Warning

 

Close

Confirm Action

Are you sure you wish to do this?

Confirm Cancel
Member Login
Posted: 12/22/2005 2:15:54 PM EDT
I was curious if anyone here knows if Marines/Soliders, enlisted/officer, are allowed to carry their personal pistol aside from the issued M9. I know Special Forces may be the exception, but I am more interested regarding regular troops.

Thanks.
Link Posted: 12/22/2005 2:38:16 PM EDT
i once heard that they could carry any nato spec sidearm. but that was gun store counter talk so i don't know how true it is.
Link Posted: 12/22/2005 2:40:28 PM EDT
It depends largely on the disposition of the CO's.
Link Posted: 12/22/2005 2:50:28 PM EDT
While there are exceptions to every rule, the answer for the most part is no.

FWIW I've spent 18+ months in Iraq and have never seen conventional forces carrying anything besides the M9 (and the occasional battlefield pickup).
Link Posted: 12/22/2005 5:32:48 PM EDT
Most "regular" troops don't get a handgun at all. They get M16s, M4s, M249 SAWs, and M240s (G or B). Some older units may still have M60s, but the 240 is replacing them. Oh, and can't forget our grenadiers with the M203 attch to an M4 or M16. :)

Typically, you will only see handguns with medics, officers, senior NCOs (and some platoon sgts), and machine gunners (M240s/M60s). Other folks you might see with one are combat vehicle crewmembers (CVC) and aviation personnel.

To your original question, the M9 is the primary sidearm, but we also have the M11 (Sig 228) for compacts. Tankers/CVCs and aviation personnel, as well as AFOSI, Army CID and NCIS are issued these.

Taking personal weapons is strictly prohibited, not only by your unit, and your service (Army, Navy, AF, Marines), but also by the Joint Forces Commander in theater. Do some folks do it and get away with it? Occasionally, but it isn't worth it. The "any NATO" rule doesn't exist either. The military is pretty strict about you carrying a weapon you are qualified with only. If I have not qualified on the M203, I don't get to carry one. If I am not qualified with the BHP or CZ75, I can't carry them either - even if they are NATO approved.
Link Posted: 12/22/2005 5:39:23 PM EDT
Some interesting stuff is in use with SF...
Link Posted: 12/22/2005 6:47:21 PM EDT
AFAIK and can remember, only .gov owned AA&E are allowed. That is not to say that the rules aren't bent or broken in theater, but the official word used to be and still is (I believe) NO PERSONALLY OWNED WEAPONS!
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 1:40:16 AM EDT
Thanks for the reponses guys. I guess that means no .45 for me when I complete officer training.
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 10:08:15 AM EDT
depending on the co of the post you may be able to have a personal weapon for use on personal time. some bases don't like having weapons around that they can't control so i would ask first. but if you live off base--knock yourself out.
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 10:11:53 AM EDT
When in garrison and subject to inspection, carry what they issue. When the bullets are flying in a combat zone, the CO isn't going to give a flying fuck if you zap an oncoming suicide bomber with a M9, 1911, sig, glock or a makarov as long as the haji is dead.
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 6:34:45 PM EDT

Originally Posted By dvr9:
When the bullets are flying in a combat zone, the CO isn't going to give a flying fuck if you zap an oncoming suicide bomber with a M9, 1911, sig, glock or a makarov as long as the haji is dead.



Even if the CO doesn't care the E-2 MP checking ALL of your bags before you head home will. (Or some other tool officer/NCO will notice it and cause a stink.) Having your own personal weapon isn’t worth the potential trouble. CENTCOM has General Order 1 which is clear - no personal weapons or ammo. Of my five trips there I have yet to see anything other than issued weapons. Other theaters may have other rules, but I doubt it.

Link Posted: 12/24/2005 2:27:38 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/24/2005 2:27:57 AM EDT by Variablebinary]

Originally Posted By Blue_Genes:
I was curious if anyone here knows if Marines/Soliders, enlisted/officer, are allowed to carry their personal pistol aside from the issued M9. I know Special Forces may be the exception, but I am more interested regarding regular troops.

Thanks.



Generally no. War is big and ugly and sometimes soldiers get away with it, but that is not the norm.
Link Posted: 12/24/2005 1:13:45 PM EDT
Some Navy and MArine personnel carry the M11 which is a Sig (9mm), Some Marine units are using 1911A1s for CQB operations, but not general carry.
Link Posted: 12/24/2005 1:49:58 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/24/2005 2:03:20 PM EDT by Dave_A]

Originally Posted By Blue_Genes:
I was curious if anyone here knows if Marines/Soliders, enlisted/officer, are allowed to carry their personal pistol aside from the issued M9. I know Special Forces may be the exception, but I am more interested regarding regular troops.

