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Posted: 8/21/2002 5:45:37 PM EDT
just trying to get a field report on either or or both. interested but I just can't see the $1000 difference in the price tag.

thanks
Iso
Link Posted: 8/22/2002 8:45:05 AM EDT
I have a TRP Operator and almost got the TRP Pro (probably will get it for my wife for her b-day next year). My best friend has both guns ($$$)! They are both awesome guns.

Fit and finish on the parts/frame/slide is spot on and it shows on the range. Groups from the gun are better then I am. The TRP Pro is only slightly slicker in its action then the Operator (Operator has a full length dust cover v. a short dust cover on the Pro). The Pro has a better finish on the gun then does the Operator. I am a tall guy (6'3") and big (275) so I can carry the operator concealed. I use a kydex holster and the finish has already worn through in several places. However, that is only cosmetic and will be fixed by either wilson or robar in the next few months.

The barrel on the operator is a heavy-duty (one piece, stainless, polished inside and out-pretty!) and the pro is a little less stout (not as thick), but equally as awesome. If I had to do it all over again, I would buy the Operator and do some slight tune-ups/mods and save my self some money and in the end get a better gun with a light rail.

The price tag on the pro is dictated by 1) a great gun and 2) the FBI's stamp of approval. It commands a premium as a result. Let me know if you have any other questions.
Link Posted: 8/22/2002 9:09:20 AM EDT

Originally Posted By BYU:
The price tag on the pro is dictated by 1) a great gun and 2) the FBI's stamp of approval. It commands a premium as a result.



Umm... not really. Actually the price on the TRP Pro Model has more to do with the fact that the guns are hand built one at a time by Springfield's custom shop. Additionally, the parts sourced for the Pro Models are of a much higher quality (read no cast or MIM crap). Nowlin barrel, WC grip safety and C&S ignition system just to name a few cost significantly more money than the junk internals that come stock in all other Springfield pistols. Plus when you've got guys like Steve Nastoff and Dave Williams in on the project you can count on the price being higher.

Link Posted: 8/22/2002 10:46:47 AM EDT

Originally Posted By AJohnston:

Originally Posted By BYU:
The price tag on the pro is dictated by 1) a great gun and 2) the FBI's stamp of approval. It commands a premium as a result.



Umm... not really. Actually the price on the TRP Pro Model has more to do with the fact that the guns are hand built one at a time by Springfield's custom shop. Additionally, the parts sourced for the Pro Models are of a much higher quality (read no cast or MIM crap). Nowlin barrel, WC grip safety and C&S ignition system just to name a few cost significantly more money than the junk internals that come stock in all other Springfield pistols. Plus when you've got guys like Steve Nastoff and Dave Williams in on the project you can count on the price being higher.




The parts and pieces on the TRP Pro v. TRP Operator are very similar in quality, fit, and finish (at least the ones that I have seen and shot). If you would read the line that you quoted of mine, you would see that I do acknowledge that the gun is great (also meaning it is a cut above the rest of Springfields 1911's), including the Operator.

People who buy the Pro look at the end resultant product-a pistol that has the FBI-HRT stamp of approval becasue it works under difficult conditions in an extremly accurate fashion. They do not buy it because it is assembled or planned out by Joe Snuffy, etc . . . If they wanted a pisotl built by Joe Snuffy, then they would buy one from Les Baer, Wilson, Ed Brown, etc . . .
Link Posted: 8/22/2002 11:28:44 AM EDT

Originally Posted By AJohnston:
the junk internals that come stock in all other Springfield pistols.



I would hardly call them junk. I have had 7 Springfields and currently have 4. Not one of them has ever been a problem and are of the absolute highest quality for a production gun. Mine hit the x ring with every pull of the trigger and have functioned perfectly. I dont know what else you could ask for out of a gun. True, mine are just Loaded's and not TRP's (I would love to have one mind you if I had the $$), but the bottom line is they work, and they work extremely well. What else is there?
Link Posted: 8/22/2002 2:34:35 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/22/2002 2:41:10 PM EDT by AJohnston]
I think this is one of the best and worst things about the 1911... how relative the components and their application can be. I too have owned and sold many currently produced Springfield's, the vast majority of them being from the “Loaded“ line. Some of those guns were right out of the box and will give the average end user a lifetime of service. Others have had enough deviation that I was surprised Springfield ever let them leave the factory. Some have needed minor work to get them running right... running reliable. In every case the guns could have always been better in terms of parts and workmanship. But one can only expect so much from a gun with a retail price point of about $600 or around $1100 for the TRP. Point being is that Hawkeye is basically correct. If the gun goes BANG every time most people are satisfied but that doesn’t mean one can’t ask for more.

I’ve also been lucky enough to work on a few Springfield's, among other brands, and I can tell you for sure that the internals are not of the highest quality, not even for a production gun. In most cases pertaining to the 1911 there is always better. Thus the large industry solely dedicated to the manufacture of custom 1911s and their components. One cannot ask for a Pro Model at entry-level gun prices and consequently sacrifices have to be made. Those sacrifices come in the form of lesser quality parts and less time spent building the gun. But again to the average end user these sacrifices are perfectly acceptable. In cases where a user demands the best for his equipment more money is required (see the TRP Pro Model). So what else is there? Well again if the user is happy with the product he spent his money on, no matter the amount, then all is well and that’s the only important factor. However, just because Springfield stamps TRP on a pistol that by no means indicates the pistol is of the highest quality or even similar to the Pro Model in either parts or workmanship.

The standard TRP is nothing more than a “Loaded” model with a few added gadgets... ambi safety, magwell, 20 lpi checkering, etc. It is a production line version based off of the Pro Model, nothing more. That’s good marketing on behalf of Springfield at it allows the user to have a similar gun in terms of features for half the cost. If they can make the gun work and the consumer is happy then that’s a good thing. But don’t assume you got an FBI quality gun, either in parts or workmanship, because it roll stamped TRP.

So are the parts “junk”? That’s largely to be determined by the user.


Originally Posted By BYU:
People who buy the Pro look at the end resultant product-a pistol that has the FBI-HRT stamp of approval becasue it works under difficult conditions in an extremly accurate fashion. They do not buy it because it is assembled or planned out by Joe Snuffy, etc . . . If they wanted a pisotl built by Joe Snuffy, then they would buy one from Les Baer, Wilson, Ed Brown, etc . . .



I suspect people who buy the Pro Model do it because it is simply the best Springfield has to offer. They spend the extra money for exactly the same reason one would spend the extra money on a Brown, Baer, or Wilson. Better parts, more attention to detail, and in the end a better pistol for the initial cash outlay. They do it precisely because they understand who built it and the way it was constructed. If this was not the case then one would simply buy a standard TRP and be happy with the "very similar quality, fit, and finish" as you put it.

Link Posted: 8/28/2002 7:20:53 PM EDT
Thanks for all the help guys. BYU, you answered questions before I even got to them, as far as CCW is a matter. I am 6'4" and weigh in at 280. was hoping that I could CC my new springfield. was looking at a leather side holster. what do you think? still have not made my mind up as to which to get. will let you guys know.

thansk
Iso
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