be matched against. (will update when I get my XD45acp tac!)
Link Posted: 2/20/2006 5:59:18 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/20/2006 6:00:32 PM EDT by ken_mays]
If I were looking to drop that much scratch on a poly framed 1911 I'd pay a bit more and get an STI.

And the ADP leaves me cold. It reminds me of the Heritage Stealth or Patriot or whatever they were called.
Link Posted: 2/20/2006 6:07:53 PM EDT

Originally Posted By ken_mays:
If I were looking to drop that much scratch on a poly framed 1911 I'd pay a bit more and get an STI.

And the ADP leaves me cold. It reminds me of the Heritage Stealth or Patriot or whatever they were called.



Its not polyframed, read me post matey! polymer is really a shell here.
Link Posted: 2/20/2006 6:08:40 PM EDT
Why buy that when you can buy the exact same thing for under $200 from your local pawn shops Saturday Night Special case?

Wilson added a couple of serrations to it, but other than that, it's the same gun that was imported by Heritage Arms. You practically can't give the things away, and when I held one it felt like a rattling pile of steaming fecal matter. It's a super cheap imported pistol with Wilson's name on it.

Pretty sad really. People are actually going to pay $500+ for that gun, just because it says Wilson on it. I sure hope Wilson did something to it, but I'm going to have to pass, and run away.


Link Posted: 2/20/2006 6:14:26 PM EDT

Originally Posted By olds442tyguy:
Why buy that when you can buy the exact same thing for under $200 from your local pawn shops Saturday Night Special case?

Wilson added a couple of serrations to it, but other than that, it's the same gun that was imported by Heritage Arms. You practically can't give the things away, and when I held one it felt like a rattling pile of steaming fecal matter. It's a super cheap imported pistol with Wilson's name on it.

Pretty sad really. People are actually going to pay $500+ for that gun, just because it says Wilson on it. I sure hope Wilson did something to it, but I'm going to have to pass, and run away.





talkin about the little guy. damned ugly tell you that much. didn't know it was a clone gun.
Link Posted: 2/20/2006 6:26:21 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/20/2006 6:28:42 PM EDT by olds442tyguy]
The ADP is what I was referring to. Heritage quit importing them back in 2004 or so. I think MSRP was only like $380, but if any dealer ever got that out of one he could probably sell ketchup popsicles and make a profit.

It's the Heritage Stealth. I believe it was offered in two variations, with or with out an external extractor.

Oh, and as for the KZ, **cough**Charles Daly M5**cough**. ETA: I have no proof, but I've always thought the imported CD frame looked strikingly similar to the Wilson.
Link Posted: 2/20/2006 6:28:29 PM EDT

Originally Posted By olds442tyguy:
The ADP is what I was referring to. Heritage quit importing them back in 2004 or so. I think MSRP was only like $380, but if any dealer ever got that out of one he could probably sell ketchup popsicles and make a profit.

It's the Heritage Stealth. I believe it was offered in two variations, with or with out an external extractor.

Oh, and as for the KZ, **cough**Charles Daly M5**cough**.



not even close. M5 is 14 rounder built like a para. this is compeltely different.
Link Posted: 2/20/2006 6:33:47 PM EDT

Originally Posted By chapperjoe:

Originally Posted By olds442tyguy:
The ADP is what I was referring to. Heritage quit importing them back in 2004 or so. I think MSRP was only like $380, but if any dealer ever got that out of one he could probably sell ketchup popsicles and make a profit.

It's the Heritage Stealth. I believe it was offered in two variations, with or with out an external extractor.

Oh, and as for the KZ, **cough**Charles Daly M5**cough**.



not even close. M5 is 14 rounder built like a para. this is compeltely different.


Ah, you're correct.
Link Posted: 2/20/2006 6:34:55 PM EDT

Originally Posted By olds442tyguy:

Originally Posted By chapperjoe:

Originally Posted By olds442tyguy:
The ADP is what I was referring to. Heritage quit importing them back in 2004 or so. I think MSRP was only like $380, but if any dealer ever got that out of one he could probably sell ketchup popsicles and make a profit.

It's the Heritage Stealth. I believe it was offered in two variations, with or with out an external extractor.

Oh, and as for the KZ, **cough**Charles Daly M5**cough**.



not even close. M5 is 14 rounder built like a para. this is compeltely different.


Ah, you're correct.



Para suing Springfield to prevent teh improt of the M5 gave it away. I dunno how CD got them in now though? maybe patent ran out?
Link Posted: 2/20/2006 6:48:16 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/23/2006 10:12:02 AM EDT by tfod]




Stealth/ TZ45 check the 1911forum.com

Link Posted: 2/20/2006 8:08:24 PM EDT
Now, if someone could just copy the Star BM and make it lighter (alloy frame a la the BKM)... or just scale a Commander size 1911 down to 9mm... I think it would make a perfect CCW.
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