Thanks.



Official policy is NO PRIVATELY OWNED WEAPONS (ex knives) or AMMO. Period.

The main reason is supply - weapons need parts, maintanance, and ammo, which would not be available if everyone was carrying his favorite personal toy... Standardized weapons mean standardized supply of mags/ammo/repair parts.

It's also a law-of-war issue, among other things...

The clause that is (100% incorectly) construed by sime to limit the use of large-caliber weapons on personell (there is NOTHING in the law of war (or any treaty) that says we can't use 50cal on troops) requires that 'no weapon be used that is designed or modified to cause unneccicary suffering'. To ensure that this is observed, privately owned weapons and ammo are banned (this way, the weapons you are using are known to be in compliance, or you modified them. It removes the chance that some E-1 will trade his M16 for a sawed off shotgun with 'Supa-Dupa Pork-Fat Whammy Shells' or whatever, and unknowingly become a war criminal)...


Now, obviously certain 'special' units get some leeway there, but for the average soldier, issue weapons only...

Accessories are up to each individual unit, and no one is going to care where you get your mags from, but at least for Iraq there was a theatre-wide ban on personal firearms, and I haven't heard anyone say that's changed....
Link Posted: 12/24/2005 2:04:26 PM EDT

Originally Posted By SSN_Doc:
Some Navy and MArine personnel carry the M11 which is a Sig (9mm), Some Marine units are using 1911A1s for CQB operations, but not general carry.



And all of the above are issue weapons (MEUSOC 1911, M-11 (Sig 228 or 226?? Forgot which one)
Link Posted: 12/25/2005 1:36:01 AM EDT
There are only two generally approved handguns, the Beretta M9 and SIG M11 for all services. There are others limited ones in use, some units still have the M1911A1, Naval units with the SIG 226 and then SOCOM Mk23 Mod 0 .45. I've fired all five above this deployment but the standard Army sidearm is the M9.

CD
Link Posted: 12/25/2005 1:45:30 AM EDT
See CENTCOM AOR General Order #1A. Google it. It will give you some insight into the restrictions that GIs in the sandbox live with. Most of the time anyway...

Link Posted: 12/26/2005 4:27:50 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/26/2005 4:28:50 AM EDT by SSN_Doc]
I meant to mention that all of the above listed weapons in my previous reply were issue weapons and using issue ammo.
Thanks for clearing up my omission.
Link Posted: 12/26/2005 6:41:23 PM EDT
I know what Centcom says about personal weapons, and een about modifying .mil weapons, yet my deployment packing list specifically says "No rifles with barrels of less than 16", and no shotguns with barrels less than 18" "
Link Posted: 12/26/2005 7:23:13 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/26/2005 7:24:04 PM EDT by Blue_Genes]
All of these "exceptions" make me wonder how strictly these rules are enforced. Standardized weapons and parts are important and essential, but if I were a Marine Officer using a Kimber Warrior, aren't the parts interchangable with the 1911's used by the Marine Recon units?
Link Posted: 12/26/2005 8:53:11 PM EDT

Originally Posted By MisterPX:
I know what Centcom says about personal weapons, and een about modifying .mil weapons, yet my deployment packing list specifically says "No rifles with barrels of less than 16", and no shotguns with barrels less than 18" "



What is your unit only issued A2's?? Thanks for serving, how are you doing? Are you still in town? Going to the range anytime soon?
Link Posted: 12/26/2005 10:02:33 PM EDT
in my most recent trip as a run of the mill reservist i knew i would no longer have the luxury of specialty side arm. i purchased a police trade-in beretta for a measly $300. as the saying goes "you can get it there, but you cant get it home" i passed it to a friend relieving me on a rotation and he passed it back to me when i relieved him 7months later. i dont know who has it now. for awhile we were allowed to swap uppers and some guys bought M4 or shorty type uppers. it is generally frowned upon to whip an SPR type upper out of your sea bag without the background and training to back it up. i managed to score one of the few available A4s at our FOB and once i purchased and mounted an SN-4 it was just like old times

as for handguns, M9s and M11s all the way around. all the NAVSPECWAR guys at our FOB carried M11s the army special forces soldiers all carried M9s. the only times i saw 1911's they were on guys in local garb and long beards. outside the wire they blended in well but once you learned to look for light hiking boots and G-shock watches you could tell who the sheepdipped guys were.
Top Top